Timber Feedback Thread - PINNED

[Botq]

On 6/20/2020 at 5:12 PM, Redman29 said:

 

Is it strong yes, OP no.

 

1 hour ago, Redman29 said:

Locust needed a nerf and is something that needed to be done and was simply broken.

Lol can you decide ?

[Redman29]

removed

 

 

 

Edited June 23, 2020 by Redman29

[Redman29]

21 minutes ago, Botq said:

 

Lol can you decide ?

Yes, and if you bothered to read the other posts that I wrote after that initial quote you will find I changed my opinion. 

See stats only say so much. 

Testing a half a dozen different builds in instance show things not shown in stats.

And I have every right to change my opinion and if you bothered to read the detailed post I posted, which you chose to ignore you will see I suggested a nerf to Locust.

But yeah, if you're going to quote me; make sure you quote everything I say and not pick and choose.

Edited June 23, 2020 by Redman29

[Botq]

3 minutes ago, Redman29 said:

Yes, and if you bothered to read the other posts that I wrote after that initial quote you will find I changed my opinion. 

See stats only say so much. 

Testing a half a dozen different builds in instance show things not shown in stats.

And I have every right to change my opinion and if you bothered to read the detailed post I posted, which you chose to ignore you will see I suggested a nerf to Locust.

But yeah, if you're going to quote me; make sure you quote everything I say and not pick and choose.

Sorry for hurting your feelings i wont do it anymore.

Btw 1 respond would be enough no need to spam

[Redman29]

2 minutes ago, Botq said:

Sorry for hurting your feelings i wont do it anymore.

Btw 1 respond would be enough no need to spam

Oh you didn't. I just ask if you quote me, make sure you read everything I post. Might put it into context. 

And yeah, been up for 20 hours. Didn't realize I posted twice....

[Hittings]

6 hours ago, admin said:

There will be a timber update this week
The philosophy will remain

Oaks - HP
Teaks - Resistance
Firs/Cedars - Speed
Other - Specialized with unique qualities.
 

Other woods will lose some of the qualities that were abnormally high. Locust is one of them. They will remain stronger/strongest in 1 parameter but will not be universally balanced/strong. 

so you moved the numbers around all up until the patch, then you patched and said this was it...  because you know you released it live without adequate testing apparently?   Now your changing values again..after people just started turning ships out left and right as they waited 3-4 weeks to build new ships because they didn't know what to be doing...   Locust is perfectly fine as it is. If these are going to be significant changes then i want my stuff back or adequate compensation as I already started to build new ships based on these new changes.  

 

Your decision on how to handle compensation for this = the outcome of my steam review.  You released a patch to live without adequate testing and are already changing the values again.  You need to provide compensation.

Edited June 23, 2020 by Hittings

[ChineseBatman]

Okay Devs you really need to finalise the woods. All you need to do is buff speed builds ever so slightly. Teak, Bermuda, mahogany and fir and Finalise it. Jezz devs should be giving out compensation for any ships crafted during this period of undecidedness. Also would be great if you could allow anyone to wreck a ship that they have before the final woods balance and get the full amount of wood/ seasoned wood back from the build. That would at least show that you some what care. 

[Never]

2 hours ago, Hittings said:

so you moved the numbers around all up until the patch, then you patched and said this was it...  because you know you released it live without adequate testing apparently?   Now your changing values again..after people just started turning ships out left and right as they waited 3-4 weeks to build new ships because they didn't know what to be doing...   Locust is perfectly fine as it is. If these are going to be significant changes then i want my stuff back or adequate compensation as I already started to build new ships based on these new changes.  

 

Your decision on how to handle compensation for this = the outcome of my steam review.  You released a patch to live without adequate testing and are already changing the values again.  You need to provide compensation.

You haven't even seen what the adjustments are and you are already asking for compensation. How about wait until the patch drops before getting all riled up?

If you were aware of this thread, what did you think was the purpose of proving feedback on the patch?
 

[Hittings]

1 hour ago, Never said:

You haven't even seen what the adjustments are and you are already asking for compensation. How about wait until the patch drops before getting all riled up?

If you were aware of this thread, what did you think was the purpose of proving feedback on the patch?
 

Because they pushed a patch out to live, and said here it is.  This isn't early access, this isn't beta.   Your suppose to test things yourself before your release them.  If you didn't realize that giving 2nd rates 110ish thickness with upgrades was an issue and you had to basically brawl it out with everything at almost point blank range to pen, that's fine, but that is their mistake.  You tell people the shipbuilding overhaul patch is coming, wait weeks to release it, then wonder why everyone is cranking out ships and now your going to nerf bat them 5-7 days later.   That's messed up.   

Steam sale gets released Thursday at noon central, and its going to be interesting when the most recent reviews are mixed/negative because of poor game design decisions due to lazy shortcuts.    Do better.  Especially if you want people to continue to pay for your products.   

 

I bought this game because I liked there civil war strategy game, it was enjoyable and mostly didn't have any issues with it.  I tried this out next, and its been a cluster hello kitty.    They wanted feedback, the feedback is this is a negative change,  poorly planned out and yet still pushed to live.  If your going to do this you need to do something for the playerbase.  I'm not saying give them ships or something but at least say this was messed up here's a free admiral chest or something or here's a xyz.   Just do something other than another Diana/ADR event.  They won't do anything, but thats okay.  They had the opportunity to get the feedback they wanted.

[Sir Texas Sir]

14 hours ago, z4ys said:

Go to PZ have fun. In WoW (warcraft) they change meta with every addon/content update nobody gets compensated there. No need to start doing it here. Its nice enough that old woods somewhat stayed the same and that they are still a valid choice -  in my opinion (just not meta anymore)

I was going to post something like this.  Why would you get compensated and how are they obsolete?  Any ship can be fought with unless he's saying he can only win with the best meta?   That sounds like a cop out.  Go have fun, maybe actually get sunk for once.  Maybe let some crappy player win a fight if the ship is so bad.  I know some guys that have never had a PvP killed but been killed hundreds of times by certain players.   You don't see them on here bitching?  Most of them are like, "oh well will just build a new ship when I need it after these get sunk."

12 hours ago, Henry Long Castle said:

You really couldnt care less about your ships could you ?
If ships have no value to you then why even bother with crafting? Just cap some npc ships and play

Edit: Maybe you are just that rich that you can replenish all these ships in a heartbeat but many of us are not

Are maybe you over value your ships?   Not every ship has to be maxed out meta top tier every thing.  Maybe that is the problem to many folks are running around with 20 Million plus ships they can't afford to loose.  Maybe make some cheap ships and thorw cheap mods and go out and have fun.  You do know you don't have to win every fight.  As I stated above some guys have no one a single PvP fight against some of you guys and they still play.   Imagine if you actually went in something normal and gave them a fair fight for once instead of some tricked out over modded ship?

 

And yes I have some of those exact same ships I speak of, but I also have ships that are made of normal woods that I can take to the PZ zone and just use.  I toss cheap mods onto them (like that stupid D**** PUMP that always drops for me).   

[Raxius]

so.. @admin once this nerf is complete will it be the final result? or do  i wait 2 weeks before updating my builds since clearly you cannot make up your mind or even respond and appease your community 

this is the posiition you put your players in. now i wonder whether we trust the updates you put in are final?  Players like myself are forced to hesitate to commit time to the game because you keep moving the goal posts.

[erelkivtuadrater]

the speed is slightly low @admin maybe its time to buff it soon? specially since 3rd rates can easily reach 16knots now certainly 1st rates should also be able to do this since they have bigger sail area  

[ChineseBatman]

Dependant on what happens with the YET again timber overhaul. I’ll want a few buildings reimbursed I spent a few million on for Woods. I’ll want compensation for ships built during this time of DEVS CANT MAKE YOU’RE MIND UP. I’ll want compensation for builds prior to the patch that are rendered useless or sub optimal now. I also want a reply from Devs addressing the catalogue of issues there is here with what they are doing. Get a test server and test there before you go and loose all you’re player base because of the constant mess you put them in. About time Devs started treating their player base like any Company should. As a customer and a cash cow. Not just a cash cow. Will happily give NA my money if the Devs sorted them selves out. Absolute shambles. 
 

Also what the hell is the point of RVR coming back this week when all we saw from the flag conquest was how broken and undefendable it was. What we saw is the kind of mechanics you would expect from pre alpha testing. Bearing in mind that we can’t even use a optimal PB fleet as we haven’t had time to test it, or even have finalised woods to choose a PB fleet from or the time to build it. This is an absolute and utter joke. 
 

I am not bothering to play this game until Devs sort this catastrophe out. What a mess. So incompetent.

Edited June 24, 2020 by ChineseBatman

[ChineseBatman]

10 hours ago, Raxius said:

so.. @admin once this nerf is complete will it be the final result? or do  i wait 2 weeks before updating my builds since clearly you cannot make up your mind or even respond and appease your community 

this is the posiition you put your players in. now i wonder whether we trust the updates you put in are final?  Players like myself are forced to hesitate to commit time to the game because you keep moving the goal posts.

I hesitate to agree with anything you ever put, but putting aside the misplaced  arrogant, yet useless persona NOTO has. I have to agree with you on this occasion. 

Edited June 24, 2020 by ChineseBatman

[Henry Long Castle]

10 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

Are maybe you over value your ships?   Not every ship has to be maxed out meta top tier every thing.  Maybe that is the problem to many folks are running around with 20 Million plus ships they can't afford to loose.  Maybe make some cheap ships and thorw cheap mods and go out and have fun.  You do know you don't have to win every fight.  As I stated above some guys have no one a single PvP fight against some of you guys and they still play.   Imagine if you actually went in something normal and gave them a fair fight for once instead of some tricked out over modded ship?

Well what can I say, Im a coward, a pirate, I dont like fair fights and rarely offer one. I dont like PVP zones much. You just go there, get ganged by some Russians or whatever that thats it. I do not like to throw away ships for no reason, hence why I was going for max speed builds all the time. If I didnt want to fight someone I wouldnt. If I wanted to fight someone it would be on my terms. I leave fair fights better men than me.

[Never]

11 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

Are maybe you over value your ships?   Not every ship has to be maxed out meta top tier every thing.  Maybe that is the problem to many folks are running around with 20 Million plus ships they can't afford to loose.  Maybe make some cheap ships and thorw cheap mods and go out and have fun.  You do know you don't have to win every fight.  As I stated above some guys have no one a single PvP fight against some of you guys and they still play.   Imagine if you actually went in something normal and gave them a fair fight for once instead of some tricked out over modded ship?

And yes I have some of those exact same ships I speak of, but I also have ships that are made of normal woods that I can take to the PZ zone and just use.  I toss cheap mods onto them (like that stupid D**** PUMP that always drops for me).   

I think everyone understands your point but your argument doesn't counter anything. It's not the ship being valued but the time it took to obtain them. It's not that people can't afford to lose those ships but that they weren't lost. They were basically stolen, in a sense. You wouldn't see those players asking for compensations if they lost those ships in a PB, they were made for that and now can't be used for that. 

Having other ships that can be used for whatever is entirely separate. You're blaming the players when it's the game that makes people play as they do. It's the game that gives you rng ships so that you have to build the same ship over and over and over until you get the ship you really want. It's the game making players do hours upon hours of activities they don't enjoy to be able to afford the best the game has to offer. 

Argue for the mechanics being flawed rather than the players that play within those mechanics. You can't shit on a player that wanted a gold ship for a PB and had to build 30 L'Oceans to get it. It's the game that is built that way. 

Edited June 24, 2020 by Never

[Tiedemann]

I always had a major issue with the speed built war ships that are purpose built to give the owner safe option to pick and chose their fights. Those ships are purpose built for hit and run and I'm not stating OP is a spineless ganker, but I have a strong impression that those light speed built warships are mostly used to sink traders and low rank players. 

I hope one day a heavy built Indiaman actually has a good chance against a light built Constitution. Would bring much more content to both sides in those fights

[Raf Van Boom]

Why are these wood stats not available in the UI? Or why is there no UI to show the points of sail of a ship, Felix has done a great job with his map but all of this stuff should be available in the UI if you want new players to understand what does what and not external websites/google docs spreadsheets.

And again, why do you decide to make drastic balance changes when nobody asked for it months after release? I also want to be able to redeem my DLC with the new exotic woods provided I have enough of them in my warehouse, what if I just like my leopard but I want to build it out of african oak? How about implementing actual trade routes where these magical traders can be intercepted?

Stop making half-assed changes nobody is asking for and focus on making the game's population grow.

[z4ys]

11 minutes ago, Raf Van Boom said:

Why are these wood stats not available in the UI? Or why is there no UI to show the points of sail of a ship, Felix has done a great job with his map but all of this stuff should be available in the UI if you want new players to understand what does what and not external websites/google docs spreadsheets.

Theres a suggestion section. I would gladly upvote this.

[Farrago]

1 hour ago, Never said:

You wouldn't see those players asking for compensations if they lost those ships in a PB, they were made for that and now can't be used for that. 

Why?

There has been no announcement that port battles were going to be restricted to only builds that you don’t own.

Maybe your enemies also jumped the gun in their rush to build meta so they will be sailing the same ships.

I suspect you are not new to the game, but when Devs say numbers are not final and they create a thread for feedback and testing reports, things are going to change. They also always repeat “Expect the worst.”

I apologize for singling you out for my reply but all these demands for compensation are ridiculous, especially following a week of one of the biggest wealth and power bonanzas in game by captains just safely planting 3 test flags in exchange for a wood chest, admirals chest and doubloons!

Fair sails. I suspect captains who were able to invest so quickly and heavily into what they thought would be meta will do just fine. 

[HamBlower]

On 6/23/2020 at 4:50 PM, admin said:

There will be a timber update this week
The philosophy will remain

Oaks - HP
Teaks - Resistance
Firs/Cedars - Speed
Other - Specialized with unique qualities.
 

Other woods will lose some of the qualities that were abnormally high. Locust is one of them. They will remain stronger/strongest in 1 parameter but will not be universally balanced/strong. 

Sorry guys -but why didn't you test such changes or discuss this before you go online?

Players and clans invest, because of the changes. They set contracts.

And the only thing, after one week, is:  sorry we made another mistake!

[Cetric de Cornusiac]

1 hour ago, Raf Van Boom said:

I also want to be able to redeem my DLC with the new exotic woods

The idea was to make crafting great again.

For your DLC you have the most easy access to seasoned woods of the universe. Should be enough.

[Never]

1 hour ago, Farrago said:

Why?

There has been no announcement that port battles were going to be restricted to only builds that you don’t own.

Maybe your enemies also jumped the gun in their rush to build meta so they will be sailing the same ships.

I suspect you are not new to the game, but when Devs say numbers are not final and they create a thread for feedback and testing reports, things are going to change. They also always repeat “Expect the worst.”

I apologize for singling you out for my reply but all these demands for compensation are ridiculous, especially following a week of one of the biggest wealth and power bonanzas in game by captains just safely planting 3 test flags in exchange for a wood chest, admirals chest and doubloons!

Fair sails. I suspect captains who were able to invest so quickly and heavily into what they thought would be meta will do just fine. 

Huh? I think you are confused. I never argued in favor of compensations for anything. Nor did I speak about what ships were built during the past week or so. 

I said ships built weeks or months from pre new woods patch like LiveS/WhiteS or TeakS/WhiteS for example that are now clearly inferior to new better builds like Locust/Teak are a huge loss to many players and they have a right to complain about that. Fir S Fir S is another good example, those ships can't fight anymore. Gathering seasoned wood was a huge chore and simply making people do it over again is also ridiculous. It would be different if they were gaining something new like when a game adds a higher tier of gear you can aspire to. But this is just having to replace your old ships with new ones that are the same thing but need to be a different build cause they messed around with all the numbers. 

 

Edited June 24, 2020 by Never

[Sir Texas Sir]

11 hours ago, Henry Long Castle said:

Well what can I say, Im a coward, a pirate, I dont like fair fights and rarely offer one. I dont like PVP zones much. You just go there, get ganged by some Russians or whatever that thats it. I do not like to throw away ships for no reason, hence why I was going for max speed builds all the time. If I didnt want to fight someone I wouldnt. If I wanted to fight someone it would be on my terms. I leave fair fights better men than me.

Than all your fir/fir ships are still fast, they just aren't the fastest on the block any more.  So nothing really changed for you.  Not every one will have the new woods to make even faster ships so your not at a sudden disadvantage.

10 hours ago, Never said:

I think everyone understands your point but your argument doesn't counter anything. It's not the ship being valued but the time it took to obtain them. It's not that people can't afford to lose those ships but that they weren't lost. They were basically stolen, in a sense. You wouldn't see those players asking for compensations if they lost those ships in a PB, they were made for that and now can't be used for that. 

Having other ships that can be used for whatever is entirely separate. You're blaming the players when it's the game that makes people play as they do. It's the game that gives you rng ships so that you have to build the same ship over and over and over until you get the ship you really want. It's the game making players do hours upon hours of activities they don't enjoy to be able to afford the best the game has to offer. 

Argue for the mechanics being flawed rather than the players that play within those mechanics. You can't shit on a player that wanted a gold ship for a PB and had to build 30 L'Oceans to get it. It's the game that is built that way. 

Actually they didn'tt loose anything, they still have the ships, with just new revised stats.  

The thing that is still a player problem, you don't have to have the GOLD ship to win and you still have a gold ship, just alter stats.  Other than @Redman29 who did a good write up on the woods and got Locust changed all I see is a bunch of players complaining cause they have to actuall go out  and fight in ships that aren't perfect meta.  Not every one has those perfect meta ships so it just kinda made it more fair of a fight.  

[Sir Texas Sir]

9 hours ago, Tiedemann said:

I always had a major issue with the speed built war ships that are purpose built to give the owner safe option to pick and chose their fights. Those ships are purpose built for hit and run and I'm not stating OP is a spineless ganker, but I have a strong impression that those light speed built warships are mostly used to sink traders and low rank players. 

I hope one day a heavy built Indiaman actually has a good chance against a light built Constitution. Would bring much more content to both sides in those fights

The problem would be turn rate and such, but if you had a fleet of them?   Speaking of which @admin I know it's kinda off topic but half the year is over and we still haven't heard about the combat indiaman project that was suppose to come some time this year?   Since we got screwed over with the AdR maybe atleast this would be a craftable ship that isn't locked behind a ton of RNG like the LGV Refit (glad we have the note option, using it to unboax mine until I get a permit).