Forthcoming patch final discussion.

[Farrago]

1 hour ago, Red Dragon 13 said:

I think Pirates and Sweden should be switched

Agree but Pirates should still be centrally located at Mortimer and give the Swedes more ports.

But what do I know, I've never played either nation. 

[Sir Texas Sir]

10 minutes ago, sounthernrebel78 said:

My biggest concern is Larger clans being able to lock out clans from ports if they wish. There are a ton of internal issues with clans in some of the nations. Are we going to be able to attack ports within our own nation if the owning clan has us listed as unfriendly. IF we don't have the ability to attack ports and player of our respected nation than the problems that we currently have with inter-clan relations are only going to get worst because you can now prevent certain clans from getting into port battles and from getting into ports.

You can't lock a clan of your nation out of a port.  Port battle yes by not adding them to the friends list. What I don't like about the friend list it doesn't allow for some random clanless to join either.   That is how a lot of times clans recruits new folks by letter them roll with them while they do agro and join the Port battle if there is room.  It's also how a lot of the extra slots are filled that one clan couldn't fill themselves.    As for same nation clan vs clan that wasn't mention in this post so maybe that was removed from the list of changes.   

To me the patch will give clans more control over port battles and ports than a nation.  So you don't have one nation that every port battle is filled by and controlled by one clan. Other clans can still go off and do there own thing if they want.  You just have to have the numbers or friendly clans to suppose the attack.  I like that the none owned neutral ports will have AI defenses as it keeps from just every one grabbing random empty ports too.  

[DeRuyter]

1 hour ago, Duncan McFail said:

Tommy's got a point I think everyone agrees with. Even if there aren't as many people that pvp or rvr most would probably agree that they don't want to spend the bulk their time grinding, gathering, and transporting. In fact I'd bet a lot more people would want to spend their time getting into pvp and rvr if they didn't have to spend so much time on those tasks mentioned.

+1 to @TommyShelby post. Pre wipe I spent time crafting and ship building and yet still could go out for pvp as a casual player. Post wipe I was spending too much time grinding pve and trading and in the end I hardly had time to pvp and didn't really get the sought after refits and skill books. I wouldn't mind going out in a capped AI ship or one without the "necessary" mods, but it would be a waste of time because you get nothing for getting sunk by a player with a fully modded ship.

Patch looks like it will help with crafting grind. Get rid of RNG skill book/refit drops - grinding pve for mods. Then there is the repairs/repairing but that's another topic.  

[Bach]

1 hour ago, Duncan McFail said:

Pretty sure France did give a crap. Pretty sure if server hadn't died out many French would've used some forged papers, but instead they just left the game.

Tommy's got a point I think everyone agrees with. Even if there aren't as many people that pvp or rvr most would probably agree that they don't want to spend the bulk their time grinding, gathering, and transporting. In fact I'd bet a lot more people would want to spend their time getting into pvp and rvr if they didn't have to spend so much time on those tasks mentioned.

I'll address the first part. You were/are reading that French situation incorrectly. Sure some of the home bound French players would have used forged papers. But you weren't actually fighting those guys anyway. Purge, Bork, Rover and WO weren't going any where. They had no reason too.  They most affected French would have been the ICS, they like RvR and they had already used their forged papers.

Second part, I'm not seeing the "ideal concept" that Pvp players don't want sailing and not in those mentioned tasks. I know it sounds like it should be that way but in observations it doesn't actually trend.  The true pvp groups I know, BLACK included, will make the long sails as needed to support their goals. These are very goal driven players and often that goal is to go where the PvP is.  Now they may whine about the sailing a bit but they are all doing it to live out of free ports, build certain wood type ships and generally doing whatever they need to for a combat edge. The players that actually do stop playing the game due to these factors seem to be non-PvP players that aren't really into striving the extra mile to gain a combat edge.  That's just my observation.

 

Edited August 22, 2017 by Bach

[Hawkwood]

18 hours ago, Intrepido said:

And I really think you should have the hard choice to remove some nations. The playerbase is too splitted

Remove Spain?

What i see on EU server does not look very promising for them so......

[Bach]

12 hours ago, Intrepido said:

Fow how long?

Your pov about a global server doesnt represent the wishes of the hundreds who freely chose the EU server after the split.

Since you asked, almost my entire game play time of 2600 hours.

Here is the thing and it's no Surprise it all pivots around RvR.  I joined Jan 2016 and for the first couple months I played on PvP2 French.  Then the  RvR got stale and the population dropped off.  When the USA prime time population matched the pvp1 server I switched (april-ish). If all you can do is PvP anyway then you might as well just be a pirate on the EU server and you get higher pop weekends. So April 2016 on until the wipe I played EU server.  Post wipe I went back to PvP Global to get some RvR, I'm one of the rare French there that likes to dabble in it, so I played there until August 2017.  This followed the second mass pop die off following the wipe. So now I'm back on PvP EU with the out look that I'm here for the rest of the year again. With these new changes being discussed IF I wanted to try them out and IF PvP EU holds the PB restrictions then I will be forced to go back to Global again to try them out.  So it does matter if the servers merge or not because I keep getting forced to develope two characters. It would be awesome if they could figure out a way around that. Unlike you I don't get a choice to pick a PvP server vs a RvR server when population drops. For me it's simply play PvP or stop playing as the low pop RvR just sucks.  This isn't always the us vs. them USA vs. EU contest your painting it to be. Some of us are literally just stuck in the middle. Aussies got it worse than me.  A true one server solution that works solves a lot of problems.

[Thonys]

8 hours ago, Bart Smith said:

Anyway feature of name clans war companies would be nice. Eg Hansa or West Indies Company etc...

found this in the discussion (the answer to your question you were wondering about) 

• War corporations can fight other war corporations in the same nation ONLY in port battles

[admin]

Stay on topic captains. Captains who derail discussions to side issues make feedback comprehension hard. Off topic commenters will be temporarily placed on pre-mod as they make it impossible to have a constructive conversation about specific issues mentioned in the main post. 

 

To all players who commented about cost of pvp here.
Explain this - why there are no players on testbed slugging it out in so called low risk pvp? All slots are unlocked, all ships are free (loads of them). Where is nonstop pvp on testbed?

[Hodo]

11 minutes ago, admin said:

Stay on topic captains. Captains who derail discussions to side issues make feedback comprehension hard. Off topic commenters will be temporarily placed on pre-mod as they make it impossible to have a constructive conversation about specific issues mentioned in the main post. 

The problem I have found with the original post is it doesnt look like it fixes any of the underlying issues.  Like the problem with to many nations.  Every one seems to agree that there are to many nations.  Then the issue with Pirates not being pirates but instead another nation with no real drawbacks.   

So I fail to see how this patch is going to change anything.  

[admin]

3 minutes ago, Hodo said:

The problem I have found with the original post is it doesnt look like it fixes any of the underlying issues.  Like the problem with to many nations.  Every one seems to agree that there are to many nations.  Then the issue with Pirates not being pirates but instead another nation with no real drawbacks.   

So I fail to see how this patch is going to change anything.  

the patch notes do not mention pirates.

So lets talk about taxation port maintenance hostility and issues mentioned there. We are not interested in discussing ANYTHING else in this topic. 
pvp rewards are ok as they concern rewards and cost/rewards mentioned in the first clause. 

Stay on topic - last warning. If you are interested in talking about pirates - start your thread in suggestions. 

[admin]

8 minutes ago, Louis Garneray said:

Every time I have been on the testbed there was less than 10 players.

 

But there were a 100 on day one.
So risk free pvp against other people who are interested in risk free pvp does not interest risk free pvp fans? Does it mean that risk free pvp has zero retention? 
Did @TommyShelby meet @Otto Kohl and sank each other using 60 free redeemables (all new and unique ships), without any time wasting (everyone is near mortimer and you need to craft nothing, as everything is provide)

Or does it mean that wolves just don't want to fight wolves? (Even with double FPS and free ships). And getting pvp costs lower will have ZERO effect on pvp player goals?
Lets stop pretending. PvP players probably can't even retain each other. They need rabbits and should wait until we fix rabbit problems. 

[Prater]

15 minutes ago, Eyesore said:

Maybe play and make your own game? Think for yourself instead of listening to every loudmouth that likes to post some crap ideas and then defend them until the rest gives up? Maybe take responsibility for the actions/decisions the devs take?  Maybe do some reasonable changes instead of swinging from one extreme to the next, changing all kinds of parameters so it's impossible to see the exact effect of changes? Maybe don't promote alts/cheating? Maybe give correct info? Etc.

No, it's easier to blame the playerbase, because they all stop playing ... How many years now have people been posting ideas? Stop acting like a child.

TLDR: Do your job. And if you can't , consider looking for your replacement?

Nothing wrong with a developer looking for community input and desiring to develop a game players want to play.  But then again, be prepared to deal with people who don't have any physical investment and are trolls...

 

What few people counted on where how many different camps there would be and the difficulty to please all the camps.  So yes, we also need to take responsibility for the roles we have played, such as holding the devs hostage with blackmail about reviews or quitting the game, or giving ideas that have turned out to be bad.

 

P.s.  "stop acting like a child" is completely uncalled for.

Edited August 22, 2017 by Prater

[admin]

1 minute ago, Prater said:

Nothing wrong with a developer looking for community input and desiring to develop a game players want to play.  But then again, be prepared to deal with people who don't have any physical investment and are trolls...

We have learnt over time. Learning takes time  

[Bjerg Bjergsson]

I haven't got on the testbed because I've been struggling to grind through gold and resources to build ships so that my clan can play together.

I'm happy to play risk free pvp but that's not exactly the game I signed up for.. 

The OP ideas sound interesting.. unfortunately most of the stuff is not helpful to me or my clan as they consist primarily of noobs or people with 1-2 hours of gaming a night/week they can do. The ship crafting is probably the best news but I have yet to see how exactly that will break down vs. the stifling issues I and my clan have now (2 months of casual gameplay to secure resources just to build a shipyard lvl2). 

[Corona Lisa]

10 minutes ago, admin said:

But there were a 100 on day one.
So risk free pvp against other people who are interested in risk free pvp does not interest risk free pvp fans? Does it mean that risk free pvp has zero retention? 
Did @TommyShelby meet @Otto Kohl and sank each other using 60 free redeemables (all new and unique ships), without any time wasting (everyone is near mortimer and you need to craft nothing)

Or does it mean that wolves just don't want to fight wolves? (Even with double FPS). And getting pvp costs lower will have ZERO effect on pvp player goals?
Lets stop pretending. PvP players probably can't even retain each other. They need rabbits and should shut up until we fix rabbit problems. 

 

[admin]

1 minute ago, Bjerg Bjergsson said:

I haven't got on the testbed because I've been struggling to grind through gold and resources to build ships so that my clan can play together.

I'm happy to play risk free pvp but that's not exactly the game I signed up for.. 

The OP ideas sound interesting.. unfortunately most of the stuff is not helpful to me or my clan as they consist primarily of noobs or people with 1-2 hours of gaming a night/week they can do. The ship crafting is probably the best news but I have yet to see how exactly that will break down vs. the stifling issues I and my clan have now (2 months of casual gameplay to secure resources just to build a shipyard lvl2). 

Securing resources will be much easier. European traders will also come back and will bring resources to you if you place a contract high enough in the port where that resource might be. 

[Quineloe]

It sure would be nice of ports allowed for production of more than just 1-2 resources...

[Liq]

How are hostility missions going to be any different from pre patch level? Are they gonna be open all the time? Or is that just the regular missions which are open forever?

 

Sidenote:

19 minutes ago, admin said:

But there were a 100 on day one.
So risk free pvp against other people who are interested in risk free pvp does not interest risk free pvp fans? Does it mean that risk free pvp has zero retention? 
Did @TommyShelby meet @Otto Kohl and sank each other using 60 free redeemables (all new and unique ships), without any time wasting (everyone is near mortimer and you need to craft nothing, as everything is provide)

Or does it mean that wolves just don't want to fight wolves? (Even with double FPS and free ships). And getting pvp costs lower will have ZERO effect on pvp player goals?
Lets stop pretending. PvP players probably can't even retain each other. They need rabbits and should wait until we fix rabbit problems. 

Dunno really - I've tested the new stuff, have had several battles in them, versus well known and very good pvpers. Example; I had a 2v2 with jodgi vs. Otto and Banished Privateer; They won, but it was still fun
It would have been nice if you had given us a bigger variety of redeemable ships to test the new ones under other circumstances, e.g. some surps and L'Hermiones battle each other; or give us aggies to test them vs. the vasa, etc.. 
 

[Hodo]

46 minutes ago, admin said:

the patch notes do not mention pirates.

So lets talk about taxation port maintenance hostility and issues mentioned there. We are not interested in discussing ANYTHING else in this topic. 
pvp rewards are ok as they concern rewards and cost/rewards mentioned in the first clause. 

Stay on topic - last warning. If you are interested in talking about pirates - start your thread in suggestions. 

So let us talk about taxation, port maintenance, and hostility.

The issues will be as follows.

With smaller clans and nations, there will be no taxation as they will be taxed out of the game by larger clans and nations.   The carebears will never leave the non-conquerable zones and thus be no help to any aspect of the "nations" development.   It will strictly be a clan vs clan game a bit like EVE, just not as polished.  

Having additional money sinks in the game is not going to help in that aspect.  You are now FORCING clans to PVE to grind money to pay for ports that they want to hold, so why hold any ports?   What would they gain from this.

[TommyShelby]

47 minutes ago, admin said:

But there were a 100 on day one.
So risk free pvp against other people who are interested in risk free pvp does not interest risk free pvp fans? Does it mean that risk free pvp has zero retention? 
Did @TommyShelby meet @Otto Kohl and sank each other using 60 free redeemables (all new and unique ships), without any time wasting (everyone is near mortimer and you need to craft nothing, as everything is provide)

Or does it mean that wolves just don't want to fight wolves? (Even with double FPS and free ships). And getting pvp costs lower will have ZERO effect on pvp player goals?
Lets stop pretending. PvP players probably can't even retain each other. They need rabbits and should wait until we fix rabbit problems. 

I never asked for risk free pvp..... 

We did not, i haven't played NA for a month or so. And over the last 6 months i think i only played 50 hours at max. I was driven away before this new patch with new ships. 
But i've kept giving feedback trying to make you understand that you are driving away the hardcore, loyal, OW PvP'ers. You've chosen over the last years time, to prioritize other playergroups (Mainly RvR players and PvE'ers.). 

I don't blame you, i understand your choice. 

So no, it does NOT mean that Wolves don't want to fight Wolves. 

[Apina]

Maybe some sheep are dressed as wolfs

But seriously. I think more battles are open, more options for pvp. fair or not still more chances. Better than sailing about for hours and not finding anything or being forced to park around known spots of the map to maybe find something.

Shame you have played less Tommy. Always liked the idea you were around.

 

[Koltes]

6 hours ago, Vernon Merrill said:

Sounds like an RvR player's paradise....  Congrats, you're down to 100 people on Global.

Wait, what I said is what I beleive in. It does NOT exist in the current game mechanic. Instead we ACTUALLY have hunters paradise. Isnt it the hunters killing the game for players who are being sheep and cant even retaliate? You have it your way now. Why are your guys left? I thought you did not care about RVR and the dots. So it means that you left for other reasons. Maybe, just maybe you left because there just no one left for you to hunt. Anywhere. And people left because they dont want to be sheep. As a hunter I understand - dont kill your hunting ground. You have been hunting with immunity. Everything in the current mechanic is designed for you to hit and safely run. You enjoyed 2 weeks of fame. What about now? Hows that working out for ya? Dont tell me you left because of RVR. Thats not what your nation said. Or where you lying?

You speak of RVR like its some kind of disease. 

Before you point a finger or put labels on someone you go and check what my play style actually is. You go and check where is my name on Conquest Leader board and you will realise that I dont do it much at all.

But if you want people to play. If you want targets you need to give them ability to play. When your guys and my guys hunt all day and night around capitals on a server that has 200 people at most what happens? People get annoyed of being harassed. 

We need a good balance. Today we HAVE hunter player's paradise....  "Congrats, you're down to 100 people on Global." How did that work out for ya?

[Koltes]

31 minutes ago, TommyShelby said:

I never asked for risk free pvp..... 

We did not, i haven't played NA for a month or so. And over the last 6 months i think i only played 50 hours at max. I was driven away before this new patch with new ships. 
But i've kept giving feedback trying to make you understand that you are driving away the hardcore, loyal, OW PvP'ers. You've chosen over the last years time, to prioritize other playergroups (Mainly RvR players and PvE'ers.). 

I don't blame you, i understand your choice. 

So no, it does NOT mean that Wolves don't want to fight Wolves. 

You said that number of times - your gameplay style is very specific. You do understand that RVR is also a very specific game play style. You do understand that casual PVPer is also a very specific game play style (which due to its casualness has largest player base - your targets). You do realise that economy is also very specific pvp gameplay. You do understand that Sole hunting is also very specific game play. You do understand that huge battles which require team coordination are also totally different and specific pvp.

You do realize that as long as we cater for one or two groups we are going to lose all others right? The only way MMO can work is by providing to ALL specific types of players with mechanics thay does not destroy gameplay of others. 

Edited August 22, 2017 by koltes

[TommyShelby]

8 minutes ago, koltes said:

You said that number of times - your gameplay style is very specific. You do understand that RVR is also a very specific game play style. You do understand that casual PVPer is also a very specific game play style (which due to its casualness has largest player base - your targets). You do realise that economy is also very specific pvp gameplay. You do understand that Sole hunting is also very specific game play. You do understand that huge battles which require team coordination are also totally different and specific pvp.

You do realize that as long as we cater for one or two groups we are going to lose all others right? The only way MMO can work is by providing to ALL specific types of players with mechanics thay does not destroy gameplay of others. 

You do realize i never asked Admin to cater to my specific playstyle right? 
You do realize i believe all my suggestions to the game have catered to as many PvP playstyles as possible right? 
You do realize that the current NA has lots of mechanics which "destroy gameplay of others" right? 

Gosh dude, give me a break with the "You do realize". I've spent what 3, 4 years in NA now, tried all the different playstyles as well. So yes. I do realize. And i definitely realize NA has gone from a game that had room for my specific playstyle, to a game that has no room for it anymore. And i have something like 70 people on my friendlist on steam that play similarly to me, they don't play anymore either. 
But i guess that is just a coincidence? 

 

[Koltes]

6 minutes ago, TommyShelby said:

You do realize i never asked Admin to cater to my specific playstyle right? 
You do realize i believe all my suggestions to the game have catered to as many PvP playstyles as possible right? 
You do realize that the current NA has lots of mechanics which "destroy gameplay of others" right? 

Gosh dude, give me a break with the "You do realize". I've spent what 3, 4 years in NA now, tried all the different playstyles as well. So yes. I do realize. And i definitely realize NA has gone from a game that had room for my specific playstyle, to a game that has no room for it anymore. And i have something like 70 people on my friendlist on steam that play similarly to me, they don't play anymore either. 
But i guess that is just a coincidence? 

 

We had it your way earlier this year and last year. Didnt help. I understand that you believe in that with all your heart that you catter for all, but no. You are not. I have spent 2 years in NA and between my main and my alts spent about 6-7k of hours of legit playing on many sides of a gameplay. I also have 140 people in my clan that no longer play. Lets not make this a dick measurement contest.

Yes your play style may suffer. If you choose to walk away so be it. But if you want it get better, you need to stay and provide feedback. Saying been there done that is ultimately denying any changes and tunings. 

The game WILL change to suit larger playerbase and it needs you with ur specific play style to help make it playable for you. It needs me to make it playable for me.

If you walked away dont blame it does not turned out the way you want it to be. We are here for one reason - test and make this game release. Its hard work. Often frustrating. But its sure as hell also has lots of fun in it.

Shit Im 41 and I cant remember spending so many hours on a single game THATISNOTEVENFINISHEDYET  since the days of Asheron's Call.