Jump to content
Game-Labs Forum

Forthcoming patch final discussion.


Recommended Posts

15 minutes ago, Sven Silberbart said:

..and give rewards to players for participate in pvp battles. Why? Because every player want to see a progress when he spend time into the game. It is ok for everyone the winner get more than den looser, but give all of them rewards. Dont reward only the damage some player do on hull. Every kind of play style should be rewarded. Look at GW2. That game is doing it excessively, but it works. But there you have to do something. Just stay around isn't enough. Maybe give points over time period and for all kinds of damage or repair activities or something.

This

 

Would it be so god damn game breaking if the loser in a PVP fight walked away with 10k gold and 150 exp? It was literally the best feature in your game 2016, and you scrapped it for what reason exactly? Oh that's right, the hardcore whiners. They got their way.

But it's the same thing as always. *everyone* is telling the devs this. But then, one particular pet poster, one dev favorite, suggests something else, and then that gets done.

Edited by Quineloe
  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Jœrnson said:
2 hours ago, Skully said:

Ah wait,

On 8/22/2017 at 8:04 AM, Skully said:

an uncapturable Capital has just proven to be a troll factory (for both sides).

A reason to not sail?

That everyone has to decide for himself.

Be a troll or not sail? I don't like either of the options.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The last patch was 100% Hardcore. And it failed. The winners were some foxes specialized to privateering. But now they killed (making players and newcomers leave the game) the most rabbits and get hungry. Some of them already died (leave game) because of they cant find enough rabbits anymore.

I dont say playing as privateer- or piratestyle is a bad thing. No it is a good gameplay mechanic. But the rabbits needs their safe zones to grow up and prepare for the dangerous world around

Edited by Sven Silberbart
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, Sven Silberbart said:

The last patch was 100% Hardcore. And it failed. The winners were some foxes specialized to privateering. But now they killed (making players and newcomers leave the game) the most rabbits and get hungry. Some of them already died (leave game) because of they cant find enough rabbits anymore.

I will have to agree that some of the web weaved towards the hardcore did not work properly, for many reasons :)

The proposed roadmap as in the OP shifts attention from the "loose" collective of a nation to clan - let's be honest, we never emulated a nation in the age of sail, we simply inflated competition of screenshots and bragging rights.

The true consequence of Conquest was to deny to enemy land, not to promote own land. Big big difference.

As a sidenote, search for non-consequentianl pvp in the OW is not privateering. Let's stick to proper age of sail risk&reward Sir. When you set sail with a "treasure" convoy you are content for corsairs. As I always say, a 1st rate can be killed even before it is born, if the corsair captures the traders transporting the materials. Please tell me how wrong it is to kill a 1st rate.

What is important is to keep interest and so far, as shown, the whole politics, conquest scene had little to entice the newcomer. Is a conquest driven by clan warfare a option ? For sure it is worth testing but I will defend scalable entry to Conquest, being a Captain grants access to a part of Conquest, and being RA blocks you from that specific rank conquest area, so you don't take breathing space from newcomers but have your own rank access.

 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

OK, ready to be flogged on deck for this:

  • WOWS (World of Warships) have implemented a nice PVE/PVP solution. You can progress in the game by doing only PVE missions but your rewards will be much lower than if you participate in PVP battles. Want to progress faster and earn more money? Well the answer is PVP.

So in a nutshell, if the balance is right and PVP really get's rewarded correctly (get gold and combat marks based on damage done and not purely on the sinking of the ship) than I believe this will turn out to be a very good solution

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just be cautious about suggesting systems of rewards for damage done in battle. Sure, the issue of no reward needs to be fixed, however in a way that won't change pve grind into an alt or staged battle grind.  There are ways to handle this, however systems you propose often don't handle this.

 

That's why sometimes solutions that seem obvious are not obvious after all :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Sven Silberbart said:

The last patch was 100% Hardcore. And it failed. The winners were some foxes specialized to privateering. But now they killed (making players and newcomers leave the game) the most rabbits and get hungry. Some of them already died (leave game) because of they cant find enough rabbits anymore.

I dont say playing as privateer- or piratestyle is a bad thing. No it is a good gameplay mechanic. But the rabbits needs their safe zones to grow up and prepare for the dangerous world around

Hence we need rookie zones that play little or no part in the actual Conquest Competition.

So far I have listed 2 good proposals and 1 cheap on the current map.

11 minutes ago, Otto Kohl said:

Ai ships in PvP - I'm out of this game -_-.

What if CONCORD was limited to the rookie zone? Would you accept that?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Zoky said:

??? WTF??? So if I do piracy on traders they can just call bs reinforcements? WTF were you thinking? You might as well remove pirates from game 

If this reinforcement makes it in you can kiss those players goodbye.

If you truly wish to improve PvP then decrease hello kittying accuracy of stern guns!!!

 

15 minutes ago, Otto Kohl said:

Ai ships in PvP - I'm out of this game -_-.

Pretty sure it means a high security space... err waters like in EVE where players can actually do their own thing without too much worry.
Most valuable resources are located outside those high sec zones.

You just cant enter those waters and attack left and right. Those zones (capitals) are not mean to be your hunting grounds.
Its all good and sensible as long as devs will make enough reasons to expend and be OUTSIDE those zones so we could find targets just as easy or easier as around capitals.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, koltes said:

Pretty sure it means a high security space... err waters like in EVE where players can actually do their own thing without too much worry.

Sounds like a good idea. New players have to start somewhere and if they don't get their own seperate area to start in peace then this might be the best solution. There have to be many reasons to encourage leaving the safe waters tho. I never played EVE but it sounds like it was / is a pretty good and successful game so i don't mind them taking inspiration from it as long as it doesn't add to the grind.

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just made a test explosion 

with the prince 

it struck me hard to see the hull disappear very fast and the sails deterioration in a fast way i could not stay close enough at the target vessel

((the damage done to the hull is to much,,,.... i sink faster than i blow ))

aslo when i blew up the second it blows i see a split second the blast and than direct in harbor 

i rather would like to see the full blast en 2 seconds later a faint and then in the harbor to add a little drama to it

 

tip if you like the lynx this is your bigger brother :)

if you always sail with the wind in your face ,this will be your soul mate :)

 

Edited by Thonys
Link to comment
Share on other sites

39 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said:

You're the last player on your side, thus it sends you to port after death, but I dislike it too. We sbould be able to stay and watch.

yes just as a spectator only when you are the only person in the game it's done and over, but in a group, you must have the ability to stay ....perhaps a pop up in groups, to make a choice what you want to do,>>> to harbor or watch would also be nice..... (of course that after a couple of seconds)

 

EDIT:

made a second run blow up 

and saw when pushing HOME just before the final blow >>you will stay in the game

520043A99747F5935CFABE94FB0BA9EC6A7A4046

Edited by Thonys
Link to comment
Share on other sites

38 minutes ago, koltes said:

 


You just cant enter those waters and attack left and right. Those zones (capitals) are not mean to be your hunting grounds.
Its all good and sensible as long as devs will make enough reasons to expend and be OUTSIDE those zones so we could find targets just as easy or easier as around capital.

I doubt that. we even get European traders back. Everything will be accessible in the safe zone. The only reason to leave the zone will be player egos. And as logs show only 75player of 2000 have an ego.

Certain goods that are important for gameplay in just one area will be to hardcore for the causals.

 

At post below: there we go. No reason to go in the map center.

 

On paper the pvp rewards are higher but practice wise the downtime in pvp is much higher. to compensate the downtime reward for pvp really have to be high and 2 times or 3 times better is not enough.

Edited by z4ys
Link to comment
Share on other sites

update

monetary rewards for sinking pve ships will be increased (they were toned down too much) to allow a couple of missions to recover the ship costs + cannons
ship and cannon prices updated (cannons on average will be 50% of cost of the ship as it was historically)

example
before - sink pve victory - money reward 50k (ship cost 400k/cannon cost 300k)
after - sink pve victory - money reward 400k (ship cost 400k/cannon cost 200k)

pvp bonuses will increase as well from 50% more to 100% more

  • Like 9
Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, admin said:

pvp bonuses will increase as well from 50% more to 100% more

What's in it for the ones who sunk themselves? Who spend time sailing OW, got stuck in a good fight, provided content and entertainment to the other both sides, but ultimately lost?

Edited by Skully
entertainment for all :)
  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

55 minutes ago, vazco said:

Just be cautious about suggesting systems of rewards for damage done in battle. Sure, the issue of no reward needs to be fixed, however in a way that won't change pve grind into an alt or staged battle grind.  There are ways to handle this, however systems you propose often don't handle this.

 

That's why sometimes solutions that seem obvious are not obvious after all :)

There was no alt farming craze back when that system we are not just suggesting but asking to be brought back (you're here long enough to know that system was in the game for a long time). The few who attempted it got caught by log monitoring and got their progress reset. It is a *Trivially easy* thing to prevent.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, The Red Duke said:

 As I always say, a 1st rate can be killed even before it is born, if the corsair captures the traders transporting the materials. Please tell me how wrong it is to kill a 1st rate.

 

And you're always wrong. The big investment in building first rates is the permit and all the labor hours. You cannot intercept either of these.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, admin said:

update

monetary rewards for sinking pve ships will be increased (they were toned down too much) to allow a couple of missions to recover the ship costs + cannons
ship and cannon prices updated (cannons on average will be 50% of cost of the ship as it was historically)

example
before - sink pve victory - money reward 50k (ship cost 400k/cannon cost 300k)
after - sink pve victory - money reward 400k (ship cost 400k/cannon cost 200k)

pvp bonuses will increase as well from 50% more to 100% more

400k for a 4th rate combat order that takes 15 minutes in an Indef?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Quineloe said:

And you're always wrong. The big investment in building first rates is the permit and all the labor hours. You cannot intercept either of these.

Did the Labour hours got spent in assembling/extracting materials/resources ? Not newcomers making a living but actual veteran crafting alts moving materials. I say I can intercept the LH. I know I did. Many many times.

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

yeah, you intercepted 100 hours out of 8000. That surely put a stop to first rate production. You are *not* intercepting assembly hours. All of that is done in the final port. Simply because pre-production is pointless, now even for Iron Ingots, because cannons require ore.

None of these changes will matter admin as long as 90% of PVP ends with "Battle Report: No Rewards"

We're spending our time, our most valuable thing, when playing this game. You don't value our time at all, you need to start valuing it. Moreso than you value the pixels we fight in and sink and lose.

Edited by Quineloe
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Quineloe said:

You don't value our time at all, you need to start valuing it.

On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 9:49 AM, Skully said:

It is funny that folks cried alt damage farming and forgot about the implications. 

As long as it is a Zero-sum game (unless we need money sink/faucet) I don't see any trouble. Ergo the rewards never exceed the value sunk.

Provided the above, should distance from the nearest friendly port play a role in rewarding?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

35 minutes ago, admin said:

example
before - sink pve victory - money reward 50k (ship cost 400k/cannon cost 300k)
after - sink pve victory - money reward 400k (ship cost 400k/cannon cost 200k)

Hello inflation my old friend... Ive come to talk with you again.. :o)

  • Like 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

it can't be a zero sum game. Ships are cheap to repair, if all you got for damaging a surprise close to sinking was 2500g, it might as well be nothing again.


However, I fully trust in the log monitoring that it will catch anyone trying to do this. Also keep in mind, this was before combat marks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Peter Goldman said:

But we all know that admin will fail on that level. People will make milions of income via PvE in highsec and will be able to afford all upgrades, ships, rare resources. High-sec will just become a money machine zone. Another level on which admin will fail is giving reasons going to low-sec or 0-sec. Rare resources in RvR zone? Double or tripple exp / gold / combat marks for PvP / PvE in these zones? Special events spawning in the middle of ocean only in low-sec? I can keep dreaming.

Yes and I'm still waiting for this to happen. The ONLY way this model will work is by creating a global market place.
Best ways is to make 4 trade hubs that share one shop. Delivery in and out is still physical.

Those hubs located in capturable territory.

Also people WILL go out to extend IF
The capital will only allow level 1 shipyard to be built. Voila! People want to build better ships must go out. They will risk and all that but then people who risk nothing will be able to buy off them. It works both ways - there you have the economy stimulation

Edited by koltes
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...