Jump to content
Game-Labs Forum
Cmdr RideZ

Naval Action Classic

Recommended Posts

Have been watching steam charts and slowly decreasing player numbers.

24-peak today 850, the last Sunday under 1000 players, Last 30 days 1097.

Maybe time to get back to 2016 and give us another server called "Naval Action Classic".  That more PvP oriented game so many of us wanted?

Version to look would be the one before tournament. Of course this version would still need many obvious fixes done after.  There are also changes that you have done that were already asked in 2016 but implemented years after. Also decrease amount of grind, easier economy, crew costs were insane this time, make it more focused on combat. Flag based system is still probably the best you have introduced so far.  Old sailing profiles and combat that gave more room for small ships. Repair kits and crew that did support chained battles. Even consider bringing back ship capturing as a valid option for crafting. Multidura is ok or single dura with lighter crafting overall and (crafting cost/rate durability). Skill should matter more, bring back Powder Monkeys 2.5%. Oh and give back our child labor and sub crafting. This game could also easily have competitive tournaments, esports.

Give xp that everyone has earned so far in their whole gaming history. In this kind of more action oriented game it would be ok, especially when all ships will be once again end game ships. If that feels to much then a fresh start.

 

Maybe too late for this as there was already launch, maybe not. It can be that people come back for this action oriented game they always wanted. Would take time to put this together but you have all code in your version control.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm sorry but this seems very incoherent to me..

How would getting the game as it was in 2016 bring players back when the current version can't? What was more PvP oriented in the 2016 version?

15 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said:

[..]Also decrease amount of grind, easier economy, crew costs were insane this time, make it more focused on combat. Flag based system is still probably the best you have introduced so far.  Old sailing profiles and combat that gave more room for small ships. Repair kits and crew that did support chained battles. Even consider bringing back ship capturing as a valid option for crafting. Multidura is ok or single dura with lighter crafting overall and (crafting cost/rate durability). Skill should matter more, bring back Powder Monkeys 2.5%.

  • the current version has less grind when crafting (massive cut in needed parts and hauling requirements), players even have some control over where specific resources are available to group ports together
  • easier economy (delivery mission = helicopter money)
  • crew is dirt cheap now
  • the flags were abused thats why they had to be pulled
  • ship capturing can still be done, npc traders will drop building materials and you keep every ship now, even ai captured first rates

To me, the current version has all the things you want for the game as of 2016, and tournaments is kinda on us players to organize. (the loss of the duel rooms hurts, sure)
As far as skill is concerned, if anything, the current repairs allow a more skilled player to fight against worse odds. 

I agree that 2016 combat was easier for smaller ships against heavier vessels than today but I don't think combat is a problem. It always was (and is) the one thing Naval Action is amazing at.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Cmdr RideZ said:

Maybe time to get back to 2016 and give us another server called "Naval Action Classic". Of course this version would still need many obvious fixes done after.

So to summarize you want a new server with a different version of the game on which they also need to work on. What will gamelabs gain in return?

Edited by Jon Snow lets go

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Snoopy said:

What was more PvP oriented in the 2016 version?

I don't understand this either.  Brits sunk 7 first rates in one battle this morning.  (None were port battle kills.)   Just counted and there were another 36 players sunk in the last hour alone. (No port battle kills ...yet).   Must be interesting for the devs to read these posts, when they can see accurate PvP stats.  Could be that there is more PvP now that ever.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Macjimm said:

I don't understand this either.  Brits sunk 7 first rates in one battle this morning.  (None were port battle kills.)   Just counted and there were another 36 players sunk in the last hour alone. (No port battle kills ...yet).   Must be interesting for the devs to read these posts, when they can see accurate PvP stats.  Could be that there is more PvP now that ever.

One problem is the notion that all PvP may be "good" PvP.. A ship is not just a ship, a 1st rate lost is not just a 1st rate.. There's the NPC shitships that can be capped to grind slots, and there's the port bonus' ships. Among other examples of PvP being less than PvP...

Take the RoE fx. they open the battle to exploitation, but disregarding that - it also opens the battles for a lot longer.. Meaning that a player in a trinc fx. fighting a frigate can be jumped 19 mins into the battle by an enemy player and thus change a previously PvE battle into a PvP battle. The player in question is now in a PvE ship in a PvP battle and the enemy that joins can be of any BR, meaning that a connie fx. can join and basically rek the trinc with little to no recourse on the behalf of the trinc since the battle closes after 20 mins or so. This makes ppl leave.

Another glaring issue, which just shows the sheer stupidity of the RoE, is the problem that IF a player jumps say 2 Wasas, with the player in another Wasa, the battle will be closed for anyone on the opposite side UNLESS someone joins with an alt just to run away and then have their real account fight the player. This ofc is hard to prove, if not impossible, as an exploit and thus the player getting rekt leaves.

PvP is not just PvP, there's nuances and there's a glaring lack of predictability and balance in the current iteration of the game.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Louis Garneray said:

We'll not go back to 2016.... because we don't have a time machine... And the more it goes and the population dwindle and the more I have big doubts that we'll get a supply of new players.

A lot of pvp players have given up and our admin doesn't seem to be alarmed by it nor in a hurry to pump out updates that would help with the population situation... Unless their big plan is to use fall or Xmas big sale to get new players? Who knows now. So many of us had so much hope in the future of the game and all that is left is bitterness.
I use to log on every day...  doesn't happen anymore and when I log in most of the time I logoff right away, I don't even sail.

 

Can't we just stop the delusion about an influx of new players?! The game released. Ppl came back, saw what happened to NA, ppl left. The yes-men killed the game, a "MMO" with less than 600 players on the PvP server in peak hours is a dead game.

END OF STORY.

Botched release and shitty mechanics.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, Louis Garneray said:

I agree with you. that's why that all that is left now is bitterness.

That hurt a lot more than any insult or comment I've heard yet. Bitterness and disappointment.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Jon Snow lets go said:

So to summarize you want a new server with a different version of the game on which they also need to work on. What will gamelabs gain in return?

They might actually get a game that is not dead.  So whats your problem?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Louis Garneray said:

We'll not go back to 2016.... because we don't have a time machine... And the more it goes and the population dwindle and the more I have big doubts that we'll get a supply of new players.

A lot of pvp players have given up and our admin doesn't seem to be alarmed by it nor in a hurry to pump out updates that would help with the population situation... Unless their big plan is to use fall or Xmas big sale to get new players? Who knows now. So many of us had so much hope in the future of the game and all that is left is bitterness.
I use to log on every day...  doesn't happen anymore and when I log in most of the time I logoff right away, I don't even sail.

 

Pretty much this. Would not be even surprised if they just let the game die.

admin had "trusted" friends whose opinion he was listening. This was probably the biggest mistake as he was listening wrong people. When they started these radical changes, I think there were some people here on forum telling them to not ruin the game.  They did not listen them, it felt almost like admin went in "block" mode and did not receive any input.

If there is something to save here it is going to be done with action oriented game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now there is plenty of PvP?

If there were plenty of PvP you would be asking repair kit patch. admin tried to have similar system for crew as there is now for repair kits. Many players on this forum told that they don't want to be sailing back to port all the time, "bound to port". Now you can still teleport crew to your ship, but if these PvP players had not been there I can promise that you would sail back to port to get more crew after every single fight.

Everyone on this forum can defend the game and tell how good it is. The game is dying, maybe time to think why and not just deny. Less grind, less craft, less economy, less gear influence, more action, more skill based PvP. What I fastly listed, it is actually pretty obvious list, no?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Lars Kjær said:

Can't we just stop the delusion about an influx of new players?! The game released. Ppl came back, saw what happened to NA, ppl left. The yes-men killed the game, a "MMO" with less than 600 players on the PvP server in peak hours is a dead game.

END OF STORY.

 

Usual haters. 
I suggest you go for a walk and think about the perspective, for example stop looking at NA from the perspective of WOW, or Warframe. Start looking from the perspective of Darkfall (most anticipated hardcore mmo when we started the company)

A) 800 peak concurrent players bring NA to top 200 games on steam (by online) ABOVE $150 mln budget Planetside 2, Above my beloved dark souls 2 and DS remastered and even above multiplayer award winning doom remake.
B ) NA is the second most played hardcore sandbox mmo with full loot on steam (eve online is at 2000 players on steam)
C) NA is literally my first game i made.

Want the game with 100000 online players? There are no plans to casualize and optimize for online.
End of story

  • Like 9

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Staunberg said:

Thx for your reply. Allways nice to get an response. Ppl have been worried abouth the game, and if I got you right. We are where you want the game to be.

Market decides where the game will be, community can provide positive or negative perspective to new players, developers can influence the course, but overall market decides. 

The game has been sitting at 600-800 people since autumn 2016. I see no reasons to worry that something will drastically change. For example some claim that limited port battle BR is the most relevant thing that will immediately bring 100000 of players to the game, but all veterans know that we had limited BR and had the same 600 people. The only thing that had clear direct influence on online were wipes ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, admin said:

Market decides where the game will be, community can provide positive or negative perspective to new players, developers can influence the course, but overall market decides. 

The game has been sitting at 600-800 people since autumn 2016. I see no reasons to worry that something will drastically change. For example some claim that limited port battle BR is the most relevant thing that will immediately bring 100000 of players to the game, but all veterans know that we had limited BR and had the same 600 people. The only thing that had clear direct influence on online were wipes ;)

Partly true. Remember last time we had variable BR and 600 people there were wipes looming, and release on the horizon. Quite a lot of players didn't want to invest time and energy into earning ports or items that would be wiped.

Also, RvR (arguably the only endgame content) isn't working. If a nation actively attacks another one repeatedly (and wins), they capture all the high point port bonus ports, leaving their opponent crippled. Look at the Pirates, instead of fighting their Frontline battles in the smaller ports, their entire crafting setup was based around 3 ports, which all fell within 2 weeks. 

In theory this is good, the pirates were defeated. The issue is many players choose to stop playing, or simply join the big nation's since they can't defend themselves. 

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, admin said:

Market decides where the game will be, community can provide positive or negative perspective to new players, developers can influence the course, but overall market decides.

But these "market decisions" are based on community behavior, reviews, perspectives etc. And they are based on developers actions.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, admin said:

Market decides where the game will be, community can provide positive or negative perspective to new players, developers can influence the course, but overall market decides. 

The game has been sitting at 600-800 people since autumn 2016. I see no reasons to worry that something will drastically change. For example some claim that limited port battle BR is the most relevant thing that will immediately bring 100000 of players to the game, but all veterans know that we had limited BR and had the same 600 people. The only thing that had clear direct influence on online were wipes ;)

first, thanks for active communication with the community! regarding port battles: shouldn't the br-limit for ship-types be deleted? let all ships take part please and see what happens. kind regards, Gene

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, admin said:

The game has been sitting at 600-800 people since autumn 2016.

Thanks for the clarification, that's how I remember it.  And 200-300 during the low off hours.  Yet there are continual urgent posts claiming the number of players online is falling, and soon the game will be empty.   Funny, ... if the population has been dropping dramatically for three years ... there should be no one playing now.  But instead the numbers have stayed the same.

Sounds like mythical predictions of impending doom.   "Quick!  Change NA now, to satisfy my wishes, or soon we will have no one playing it !" 

My prediction is;.   3 years from now  we will still be hearing urgent warnings that the numbers are plummeting, but 600-800 people will play at peak times, and there'll be 200-300 at low levels.   And it'll still be lots of fun and highly addictive.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, Snoopy said:

......

I agree that 2016 combat was easier for smaller ships against heavier vessels than today but I don't think combat is a problem. It always was (and is) the one thing Naval Action is amazing at.

And that's why NA imho will not survive. It's nothing half and nothing whole.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, admin said:

Market decides where the game will be, community can provide positive or negative perspective to new players, developers can influence the course, but overall market decides. 

The game has been sitting at 600-800 people since autumn 2016. I see no reasons to worry that something will drastically change. For example some claim that limited port battle BR is the most relevant thing that will immediately bring 100000 of players to the game, but all veterans know that we had limited BR and had the same 600 people. The only thing that had clear direct influence on online were wipes ;)

I'd settle for 1000 players online at all times and not just in peak hours. At the moment we don't even hit 1k in peak hours though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Macjimm said:

Thanks for the clarification, that's how I remember it.  And 200-300 during the low off hours.  Yet there are continual urgent posts claiming the number of players online is falling, and soon the game will be empty.   Funny, ... if the population has been dropping dramatically for three years ... there should be no one playing now.  But instead the numbers have stayed the same.

Sounds like mythical predictions of impending doom.   "Quick!  Change NA now, to satisfy my wishes, or soon we will have no one playing it !" 

My prediction is;.   3 years from now  we will still be hearing urgent warnings that the numbers are plummeting, but 600-800 people will play at peak times, and there'll be 200-300 at low levels.   And it'll still be lots of fun and highly addictive.

Actually the truth is somewhere in between. For the past three years we've had patches, big and small, that has changed the game dramatically and some has seen greater influx of players some has seen the player count drop. If you want a picture of the development you can check steamcharts.

https://steamcharts.com/app/311310#1y

 

If you go back to November '18 fx. you see that we had 600 players online on both servers, this was at a time when everyone knew that devs lied and everything including xp, craft xp, books etc. would be wiped and hence all progress would be lost. This I would argue put a dampener on the spirit of the community. What we see now however is that the game is released, and a continous decline in population downwards towards the same numbers. I will argue that in 3 years time you'll still see ppl play this game but that doesn't constitute a living healthy game, nor a living healthy community. One point of contention where I might give @admin a point, is that there is markedly different ways to look at what constitutes a healthy community.

As for me.. I'm done discussing the issue, the game is what it is and we won't see an increase in playernumbers.. Wether @admin considers this a success or not is irrelevant, wether I consider it a succes is prob irrelevant to @admin as well..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, admin said:

Market decides where the game will be, community can provide positive or negative perspective to new players, developers can influence the course, but overall market decides. 

The game has been sitting at 600-800 people since autumn 2016. I see no reasons to worry that something will drastically change. For example some claim that limited port battle BR is the most relevant thing that will immediately bring 100000 of players to the game, but all veterans know that we had limited BR and had the same 600 people. The only thing that had clear direct influence on online were wipes ;)

For the record. I believe current BR for PB is one of factors that is making NA bleed rvr players. 

Rvr players must be definitely bored sailing always ocean/santisima.

You can stop the bleed by fixing that mechanic and others, such as a trading based on very long distances.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, EliteDelta said:

Partly true. Remember last time we had variable BR and 600 people there were wipes looming, and release on the horizon. Quite a lot of players didn't want to invest time and energy into earning ports or items that would be wiped.

Also, RvR (arguably the only endgame content) isn't working. If a nation actively attacks another one repeatedly (and wins), they capture all the high point port bonus ports, leaving their opponent crippled. Look at the Pirates, instead of fighting their Frontline battles in the smaller ports, their entire crafting setup was based around 3 ports, which all fell within 2 weeks. 

In theory this is good, the pirates were defeated. The issue is many players choose to stop playing, or simply join the big nation's since they can't defend themselves. 

I can see some ports having different BR's,  but I would like to see it more a clan owners choose as I would prefer important ports to have high BR and none important ports lower.   Like higher maintenance the higher the BR and if you want to have low maintenance you can have a lower BR.  @admin also once mention about having the BR go up with the importance/wealth income of a port from a base which would been a way to start with a low BR and than have it get bigger the more money that port makes.  

As for the Nations issue with RvR is that some nations just get in a comfort zone and don't want to fight (that cause not all players are hard core PVP players).  We also have an issue with nations getting to big and little nations just giving up.  Alliance system needs to be brought back and the last Faction post was a great way to do this where devs can set up factions that work together.  Don't like the faction your in just use your forge papers and switch to a nation that has a Faction you like.   

Nations should be defeated in the game, but the problem is we have no true end game in the RvR world....no map resets or condition of a win.  Which ends up getting a very boring and stale server after a while as you end up with one clear nation way to powerful for the others to fight.   I don't know why multi nations don't all attack Russia at once and crush it's power, but instead as mention above we gett where every one wants to be buddy buddy with that person so not to be attacked.  For example US won't help DUTCH vs Russia even though DUTCH helped them against the pirates, simply cause US doesn't want to be crushed by Russia.   So now you have a nation that won't support or help them fight a bigger stronger nation.   Something needs to be done to prevent the RUSSIAN ZERG (this could happen with any nation) we have right now where every one seems to be jumping on the winning team until the game gets dead and every one stops playing cause they are bored or afraid to loose things if they did attack the big BEAR.

13 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

For the record. I believe current BR for PB is one of factors that is making NA bleed rvr players. 

Rvr players must be definitely bored sailing always ocean/santisima.

You can stop the bleed by fixing that mechanic and others, such as a trading based on very long distances.

I don't think it's as big as the issue that every small port is trapped behind a capital big port.  Raids would be a way to allow small BR fights on sub ports that don't mean some one looses a port but we still get the smaller BR battles that many want.  The problem right now is that one nation can field 2 PB fleets but no screeners while another nation can fill those two PB's and have screeners at both.  There is a big imbalance of player numbers between nation number 1 and 2 in game right now and without some time of alliance system it's not going to change any time soon.    We really need to bring in the faction system and test it.  

5 big Factions is way better than 11 nations.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, admin said:

Market decides where the game will be, community can provide positive or negative perspective to new players, developers can influence the course, but overall market decides. 

The game has been sitting at 600-800 people since autumn 2016. I see no reasons to worry that something will drastically change. For example some claim that limited port battle BR is the most relevant thing that will immediately bring 100000 of players to the game, but all veterans know that we had limited BR and had the same 600 people. The only thing that had clear direct influence on online were wipes ;)

Reduce Br for port battles 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...