Plans for Reputation and Sailing changes

[Farrago]

@admin bravo. I think this will be ultimately a good development.

Will there be a visual indication on positive, neutral, or at war karma with your nation when you view an enemy captain on open water?

It would be beneficial to know whether that enemy is maintaining positive karma with my nation in making my decision whether to attack. 

[Audacious]

is this the wind shadow you mean? port battle , line fighting team on  the right wind side will always have the upper hand. How far will shadow stretch? 200 y , 500y?

I can see a lot of possibilities when stealing (suffocating) another team in line battle. 

How much speed loss do we get if we are in the shadow zone? @admin

 

Edited July 23, 2020 by Audacious

[admin]

33 minutes ago, Audacious said:

is this the wind shadow you mean? port battle , line fighting team on  the right wind side will always have the upper hand. How far will shadow stretch? 200 y , 500y?

I can see a lot of possibilities when stealing (suffocating) another team in line battle. 

 

Its going to be a huge game changer for blobs. Players will start to appreciate why you need a line . No more turning someone into a wind as well
but a server needs to be tested first - wind shadow is a very complex server intensive feature.

[admin]

36 minutes ago, Farrago said:

 

It would be beneficial to know whether that enemy is maintaining positive karma with my nation in making my decision whether to attack. 

You will see Greek theater masks on the player info screen in OW.

[Hethwill]

8 hours ago, admin said:

Chance of wind shadow just increased by 30% from 3%.

This is what I talk about. Many many thanks in order to make it work.

[Raf Van Boom]

Does that mean we get true sailing profiles for these ships as well, something like 90 deg wind angle at most?

Weighing anchor under sail? Raising anchor under sail? All those cool maneuvers those ships could do. I mean this is not yacht racing really - cool video

 

 

Edited July 23, 2020 by Raf Van Boom

[admin]

3 hours ago, Malcolm3 said:

JOINING battles

Joining battles is an act of aggression - so it will also turn neutral character into a combat one. 

[Koltes]

8 hours ago, Hethwill said:

Now give me more age of sail mechanics. That's what i'm here for. High winds and low winds next

Lets be honest here

How about no game mechanic that prevents you to have freedom of choice... like true age of sail mechanic.

Free for all. No restrictions. Captains themselves decide who they fight. Battles without sides. Like in “true age of sail mechanic”.
You always join with your nation flag and you always fight as who you are. Let players to sort it themselves who is who In the battle. 

Cant exploit what is not exploitable.

No more green on green tribunals.

No more alt exploits.

No more ROE exploits.

No more supporting mechanics needed such as Instant Karma, which is there to just affect  players behavior. 
 

EVE Online have proved it beyond any doubt - players themselves needs to have their relations and actions against other players to sort out. Not the hard coded mechanics. Which are exploitable, which creates tons of rules, tribunal posts, restrictions on pvp, restrictions in decision making, restrictions to counter exploits etc etc. Its a never ending train of headache for devs and shitposts from players because the only mechanic that you cant exploits is the one that restricts you 100%. Means game is unplayable.

Will this Karma patch affect OW hunters? Yes it will. But then again with with 350-450 online the OW hunting is a waste of time anyway. Sailing for 3 hours straight, checking places in different corners of the map from Tumbado to Guayaguayare and finding only AI ships and sometimes a lone trader means the game does not provide this type of activity anymore. 

There are simple priority issues here. Which server always had more population PVP or PVE? Simple numbers will tell that this game was always more attractive as PVP. 
 

With OW practically dead what else is there to do? Mostly empty PZs (2 of them working because one is close to the largest nation and the other is shallows). RVR is in shock. Cant even describe it otherwise.

So lets see what is the real value this patch brings. Does it help to increase online? Nope. Does it improve pvp experience? Nope. Does it address issues with imbalance of RVR to improve that activity? Nope.

You may say that hey those are coming!

Okey, but they should have been THE priority! We are NOT losing players because of karma or palyer actions. We lose players because of inaction

 

Edited July 23, 2020 by Koltes

[Hethwill]

No idea why I was quoted.

Do i have to look to the game through your lenses ? I have no clue what you are talking about in half that post, nor do I care.

I have numbers of players info / ping and fps turned off. 

I do pay more attention to the simulation than to the mmo aspect. Sorry man, can't help it.

And been involved in good fights, but then i'm EU timezone. And EU timezone has the bulk of players it seems.

Edited July 23, 2020 by Hethwill

[Malcolm3]

3 hours ago, admin said:

Joining battles is an act of aggression - so it will also turn neutral character into a combat one. 

So you are not allowed to help your countrymen in that case.
But allowed to participate in offensive Port Battles...

[Magnus Baldur]

@admin 

Can you elaborate on this Battle Flags?

[Hittings]

you still cant' build ships out of a port the enemy has taken control of because you aren't on the friends list.  Friendslist is a mechanic that needs to go.  It serves no benefit to the nation to alienate clans that aren't on the list, and it only holds back players with positive reputation under these changes.

[Koltes]

8 hours ago, Hethwill said:

No idea why I was quoted.
You have replied to someone else's post. This is a reply to yours, but with the emphasis on the content discussed.
 

I have no clue what you are talking about in half that post, nor do I care.
Allow me to point out where the problem is in your reply.
a) ~ "you have no clue"
b) ~ "you dont care"
 

I have numbers of players info / ping and fps turned off.
And this is why you have no clue. You simply choose to ignore the fact of the low population.
 

I do pay more attention to the simulation than to the mmo aspect. Sorry man, can't help it.
That's all good. We all try to take the best out of this game. Each to his own and its good if it suits different attitudes and types of players... But it doesnt... And hence why it suffers from bad reviews and low population of online players. You sail in your own bubble and I'm happy that it suits you. And I DO care because if you are happy you will stay and be part of the game content.


And been involved in good fights, but then i'm EU timezone. And EU timezone has the bulk of players it seems.
That is a false statement. I play in all time zones and EU (though having more numbers) rarely go above 500. If this is the peak you are talking about then its not good enough. 
It simply shows that huge majority of players no longer happy with the product and chose not to play it.

The online population is a single most important indicator of how the product is doing in general. Devs want players to be happy and this is a great goal. But they only target a very small number of individuals. Most that playing are not happy with the gameplay, but we do play because we love the setting and... we hope it will improve.
A great game design would bring a huge influx of new and returned players. More players more DLC content is sold means more $$$ for the devs. More players more OW and RVR content means happier players in general. We DO suffer from inactivity due to low pop. If you cant see this then you are in denial

 

Edited July 24, 2020 by Koltes

[Zorg the Merciless]

When will this be delpoyed?

[Vibrio Cholerae]

7 hours ago, admin said:

Joining battles is an act of aggression - so it will also turn neutral character into a combat one. 

I do not get it why to put such a system when you must play like in the PVE to profit the advantage?

Why not just take out this system right at the start? 

because I only see a use with alt hiding inside port to give some rep to players?

 

Other fact @admin I see no info on the fact that you cannot join one side because of bad karma?

 

Edited July 24, 2020 by Vibrio Cholerae

[admin]

7 hours ago, Koltes said:

Lets be honest here

How about no game mechanic that prevents you to have freedom of choice... like true age of sail mechanic.

Free for all. No restrictions. Captains themselves decide who they fight. Battles without sides. Like in “true age of sail mechanic”.
You always join with your nation flag and you always fight as who you are. Let players to sort it themselves who is who In the battle. 

Cant exploit what is not exploitable.

No more green on green tribunals.

No more alt exploits.

No more ROE exploits.

No more supporting mechanics needed such as Instant Karma, which is there to just affect  players behavior. 

You want chaz darkfall and we all know where darkfall went. Since caves people crave for associations with groups based on trust and without punishments for breaking the trust (which people in reality can do by lets say beheading) you cant have a functioning society. PUBG yes.. society no.

How do you envision punishments in such world without rules?
Someone reading tribunal - but why should someone read tribunals if there are no rules?
Account deletion for consistently breaking trust? - or wait its a first rule - but we cant have rules.

[Universae]

19 hours ago, admin said:

3 reputation levels will be shown on map. Map will have a button allowing player to reset his reputation to positive by paying a very large sum of doubloons.

If I may make a suggestion, I feel like a cooldown of 7, 14, 21 or 28 days would have been better than a buyout. A cooldown would make it more balanced for new/old and poor/rich players. Continued good behaviour would be rewarded with moving up a notch in the reputation system, where negative behaviour would reset your cooldown. As opposed to bribing the clerk to wipe your records as and when you please. 

---/-\---

Still, looks like a great update! 

But I am curious, what will happen if an player of my nation attacks an enemy player and I happen to get tagged in against my will? Its unlikely to happen, but will this tarnish my reputation as if I was the aggressor? 

[Koltes]

23 minutes ago, admin said:

You want chaz darkfall and we all know where darkfall went. Since caves people crave for associations and without punishments (which people in reality can do) you cant have a functioning society. PUBG yes.. society no.

No, I want EVE Online with its "hi-sec" where new players and casual players can have an easy play and I want deadly "no rules other than what you can force" areas where no one is safe. EVE still function and for years maintains same player population.
Do an event. One time. Just to shut us up if we are wrong.
One time event. A week of green on green PVP no rules. Free for all. Just as an event while we are waiting for the patch. Gives us something to test in a mean while.

 

Quote

How do you envision punishments in such world without rules?
Someone reading tribunal - but why should someone read tribunals if there are no rules?
Account deletion for consistently breaking trust? - or wait its a first rule - but we cant have rules.

Well, if its free for all and green on green and all, then there ARE no green on green tribunals. If one did that to another player then those clans will sort it out diplomatically and if it does not work they will sort it our by war between the clans. No punishments other than what players do in game to themselves.
At the time of green on green in pirate nation everyone noticed how polite the nation chat has become with so few trolls. One just knew if he run his mouth he will get punished. Not by tribunal, but by those very players who he trolled a minute ago.

That is what I call REAL KARMA

Edited July 24, 2020 by Koltes

[Suppenkelle]

19 hours ago, admin said:

Chance of wind shadow just increased by 30% from 3%. Time to practice station keeping with @Charles Caldwell

 

This one is interesting. (The other changes too, but I’m especially interested in all things regarding sailing.)

Somewhere else you stated that the first sail being set is much more important to the ship’s speed than the last one being set of the whole rig. That is true. The same is valid for wind shadows. A reduction of wind power by 33% due to eddies etc. will not lead to a speed reduction of 33%. The impact on speed will be much lower (about one order of magnitude). Will that be considered?

Other questions: Will the wind shadow be as big as in reality and shaped like a cone? Will the impact of the wind shadow vary with distance to the ship? Will the impact of the wind shadow on the ship‘s speed vary with time as the ship is seeping inertia over time? Meaning: crossing a wind shadow has almost no impact on the speed because  it takes only a very short time. Sailing alongside in a wind shadow, however, has a much bigger impact over time. 
 

Actually I’m a bit worried that there will be a block shaped wind shadow with 100% impact over it‘s whole area and 0 impact everywhere else. 
But I do trust your attention to detail and your dedication to get things as realistic as possible.  

 

[Karpfanger]

If I have built up a negative reputation towards a nation, how can I regain a positive reputation?
Only through doubloons... a sort of medieval selling of indulgences...

It's quite possible that my battle will be joined by a player on the opposing side who actually belongs to an allied nation. Will my reputation decrease if I fight him?

What about battle groups of players with different reputations? Suppose the group wants to support a group from an allied nation and joins a battle. Is it possible that some players will be left out because they don't have the necessary reputation?

I'm excited to test the feature, but I don't think a system based on individual players' reputation can replace a nation-based alliance system.

Edited July 24, 2020 by Karpfanger

[erelkivtuadrater]

2 hours ago, Koltes said:

No, I want EVE Online with its "hi-sec" where new players and casual players can have an easy play and I want deadly "no rules other than what you can force" areas where no one is safe. EVE still function and for years maintains same player population.
Do an event. One time. Just to shut us up if we are wrong.
One time event. A week of green on green PVP no rules. Free for all. Just as an event while we are waiting for the patch. Gives us something to test in a mean while.

 

Well, if its free for all and green on green and all, then there ARE no green on green tribunals. If one did that to another player then those clans will sort it out diplomatically and if it does not work they will sort it our by war between the clans. No punishments other than what players do in game to themselves.
At the time of green on green in pirate nation everyone noticed how polite the nation chat has become with so few trolls. One just knew if he run his mouth he will get punished. Not by tribunal, but by those very players who he trolled a minute ago.

That is what I call REAL KARMA

Couldnt agree more, and to guide people to not attack players of same nation, turn them to pirate (only way to become pirate) after x amount of engagements. We have the forged paper to get back to a normal nation. 

@admin it would take off alot of work for your selves aswell considering you lay the moderation part on ingame mechanics and get a decrease in the amount of tribunal you get

[admin]

2 hours ago, Suppenkelle said:

Will the impact of the wind shadow on the ship‘s speed vary with time as the ship is seeping inertia over time? Meaning: crossing a wind shadow has almost no impact on the speed because  it takes only a very short time.

I don't know about that and are currently talking to those who sailed bigger ships
When i sailed in spring the small two masted flush decked sloop, the effect of inertia felt negligible. Slight wind change of 5 degrees, or slightly wrong trim on sails, causes immediate noticeable WOOMPTH effect like pushing the brakes in the car. You slowdown and you feel it immediately. Its not stoppage, but speed drops by a good amount. 
 

[Henry Long Castle]

35 minutes ago, admin said:

I don't know about that and are currently talking to those who sailed bigger ships
When i sailed in spring the small two masted flush decked sloop, the effect of inertia felt negligible. Slight wind change of 5 degrees, or slightly wrong trim on sails, causes immediate noticeable WOOMPTH effect like pushing the brakes in the car. You slowdown and you feel it immediately. Its not stoppage, but speed drops by a good amount. 
 

I was doing competitive sailing for around 8 years, Optimist, then 420 class then 470 class. When we would enter the "shit" as we called it, of an other boat we definitely felt it. Sudden loss of power and change in wind direction. The boat would get destabilized, loss of power in the sails meant we had to quickly rush leeward to prevent the boat from healing on the windward side ( that was when sailing upwind for example). General advice was to avoid Wind Shadow at all costs, either tack or maneuver accordingly to completely avoid it (try to not even enter that zone, ever) . Wind Shadow was roughly 3-4 boat lengths depending on the wind and angle of sailing. The boat would carry some momentum initially as it entered but would very quickly loose it since our boats are extremely light weight (sudden rudder movement really reduces the speed as well). Bigger boats are less affected but also need to correct your course accordingly to keep the sails as full as possible. If you fail to do that the sail will just stall and act as a break. With correct and precise movements you can however maintain your speed for just enough time to get out of that zone, needs some practice to achieve it.
If that helps or if i can help in any way in the development of that feature feel free to pm me. 

Edited July 24, 2020 by Henry Long Castle

[admin]

1 minute ago, Henry Long Castle said:

I was doing competitive sailing for around 8 years, Optimist, then 420 class then 470 class. When we would enter the "shit" as we called it, of an other boat we definitely felt it. Sudden loss of power and change in wind direction. The boat would get destabilized, loss of power in the sails meant we had to quickly rush leeward to prevent the boat from healing on the windward side ( that was when sailing upwind for example). General advice was to avoid Wind Shadow at all costs, either tack or maneuver accordingly to completely avoid it (try to not even enter that zone, ever) . Wind Shadow was roughly 3-4 boat lengths depending on the wind and angle of sailing. The boat would carry some momentum initially as it entered but would very quickly loose it since our boats are extremely light weight. Bigger boats are less affected but also need to correct your course accordingly to keep the sails as full as possible. If you fail to do that the sail will just stall and act as a break. With correct and precise movements you can however maintain your speed for just enough time to get out of that zone, needs some practice to achieve it.
If that helps or if i can help in any way in the development of that feature feel free to pm me. 

i need to talk to you in private)))

[Koltes]

2 minutes ago, admin said:

i need to talk to you in private)))

I PMed you the discord link