SAFETY OFF - Raiders Start Attacking Ports

[erelkivtuadrater]

17 minutes ago, admin said:

If you want to get what you want (more people staying). You NOT ONLY should take it back but should start actively countering people who claim the game is dead or dying just like you countered me when you disagreed. 

Otherwise the cycle will continue. 
People interested in conflict and RVR will not buy the game or will not stay (reading the reviews forums or chats)
People interested in beautiful ships do not care about rvr, or forums or chat, in fact they feel safer in with dead PVP/RVR  

 

but i have to say those games are mediocre games atm, with several games directly competing with them when naval action has no direct competitor in the Age of Sail genre other then PotBS, but fixing economy, making pirates piraty again would make it feel more immersive and hopefully keeping more players wanting to play the game and not have it to feel like a grind

Edited November 19, 2019 by erelkivtuadrater

[z4ys]

8 minutes ago, erelkivtuadrater said:

 ...feel like a grind

Its only a grind when its played this way.

When pvp is the main goal

• Sure a playe can unlock the ship slots before starting to pvp
• Sure a player can grind to first rates before starting to pvp

But this player could take a privateerand sail out to pvp almost right away

Edited November 19, 2019 by z4ys

[erelkivtuadrater]

55 minutes ago, z4ys said:

Its only a grind when its played this way.

When pvp is the main goal

• Sure a playe can unlock the ship slots before starting to pvp
• Sure a player can grind to first rates before starting to pvp

But this player could take a privateerand sail out to pvp almost right away

that is true, but for a new player the usual thing is to rinse and repeat combat missions, i remember when i ranked up in GB, i got carried through ranks by @John Cavanaugh in his victory,  blasting through frigates etc but it didnt get repetitive by doing that because we were traveling different places aswell

[Malcolm3]

@admin

Regarding your two last posts here

1. I fully agree that Naval Action has stable player base aroud 400-600 players at prime time. But we had around 1500 players for 2 months after release and players were quite busy  capturing ports, leveling up, developing infrastructure etc. And then they were done, online steadily fell back to usual numbers. Why?

2. The answer, I think, is that while Naval Action really has best combat model and beautiful most realistic ships, it's almost all it has and can offer to a new player. So most players have little interesting to do besides grinding and battling just for fun. And that's the problem

So I tend to agree with @erelkivtuadrater about

Quote

fixing economy, making pirates piraty again would make it feel more immersive

Then they will have more things they can do and more ways they can do them, so the staying power will increase. But now life for beginner is quite hard

And I (along with others) write all that suggestions, because we also want more people - 600 players (including alts) is not enough for fully players' driven world of such size unfortunately.

P.S. And RVR don't suck, but it is too limited just to Port Battles of mostly 1st rates

Quote

 He bought the stable mature game, not a declining game or unfinished alpha. Make him know that. 

Tend to disagree here a bit - game not declining and not alpha, but it is still unfinished in some parts. That's why many of us want some things get fixed or corrected and some new things implemented.

[Conte D. Catellani]

4 hours ago, admin said:

(thank you for buying DLC everyone who bought it - it helps funds servers and new content).

You very welcome when the Leopard will come out? and is planned to have a dlc to have dolphins jumping around the ship ?

 

 

[Capitan Salazar]

15 hours ago, admin said:

If you want to get what you want (more people staying). You NOT ONLY should take it back but should start actively countering people who claim the game is dead or dying just like you countered me when you disagreed. 

Otherwise the cycle will continue. 
People interested in conflict and RVR will not buy the game or will not stay (reading the reviews forums or chats)
People interested in beautiful ships do not care about rvr, or forums or chat, in fact they feel safer in with dead PVP/RVR  

 

Seems you are the one in charge around.

I have lost many clan members because they couldn´t play conquest. Recently, one member quit the game because, quoting him, "this game is all about combat, no place for traders and crafters here". 

Only one member of my clan was following a bit the forums, specially the national news forum. And I can make sure that what they made all left wasn´t reading a forum.

[admin]

On 11/19/2019 at 9:43 PM, Malcolm3 said:

 

Tend to disagree here a bit - game not declining and not alpha, but it is still unfinished in some parts. That's why many of us want some things get fixed or corrected and some new things implemented.

 

12 hours ago, Capitan Salazar said:

Seems you are the one in charge around.

I have lost many clan members because they couldn´t play conquest. Recently, one member quit the game because, quoting him, "this game is all about combat, no place for traders and crafters here"

You should look at it this way. We always (from the start of early prototyping in 2014) stated that the game will have basic crafting and basic trading. It is in game. Its the best we can do..

• We always say we have the best looking ships and best age of sail combats with leeway and yards. 
• We NEVER said we have the best crafting. We have basic crafting and basic trading just barely enough to support the feature described above. Take a good from a deliver to point b - that's it. Gather resources - click a button - that's it. We never advertised the game as a crafting game. There was no a single ad for naval action which mentioned crafting. Trailer has no workers hitting hammers, or gathering tobacco. Texts say you can build ships and thats it.

This is literally what is said about trading and crafting.

Trading and privateering – Buy trading goods at low prices, haul them to distant places for high profits. Board ships and sell them and their cargo at nearby ports. Use shallow waters at your advantage to escape from larger ships. Shipbuilding and manufacturing - Build ships, upgrades and cannons, supply your clans or your nation or set up shops in free towns to sell to your enemies.

We have 15 detailed paragraphs on combat and 2 sentences on trading and crafting. Better crafting is not there, was not there, was not advertised anywhere. 
This is all we have

• Buy goods at low prices and haul them to distant places = check
• Board ships and sell cargo = check
• Build ships = check
• Supply your clans or your nations with... (repairs, ships, cannons) = check

Crafting was proposed by players in 2015 and added because players requested it (in original pre-launch version you were a naval officer or a pirate, you could only capture ships from others or buy them from the government). When basic buildings and crafting was added players were happy with at least some crafting because previously they had nothing. 

Given the facts stated above - we have basic crafting and advertised basic crafting - why people are unhappy with it??

You can accept it as it is. Or ask for removal. We are focused on new player retention and NPC aggression. Crafting is not on the priority list and will remain as is, with only minor changes. We can remove it if it is annoying everyone. Hope this brings it into proper perspective. We can keep it as is - or cut it. 

I am 100x more interested in fixing battle sails, adding wind shadow, adding non-binary rudder, adding hull leeway, rig entanglement in close counters, wind strength and variety, barometer - to predict wind change and direction ... you get the idea what i am good at, best age of sail combat and best looking ships.

I am also wondering how i can make this combat trading refit into the game without ruining FPS. 

Why should I think about crafting? Can someone popularly explain as I am five? From all i read it sucks, trading sucks and if i was a medical doctor i would just amputate and removed the aching leg to stop the gangrene of bad opinions from spreading. No crafting = no problem of bad reviews.

To summarize
Crafting can be improved - probably. Can it be done without research and iteration - No. Are current customers of crafting happy? Based on the forums - No. Is there risk in changing crafting - Yes huge risk. Did those customers bash us, expressed outrage and punish us for risky changes - yes. Based on this answers crafting should not be touched.

We do not believe in changes in crafting because community got tired of experiments. Will it be better if we cut out crafting completely? No. So let it be as is.. Crafting its not the best but its ok and it will be worse without it for those who like it as it is.

[erelkivtuadrater]

26 minutes ago, admin said:

We can keep it as is - or cut it.

Imo it might aswell be better to remove it since all we have are frankenships, better of with oak oak ships and not having 5th rate with over 80 hull thickness

[Stars and Stripes]

22 minutes ago, admin said:

This is literally what is said about trading and crafting.

Trading and privateering – Buy trading goods at low prices, haul them to distant places for high profits. Board ships and sell them and their cargo at nearby ports. Use shallow waters at your advantage to escape from larger ships. Shipbuilding and manufacturing - Build ships, upgrades and cannons, supply your clans or your nation or set up shops in free towns to sell to your enemies.

We have 15 detailed paragraphs on combat and 2 sentences on trading and crafting. Better crafting is not there, was not there, was not advertised anywhere. 
This is all we have

• Buy goods at low prices and haul them to distant places = check
• Board ships and sell cargo = check
• Build ships = check
• Supply your clans or your nations with... (repairs, ships, cannons) = check

Crafting was proposed by players in 2015 and added because players requested it (in original pre-launch version you were a naval officer or a pirate, you could only capture ships from others or buy them from the government). When basic buildings and crafting was added players were happy with at least some crafting because previously they had nothing. 

You can accept it as it is. Or ask for removal. We are focused on new player retention and NPC aggression. Crafting is not on the priority list and will remain as is, with only minor changes. We can remove it if it is annoying everyone. Hope this brings it into proper perspective. We can keep it as is - or cut it. 

Thanks for your efforts. I buy all the DLC to support what you do, plus I wrote a nice review. i want the game to continue to grow.

Crafting is secondary and I get that. That's fine IMO.

Combat is good and the stuff your adding is great.

Aggressive AI would great,  it annoys me that i sail through first rates......and big fleets and they do nothing they should tag the day dreamers.....BUT maybe drop Loki if you do this ?

Please continue adding more trading options to the game if you can. This brings in a lot of non hard core players and adds more ships to the OW.

AND by the way most people actually in game, don't agree with most of the loudest shouters on this forum so keep doing your thing. 

Good Job Devs. 👍

[Malcolm3]

36 minutes ago, admin said:

You can accept it as it is. Or ask for removal. We are focused on new player retention and NPC aggression. Crafting is not on the priority list and will remain as is, with only minor changes. We can remove it if it is annoying everyone. Hope this brings it into proper perspective. We can keep it as is - or cut it. 

Well, when I said that game is unfinished in some parts, I mean not crafting (it's OK enough for now, though previous version was better IMHO), but things related to combat. You created more than good system realistically simulating tactical warfare of the Age of Sail, but there is no such system for operational and strategic levels (OW RVR actions) of naval combat:

Quote

while Naval Action really has best combat model and beautiful most realistic ships, it's almost all it has and can offer to a new player. So most players have little interesting to do besides grinding and battling just for fun. And that's the problem

And such system cannot be created without some fixing of economy and trading, at least to make commerce raiding useful way to wage war. OW must be alive place, not the vast empty arena just for fighting, and players must be part of it. Or else it should be abandoned and we should be back to arena battles.

36 minutes ago, admin said:

I am also wondering how i can make this combat trading refit into the game without ruining FPS. 

WOW - heavy 2-decker East-Indiaman.

Edited November 20, 2019 by Malcolm3

[Never]

Crafting is fine as is, I don't understand why some people try to force NA to become something it just isn't. This game is about combat, so if someone doesn't like combat then NA is probably not for them, doesn't mean NA needs to become what every single age of sail fan wants it to be. 

The only thing wrong with trading is that it needs to go back to it's previous iteration, before the 100 ton patch. Before that patch trading was as good as it needed to be. The patch wasn't needed, I still don't understand why it was changed. Trading used to work perfectly. 

[Conte D. Catellani]

The main problem is to wander around to find something to sink. 

I took a mission about sinking 10 Surprise at Cuba. Moved there and I started to go back and forward along the North coast. Nothing, on the way to home I found a t brig whit inside pudding and cheese, then when I decided to go back at home I was sinked. 2 hours for pudding and cheese.. That not help to keep people, is frustrating. 

 

EDIT:  since you use DLC to gain money why is not plaanned to make DLC chest with dobloons and if you want other random stuff inside?

Edited November 21, 2019 by Conte D. Catellani
info about chest/gold DLC to support dev costs

[Thonys]

2 hours ago, admin said:

 

You should look at it this way. We always (from the start of early prototyping in 2014) stated that the game will have basic crafting and basic trading. It is in game. Its the best we can do..

• We always say we have the best looking ships and best age of sail combats with leeway and yards. 
• We NEVER said we have the best crafting. We have basic crafting and basic trading just barely enough to support the feature described above. Take a good from a deliver to point b - that's it. Gather resources - click a button - that's it. We never advertised the game as a crafting game. There was no a single ad for naval action which mentioned crafting. Trailer has no workers hitting hammers, or gathering tobacco. Texts say you can build ships and thats it.

This is literally what is said about trading and crafting.

Trading and privateering – Buy trading goods at low prices, haul them to distant places for high profits. Board ships and sell them and their cargo at nearby ports. Use shallow waters at your advantage to escape from larger ships. Shipbuilding and manufacturing - Build ships, upgrades and cannons, supply your clans or your nation or set up shops in free towns to sell to your enemies.

We have 15 detailed paragraphs on combat and 2 sentences on trading and crafting. Better crafting is not there, was not there, was not advertised anywhere. 
This is all we have

• Buy goods at low prices and haul them to distant places = check
• Board ships and sell cargo = check
• Build ships = check
• Supply your clans or your nations with... (repairs, ships, cannons) = check

Crafting was proposed by players in 2015 and added because players requested it (in original pre-launch version you were a naval officer or a pirate, you could only capture ships from others or buy them from the government). When basic buildings and crafting was added players were happy with at least some crafting because previously they had nothing. 

Given the facts stated above - we have basic crafting and advertised basic crafting - why people are unhappy with it??

You can accept it as it is. Or ask for removal. We are focused on new player retention and NPC aggression. Crafting is not on the priority list and will remain as is, with only minor changes. We can remove it if it is annoying everyone. Hope this brings it into proper perspective. We can keep it as is - or cut it. 

I am 100x more interested in fixing battle sails, adding wind shadow, adding non-binary rudder, adding hull leeway, rig entanglement in close counters, wind strength and variety, barometer - to predict wind change and direction ... you get the idea what i am good at, best age of sail combat and best looking ships.

I am also wondering how i can make this combat trading refit into the game without ruining FPS. 

Why should I think about crafting? Can someone popularly explain as I am five? From all i read it sucks, trading sucks and if i was a medical doctor i would just amputate and removed the aching leg to stop the gangrene of bad opinions from spreading. No crafting = no problem of bad reviews.

To summarize
Crafting can be improved - probably. Can it be done without research and iteration - No. Are current customers of crafting happy? Based on the forums - No. Is there risk in changing crafting - Yes huge risk. Did those customers bash us, expressed outrage and punish us for risky changes - yes. Based on this answers crafting should not be touched.

We do not believe in changes in crafting because community got tired of experiments. Will it be better if we cut out crafting completely? No. So let it be as is.. Crafting its not the best but its ok and it will be worse without it for those who like it as it is.

 

"Why should I think about crafting? Can someone popularly explain as I am five? From all i read it sucks,"

 

we kill more ships in one day in NA...... than sunk  in history  in a century...

a lot of people are complete stupid and have no idea of reality, ship building, and crafting in general.

actually i plea for a intensifying use of goods and material by factor 3 (ships are to easy to make)  and are more handled like waste or disposable items. it is disgusting if you ask me.

increase crafting material please ....

seriously increase making ships by factor 3 for materials and items...

that's what you should think ABOUT CRAFTING.

                                                                                       YEAH IT sucks WHEN YOU LOSE A SHIP...

(A SHIP IS NOT A WOT TANK  OR WAR THUNDER PLANE....  ITS A SAILING VESSEL  )

 

TIME TO HEAR THE WHINERS COMPLAIN HOW DIFFICULT IT IS TO BUILD A SHIP ... LOL (SORRY FOR THE TROL)

[Thonys]

3 hours ago, admin said:

 

I am also wondering how i can make this combat trading refit into the game without ruining FPS. 

 

"I am also wondering how i can make this combat trading refit into the game without ruining FPS. "

Good news 

i have looked 10 times  at it and saw my pc running at 60 FPS 

no problem, on this side  

 

 

Edited November 21, 2019 by Thonys

[Capitan Salazar]

4 hours ago, admin said:

 

You should look at it this way. We always (from the start of early prototyping in 2014) stated that the game will have basic crafting and basic trading. It is in game. Its the best we can do..

• We always say we have the best looking ships and best age of sail combats with leeway and yards. 
• We NEVER said we have the best crafting. We have basic crafting and basic trading just barely enough to support the feature described above. Take a good from a deliver to point b - that's it. Gather resources - click a button - that's it. We never advertised the game as a crafting game. There was no a single ad for naval action which mentioned crafting. Trailer has no workers hitting hammers, or gathering tobacco. Texts say you can build ships and thats it.

This is literally what is said about trading and crafting.

Trading and privateering – Buy trading goods at low prices, haul them to distant places for high profits. Board ships and sell them and their cargo at nearby ports. Use shallow waters at your advantage to escape from larger ships. Shipbuilding and manufacturing - Build ships, upgrades and cannons, supply your clans or your nation or set up shops in free towns to sell to your enemies.

We have 15 detailed paragraphs on combat and 2 sentences on trading and crafting. Better crafting is not there, was not there, was not advertised anywhere. 
This is all we have

• Buy goods at low prices and haul them to distant places = check
• Board ships and sell cargo = check
• Build ships = check
• Supply your clans or your nations with... (repairs, ships, cannons) = check

Crafting was proposed by players in 2015 and added because players requested it (in original pre-launch version you were a naval officer or a pirate, you could only capture ships from others or buy them from the government). When basic buildings and crafting was added players were happy with at least some crafting because previously they had nothing. 

Given the facts stated above - we have basic crafting and advertised basic crafting - why people are unhappy with it??

You can accept it as it is. Or ask for removal. We are focused on new player retention and NPC aggression. Crafting is not on the priority list and will remain as is, with only minor changes. We can remove it if it is annoying everyone. Hope this brings it into proper perspective. We can keep it as is - or cut it. 

I am 100x more interested in fixing battle sails, adding wind shadow, adding non-binary rudder, adding hull leeway, rig entanglement in close counters, wind strength and variety, barometer - to predict wind change and direction ... you get the idea what i am good at, best age of sail combat and best looking ships.

I am also wondering how i can make this combat trading refit into the game without ruining FPS. 

Why should I think about crafting? Can someone popularly explain as I am five? From all i read it sucks, trading sucks and if i was a medical doctor i would just amputate and removed the aching leg to stop the gangrene of bad opinions from spreading. No crafting = no problem of bad reviews.

To summarize
Crafting can be improved - probably. Can it be done without research and iteration - No. Are current customers of crafting happy? Based on the forums - No. Is there risk in changing crafting - Yes huge risk. Did those customers bash us, expressed outrage and punish us for risky changes - yes. Based on this answers crafting should not be touched.

We do not believe in changes in crafting because community got tired of experiments. Will it be better if we cut out crafting completely? No. So let it be as is.. Crafting its not the best but its ok and it will be worse without it for those who like it as it is.

Thanks for the long and detailed reply sir.

I would like to remark that my clan member is mostly a trader. I have made some research about the subject, which included asking to other members of the community, and they told me trading was in much better shape some months ago. Seems that the goods had different weights and profit margins, the game had trade routes and people competed for buying items like textiles, terracota, furniture from paris and others. They told me it was fun, risky but also profitable. That´s what my clan mate was looking for.

[qw569😳]

8 hours ago, admin said:

Why should I think about crafting? Can someone popularly explain as I am five?

You can make your own opinion. Create account in War server and try to craft your first rate as real player (without God mode )

[huliotkd]

13 hours ago, admin said:

To summarize
Crafting can be improved - probably. Can it be done without research and iteration - No. Are current customers of crafting happy? Based on the forums - No. Is there risk in changing crafting - Yes huge risk. Did those customers bash us, expressed outrage and punish us for risky changes - yes. Based on this answers crafting should not be touched.

We do not believe in changes in crafting because community got tired of experiments. Will it be better if we cut out crafting completely? No. So let it be as is.. Crafting its not the best but its ok and it will be worse without it for those who like it as it is.

crafting can be changed as you did in the past @admin , so you can change it again. but crafting cannot be changed alone.

crafting is creation of ships so it must be changed simultaneously with death of the ships, and death of ships has to be changed before crafting.  so the ships must die more than now and the only thing you can do is to bring back the 1st Damage Patch of test server that means reducing HP of every ships (because you changed HP after guns damages).

the parameter on which to base the correct balance is that which allows a 1st rate to kill a 5th rate with 1 single broaside dismantling 2 or 3 masts and killing half the crew and wiping all structure. this is the correct parameter for Ship's Death.

Ship's Crafting , instead, has to be raised in resource demanding: 1st rates are end game for every player,especially the new ones that think ''i will have a 1st rates so i can destroy everything'' (clearly, if they are noobs they will always die VS a Vet but a strong damage output of the 1st Damage Patch can compensate a little the lack of skill), so the end game must be challenging and Line Ships must costs al lot of resources (1st rate 70k frame wood-45k planking, 2nd rate 50k - 30k, 3rd rate 30k-15k) and the other ships costs as they costs now. this will solve also the problem of spam of 1st rates in RVR or Screening battle.

all i wrote doesn't need any long programmer work because you have already the code and you need only to change numbers in codelines(Hp and Resources). you need only the will to do it, so open again Test Server

 

for Economy instead, you can introduce resource consumption by ports every N hours (this will require programmer work). that means players have their motivation to trade again from port to port to bring resources to port because without resources their Production Buildings can't produce the resources they need for crafting. so, for example, every port will consume 2k food resources (livestock + maze + beans etc etc = 2k ) every 6 hours and the port can stock a max of 10k of each food resource (10k livestock, 10k beans etc etc) so you have to move food every 3-4 days (or it will become a pain in the ass again). Capitals will require also some luxury goods like Historical Artifacts (in low quantity) and every port where you invest an N amount of port investment (new farm or port bonus) will start asking luxury goods also.

every 6 hours of resource consuming, prices will change so players can earn money with basic resources transports or filling empty port never used by nation but useful to make money with this resource consming

[Angus MacDuff]

This thread has been hijacked into a trading and crafting discussion.

[Conte D. Catellani]

A DLC chest with dobloons and random items could be a solution. Or just dobloons.. 

[Capitan Salazar]

On 11/18/2019 at 10:08 PM, admin said:

11 successful chests were raided this weekend. If we only take into account combat marks the average payout was 25 marks. (21 worst chest -28 best chest) + doubloons + victory marks.

Those who can make more combat marks in a couple of hours should continue what they are doing. Those who cant make 25 combat and 1-3 victory marks in 1-2 hours can just raid the ports and make the same. You probably forgot victory marks are unattainable for a 3-6 men groups and they can get them by raiding. Your perceived value has no serious implications on the average player. We know people who make 3 mln reals per trip according to your logic i should make everyone make 3 mln. reals per trip. 
 

I made a raid a few days ago with 4 players (from another clan, mine is dead).

After going back to port and split the rewards I was like "wtf, I have wasted my time". Even I thought I was a fool for risking a good ship for a mission with such low rewards (my ship was a bucentaure with good woods and modifications).

[jodgi]

22 hours ago, admin said:

I am 100x more interested in fixing battle sails, adding wind shadow, adding non-binary rudder, adding hull leeway, rig entanglement in close counters, wind strength and variety, barometer - to predict wind change and direction ... you get the idea what i am good at, best age of sail combat and best looking ships.

And I am 100x more interested in spending time playing with what you have done best since 2015 than faffing about with hauling, crafting, grinding cash to compensate for loss, dealing with loss mechanic induced PvP aversion and similar detrimental distractions.

People now think I'm a hater. I'm not. I adore core NA. I like the fun and good stuff and want to avoid the boring and bad stuff. 

#liberateNA

[admin]

15 hours ago, qw569 said:

You can make your own opinion. Create account in War server and try to craft your first rate as real player (without God mode )

You can capture a 1st rate for free  Just like it was long before release. Its how it is supposed to be. All ships except for premium exclusive vessels can now be captured for your own use. Players did not ask for it but the majority actually wanted that.

In terms of crafting the easiness of crafting first rates was always a main concern of players. If you search the forum - there are 100s of posts asking to limit first rates, there are even proposals to limit first rates by 2 per nation. Its ridiculous that we were even reading them seriously and responding to them. Can you imagine if we listened and limited 1st rates to 22 players (earning 22*40 = 880 dollars) locking out all other 150,000 players from the wonderful creations - the carriers or spaceships of the age of sail.

We know first rate can be crafted with just one friend in a reasonable amount of time. Now it is possible to do without hauling (in some ports)

[znôrt]

@admin,  it's been a while you wrote a post making so much sense. glad to have you back.

On 11/20/2019 at 10:52 PM, admin said:

I am 100x more interested in fixing battle sails, adding wind shadow, adding non-binary rudder, adding hull leeway, rig entanglement in close counters, wind strength and variety, barometer - to predict wind change and direction ... you get the idea what i am good at, best age of sail combat and best looking ships.

take my money!

[admin]

7 hours ago, Capitan Salazar said:

I made a raid a few days ago with 4 players (from another clan, mine is dead).

After going back to port and split the rewards I was like "wtf, I have wasted my time". Even I thought I was a fool for risking a good ship for a mission with such low rewards (my ship was a bucentaure with good woods and modifications).

What were your rewards ? 

[Despe]

somobody knows if raiders can attack any port or only capital ports?