Explosions feedback

[Poryv]

Totaly agree with Anolytics suggestions

[Complete-Disaster]

11 minutes ago, rediii said:

In my oppinion:

 

Short-Term Hotfix:

- Deactivate the ability to turn off survival for ships that have no fireship-fitting as a perm upgrade

- Remove fireship 1-3 from the game

Long Term mechanic should focus more on fire and not on the explosion itself see @Anolytics post

 

 

Burning sails could be an option? the moment a fireship caughts fire it will take sail damage over time till it reaches 0 and the ship will be just a burning nuke in the open sea;)

[Angus MacDuff]

Just now, Complete-Disaster said:

Burning sails could be an option? the moment a fireship caughts fire it will take sail damage over time till it reaches 0 and the ship will be just a burning nuke in the open sea;)

Very true.  Many explosions were premature.  It was a common problem!

[admin]

We have tested again and again and there is absolutely no damage coming above 400 meters unless the exploding ship is a fireship (then it will increase the distance by 50%)



We will provide tunes that will allow to clearly identify the fireships on wednesday together with some tuning of the explosion damage to crew and slight reduction of distance.
Crew damage is i think too high. If you are not bracing the explosion kills ALL crew on the opposing ship at 200m. Bracing saves almost all crew. But without bracing losing 100% of crew at 200 m is somewhat too high. There is not enough pressure difference due to shockwave to be so deadly at this distance behind wooden wall 

But we will keep all other damage in explosions strong and only slightly adjust it. Fireships are amazing counters and provide the way for a newbie to be useful and take out 4 pros if they blob like cattle and do not keep distance in station keeping. 

 

[Liq]

Im not a fan of this as big battles are decided within minutes; get a decent fireship in and the competetive battle is done - feels just like either ganking or being ganked afterwards, depending on how lucky you get / if RNG is on your side or not... Basically a gamble.. 

You should make a poll on this.. Prerty sure most players, all nations, prefer the original fireship Mechanics

[erelkivtuadrater]

34 minutes ago, Liq said:

Im not a fan of this as big battles are decided within minutes; get a decent fireship in and the competetive battle is done - feels just like either ganking or being ganked afterwards, depending on how lucky you get / if RNG is on your side or not... Basically a gamble.. 

You should make a poll on this.. Prerty sure most players, all nations, prefer the original fireship Mechanics

i believe its one more element to take into consideration when fighting though. Also it can shift a battle in the opposite direction if someone are getting crushed. In RVR you can usually see the outcome in the first 30 mins, and it usually becomes a clean wipe of one the sides with the winning sides loses maybe 2-3 ships.

But I can agree though, that you shouldn't be able to turn off survival if you dont have the fireship refit. Maybe the ship should start to lose crew if he turns of survival if its a fireship? simulating that the captain makes the command to abandon ship?

[North]

59 minutes ago, erelkivtuadrater said:

i believe its one more element to take into consideration when fighting though. Also it can shift a battle in the opposite direction if someone are getting crushed. In RVR you can usually see the outcome in the first 30 mins, and it usually becomes a clean wipe of one the sides with the winning sides loses maybe 2-3 ships.

But I can agree though, that you shouldn't be able to turn off survival if you dont have the fireship refit. Maybe the ship should start to lose crew if he turns of survival if its a fireship? simulating that the captain makes the command to abandon ship?

Most battles in RvR is about player skill or fleet skills.

If battle is desided om 30 min is because tactical mistake or that the player skill diffrence is to high.

Edited December 9, 2019 by North

[Sir Texas Sir]

10 hours ago, rediii said:

Fireships back in the days also didn't sail together in line with the fleet, exchanged full broadsides with the enemy and then explode with 1000 ppl on board.

Fireships are now obvious aswell because they generate 1-3 fires every broadside they receive. They are also faster than fighting ships.

 

You cant realy focus fireships as you might think because they will get close enough most of the time to do damage and compared to the BR they need they will do a lot of damage. Maybe this will even lead to more mixed fleets in PBs

One thing they also didn't do was put a bunch of expensive (in real life) cannons on a fireship.  So what the mod can actually do is limit the crew and cannons on a ship.  Than you know if that first rate is running 200 crew with no cannons it's a fireship.  This way the fireship can't try to rage board some one while on fire or get lit......they will be way under crew to do anything other than man the sails of that ship.

[Elric]

Personally, I feel there should NEVER be 100% crew kill from these explosions - except on the exploding ship.

The battles are become more of an arcade game.  Not what I expect of a game that promotes itself as a realistic naval combat game.

[z4ys]

5 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

One thing they also didn't do was put a bunch of expensive (in real life) cannons on a fireship.  So what the mod can actually do is limit the crew and cannons on a ship.  Than you know if that first rate is running 200 crew with no cannons it's a fireship.  This way the fireship can't try to rage board some one while on fire or get lit......they will be way under crew to do anything other than man the sails of that ship.

But then a fire ship should get a button to start a fire and not wait/rely for some random cannon shots to ignite the powder.

 

[Farrago]

9 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

One thing they also didn't do was put a bunch of expensive (in real life) cannons on a fireship.  So what the mod can actually do is limit the crew and cannons on a ship.  Than you know if that first rate is running 200 crew with no cannons it's a fireship.  This way the fireship can't try to rage board some one while on fire or get lit......they will be way under crew to do anything other than man the sails of that ship.

I like this suggestion tho it would be cool if the fire ship appeared normal (crew and cannons) until it had closed to a certain distance of an enemy ship. 

[Cpt Eole]

2 hours ago, Farrago said:

I like this suggestion tho it would be cool if the fire ship appeared normal (crew and cannons) until it had closed to a certain distance of an enemy ship. 

I think the amount of crew and canons put on a fireship should be at the discretion of each player. But I agree that fiireships should be recognizable if players pay attention.

Suggestions:

The upgrade fireship could add some gunpowder barrels on upper deck which can be seen by other player.

Because of the upgrade fireship lowers decks canons are locked and cannot fire any single ball because of the space occupied by the gunpowder barrels.

Edited December 10, 2019 by Capitaine Eole

[Ivan87]

 

I love nukes, but I think I bought a ships game... not a WWIII game...

I'm sorry but it's a disastrous idea

[erelkivtuadrater]

7 hours ago, Graf Bernadotte said:

Nice that you admitted your mistake. Do I get compensation for my random Ocean with upgrades now? I lossed it due to an explosion 200 m away. I had full health and full crew before. It took me 10 hours game play of gathering CMs, Doublons, Reals and resources to built it. Only to get wiped out by a fault of your company I paid a lot of money for the promise of a functioning game.

this is abit off topic though.. but hold on.. 10 HOURS? for a ship that should be the very last obtainable object? @admin get those permits out of the admirality and into the epic events right now 😮

[admin]

The feature is currently working as intended and deadly explosions is not a bug.  But needs tweaking. 
Off topic conversation was removed. This topic is about explosions feedback

[Dalai Lama]

Me too would like to see the removal of the option to disable survival unless you have the fireship upgrade. 

It is really annoying in pvp as the loosing side tends to blow itself up to prevent kill or capture which kills immersion and makes e.g. looting even more difficult, fighting predictable, prelongs fight unnecessarily...

Right now it feels more like the pacific in mid 20th century rather then the caribbean in 18th century.

[erelkivtuadrater]

2 hours ago, Henry Durnin said:

It is really annoying in pvp as the loosing side tends to blow itself up to prevent kill or capture which kills immersion and makes e.g. looting even more difficult, fighting predictable, prelongs fight unnecessarily...

wasnt this already a thing like always? I know if i were ganked by 200 people and only managed to kill 187 of them and was set on fire with a destiny to die anyways, i would turn off survival to blow up. But maybe give a reason to surrender the ship instead of blowing up if you dont have the "maybe to come fireship refit", like higher insurance or keep upgrade, or the more crew you hire the more it cost, but if you surrender your ship in battle before it starts sinking you get your crew back etc

[Farrago]

37 minutes ago, erelkivtuadrater said:

wasnt this already a thing like always? I know if i were ganked by 200 people and only managed to kill 187 of them and was set on fire with a destiny to die anyways, i would turn off survival to blow up. But maybe give a reason to surrender the ship instead of blowing up if you dont have the "maybe to come fireship refit", like higher insurance or keep upgrade, or the more crew you hire the more it cost, but if you surrender your ship in battle before it starts sinking you get your crew back etc

Agreed. There should be some motivation to saving the life of your crew.

[Dalai Lama]

11 hours ago, erelkivtuadrater said:

wasnt this already a thing like always? I know if i were ganked by 200 people and only managed to kill 187 of them and was set on fire with a destiny to die anyways, i would turn off survival to blow up. But maybe give a reason to surrender the ship instead of blowing up if you dont have the "maybe to come fireship refit", like higher insurance or keep upgrade, or the more crew you hire the more it cost, but if you surrender your ship in battle before it starts sinking you get your crew back etc

Good idea to give players some incentives to surrender rather then blow themselves up. Theres always been the options to surrender but theres no advantage over turnig yourself into a bomb. Crew and Insurance can be an option, but it might not be enough at the current state as crew is cheap and insurance brings just a few reales. 

Not sure how this could be solved, maybe increase the insurance to give partially back some doubs of the cost when you surrender, or make crew limited with national manpower as suggested before but this creates new problems through e.g. alts reducing manpower on purpose. 

[erelkivtuadrater]

3 hours ago, Henry Durnin said:

Good idea to give players some incentives to surrender rather then blow themselves up. Theres always been the options to surrender but theres no advantage over turnig yourself into a bomb. Crew and Insurance can be an option, but it might not be enough at the current state as crew is cheap and insurance brings just a few reales. 

Not sure how this could be solved, maybe increase the insurance to give partially back some doubs of the cost when you surrender, or make crew limited with national manpower as suggested before but this creates new problems through e.g. alts reducing manpower on purpose. 

if they have so hire crew starts with say x reals pr crew maybe up to 200, then x real from hiring 200-400 then 400-600 and if we carry on it will be expensive to crew the ships of the line, maybe especially the biggest 3rd rates the 2nd and 1st rates. Then it would make it more worth surrendering if you can get the crew back that you brought into the battle, but also if you're a new player its not expensive sailing a frigate.

This is a bit off topic though, but indirectly this would lead to people in high crew cost ships not suiciding with explosions?

Rough counted so maybe like 200 crew could cost 10k reals (50 reals each) , hiring from 200-400 crew range would cost 20k reals (100 reals each) etc, but hiring from 1000 to 1400 crew would cost 8kk ( 20k each crew member). This would create maybe a "usage cost" of the heavy lineships, where the reals gained from killing would normally sustain a decent usage of crew on the higher rated ships, but also new players wouldnt get punished for sailing lower rated ships.

Edited December 11, 2019 by erelkivtuadrater

[Vibrio Cholerae]

On 12/9/2019 at 10:44 PM, admin said:

Crew damage is i think too high

 

Fireships are amazing counters and provide the way for a newbie to be useful and take out 4 pros if they blob like cattle and do not keep distance in station keeping. 

after the PB of Port au prince 

I think that you can take out 15 People

 

[admin]

Off topic and empty posts removed.
We already said the explosions will be reworked and patched this week. 
 

[vazco]

16 minutes ago, admin said:

Off topic and empty posts removed.
We already said the explosions will be reworked and patched this week. 
 

I'm confused. Do I understand correctly that we shouldn't comment explosions here? If so, is it indefinite, or time-limited?

[admin]

11 minutes ago, vazco said:

I'm confused. Do I understand correctly that we shouldn't comment explosions here? If so, is it indefinite, or time-limited?

Talking about krupp cemented armor is not feedback. There is a tavern and national news sections like this. Comedy is welcome in those sections, and can ligthen up someone's day. 

Here is the link https://forum.game-labs.net/forum/53-national-news/ 

This topic is for feedback and analysis. All off topic will be removed.

 

[vazco]

4 minutes ago, admin said:

This topic is for feedback and analysis

Ok then.

My feedback is that explosions right now have no counter and remove the validity of all other tactics, as proven in two port battles / screening fightsd today. It's good that you plan to change them.

Explosions as we had them before last changes were well balanced - a fireship could turn the battle around, however wasn't reliable enough to be used repeatedly, invalidating other tactics. Just changing timing of explosions, and leaving all other statistics as they were, would be an improvement good enough to make them fun, but not overpowered.