Exciting times ahead - pre-release wipes information

[Sento de Benimaclet]

21 minutes ago, Celtiberofrog said:

as veteran players !!

Apparently veteran players do not count at all.

 

[staun]

28 minutes ago, Neads O'Tune said:

Sell them to WHO exactly? No one has any money

I have 40 shops now. Will go long time before I need to Trade ore craft. So long time before I’ll be afffected. So test Will not show the right picture.

[Sir Max Magic]

On 2/27/2019 at 8:17 AM, rediii said:

Looking foward to it!  I realy liked the last after-wipe situation  

Finally someone of our Uber-Pros connection makes a statement, which sounds reasonable...and not selfish about losing stuff +1

@rediii you have my outmost respect !!! 👍👍

...all the other Pros should think and act alike !!!

Its a shame what some other Pros are doing right now (here in forums and on discord)

[s2bu]

About the xp wipe - I have to agree: The intentions behind the proposed xp wipe are noble - however imho it's a futile effort to keep up the pretense of an even playing field after the release that only pisses some people off w/o doing anything meaningful towards the intended goal.

 

Here's my proposition: How about we do what we are here for - we actually test it (while the current database is safely stored somewhere).

- Reset everything to your heart's content

- Monitor the players' progress over both time played and absolute time

- See how long it takes until the progression of players will completely diverge

My prediction is "it wont be long". If you then add complete noobs to the equation who will most likely progress even slower than the slow people in our testgroup and thus speed up the divergence the obvious conclusion is: Alienating a sizable portion of the playerbase to achieve nothing significant in terms of player experience just isnt worth it.

In case the xp wipe does achieve the desired goals go through with it at release, in case it doesnt restore the pre-wipe database (in regards to xp). The people who think starting from scratch after release is a fresh and thus desireable experience are free to delete their characters to start over regardless...

It doesnt matter which way the decision goes in the end but as long as people are presented facts that led to the decision and show that it made sense it will be a lot easier to accept compared to now where the entire basis of the decision seems to be some1's gut feeling.

 

I guess we can all agree on the following 2 points:

- if NA ends up being  a working game and not a total desaster it has the potential that people will keep playing it for years and that always will have new players coming in

- if you take 2 alternate timelines (1 w/ xp wipe and 1 w/o  xp wipe) you won't be able to differentiate the two by looking at a point in time that is sufficiently far into the game

Coming up with irritating ways to create the pretense of an even playing field at the start is completely besides the point imho. What really needs to be addressed is a the fact that the game needs some mechanic to stabilize it in the long run, something that makes it near impossible for a nation to dominate the game. The only thing that is currently doing this is clans moving around from nation to nation once they get bored (oh guess what - DLC required). This can hardly be the intended solution.

Edited February 28, 2019 by s2bu

[Celtiberofrog]

On ‎2‎/‎27‎/‎2019 at 12:06 AM, admin said:

What is certain is that books and skill books will remain safe + pandora

This decision must be positive for both "potential newcomers" & "veterans", otherwise the War server population will suffer one way or the other.

Books & knowledges being safe, it will be good for hard core veteran players (minority), but thousands of "old players" who built up their XP are not hard core players, not sure they accumulated so many special books & knowledges. I'm worried about those players (majority) who may not come back...

Dev's want every player to start at same level with the release, but these special books will make a difference anyway, not sure skill will be the only difference.

So the ideal leveling goal is twisted anyhow.

"XP safe with books wiped" was smoother than "XP wiped with Books safe". (smoother = negative effect for less player number) 

 

NEW RANKS ARE GOING TO BE IMPLEMENTED :

If this is the MAIN REASON to destroy player XP (rank), I really hope there can be a compromise that will allow new rank ladder to integrate player former ranks level.

 

Your decision should privilege the largest population of players, there are thousands of players waiting for the release,

newcomers are hypothetical projections while "waiting old players" are real bases.

 

[admin]

2 minutes ago, Celtiberofrog said:

NEW RANKS ARE GOING TO BE IMPLEMENTED :

If this is the MAIN REASON to destroy player XP (rank), I really hope there can be a compromise that will allow new rank ladder to integrate player former ranks level.

The highest rank in the age of sail is/was Lord of the Admiralty and rear admiral was never mentioned to be a final rank of the game. There are no particular reasons for that. We just want the rank map to be complete, giving players a chance to become a Sea Lord.

[Celtiberofrog]

1 minute ago, admin said:

The highest rank in the age of sail is/was Lord of the Admiralty and rear admiral was never mentioned to be a final rank of the game. There are no particular reasons for that. We just want the rank map to be complete, giving players a chance to become a Sea Lord

But is this feature extension the reason for not keeping former ranks ? or would there be a way to integrate former ranks to this new rank ladder ?

[admin]

6 minutes ago, Celtiberofrog said:

But is this feature extension the reason for not keeping former ranks ? or would there be a way to integrate former ranks to this new rank ladder ?

There is no final decision on the ranks or how they will be distributed.
If new ranks happen they will be added above the current rank increasing the number of total ranks.
Missing ranks based on the table of ranks
Vice- Admiral
Admiral
Admiral of the Fleet
Sea Lord
Lord of the Admiralty.

[s2bu]

What is the point of these new ranks? Will they just further increase available crew (i.e. you can crew 2-3 1st rates in the end) or will there actually be new mechanics...

[Guest]

Lord of the Admiralty was no military rank, it was a political job afaik

[Neads O'Tune]

1 hour ago, Irenicus said:

AI ffs. I got 5 alts with about 30 1st rates. Each sell will net about 50k so 30x 50.000 = 1,5m in starting Capital. And that's presuming I don't use what Labour hours and dubs I got on me atm + the 35 L'Ocean permits, 30 santi permits and 20 vic permits I got atm.. 

Well woop de doo! Not everyone does and if you wanna go hello kitty it up for everyone else then feel free

[admin]

1 minute ago, Intrepido said:

Which are going to be the advantages of new ranks?

there is no information on the new ranks except for the fact that there could be new ranks added.

[Neads O'Tune]

51 minutes ago, staun said:

So ok to keep garanty something repeately. Say the are not that kind of developers that go back on there words. Ppl actually bought games on there promis. But tjeck on thats ok. Then I know that what we can expect.

Ppl are not complaining abouth the wipe of ressources. But plz enlighten me on the wipe of rank will have a great impact on testing trading and crafting.

whinners always nice when ppl think name calling lift Them High above the rest.

They are not wiping XP as part of the Eco patch you fool! They are wiping XP at LAUNCH.

You don't even know what you are complaining about!

[Celtiberofrog]

@admin

NA project is your house (building)

You built it for many years,

One of the essential material of this construction was : your faithful player followers

 

Do you really wish to a build foundations for a new house (the release) without relying on this precious material who helped you building your first house ? 

I guess not, so why not finding a compromise that will also profit to your old player base ?

Edited February 28, 2019 by Celtiberofrog

[Njord]

17 minutes ago, admin said:

Missing ranks based on the table of ranks
Vice- Admiral
Admiral
Admiral of the Fleet
Sea Lord
Lord of the Admiralty.

If I had any say in this, I would want "Sea Lord" to be the max rank. It just sounds more distinct and powerful than "Lord of the Amiralty". Also, because I think there would be too many ranks with no purpose other than a bit more crew that you only need for fleet ships ( which are somewhat useless anyways outside of trading where you dont need the crew ).

[s2bu]

on the issue of ranks:

the Board of Admiralty consisted of the first lord of the admiralty (civilian), a bunch of sealords (selection of serving admirals) and a couple of other personell (depending on the time you are looking at)...

I think having these top ranks as achieveable player ranks that everyone will eventually get to in the long run is gonna have a weird feeling to it...   keeping in mind that there only ever was ONE first lord of the admiralty and a few sealords at any given moment in time.

 

Imho the player ranks should end before the "top notch pencil pusher level"  ;o)

Edited February 28, 2019 by s2bu

[Thonys]

8 minutes ago, s2bu said:

on the issue of ranks:

the Board of Admirality consisted of the first lord of the admirality (civilian), a bunch of sealords (selection of serving admirals) and a couple of other personell (depending on the time you are looking at)...

I think having these top ranks as achieveable player ranks that everyone will eventually in the long run is gonna ahve a weird feeling to it...   keeping in mind that there only ever was ONE first lord of the admirality and a few sealords at any given moment in time.

 

Imho the player ranks should end before the "top notch pencil pusher level"  ;o)

i think there is no issue 

at a particular port battle, i saw 50 rear admirals sailing around and not even one lieutenant

ranks have more to do with possibilities on crew handling, and it doesn't matter how you call them

 

 

Edited February 28, 2019 by Thonys

[Abram Svensson]

Just catched up with this topic.

In my opinion people are whining WAY to much. The argument about wasted hours in a game is just stupid, as you need to shittalk every game you "wasted" your hours in.

The point about an equal start for every player is a valid argument. Someone who starts a MMO on release date and sees a lot of players on (almost) max rank calls it unfair and leaves faster than someone who starts 4 weeks after release.

For my part i am looking forward for the release. They can wipe as much as they want, i like this game and the people i play it with.

[Meraun]

1 hour ago, Celtiberofrog said:

YES ! I always defended this fact.

But XP keep was granted to veterans and was understood as being the reward & recognition for their hard/long support. 

So by going from white to black decision (hoping the grey decision was possible), the XP being thrown away is now going to reduce the number of potential players after the release !!

New players are deadly needed as veteran players !! 

Personally I will wait & see what will happen after the release, if server grows I will not mind reworking these learning steps, but frankly, Dev's are taking a high risk of demotivating (and possibly lose) its faithful playerbase... Very daring decision at this stage !

I believe the healthy, mature part of this Communtiy will stay, wihle the Toxic Part breaks away. Taht woud be the best thing taht coud happen

Edited February 28, 2019 by Meraun

[Angus MacDuff]

36 minutes ago, admin said:

There is no final decision on the ranks or how they will be distributed.
If new ranks happen they will be added above the current rank increasing the number of total ranks.
Missing ranks based on the table of ranks
Vice- Admiral
Admiral
Admiral of the Fleet
Sea Lord
Lord of the Admiralty.

If you do adjust the ranks, I hope you will adjust the crew distribution also.  It's a bit off for crew size around the 5th rates.  You could even squeeze in a Post Captain (lower).  These gentlemen had a single epaulette on only one shoulder and were of less than 3 years seniority.  And please (please) get rid of those awful Pirate ranks and maybe just  use a mixture of the other nation's ranks.  It's probably the thing that I like the least about this great game!

[admin]

23 minutes ago, Celtiberofrog said:

@admin

NA project is your house (building)

You built it for many years,

One of the essential material of this construction was : your faithful player followers

 

Do you really wish to a build foundations for a new house (the release) without relying on this precious material who helped you building your first house ? 

I guess not, so why not finding a compromise that will also profit to your old player base ?

We declared that statement in 2015. We repeated the promise multiple times every year, planning to keep it because it made sense then. And even defended it when many loyal supporters we asking for the wipe, making many of them angry. 

But it indeed stopped making sense. And we are upfront saying this in advance - this promise no longer make sense thus it will be retracted for the pvp server. This is how your message reads to me: keep the stupid promise that stopped making sense, even if it is not good for the game. 

Reset does not make sense on the PVE server - thus PVE server won't be reset
Reset makes a lot of sense on the War server - … lets do what makes sense.
 

[s2bu]

1 minute ago, admin said:

We declared that statement in 2015. We repeated the promise multiple times every year, planning to keep it because it made sense then. And even defended it when many loyal supporters we asking for the wipe, making many of them angry. 
But it stopped making sense. And we are upfront saying this in advance - this promise no longer make sense thus it will be retracted.

This is how your message reads to me: keep the stupid promise that stopped making sense, even if it is not good for the game. 
 

As i said: let's test how much sense it makes...  (after all we are here for testing)

- reset xp

- monitor player progress

- see how long it takes for the progress to absolutely diverge

 

Use that information to meassure the effectiveness of the tool "xp wipe" in regards to "creating an even player experience". If the tool proves to be not effective just restore the current database in regards to xp...

 

[Angus MacDuff]

10 minutes ago, admin said:

But it indeed stopped making sense. And we are upfront saying this in advance - this promise no longer make sense thus it will be retracted for the pvp server. This is how your message reads to me: keep the stupid promise that stopped making sense, even if it is not good for the game. 
 

Frankly, the knowledge books are one of the great unbalancers in this game (more so than XP IMHO).  **pause for rage**.  Get rid of them too.  **more rage** Alternatively, make them available for purchase at the Admiralty.  After more than a year, I still don't have the good ones.  I understand that it is because of my play style, but would prefer it if every play style still had options to gain these books.  Buying from players is extremely difficult at times.

Edited February 28, 2019 by Angus MacDuff

[Barents]

8 minutes ago, Abram Svensson said:

Just catched up with this topic.

In my opinion people are whining WAY to much. The argument about wasted hours in a game is just stupid, as you need to shittalk every game you "wasted" your hours in.

The point about an equal start for every player is a valid argument. Someone who starts a MMO on release date and sees a lot of players on (almost) max rank calls it unfair and leaves faster than someone who starts 4 weeks after release.

For my part i am looking forward for the release. They can wipe as much as they want, i like this game and the people i play it with.

I do agree with you on most part. On release i even think everything including ship knowledge and skill books should be wiped.

But i don´t see the (on my opinion) core problems of this game even adressed. There will be higher player numbers after release but why should i expect them to stay? And why should i do the grind again if don´t expect them to stay?

 

[greybuscat]

4 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Frankly, the knowledge books are one of the great unbalancers in this game (more so than XP IMHO).  **pause for rage**.  Get rid of them too.  **more rage** Alternatively, make them available for purchase at the Admiralty.  After more than a year, I still don't have the good ones.  I understand that it is because of my play style, but would prefer it if every play style still had options to gain these books.  Buying from players is extremely difficult at times.

My main issue with the skillbooks is that people who have the best ones were able to obtain them when a) mission were much more farmable than they are now and b) enemy AI fleets regularly visited every port. It creates a huge gap that can't be closed by a skilled captain putting in the same amount of time and effort as people who have been around for a couple of years.

I'm sure I'm in the minority on this one, but I don't think ship XP should even be a thing. Just about everyone seems to hate it, anyway. All ships should have all slots for all captains. We already have haves and have-nots with the books, don't we?