Preliminary discussion of the changes to conquest - clan wars are coming

[Sir Texas Sir]

4 minutes ago, admin said:

center of map will not have significant changes to free towns 

Only coasts. Placing a free town near every capital was done to provide players with resource transport opportunity. This is no longer needed as all resources must be transported. 

I think he's talking about being able to raid along the coast than.  Since your still allowed to do PvP in that are Pirates and Privateers for nations would prob want to set up shop and do there deeds.  That is normally done in a freetown close buy until they need to return to there home base and resupply.  The French have been doing this on PvP GLOBAL very effectively and other folks too.  The other way to do this is what we did  for pirates.  Put a BLACK dot next to every major nations capital so our guys can raid them.

[Armored_Sheep]

I would prefer keeping the Hostility concept instead of Flags/war supplies. To trigger PB the main investment should be gameplay in OW - sail and sink ships. When the hostility numbers raise, more players have chance to rally up and have some fun in OW. I had very nice evening yesterday when Brits were defending Caymans and some time ago when Dutch were defending Santa Marta. Always nice mixed fleet and long battles.

Edited August 4, 2017 by Armored_Sheep

[Sir Texas Sir]

3 minutes ago, Daguse said:

You could expand upon that, rep with nations means you get better trade prices with that nation. Maybe pirates can't trade with a nation they don't personally have a good rep with, forcing them to obtain most of their resources from raids. 

I wouldn't have it effect prices, need to keep it simple and the same goes for any Nationals.  A Spain player that does nothing but sink British traders won't be able to trade in any british ports cause he has bad reputation with them.  Why would any merchant want to trade with an enemy that will just sink them.  

Now you could have a black market reputation that allows some traders that has good reputation with the pirates, but not a pirate to trade in pirate ports.   Remember there is no new pirate mechanics so we need to keep them treated as a Nation until such comes out in game if it ever does.

 

[Zoky]

44 minutes ago, Liquicity said:

But then again, 5v1 is not PvP in my book. It's ZvP. Zerg vs Player.

Even 100vs1 is valid PvP. Most of times defender didn't even read national chat with countless warnings of enemy around before sailing out. I cant even count how many mission runners i sunk around belize, one after another, and they still keep sailing out of port in mission ships, alone. NA was destroyed before wipe by trying to fix imaginary problem. Lets not make same mistakes again.

P.S. What do you think of no free ports anymore?

[Hethwill]

Just now, Zoky said:

imaginary problem

Can you explain what this was ? Thanks.

[Daguse]

21 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said:

Then players will use alts to secure their port by buying the flag with alt (we had it). You can limit the company to buying flag only once per day for a certain port.

Flags and lord protector need to be rebalanced. I had a few thoughts that would help.

• Set port timers to 4 or 6 hour limits.

• Require ports be split across all time slots. So if a nation/war company owns 4 ports.  1 must have a timer of 00-06, 1 from 06-1200, 1 from 1200-1800 and 1 from 1800-0000.

• Once a port is attacked, it has a 5 day cool down if defended and a 10 day cool down if won. Spread out the attacks to more ports and help encourage raids.

• war company will have 72 hours to vote for port time to help prevent one player screwing over a WC.

• 1 hour notice to start of pb. So once the pb has been purchased, the defending nation gets a notice that the pb would start in one hour. No nation would be able to join during that hour. This means sinking one ship will not end the pb as well as giving defending nation notice and time to stage.

• PB timer doesn't start till a minimum of 1 player from each nation joins or 1 hour. This will give the attacks time to adjust for the wins. Right now too many PBs are losses.

• You must use admiralty points (or what ever we call them today) to buy the flag. 50-100~

• WC (War Companys) can only buy 1 flag at a time. WCs can only have 1-2 active attacks on them at a time. 

  • This is to reduce the false flags or ganking of WCs. let's face it, we know it will get out of hand. 

• The flags can not be traded, placed aboard a ship or moved. The flag is tied to the captain that pulled it.

  • if sunk, the captain does not lose the flag. We want to support PVP not stop it by sinking one ship.

• A single player can only pull 1 flag at a time.

Edited August 4, 2017 by Daguse

[oleander]

I like the idea of a reputation system, or maybe some sort of bounty system. That would turn the hunters into the hunted once the bounty gets so high. It would help with a lot of the griefing and ganking. As far as I know it worked really well in games like EVE.

[Hodo]

3 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

 

You mean like nationals actually act like Nationals too?   I actually proposed some pretty hard core changes for pirates, but it seems the Devs never want to make Pirates actuall not a bastard/red-headed Step child of a Nation.

Until they do give us an actual mechanic than we should continue to be treated like the other nations.  We all ready don't have the BP's for the SOL of 2nd and 1st rates and we can't get the Permits for the Aggy and SOL of 2nd and 1st rates.  Which is add as we can buy the BP for the Aggy, but not the permits?    The only special ship we have is the Pirate Frigate which any national can get too the same way we get our SOL's BP's and Permits.    Personnel I think any National caught in a Pirate Frigate should be treated as a pirate by all.   You want to sail in a pirate ship you must be a pirate.  

 

So you mean actually sail in lines and do line fighting formations in line ships?   Sail around in frigates/5th rates.   

How should a national act?

[Zoky]

3 minutes ago, The Red Duke said:

5 minutes ago, Zoky said:

 

Can you explain what this was ? Thanks.

I mean ganking. I can't think of single OW PvP game without players trying to organize in bigger groups for security. Be it in offence or defense. And my opinion is that devs shouldn't punish something that is natural thing to do, both in game and in real life.

[Liq]

5 minutes ago, Zoky said:

Even 100vs1 is valid PvP. Most of times defender didn't even read national chat with countless warnings of enemy around before sailing out. I cant even count how many mission runners i sunk around belize, one after another, and they still keep sailing out of port in mission ships, alone. NA was destroyed before wipe by trying to fix imaginary problem. Lets not make same mistakes again.

P.S. What do you think of no free ports anymore?

I'm fine with no free ports. In general I don't care what flag I'm flying, as long as I get good access to OW PvP, hence in the DK-NO faction at the moment. If things change, I might change nation again .)
Wasn't operating out of free ports too often anyway. But I can see why it could suck for pirate privateers, unable to settle down in a hunting area across the map for a while.

[Lordicious]

2 hours ago, admin said:

PvP EU: Players who won at least one port battle since wipe 612
PvP US: Players who won at least one port battle since wipe: 428. 

Total players logged in at least once during last two weeks on all servers is around 11000.

Question is how are you going to make them move from temps to Full timers?

11 000 of players still hoping you will create what they want before they leave for good. So, they log in to see if there is any changes and log out providing 0 benefits to the rest of Full time players. I call them Ghosts. 

Edited August 4, 2017 by Lordicious

[Daguse]

5 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

I wouldn't have it effect prices, need to keep it simple and the same goes for any Nationals.  A Spain player that does nothing but sink British traders won't be able to trade in any british ports cause he has bad reputation with them.  Why would any merchant want to trade with an enemy that will just sink them.  

Now you could have a black market reputation that allows some traders that has good reputation with the pirates, but not a pirate to trade in pirate ports.   Remember there is no new pirate mechanics so we need to keep them treated as a Nation until such comes out in game if it ever does.

 

The thing is I don't think it should be kept simple. We want to promote building relationships, that's the point of rep. This will give the hardcore traders something to work on, do they build better rep with the bits for their live oak or the French for their white oak? As for sinking of trade ships, 100% agree, you sink ships, you lose rep. 

No for the pirates, I agree, they need a better system, the idea is this would be a start. In short your a pirate, why would any nation want to give you the wood to build better ships? (An argument could be made that they shouldn't build ships but rather cap them.) So instead of trade, the pirates are forced to be pirates, sink and take trade ships and raid. It's by no means adequate but it's a hell of a lot better than this dumb ass pirate nation crap. 

[Sven Silberbart]

5 minutes ago, Daguse said:

•  

  • if sunk, the captain does not lose the flag. We want to support PVP not stop it by sinking one ship.

No. I loved the old flag system and espacially the flag carrier as a strategically target.

[Zoky]

3 minutes ago, Liquicity said:

Wasn't operating out of free ports too often anyway. But I can see why it could suck for pirate privateers, unable to settle down in a hunting area across the map for a while.

Well me and my clan operate between belize, great corn and willemstat so it will suck big time for us 

Edited August 4, 2017 by Zoky

[Daguse]

Just now, Sven Silberbart said:

No. I loved the old flag system and espacially the flag carrier as a strategically target.

He would still be a target, you sink him, he goes back to port and has to get a ship sail back to the port and plant the flag. However, that doesn't just end the PB with one gank fleet. 

[Lordicious]

2 hours ago, admin said:

lol.
This is just alt paranoia. A huge majority of new players buy this game "because ships" and don't really care about alts or rvr. 
War companies will eliminate alts from your conquest. 
 

You just confirmed that there is a huge amount of new players who don't care about RvR, and yet you work on completely new RvR mechanics (war companies). Instead you could add content to keep them playing, help them learn and reward them. How can this strategy promote population or health of your product?

Edited August 4, 2017 by Lordicious

[admin]

6 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said:

Then players will use alts to secure their port by buying the flag with alt (we had it). You can limit the company to buying flag only once per day for a certain port.

will try to consider ways to counter that.. 

[Aventador]

On 8/2/2017 at 9:57 AM, admin said:

 

• • Captureable regions
    • Cuba (with the exception of havana)
    • Jamaica
    • Bahamas
    • Lower parts of florida
    • Hispaniola
    • Turks and Caicos
    • Puerto Rico
    • All minor island chains
  • Capitals for two nations might move to a more appropriate safe place
  • Port royal and havana will still remain secondary capitals but the spawns of new players Might be moved to 
    • Sisal
    • Bridgetown or Belize 
  • Pirate republic capital might move to Nassau (with a secondary capture able capital in Mortimer)

Regions

• Regions will split into individual ports for conquest (tentative)
• All ports will be split into captureable (all large islands in the center of the map and island chains) and non captureable - coasts
• All capture able ports will change status to neutral after reset
  • History fans can relax because in 2-3 weeks port captures will shape the nationalities of ports themselves. New players will come to a live fluid map, which will have stability along the coast and constant instability in the center.

 

1.Personally I disagree that you should be able to capture some areas that you listed like Cuba,Jamaica,Hispaniola, and Florida. Some are incredibly large and/or significant historically in that region. I would propose that you just stick with small islands that were not historically significant. 

2. I think having multiple capitals is a good idea. Maybe the larger the empire like gb or spain the more 'capitals' they can have.

3. An easy way to fix pirates is to move their capital to the secret island and give their starting territories back to gb and spain (or make them neutral) I don't think pirates should be able to capture ports even if they are capturable. Instead they should be able to control them with the company feature. Ex: Pirates take Nassau but it stays british but it's controlled by the X company

 

Edited August 4, 2017 by Aventador

[Hethwill]

10 minutes ago, Zoky said:

I mean ganking. I can't think of single OW PvP game without players trying to organize in bigger groups for security. Be it in offence or defense. And my opinion is that devs shouldn't punish something that is natural thing to do, both in game and in real life.

Thanks for clarification.

[Red Dragon 13]

Admin, could you say something/elaborate about special Pirate Mechanics? Is it an issue for you? Are there hardware/software limits to establish one?

Thanks a lot for the hard work, I think the game is going in the right direction in general.

[Sir Texas Sir]

7 minutes ago, Daguse said:

No for the pirates, I agree, they need a better system, the idea is this would be a start. In short your a pirate, why would any nation want to give you the wood to build better ships? (An argument could be made that they shouldn't build ships but rather cap them.) So instead of trade, the pirates are forced to be pirates, sink and take trade ships and raid. It's by no means adequate but it's a hell of a lot better than this dumb ass pirate nation crap. 

Fine you want to limit us than limit nationals.   You can't capture ships, any ship you capture auto goes to the Admiralty to be auction off or refitted to be put back into service.  You can only have one SOL at a time.  What captain was ever commissioned on more than one ship in the Navy at time?  If a National Captain is caught in a stolen ship (pirate frigate or any others) than they should be treated as a pirate.  

We can go on and on and on on this, but until the Devs change pirates and give them an actually pirate mechanics you have to live with the fact we are still nothing more than a nation with a black flag.  I'm really getting sick of Nationals trying to tell us how to play our nation when ya'll don't even play your own right and make care bear alliance and never fight each other.  If I remember right in history most of the big nations in game actually fought each other at one time or another.  Something many of them refuse to do. 

[Red Dragon 13]

11 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

Fine you want to limit us than limit nationals.   You can't capture ships, any ship you capture auto goes to the Admiralty to be auction off or refitted to be put back into service.  You can only have one SOL at a time.  What captain was ever commissioned on more than one ship in the Navy at time?  If a National Captain is caught in a stolen ship (pirate frigate or any others) than they should be treated as a pirate.  

We can go on and on and on on this, but until the Devs change pirates and give them an actually pirate mechanics you have to live with the fact we are still nothing more than a nation with a black flag.  I'm really getting sick of Nationals trying to tell us how to play our nation when ya'll don't even play your own right and make care bear alliance and never fight each other.  If I remember right in history most of the big nations in game actually fought each other at one time or another.  Something many of them refuse to do. 

Quite true.

Besides, when you look at the game now, most French act as Pirates, and Pirates are a powerful nation acting as such.

[Hodo]

2 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

Fine you want to limit us than limit nationals.   You can't capture ships, any ship you capture auto goes to the Admiralty to be auction off or refitted to be put back into service.  You can only have one SOL at a time.  What captain was ever commissioned on more than one ship in the Navy at time?  If a National Captain is caught in a stolen ship (pirate frigate or any others) than they should be treated as a pirate.  

We can go on and on and on on this, but until the Devs change pirates and give them an actually pirate mechanics you have to live with the fact we are still nothing more than a nation with a black flag.  I'm really getting sick of Nationals trying to tell us how to play our nation when ya'll don't even play your own right and make care bear alliance and never fight each other.  If I remember right in history most of the big nations in game actually fought each other at one time or another.  Something many of them refuse to do. 

Actually not correct.  

National naval captains could take other ships as prizes.  But would have to turn them over to the admiralty for the prize court to access the value.   And several admirals had several ships under their "command".   Nelson had the HMS Victory, and the HMS Pickle,  but the Pickle was his personally owned ship but under Royal Navy charge.  

But there was also other advantages to being a naval officer.   If you were a fleet commander, or squadron commander, like Pellew, you would get paid on your standard pay and get prize pay based on your captures AND the captures of your squadron.  

[Teutonic]

If we go to flags then we also need to go to time windows in my opinion...

Or will the flag pop the port battle for 22 hours later still?

Either way, i am in favor of going to a time window system, whether that's choosing a time period that you can only be attacked, or choosing a time period that no one can attack the port.

 

[admin]

1 minute ago, Teutonic said:

If we go to flags then we also need to go to time windows in my opinion...

Or will the flag pop the port battle for 22 hours later still?

Either way, i am in favor of going to a time window system, whether that's choosing a time period that you can only be attacked, or choosing a time period that no one can attack the port.

 

the problem of alt buying a flag, placing it first and setting up a pb that you cannot enter as a clan is a problem. it can be countered to an extent but still