Patch 25: Open world user interface update.

[Niagara]

2 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

You do know the next patch is not just UI, it's ECON PATCH TOO?

I wont hold my breath.. meaning WHEN I see I will believe it.

Also I think its more of a crafting patch and not Econ.

Edited August 10, 2018 by Niagara
Added stuff

[Niagara]

53 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

Aww the little traders are crying cause they had broken game mechanics fixed.  The perk was never called Fleet Optimization.  You didn't loose 20% you still have it on your main ship.  

As for me being a PvPer I would like to tell you I"m pretty much a tripple threat in this game:   PVP/RVR, CRAFT, TRADE

So I do know a thing or two about trading.  If your margine is so bad that you have to bring 4 ships and loosing 20% cargo on 3 of those than you are trading in the wrong goods, or your sitting on 200 millions pluss that is doing nothing.   

Again I don't even run Hold Optimization on my Crafter or Trader/Hauler chars.   They don't need it cause I make enough profit that I don't need to stuff the ship full. I also sale cannons in two ports and ships in one to make money. I get a lot of money just for doing PvE to get my PvP/RvR too.   There are multi ways in this game to make money and I have no problem with some one doing it strictly through trade, but if the Devs fix a bad mechanic that shouldn't be there so don't bitch.  You will live with the less cargo space and profits I assure you.   I mean it's not like half those ships ever make it any way when you get tagged and have no guns and loose a few of them.  Here's a hint how to max your profits and not loose ships:

1) RUN GUNS ON YOUR TRADE SHIP

2) MAKE RUNS WITH CLAN MATES....Numbers is power, loan hunters or small groups won't attack a large group even if they are all trade ships.

3) IF YOU ARE RUNNING SOLO BRING ONE ESCORT WAR SHIP.  Fight them off while your trade ships run and escapes (though this will be changes soon so no easy free ride back to port).

4) DON'T DEPEND ON ONE THING TO MAKE YOU MONEY.  Econs and times change, so does game mechanics.  Remember the Fine woods days, Campus Wood and Tabbaco days where you could make a killing of them.  Devs saw that as a problem and changed it. 

Ok. I dont think I was crying but merely pointing out some things that I and other Econ/Traders players have noticed and felt... But hey, if you cry for that little then by all means, let the tears flow.

But lets discuss your points and suggestions instead.

You cant have 3 fleet ships and have the Hold optimization perk as that is 11 points so that argument is just moot. I dont mind the Devs fixing bugs but atm there has been so little love for Econ/Traders its starting to feel that we are not wanted in the game.

1. I HAVE GUNS ON MY SHIPS!!!

2. IF POSSIBLE I TRY TO DO THAT, HOWEVER NOT ALWAYS POSSIBLE!!!

3. I DO THAT ALSO, BUT TRADE SHIPS ARE DUMB AND WILL OFTEN RUN AGAINST THE ENEMY IF THE WIND IS IN THAT DIRECTION; I WISH THEY WOULD SCATTER AND FLEE IN DIFFERENT DIRECTIONS TO INCREASE CHANCE TO GET AWAY!!! THAT MAKES FIGHTING HARD NOT TO MENTION YOU CAN GET ATTACKED AGAIN JUST AS SOON AS THE BATTLE IS OVER WHICH MEANS YOU LOSE YOUR TRADE SHIPS ANYWAY...

4. I TRADE IN A MULTITUDE OF ITEMS TO MAKE MONEY, I ALSO TRADE IN RESOURCES NEEDED TO CRAFT TO AID OTHERS AND THE CLAN!!!

There are atm 4 main perks that is aimed at Traders. Fleet Perks 1-3 and Hold Optimization.

25% of those perks just got bug fixed. If 25% of PvP oriented perks got nerfed in a bug fixed I bet there would be more whining here then what I have a few others have made over this change.

The perk itself is what it is after the bug fix, but the content created for Traders is little.

Where are the TRADERS MARKS? I mean I can see that they are listed right up there with Combat, PvP and Victory marks, yet THEY HAVE NEVER BEEN AWARDED FOR ANY TRADE.

Now this could be due the fact that you need to trade from one corner of the map to another to get 1 but guess what, I have tried that and it did not award any Traders marks.

But No, I dont think content for traders has been a priority for the developers and that's what it is. Its a small team, they have to have priority's but I think I earned the right to whine here just as much as any other player about what I see as missing content in the game.

Or crying as you call it.

 

[Macjimm]

2 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

Aww the little traders are crying cause they had broken game mechanics fixed.  The perk was never called Fleet Optimization.  You didn't loose 20% you still have it on your main ship.  

As for me being a PvPer I would like to tell you I"m pretty much a tripple threat in this game:   PVP/RVR, CRAFT, TRADE

So I do know a thing or two about trading.  If your margine is so bad that you have to bring 4 ships and loosing 20% cargo on 3 of those than you are trading in the wrong goods, or your sitting on 200 millions pluss that is doing nothing.   

Again I don't even run Hold Optimization on my Crafter or Trader/Hauler chars.   They don't need it cause I make enough profit that I don't need to stuff the ship full. I also sale cannons in two ports and ships in one to make money. I get a lot of money just for doing PvE to get my PvP/RvR too.   There are multi ways in this game to make money and I have no problem with some one doing it strictly through trade, but if the Devs fix a bad mechanic that shouldn't be there so don't bitch.  You will live with the less cargo space and profits I assure you.   I mean it's not like half those ships ever make it any way when you get tagged and have no guns and loose a few of them.  Here's a hint how to max your profits and not loose ships:

1) RUN GUNS ON YOUR TRADE SHIP

2) MAKE RUNS WITH CLAN MATES....Numbers is power, loan hunters or small groups won't attack a large group even if they are all trade ships.

3) IF YOU ARE RUNNING SOLO BRING ONE ESCORT WAR SHIP.  Fight them off while your trade ships run and escapes (though this will be changes soon so no easy free ride back to port).

4) DON'T DEPEND ON ONE THING TO MAKE YOU MONEY.  Econs and times change, so does game mechanics.  Remember the Fine woods days, Campus Wood and Tabbaco days where you could make a killing of them.  Devs saw that as a problem and changed it. 

Tex,

good hints there.  Thanks.

Have you got any ideas for those of us who like to use small ships, T Lynxs, and avoid combat?  This new patch will eliminate the magic teleport for fleet ships, to the nearest port.  Sounds like this is a good thing so players don't get a free transport of a whole fleet of 3 Indiamans safely to port with 12,000 ton of cargo.  But for the modest merchants, sailing little schooners, it would be nice to not get repeatedly dragged to the chopping block.

z4ys offered a suggestion;  "Just surrender rightaway  while your ships escaped. raider has to sail towards your lost ship while you leave the battle and sail away with the remaining ships? Giving you a huge headstart". 

I'm looking for ways to stay in game and not be forced into fighting.  I don't use the larger ships.  There has to be some strategies to avoid being pulled back along side the same solo raider with each fleet ship and not be forced to fight?

 

Edited August 10, 2018 by Macjimm
1200 is different than 12,000

[Macjimm]

13 minutes ago, Coraline Vodka said:

Tlynx are requin food

Sigh,
seems like there is little hope left.

[Barbancourt]

3 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

2) MAKE RUNS WITH CLAN MATES....Numbers is power, loan hunters or small groups won't attack a large group even if they are all trade ships.

 

 

Nobody wants to schedule their long trade hauling hours according someone else's schedule, and there aren't enough trading goods to go around for a group anyway.  You're fighting everyone else in your nation to buy the good stuff, and when you find a money pot you don't want to advertise the good stuff to everyone else and reveal your profitable secrets. 

 

[Archaos]

4 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

3) IF YOU ARE RUNNING SOLO BRING ONE ESCORT WAR SHIP.

This comment alone shows that you do not do risky trading to other nations ports, as you cannot sail a warship into enemy ports so how are you supposed to defend your traders with a warship. Taking a warship in fleet is a waste of time as everyone knows how lousy the AI fights and it cannot have perks so is even further gimped.

[Batman]

1 hour ago, Coraline Vodka said:

Tlynx are requin food

Before Bonacca PB I sailed repairs on a TLynx into port. Max Speed 12.6. Was tagged by a Spanish req just outside Bonacca and I managed to get away.

[Vernon Merrill]

1 hour ago, Coraline Vodka said:

Tlynx are requin food

To be fair...  TLynxes are Prince food too....  just not QUITE so obvious and easy.

[Sir Texas Sir]

1 hour ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

Nobody wants to schedule their long trade hauling hours according someone else's schedule, and there aren't enough trading goods to go around for a group anyway.  You're fighting everyone else in your nation to buy the good stuff, and when you find a money pot you don't want to advertise the good stuff to everyone else and reveal your profitable secrets. 

And this is why clans fail.  You don't work with each other as a team.  I have done runs with clan mates and I know some of the guys are still doing them when they make runs.  We collect up our goods over time and than make a run for profit filling every ones ships.  

1 hour ago, Archaos said:

This comment alone shows that you do not do risky trading to other nations ports, as you cannot sail a warship into enemy ports so how are you supposed to defend your traders with a warship. Taking a warship in fleet is a waste of time as everyone knows how lousy the AI fights and it cannot have perks so is even further gimped.

This comment alone shows how much you don't know the game mechanics.  If your going to run in enemy waters you can still put it in your fleet. As soon as you get tagged you tell the AI to stop and you trade ships with it and than tell the now trade ship to escape and you go fight.

 

You know if all these so called Traders do nothing but trading what the hell are they spending all that loot/money on they get from these runs?  I make a few runs to friendly ports and I easily make any where from 1-5 million profit on a run using only one or two trade ships with a war ship and these are friendly port runs.   

2 hours ago, Macjimm said:

Sigh,
seems like there is little hope left.

Saddly shallow waters your pretty much screwed cause of the crew and gun compared to other shallow ships.  It's the only time I don't run an escort ship and I take the lost of the ship they go after.  I plan those runs off hours so less chance of getting tagged/found.

[Kawazz]

1 hour ago, Archaos said:

This comment alone shows that you do not do risky trading to other nations ports, as you cannot sail a warship into enemy ports so how are you supposed to defend your traders with a warship. Taking a warship in fleet is a waste of time as everyone knows how lousy the AI fights and it cannot have perks so is even further gimped.

There's traders and then there's smugglers.

I've "smuggled" into every capital and plenty of other ports.

Its not about just getting it from A to B, timing is everything. A good smuggler makes sure luck is on their side. A lot of traders seem to really just roll the dice no matter what red flags may be out there. 

[Archaos]

33 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

This comment alone shows how much you don't know the game mechanics.  If your going to run in enemy waters you can still put it in your fleet. As soon as you get tagged you tell the AI to stop and you trade ships with it and than tell the now trade ship to escape and you go fight.

And how many times have you tried that, you end up on a gimped ship as you have no skill slots filled on a ship that has been in fleet.

[Barbancourt]

1 hour ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

And this is why clans fail.  You don't work with each other as a team.

Nah, the port only spawned one or two players worth of the trade goods, so I protected it from being diluted by too many players and kept the wealth in my clan.  If anyone else started using the same route and goods there would not be enough to make it worthwhile anymore.  By exploiting that trade route efficiently I was able to contribute more to the team/clan economy with crafting materials and ships.  (Several clan members borrowed my ships and soon disappeared from the game.)  Other players had their own secret trade routes, as well. 

[Barbancourt]

2 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

You know if all these so called Traders do nothing but trading what the hell are they spending all that loot/money on they get from these runs?  I make a few runs to friendly ports and I easily make any where from 1-5 million profit on a run using only one or two trade ships with a war ship and these are friendly port runs.  

I think I made about 200k-250k profit per round trip using a 3 LGV fleet.  IIRC the round trip took one wind cycle, so I had good wind the whole way with no waiting, and zero risk.  I did that until I got up around 10-15 million assets and moved on to doing the crafting ranks. 

I'm still mad they made the LGV capturable after I bought the permits to build them.  :/ 

 

 

[Macjimm]

5 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

Saddly shallow waters your pretty much screwed cause of the crew and gun compared to other shallow ships.  It's the only time I don't run an escort ship and I take the lost of the ship they go after.  I plan those runs off hours so less chance of getting tagged/found.

Not sure what you mean.  Crew and gun?  Ship they go after?

Also:  I've  been jumped and capped after hours and the Raiders who tagged me said they hunt "off hours" because they are less likely to encounter groups (of traders), and they believe solo traders tend to work "off hours".  I find I get jumped by Princes less often when I sail during prime time.  During prime time I am more likely to outrun the Raiders I encounter, and the groups of Raiders are seeking bigger targets.

[victor]

17 hours ago, Vernon Merrill said:

"it's a fact that so many seasoned and very active testers got bitter (or silent) over time ..."

guess why ... then ... (or go on thnking this is the best game possible just because you personally like it)

Edited August 11, 2018 by victor

[Vernon Merrill]

@victor we ALL do that...  If you think that YOUR suggestions are not an attempt to influence the devs to build a game that’s more to YOUR liking, then you are deluding yourself. 

Again, ultimately the devs are going to have to decide how “hard-core” they want the game to be.  It’s quite clear there are two distinct camps.  One of them, however, just doesn’t to threaten to rage-quit all the time or spread speculation of doom and gloom about “everyone” quitting as if they are the Oracle.  

Edited August 11, 2018 by Vernon Merrill

[Simon Cadete]

So nothing new, just a bunch of nerfs and buffs and tweaks?! 

A patch that replaces skill books from random loot drops and replaces them with skill related challenges is what we really need right now...

[victor]

On 8/11/2018 at 2:28 PM, Vernon Merrill said:

@victor we ALL do that...  If you think that YOUR suggestions are not an attempt to influence the devs to build a game that’s more to YOUR liking, then you are deluding yourself. 

Again, ultimately the devs are going to have to decide how “hard-core” they want the game to be.  It’s quite clear there are two distinct camps.  One of them, however, just doesn’t to threaten to rage-quit all the time or spread speculation of doom and gloom about “everyone” quitting as if they are the Oracle.  

NO mate. There is a very important difference in what I propose and what you propose. 

I want a game that can satisfy BOTH a trade career AND a combat career (so I look for a win-win situation), you want a game with a clear BIAS in favor of the combat playstyle and leave peanuts to anyone else (so you want a win-loose situation). 

As far as your last comment is concerned, actually you made me laugh big time: no one threatens to rage quit. This is just a game, so if someone does not like the game anymore ... they simply quit and go play something different.

Point is that, if many players quit, the game will be just a meeting club for a couple of dozens of old fanboys. And that's the very reason why it's better to have a game that makes available MORE carrers, rather than just one.

It's just simple as that. But I'm quite sure you will not understand.

 

Edited August 13, 2018 by victor

[Jean Ribault]

On ‎8‎/‎12‎/‎2018 at 3:44 AM, victor said:

...if many players quit, the game will be just a meeting club for a couple of dozens of old fanboys. And that's the very reason why it's better to have a game that makes available MORE carrers, rather than just one.

...

 

This is the thousand foot view of the game, and it is a profound truth.  Well said, and I hope in development we do not lose sight of it.

 

(....in spite of your misspelling.  )

[Hethwill]

On 8/12/2018 at 8:44 AM, victor said:

I want a game that can satisfy BOTH a trade career AND a combat career

+1

Game design wise, how to put more 10x more traders in the water than navy captains ( actually a low ratio for the west indies, was more like 100x for the type of ships we have represented in game ) ? We can be both, it is just a teleport away , a lot of captains simply do not care about trading, i'd say 5:1 odds. So, even if you are seen and chased and successfully taken 1 out of 12 times ( traced averaged ) it means you managed to evade 60 potential combatants while sailing around.

Game design wise, how to have trade fuel war fuel trade at a "faction" scale ? We have both, but at a individualistic level

Combat will interfere with trade, and trade relies on combat for protection. Despite being a game, it is based on navy. A navy existed to protect trade ( and in case of war attack enemy trade ). A war between two big nations means big navies and big battles. Game design wise how to do it ? Remember that the same way as some like trade career and others combat career, we have players that love the economy baseline and other that loathe eco.

 

[Guenwhyvar]

On 8/12/2018 at 9:44 AM, victor said:

Point is that, if many players quit, the game will be just a meeting club for a couple of dozens of old fanboys.

Something like the state of the game now, you mean? 😃

Compared to the amount of players who bought the game and the thousands who actually played the game for more than just a few days - what's left now is a comparatively tiny group of "old fanboys" as you say.

We are at 500 simultaneous players at peak times, if we are lucky. At least 10x as many players have actually played the game for a while and have left (maybe not permanently).

And then there are the many many thousands who bought the game and quit after just a few days (or oftentimes even after a few hours).

The first group you don't really need to change anything for. They stuck with the game this far and will probably accept whatever happens.

The 2nd group is between 5.000 and 10.000 people and some could be convinced to return to the game if the most glaring of the design problems were addressed.

Then there is the group that were lost to the game because there was no manual, no tutorial and who were slaughtered (often by other players) within minutes and those who just don't have the patience for games like these. These will come and go and I guess the tutorials have already mostly addressed that problem. 

This game needs at least 1000-1500 active users at peak times (per server) to make it interesting and you need both the "combat-lovers" and the "trade-lovers" to make it work. 

But...to make that happen the design needs to be in balance and it is not as if the devs seem to understand even the basics of "game-balancing". 😥 

[Barbancourt]

5 hours ago, Sir Hethwill the RedDuke said:

Game design wise, how to have trade fuel war fuel trade at a "faction" scale ? We have both, but at a individualistic level

 

I'd like to see the useless fake trade goods disappear, and instead have players (traders) transport things between players that have actual value and utility such as necessary crafting resources and crafted goods.  You also require that controlled ports receive a weekly supply of food, fuel, money, building supplies, etc to maintain port control and health.  A real economy, which I'm sure has been discussed many times over the years.  Maybe you could also hire needed AI trader ships/fleets and escort them yourself rather than "fleeting" trade ships with your warship.   Unfortunately it seems very late in the development process to force a fundamental economy change. 

[blademage]

Trade goods are neither fake nor useless. Or at least they wouldn't need to be.

[Barbancourt]

50 minutes ago, blademage said:

Trade goods are neither fake nor useless. Or at least they wouldn't need to be.

You mean they killed actual cute playful arctic foxes to make these Arctic Fox Pelts?  😥

[blademage]

I mean they could / should have impact on the cities they are traded in (e.g. local production etc).