Patch 14: Part 2 experimental patch increasing realism in ship behavior

[John Sheppard]

6 hours ago, admin said:

We are not sure about it.
But we need to force players to rvr. Old players might not like it (and its fine) new players will come on release and will consider this a given.

You need 5 people to capture 35-40% of ports on the map. 

1st of all DON"T YOU DARE TO ERASE THIS.. we are pissed and we have a right to be..

ok .. WHAT THE F@CK?? do you have any idea what's going on at the momment in the game??? "WE NEED TO FORCE PLAYERS TO RVR"???? do you know that a lot of people are soooo damn fed up with 3 port battles every F day that they actually said ENOUGH??? and now you want to force them to do RVR? well let me tell you something .. you will only force them to LEAVE this f@cked up game.. 

and about all this "maybe the old players aren't interested in RVR but new players will do it" bullsht .. this is hilarious .. we have so many examples of what happens when 20 newbies try to fight 10-12 1+ year old players .. it always ends up a disaster for the newbies and pls don't say "they will learn" coz continuously getting their ass kicked does not make them learn .. i've seen it all too many times 

you see that 95% of the replies here say that you've screwed up .. well you HAVE to do what we want .. you can't do what YOU want coz we pay the money so tell the guys at dev to shove this update in someone else's throat .. we don't care otherwise they can keep paying for empty servers and we'll make sure to spread the word how much this game sucks that you won't see any money from now on

Edit : this may be seem too harsh responce but we as customers have every right to be angry about you going totally against our wishes

Edited December 22, 2017 by John Sheppard

[Barbancourt]

There are more diplomatic ways of disagreeing...

[John Sheppard]

4 minutes ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

There are more diplomatic ways of disagreeing...

wich are being totally IGNORED it seems

[VirtuallyIdiotic]

1 minute ago, John Sheppard said:

wich are being totally IGNORED it seems

Being ignored just like you ignoring anything resembling grammar or spelling. Acting like a child who is not getting their way is no way to act and will do more harm than good when wanting to be productive to ones cause.

7 minutes ago, Coraline Vodka said:

I'm surprised no one has started a poll tbh

Yeah, noticed the lack of poorly done polls over various issues in patches lately.

[Rhodry Heidenrich]

There's only one solution to re-visiting a failed concept via simply painting the dead horse and calling it a zebra. 

[Jean Ribault]

1 hour ago, Lucius Esox said:

I startet on PvE server in Prussia what is with the admirality on the Pve server. Are they accessible after a special rank or are they only in national ports like on Pvp server. 

 

No, you can't access Admiralty at all on the PVE server for Prussia.  Because devs won't address the configuration of the server, or for that matter even condescend to discuss it.  For the "impossible" nations, the only way to get it is to conquer ports.  Since you cannot conquer ports on the PVE server, then you can never access Admiralty for the new impossible nations.  They obviously know this, but will not address it.  Unfortunately how would you know that if you are a new player starting out on that server?

Edited December 22, 2017 by Jean Ribault

[King of Crowns]

8 hours ago, admin said:

First rate ships are rare special ships. 

nope. you may have wanted them to be....... but they are not. they are easy to get and easy to maintain. I think your problem is that your game econ is to broken. your trying to fix with marks. I don't really care one way or the other. vic marks can be bought or traded from other players. they can also be collected via ALTS. so its really no problem at all. your economy is to broken for any ship to be rare and special. the only ship that is rare and special in the game is the santa cecilia

[Valentine Karrde]

1 hour ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

There are more diplomatic ways of disagreeing...

Diplomacy has failed. They only understand anger. 

[King of Crowns]

1 minute ago, Intrepido said:

All ships are essential for rvr and for achieving the long desired fleet variety in port battles.

You cant imagine how many people left the game because they cant sail a lineship when conquests marks were on the game.

Limiting the best content of the game is going to be painful.

PVP marks already increases the gap between the hardcore and the average player. Victory marks will give a huge boost to the already winning nation. Now the successful nations will have everything, the best rvr team and the most powerful ships. Who is going to fight against that?

NO they wont. not for a couple months. lets be real for a second and stop acting like the sky is falling. any clans that are involved in RVR have enough first rates to loose their whole fleet 2/3 times before they need to make a new one. ALTS and other players that don't do RVR would stand to make a nice profit by sailing their victory marks.

however if @admin wants to make 1st rates rare. then make every first rate cost a daily maintenance of 3mil. weather it is sailed or not. just to have that ship sitting in your dock costs the owner 3mil. you want to make them rare. that's how you do it. and its realistic. there were not many 1st rates due to the upkeep costs on the ships. most of the ships you see in the battles were 3rd rates. 

[Valentine Karrde]

13 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

All ships are essential for rvr and for achieving the long desired fleet variety in port battles.

You cant imagine how many people left the game because they cant sail a lineship when conquests marks were on the game.

Limiting the best content of the game is going to be painful.

PVP marks already increases the gap between the hardcore and the average player. Victory marks will give a huge boost to the already winning nation. Now the successful nations will have everything, the best rvr team and the most powerful ships. Who is going to fight against that?

Admin thinks that depriving players of the means to compete will force them to do rvr. This is a rather short sighted and arrogant solution. What he has not included in his thinking is that players won't stand for being pushed around in a game. Every time he tries something like this he loses 25 percent of his player base. We are at around 800 to 1000 players now. If he pulls this new brain child of his, and we lose the same numbers we lost the last times he tried to enforce his will on the players, we will be at 500 to 600 players tops. Less if the outrage I've seen in game today is any indication.

Edited December 22, 2017 by Valentine Karrde

[OneEyedSnake]

7 hours ago, admin said:

you can't be everywhere. Even the most populated nation cannot be at 311 ports at once. We won't give high end content from the green zone any more. Get out and fight. 

 

youve made a mistake, it isnt that simple and everyone knows it. 

[OneEyedSnake]

9 hours ago, admin said:

Why did you omit Russia from the list. They started from the same empty clean sheet as prussia or commonwealth.

because more people went russia than those other nations..... sorry for being capt obvious. 

[Valentine Karrde]

3 minutes ago, OneEyedSnake said:

youve made a mistake, it isnt that simple and everyone knows it. 

Not his first, but judging from the outrage, it may be his last lol. 

[OneEyedSnake]

12 hours ago, admin said:

All nations have at least 25 players. we just need to give them an incentive to get out of the safe zone; a real incentive to practice and fight. No leading nation can withstand the simultaneous attack on multiple fronts.

except not all nations have 25 players on at one time. if we exclude alts especially. i am from one of these nations. except for once a week for a couple hours we are short of 25 players on at one time. 

[Rigge1988]

7 hours ago, admin said:

We are not sure about it.
But we need to force players to rvr. Old players might not like it (and its fine) new players will come on release and will consider this a given.

You need 5 people to capture 35-40% of ports on the map. 

Haha, this is candy right here. Sinking 2231 hours into your game and you just piss on me, and frankly others who have played longer too.

You even had time to rephrase that before clicking "submit reply" and let me tell you. That's what I would've done if I were you.

All this tells me is that you are looking to make the game attractive enough to keep players for longer than 2 hours so they can't bail with a full refund.

Thank you. Now I can quit this game and feel done with it as you obviously don't care for old players. Am I interpreting you correctly?

[Anolytic]

It's only been less than 24 hours since this patch, and people are too quick to loose their tits about it, but please take into consideration those reasonable counterarguments that are presented in-between the flow of abuse.

6 hours ago, admin said:

We are not sure about it.
But we need to force players to rvr. Old players might not like it (and its fine) new players will come on release and will consider this a given.

Please take into consideration, that this change contradicts, and completely conflicts with, your recent change towards clan-based RvR. You gave clans charge of RvR, by allowing us to decide who is able to get into Port Battles through our clan lists and friendly clans lists. Now you are trying to force everyone into RvR, not just the clans that form around this activity. 

You have many times said that "ships are content". I wholeheartedly agree. By this change you are handing a significant part of your gameplay - SOLs - over to a niche group of your player-base (clans) as a hostage. I can tell you right now, that hostage has no chance.

Not everyone likes being in a clan. Not everyone plays using teamspeak (and you need teamspeak/discord to do RvR). If you cannot get accepted into someone else's clan, you can of course make your own, but not everyone have the time, or skill, to run a clan and run it in a way that it can actually do RvR.

I spend more time to help managing my clan than I spend playing the actual game. You @-mentioned me about my thoughts on why Russia gained players. Russia is gaining players because we are active and we have something to promote. We have something to promote to new players because of the successes of our active RvR- and PvP-clans. Talking only about REDS, a key reason for our current activity is that players are not forced to do a lot of stuff that they do not care for. Sure, we all have to pitch in and do boring PvE every time we want to set a Port Battle, but even that can be managed when we have fun on Teamspeak together.

But when it comes to other things we have streamlined our clan for maximum fun for our members. Some of our Officers have a ridiculous amount of alts. And by the use of these alts and tight cooperation we are able to gather resources, labour hours and materials so that every ship a member of the clan needs he need only ask for it. Be it for PvE, PvP, or RvR. Just the other day a clan-member needed a ship to join other clan members and go out to PvP. I was able to use my alt to craft a ship for him to his specifications and use my alt to teleport it to where he needed it, and hand it over to him in time for him to catch up with the rest of the group.

Some players want to follow the production chain of the ship that they use, from gathering resources to launching and outfitting a finished ship and taking it out for PvE. Others just want to grab a ship and go out in the open world and hunt PvP, or RvR, or even PvE. A well organised clan allows them to do that, and be part of the production chain without having to handle every part of it themselves. 

With restricted Victory Marks access we will no longer be able to hand our players the ships that they need when they need them. 

Players won't be able to get into port battles in big ships, because they don't have knowledge slots on their big ships, and they can no longer get knowledge slots on their big ships because if they go out to PvE-grind and they loose their ship to an accident, a disconnect or someone jumping their mission, then we cannot replace those ships anymore.

7 hours ago, admin said:

taking neutral ports gives everyone a chance to get to top three. There are 311 ports on the map. Goal is to keep capitals safe but give a real reason to sail out. Everyone requested this and here we are. Reason to sail out.. if you are strong attack defended ports. if you are not yet strong attack distant ports, npc ports or weaker enemies.

This change will not have that effect. It will have the effect that the strong nations will be afraid to fight each other (loss of valuable ships for no benefit) and rather will race against each other to grab ports from the weak nations.

Having top 3 nations get victory marks, also means that there is every possible incentive for the 3 largest nations at any time to not fight each other and rather cooperate about keeping the rest of the nations at bay so that neither of the 3 can loose their spot in the top 3.

7 hours ago, admin said:

But we need to force players to rvr.

I think I get your point. Although you cannot force players to do anything except stop playing. If you really want to push people hard towards participation in RvR, what you need to do is give players that participate in any part of RvR, meaning, hostility grinding, screening or inside the actual PB, in connection with any port battle that is actually set and actually happens, should get victory marks. All of them. Regardless if they only did hostility or only joined in the PB. You also need to incentivise people to actually want to risk their ships, so victory marks should be handed out to both the winning side and the loosing side. Equally, or possibly twice as many for the winning side. That way players get back marks to replace the ships that they lost.

However even this would only be viable back when RvR was available to all and not clan-controlled like it is now.

[Jesters-Ink]

2 hours ago, Jean Ribault said:

 

No, you can't access Admiralty at all on the PVE server for Prussia.  Because devs won't address the configuration of the server, or for that matter even condescend to discuss it.  For the "impossible" nations, the only way to get it is to conquer ports.  Since you cannot conquer ports on the PVE server, then you can never access Admiralty for the new impossible nations.  They obviously know this, but will not address it.  Unfortunately how would you know that if you are a new player starting out on that server?

The Devs don't want you doing PvE at all, haven't they made that clear enough?

A good game makes room for all aspects of game play and a great game encourages it.

Edited December 22, 2017 by Jesters-Ink

[Farrago]

Uggghhh! This sounds like such a bad idea.

Capturing (or defending) a port that you only need to raise a score so you can get a Victory Mark so you can get a good ship so that you can capture (or defend) another port so that you can get a Victory Mark so that you can capture (or defend) another port so that... you get the idea = GRIND

Capturing (or defending) ports that your nation needs because they add value to your gameplay = GAME

But alas... I’ll keep trying to find something to do in game for a while longer. But we’ve always said “don’t sail watch you can not afford to lose”. Now very few of us can afford to sail a first rate and can never hope to do so.

Swedes (and perhaps the Brits and Russians), please keep the rest of us updated on any changes in 1st Rate sailing characteristics. We’ll live vicariously through you!

[Jim Beamreach]

3 hours ago, Jesters-Ink said:

The Devs don't want you doing PvE at all, haven't they made that clear enough?

A good game makes room for all aspects of game play and a great game encourages it.

Yeah but you answer to a answer about PvE server not abaut PvP server so it makes no sense.

What shoud guys on PvE server do can you explain this?

I asked for Admirality on PvE server for the impossible Nations like Prussia/Russia and Poland. So Devs did not think about how a Player on PvE server gets to his Admirality when they dont have acces to a National Port of there Nation.  If a new Player will start on PvE-Server he will not know that there is a Admirality so i woud say next thing they dont think about.

[Yngvarr]

16 hours ago, admin said:

We are interested in opinions of the supporting base but will push our design if we disagree with those opinions. 

ps legends is a side offshoot of a proven tested design (sea trials). NA is still a main game. 
 

@admin Pushing your own views on how the game should work when the majority of the players disagree, is a very good and sure way to drive your players away.

 

News Flash....a game needs players to work.

You might want to think about keeping the players that you have, which is laughably low in numbers, instead of kicking your player-base in the shins.

 

[Urchin]

The concept that players of minor nations will work harder or together to defeat the top nation is a nice idea however false and can be a crushing blow to minor nations. Since new players or players not committed to their nation/clan will always take the fastest path of least resistance to get the best and biggest toys they want to play with as quickly as possible.

If the goal is to encourage players to leave reinforcement zones and participate in PBs and other actions then provide ship insurance like Elite Dangerous insurance cost depending on ship type,build and additional mods. Discounts to ship insurance and increases in rewards could be given to minor nations to help encourage players to join those nations and participate in port battles and other actions.

Also like strategy games the map needs to have winnable conditions similar perhaps to Hearts of Iron series. Each nation has different variable victory conditions not just conquest. And every action can help towards that victory and receive rewards. Traders supplying resources, PVP's taking out other nation trade ships and warships,port battles for control of more resources etc. 

 

 

[Yngvarr]

15 hours ago, Iroquois Confederacy said:

and not once did a ship sail backwards in this fight....oh my...*sarcasm*

[admin]

57 minutes ago, Yngvarr said:

and not once did a ship sail backwards in this fight....oh my...*sarcasm*

at 2.50 java gets stuck into wind (probably already lost some yards and sails backwards while tacking
please avoid talking about things you have no idea about. 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Yngvarr said:

 Pushing your own views on how the game should work when the majority of the players disagree, is a very good and sure way to drive your players away.

Game will be developed for new players from now on not for the existing playerbase.Just to let you know.

[Demsity]

26 minutes ago, admin said:

at 2.50 java gets stuck into wind (probably already lost some yards and sails backwards while tacking
please avoid talking about things you have no idea about. 

And once again admin decides to not answer any important question or concern, but to answer nonsense.

@admin You have seriously angered your player base and this is one of those times where you have to do something about it and not just ignore.

Edited December 22, 2017 by Demsity