Reinforcement fleets: feedback

[Fletch]

Once everyone stops playing at the capital and disperses to the far corners of the map to PVE all your have is your empty pvp zone to pvp in.  good luck with that.

[Vile Executioner]

51 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

Historically you didn't sit in the bay of London killing folks either.  

Blackbeard raided Charlestown, raised port royal and havana. Your wrong lol this is the carribean mate. Blackbeard raided Charlestown for medicine lol. And that’s just one pirate. Black Sams wreck is found outside of Boston harbor. Here is a list of all the wrecks on the Florida coast for instance from traders, warships and pirate wrecks. Pirates actively hunted outside of capitals of Europe to, look for Barbary pirates for instance.

[Sento de Benimaclet]

3 nights ago a captain who had 2 indianman in Mariel was attacked by 2 hercules. He asked for reinforcements and 2 mercurys came out. I imagine the laughter of the attackers. There can not be an intermediate point ?, Before, it was still excessive (it was really a safe area), but now it is a safe zone of attack and sinking. 

[Teutonic]

2 hours ago, Vile Executioner said:

Yes, but in order to do anything in EVE first you must leave HI sec to get anything done. There is no reason to leave reinforcement for the pve player. What reason do you have to leave reinforcement? You can build anything you want, do whatever you want, get whatever resource you want(even if it’s high priced) and be perfectly happy. That’s not a sandbox pvp game. There is s server out there to do exactly that.

You can do everything but capital warfare in high-sec eve online. Yes even pvp through a war declaration mechanic.

It just so happens that low-sec and null-sec are 10 times better.

There needs to be more and better bonuses outside the safezone. Constantly restricting what can be done in the safezone is going to get us nowhere.

@Christendom @Sir Texas Sir Battles in the safezone need to close for the attacker and stay open for the defender. Instead we have attackers abusing the open battle in the defenders zone to reinforce greater numbers and more powerful ships. 

Edited May 8, 2018 by Teutonic

[Tiedemann]

8 hours ago, admin said:

• if you used reinforcements - when did they help and when they were useless?

I used it once to help protect 3 trade ships. One of the reinforcement ships spawned on a collision course with one of my traders that where running. Result they both stop, and my trader get's boarded by an enemy player. I was able to escape with 2 out of 3 ships. So it kinda worked out, but the enemy players where never ever in any danger of getting sunk..

Imo the AI in reinforcement fleets are to weak and predictable against player who knows how AI behave, so they are not very good at protecting anything. Having 1. rates spawn is a overkill and just not realistic. Therefor I would much rather prefere that the reinforcement AI was buffed to epic event AI. They are much harder to kill, they are fast even when chained down and they a pose a real threat to players. 

They could also be taught to stay and protect the player ships, in sted of wandering off after a single ship they can never catch anyway.. Or learn them to use chain..! 😅

I forgot that the AI reinforcement fleet was demoted. So it's on the to-do list to test this from the other perspective 😈

[Aster]

I'm fine with reinforcements as they are now. It provides a deterrent to attacking people in the zone but more over it prolongs the battle which lets other players join in to help if they so choose. I find that the AI can be dangerous but if its just AI its more of an annoyance then a true danger. 

[Retrin]

what do you want to 'protect' in the zones: traders or new players in war ships?

if it is traders ... then have the AI that show up be over powering, as trade is the life blood of a nation it makes sense that a capitol port would send out its big ships to protect the traders

if it is the new players on war ships ... then have the AI that show up be over powering 

no reason to 'protect' all ships equal ... 

 

[King of Crowns]

12 hours ago, Christendom said:

Yea but PVPers already have EVERY advantage in this game.  You need to throw a bone to the little people or they will stop playing.  Which it seems they already have.  

clearly stated by some one who doesn't pvp. PVE/NEWB has super ai reinforce zone. fortress/towers. open world AI. full 1 1/2 hour open battle in capital area that the enemy can freely choose the join location. none of these factors work towards the pvper. all of them work towards the newb. and any one of them could easily get you killed. 

what otto says here is 100% correct.   "AI should not do all the work of protecting home waters - players should do that. Battle beeing open for the whole duration is enough help. " until every nation runs a coast guard fleet they will loose players. GB has done a great job with their new coast guard. and it is working to save their newbs and create content. 

[Sparkydog]

Ok here is my opinion from someone who can only play for an hour or so at a time during the work week.  I might get on before bed, late at night west coast time because that's the only time I can play.  The pop is low at this time and it's not possible to have a US coastguard to help you outside CT, there is only a few of us on at this time.  I might want to hit NPCs or run a quick mission and be done.  I don't want to get sucked into a 90'minute battle- so I would rarely leave green zone at this time. If I would get jumped the reinforcement fleet would be the only help I would expect. This is the way it is for some of us- why not even make the reinforcement ship one rate higher than attacker? Then it would be slower than attacker and he could either escape to jump someone else or if he had skills he could stay and battle it out.

on the other hand- if I play on a day off or have more time- I will leave the green zone and look for longer more elaborate PVP battles out in the OW or at other nations territories.  This seems to make sense to me - and I wonder how many others play in a similar fashion. Just one sea dogs opinion.

[Sir William Hargood]

I was in a Traders Lynx and was tagged by Sayid in a Prince right next to Carlisle. I called reinforcements which appeared in a Navy Brig right next to him. Silly me not having guns or repairs as I was in a low key trade run. The Brig did some damage but Sayid had no problem whatsoever outmaneuvering him and reducing my ship to 43% sails. I only survived thanks to support from nation players. In my opinion the AI reinforcement was of zero value in this case.

[seanjo]

7 hours ago, Teutonic said:

 

@Christendom @Sir Texas Sir Battles in the safezone need to close for the attacker and stay open for the defender. Instead we have attackers abusing the open battle in the defenders zone to reinforce greater numbers and more powerful ships. 

3

I agree...

 

The safe zones are about protecting new players IMO, reinforcements don't do that. We need to encourage a growing player base not club it at the source.

[Sento de Benimaclet]

Obviously, it is no longer a safe area. It was when they went out to help first rates. And it's not that I say it, it's a popular clamor. This is a debate where people will never agree. Those who attack in the green zone seem to change well, those who carry merchants in the area feel little less than unprotected. There must be an intermediate point. For example, if one attacks in green zone with a fifth class, (trinco, endymion) the best fourth reinforcement class comes out (Consti, Agamemnon). Always a superior class to the boat that attacks. It is not the first class protection of before but you can get close to that intermediate point. Just like that, everyone is half satisfied. Regards!!.

[Glorgir]

I can only give an opinion on the few times I have attacked a Trader inside a reinforcement Zone.

The AI were no deterrent, spawned too far away, easy to outmanouver and escape from.

I cannot give any Input into the effectiveness of the AI when being attacked, as I have no safe Zone, can be attacked outside every port with no Chance to call for help.

This is not a complaint, we Chose the Nation we play for, but please, for those of you who can call reinforcements, thank your lucky stars, a ittle help is better than none

[Simon Cadete]

I got attacked by a Prussian Endymion around Beaufort the other day. I was in a rattlesnake (the one from the tutorials). I called reinforcements and got a bellepoule. I had to keep going towards it because it kept getting stuck in the wind. In the end I got the kill on the Endymion with the ai ship getting the assist. 

The reinforcements ships work but you gotta know what you’re doing. A new player or a care bear will still die because the ai ships are easy to control or out maneuver. From a solo hunters perspective, I like the current system

[Macjimm]

The reinforcement ships are not effective for traders.  Perhaps they could spawn close beside the enemy.  One friendly  reinforcement ship beside each enemy ganker.   At least very close to your own nation's capital, it would be nice to have some protection that is a deterrent

[Christendom]

8 hours ago, King of Crowns said:

clearly stated by some one who doesn't pvp. PVE/NEWB has super ai reinforce zone. fortress/towers. open world AI. full 1 1/2 hour open battle in capital area that the enemy can freely choose the join location. none of these factors work towards the pvper. all of them work towards the newb. and any one of them could easily get you killed. 

what otto says here is 100% correct.   "AI should not do all the work of protecting home waters - players should do that. Battle beeing open for the whole duration is enough help. " until every nation runs a coast guard fleet they will loose players. GB has done a great job with their new coast guard. and it is working to save their newbs and create content. 

I actually do 10x the amount of solo PvP you do.  Do you even remember what that is?  I don’t roll out in first rates in the patrol zones or hide out on TS until I have enough people to show my face out of port with.  Most of my marks come from solo hunting during our off times (EU prime).  I’m exactly the type of feedback admin is looking for here. But leave it to you to grind that axe on every thread.

If this game has 2x or 3x the amount of players I would agree with you.  But it doesn’t.  With peak times in the 450 players range split into 11 different nations...The ability to put up a constant coast guard isn’t really an option for new people.  In lieu of the players protecting rookies and traders, the game itself has to.  If our goal is to retain players anyway.  If not the we should by all means continue on the course we’ve been going, we’ve been quickly running out of seals to club.  What then?

Another thought would be to provide game incentives to those who coast guard and protect traders and rookies.  Maybe more PVP marks for players killed inside the safe zone?  Would that encourage people to leave them though?  Doubtful.  I’m not sure what the answer is, but I do know that letting veteran players beat up PVE guys and rookies pretty much unchecked is a very good way to get people to quit the game.

I suppose we need admin to officially come up with a goal of how effective he wants the safe zones to be

 

 

Edited May 9, 2018 by Christendom

[Sir Loorkon]

I think the amount of reinforcement ships should depend on the rank of the player calling them. Up to the rank of Master and Commander, there should be 2 ships, up to the rank of Postcaptain there should be 1 ship and Admirals should not get any reinforcement at all. 

[Roronoa]

13 hours ago, Intrepido said:

A new player playing in the reinforcement zone. Enjoy @admin

that was not in thereinforcement zone, he started a mission right outside the reinforcement zone but thought he were still inside

[admin]

On 5/8/2018 at 10:58 PM, Archaos said:

. Personally I used to attack a lot of AI fleets in the Belize green zone, now I have moved elsewhere. I have also heard of many solo hunters that avoid the green zones because of the forever open battles. 

This will be fixed next patch
Reinforcement zones will only be open forever for the owner of the zone
We will also allow attack of enemies by enemies in the capital waters (so enemy hunters cannot hide from other hunters behind the protection of capital)
 

[z4ys]

Pls remove pve missions completely as we dont need that testing feature anymore

[vazco]

1 hour ago, admin said:

This will be fixed next patch
Reinforcement zones will only be open forever for the owner of the zone
We will also allow attack of enemies by enemies in the capital waters (so enemy hunters cannot hide from other hunters behind the protection of capital)
 

Battles open for all are right now the only source of fun encounters with many enemies which are available right away (in NA terms this means 1-2h from sailing out) . If you make it open just for one side, you will remove this. I expect many players will leave then. There's no alternative option to get such battles. 

Having your capital nearby is already an advantage that works. 

Edited May 10, 2018 by vazco

[Sir Texas Sir]

On 5/9/2018 at 8:11 AM, Sir Loorkon said:

I think the amount of reinforcement ships should depend on the rank of the player calling them. Up to the rank of Master and Commander, there should be 2 ships, up to the rank of Postcaptain there should be 1 ship and Admirals should not get any reinforcement at all. 

I kinda of like this but only the first half part.  Make it two ships to support any one Master Com and below and any one above that rank gets one ship.  Even Rear Admirals can use help specially if out number.

6 hours ago, admin said:

This will be fixed next patch
Reinforcement zones will only be open forever for the owner of the zone
We will also allow attack of enemies by enemies in the capital waters (so enemy hunters cannot hide from other hunters behind the protection of capital)
 

See he is a prime example of the problem, the solo hunters aren't the probelm it's the groups that come up and gank folks.  Those are who your hearing most the complaints about. Hell we don't mind the 1-2 guys groups hunting in our waters as it keeps us on our toes, it's when folks come up with 5-10 ships is the issue and than wonder why folks won't fight them cause they out class the lower levels and newer players big time.

These are good fix's I think in the right direction.  They should not be prime hunting grounds for PvP players.  That and the issue is why aren't these PvP players/hunters attacking each other.  Many of times I seen one or two groups just sitting outside of CT waiting for victims and not attacking each other.  Funny they are the same players on here we hear bitch about not enough PvP or RvR but some how they never attack each other....lol

6 hours ago, Intrepido said:

Buff or improve npc behaviour. We are tired of all the guys crying and complaining about being ganked at safe zones. 

Also the three missions cancellation was one of the worst thing lately added. They share cancellation with everything!!! 

The missions should be wipe clean at server reset. I shouldn't have to use my cancellations straight off on a new day cause I have missions left over the day before that i no longer need. 

6 hours ago, z4ys said:

Pls remove pve missions completely as we dont need that testing feature anymore

I would honestly leave them for up to a certain level.  Lets say Master Com as that is the mid level and you can make that with the exams, but not every one can pass it.  Cause really it's hard to find the lower rank ships around capital/deep water ports.  I would love to see more AI fleets of better mix for different level ships to be honest if the missions are touched at all. 

5 hours ago, vazco said:

Battles open for all are right now the only source of fun encounters with many enemies which are available right away (in NA terms this means 1-2h from sailing out) . If you make it open just for one side, you will remove this. I expect many players will leave then. There's no alternative option to get such battles. 

Having your capital nearby is already an advantage that works. 

Uh manybe they need to go pick a fight with another RvR/PvP nation and they will get fights instead of picking fights with new players, casuals and carebears?   You want to know how to get a fight?  Go flip a major port of a clan and you will get a reaction.  That what we been doing to get our fights.  When was the last time half these players actually went and did RvR?   I'm not talking about empty ports I'm talking about flipping a port in one of the prime time and fighting it out?  Take a look at all the port battles we had over the last few weeks and who actually started them and who hasn't done a single port battle.  I also don't mean to go flip a weak nations port.  You want a fight, you want RvR/PvP than pick a nation that can fight back and go pick a port of there's that is major econ.  When was the last time LIttle Harbour, Nassua, Cart, Estro's, La Navas.....etc any of the major money making ports been attacked?   I hear folks constantly saying, "There is no PvP."  Well go make it than, that is how it was done in POTBS you went to flip a port and put it into red (didn't even have to put it into Port battle) and you had PvP in front of that port.  You can do the same in game.  Go to one of those ports and do one set of missions and see how fast defenders come out and jump into your missions. If your such a great PvP folks than you would be doing stuff like this not camping capitals for your PvP.   You know why we have a lack of RvR/PvP?  Cause most of the PvP/RvR guys that are so call Vets/Elite refuse to fight each other for the most part.

[Vernon Merrill]

Yep.  Time to remove "Missions" altogether...   promoting a false sense of security is worse that actually NOT providing any...

The sea is a dangerous and unforgiving mistress...

Time to take the training wheels off....

[Fletch]

26 minutes ago, Vernon Merrill said:

Yep.  Time to remove "Missions" altogether...   promoting a false sense of security is worse that actually NOT providing any...

The sea is a dangerous and unforgiving mistress...

Time to take the training wheels off....

Are you serious? There is already a massive lack of content in the game why would you remove what little there is. instead of introducing more.

I would like to see a lot more dynamic events including escort missions invasions all sorts of other stuff. Dont remove what little we have.

Edited May 11, 2018 by Fletch67

[Vernon Merrill]

6 minutes ago, Fletch67 said:

Are you serious? There is already a massive lack of content in the game why would you remove what little there is. instead of introducing more.

I would like to see a lot more dynamic events including escort missions invasions all sorts of other stuff. Dont remove what little we have.

I'm sure there's plenty of traders in nation that absolutely love an escort...  you should post something in chat.

Other than that, there is ZERO difference between "Missions" and finding AI fleets out in the OW (except for the fact that missions keep players from adding to the OW player-base)...