Patch 10.4 Conquest changes, Battle Groups, Wapen von Hamburg (III)

[EL LOCO]

They need to up the speed on traders.   If a traders brig is based off a brig.  Then base speed should be 12.76 not 11.95.      Trader lynx is based off a lynx.   12.15 versus 14.16knots.

Trader snow is 11.34knots compared to snow base 12.15 knots.  

[Hodo]

1 minute ago, EL LOCO said:

They need to up the speed on traders.   If a traders brig is based off a brig.  Then base speed should be 12.76 not 11.95.      Trader lynx is based off a lynx.   12.15 versus 14.16knots.

Trader snow is 11.34knots compared to snow base 12.15 knots.  

Base Snow is 12.95.

 

[JeanJacques de Montpellier]

2 hours ago, Flinch said:

I replied to you about bonuses specifically as a form of customizing a ship. Athestetics are not as important as ship builds and theory crafting ships with bonuses. 

Bonuses are bonuses. I know that players of these type of games want bonuses. Bonuses on bonuses. Maybe because they suck, not sure...

[DrZoidberg]

Dear Developers!

At first sight i thought the patch is not bad, now i think, it is bad.

I share my opinion, why.

The system u made on OS streghten the gankers and supress the good fights. Its not fair, if defenders dont get at least 1 oportunity to revenge, but instead of the gankers get a superior ghost fleet option. U should just let battle defenders move with that superior OS speed.

The speed rework on metapatch just made 1 thing in my guild. The last ones just came in, and they realized that the ships they build for shitload are near crap. They just say enough and logged out. im fine with it, but u cant do much more action like that i think with the small clans.

I see only one big problem in ur game, its life stealer in this form as its egzist.

I think u must let players lower thier gametime, and let them succes. The easiest way is to let the rearrangment movements automatically.

There are a lot of boring sailing time implemented, 99% no action in it. This sailing are mostly ship rearrangement between outpost and for hauling. This OS sailing get players from real action, what is bad for them and for the rest.  Let all type of ships move automatically between outposts without cargo with 1 day penalty. In outposts should be an option to send ships to other outpost. The ships should get "on the way mark", and should arrive in targeted outpost at server reset or after 24 h (to avoid get advantage by fast rearrangement). This can give more active players on sea (PVE, PVP, smuggling, cargo hauling, exploring for outpost and for trading missons) against non active players. Btw automatic movement should help players struggled with ships in contested port aswell (struggling with ur best ship in a contested port can make player leak again, and can weaken low populated nations). Top of that i think ships from contested ports should move to the closest outpost automatically without any player action/intervention, so players after holyday or long work or just  a short break shouldnt get themselfes without thier best ships. I think till u not make OS sail easier, ur player base will always go below critical mass, and ur map wont work again and again appart from that what else u patch. I have that opinion appart form that there are lots of whining against making OS sailing easier. Those whiners are without real life, and im sure they wont leave the game, but normal players will sooner or later if they have to sail hours for some or none action.

About ur new conquest system:

Ur new conqest system doesnt solve the supressed nation issue, as it has no really balance in it, just try to solve the problem with the reset. If a nation too strong, it can be stronger after every map round, and can supress still some low populated nations. Another problem, that nations will always hit same nations. French will always against swedish and dutch, british always against spanish and pirates. That means aswell that french and spanish always be a supressed nation, what will make player base leak in thiese nations, and nations arond spanish can easily win the map round with no action flips and PB-s.

I suggest a new conquest (ruler) system. The war/play on the map should go for the Ruler of the Caribean title. In my system between two nation there will be 3 type of reletaionship. One can rule the other, and they can be equals. For example British can rule spanish, spanish can rule british and they can be equals. If british wants to rule spanish, they have to attack one of thier ports and win the port battle. If they rule the spanish, they shouldnt be able to attack any more port, but OS battles will be still enabled. The British should be able to use the spanish resources (with smuggler flag they should be able to bid on thier resources). If the spanish attack back to a british port, and they win, they became equal (they both can attack again, and British smugglers can not bid  in spanish ports again), and if they win another PB (area) against british, they will rule  british (cannot attack them anymore, but can bid on resources). If a nation rule  all others (get one area form all others), they become the ruler of the caribean, and they win the map. Then should be map and nation status reset (all equals), but every outposts, xp, ships and so one shouldnt be reseted in the starting areas. With this system there is one problem. There can be a situation, when nation(s) with small starting area (especially swedish, US) will have only the capitals at endgame. Solution is easy, when a nation rule  all others but one, the last attack should be on 1st rate port or on the last remaining (not ruled) nation capital. If the main ruler win, the map reset come! There should be some tricky situation, but its not that chaotic, as it seems. For example if swedish, british and spain equals, British attack Cartagena (spanish port) and win, they will rule  spanish. If swedish attack cartagena after that, and take it, they will rule  british, while british still rule  spanish. Another tricky situaton if only US not ruled by British and British  attack thier capital but before attack time they lose one port against another nation. In that case the capital attack should be canceled.  Its simple, isnt it?

This system has loads of advantages. Strong nations capable to win has to attack all other nations, and they wont be able to anihilate or supress others (they can get only one area from one nation). The wars between nations will go for 1-2 important area. It should work like a climbing ladder, win against (rule) 1 nation after 1.  In this system there are big chance that strong nations will deplete thier ship pool for the win, as they need to attack all others. Till the map reset (win) the national areas doesnt change much, so easy nation stay easy, hard nation stay hard even if they are ruler or underdog.  The system has the national balance in itselfs, as the strongest nation always against all others. This system doesnt bother the cross play, what i think u support nowdays, as smuggler on ruler side still can be attacked, so own a second character on the underdog side still has advantage.

Appart from that system:

U must defend new players appart from that which nation they choose. They do mainly PVE, so PVP and especially ganking is bad for them. Give an opportunity to players below "post captain" to flag themselfs with "Naval Student flag". If they sail under this flag with a warship, they and thier missions shouldnt be attacked in home waters (!), and they shouldnt attack enemy or join PVP battles either. After that rank i dont think anybody leave because of some ganks, and they should be able to defend themselfes. 

If u do the conqest/ruler system i suggested, u have to let nations attack others far from home water, and help to defend or take back thier isolated ports. That wont work, if u dont let players to make outpost at least 1 freetown, with the capability to move there ships automatically (after sailing there for the outpost for sure) and switch to ship there. This can boost OS PVP very much, and if u let only 1 freetown outpost, main force of the nation will have the same freeport, while minor part can do solo trader hunting, smuggling with it.

I think nowdays u want solve the "suppressed nation", lowby player gank and another problems with the long OS sailing distances, but it seems to me doesnt work. U get player leak again and again, because OS PVP is supressed while HC players going for ganks instead of real fights.

I have other ideas, but they are not so important. In my system tow to port is useless, and i think it bad for trader hunting/trader running/trader fleet game.

Btw u should boost OS PVP activity without raise ganking. Just make PVP zones at ports with 50% tension, where PVP rewards are 10X. That should pull all PVP focused players there and withdraw them from ganking. It should work like ur daily events for PVP players :).

Low populated nations should get some advantage, like lower conquest mark and combat mark prices of ships (Agamemnon 3-4 Conquest mark, Consti 50-60 Combat mark and so one...), and advertise it at player creation (low populated nation, advantage of endgame ship building prices by 10-20%). Top of that the 1 or 2 nation with lowest population should be able to change combat marks to conquest mark 20-50-100 to 1, as u wish). If the population growth, they shouldnt be able to do this anymore.

i think if there are more than 50 (30-100?) outpost at a Freeport, that should be PVP zone aswell till outpost number wont go down. That should help defensive moves aswell, as can activate PVP focused players of the defensive nation to attack ships around the attackers freeport.

After this i would be really appriciated if  sell players some ship paintings maybe specified ship XP books, or anything else what player can use and wants after or before release.  I would be happy if i can support ur game more. Btw sooner or later u must decide whats ur bussinnes model, u want to make this game life stealer and make a faster player base change, or make this game enjoyable and make a real best seller. if u want second sooner or later u have to think about what u can sell for money, If u make things well, u still can make a profitable game, i think. With fast player base recycle soon u wont get player base critical mass.

 

 

With the changes i supposed i think u can avoid all type of player pool leak, no supressed nations, no lowbie gank, much more OS PVP, new endgame content, real national balance, less boring OS sailing without action. when u see player base grothw, start find out a new bussiness model.

 

Best regards: ..

Edited July 21, 2017 by DrZoidberg

[Prater]

Dr. Zoidberg, you don't want an Open World mmo with a huge map as Naval Action has been advertised as.  You want Naval Action Legends, the arena game, which can be found here.  You say 99% of sailing has no action, so leave Open World to those of us who want Open World, and wait for legends so you don't have to have those boring sails.  P.s.  You do realize you bought an Age of Sail game, right, that must include boring sailing right?

[EL LOCO]

So.  I have a Bovenwinds blueprint.  Its very rare to get the recipe needed so therefore only 2 of my 13 ships have bovenwind.  And now you nerf it to 1%.   And its still rare.   Wow.  This game is completely dead to me now.     Too bad.  Actually had 2 million to invest in this company but not now.   Russell Williams is not impressed.   I know you know who this is.

[Guest]

39 minutes ago, EL LOCO said:

So.  I have a Bovenwinds blueprint.  Its very rare to get the recipe needed so therefore only 2 of my 13 ships have bovenwind.  And now you nerf it to 1%.   And its still rare.   Wow.  This game is completely dead to me now.     Too bad.  Actually had 2 million to invest in this company but not now.   Russell Williams is not impressed.   I know you know who this is.

Your full of shit. But if you're still playing Ill sell you back your Snow I captured from you while you accused me of cheating. 

[Vernon Merrill]

41 minutes ago, EL LOCO said:

So.  I have a Bovenwinds blueprint.  Its very rare to get the recipe needed so therefore only 2 of my 13 ships have bovenwind.  And now you nerf it to 1%.   And its still rare.   Wow.  This game is completely dead to me now.     Too bad.  Actually had 2 million to invest in this company but not now.   Russell Williams is not impressed.   I know you know who this is.

Soooooo....   you're mad because they changed settings in an Early-Access game and you lost pixelated money???  Just want to make sure I'm reading you correctly before I tell you to get a grip on your life...

 

[akd]

52 minutes ago, EL LOCO said:

So.  I have a Bovenwinds blueprint.  Its very rare to get the recipe needed so therefore only 2 of my 13 ships have bovenwind.  And now you nerf it to 1%.   And its still rare.   Wow.  This game is completely dead to me now.     Too bad.  Actually had 2 million to invest in this company but not now.   Russell Williams is not impressed.   I know you know who this is.

It is still rare and technically the only way you can get that last 1% if you have everything else.  1% can be the difference between escape and death.  To put further in perspective, 1% is close to the difference between guns and no guns on some of the faster ships.

Anyways, we need you for forum and open sea comic relief, so please don't leave.

Edited July 21, 2017 by akd

[jodgi]

1 hour ago, EL LOCO said:

So.  I have a Bovenwinds blueprint.  Its very rare to get the recipe needed so therefore only 2 of my 13 ships have bovenwind.  And now you nerf it to 1%.   And its still rare.   Wow.  This game is completely dead to me now.     Too bad.  Actually had 2 million to invest in this company but not now.   Russell Williams is not impressed.   I know you know who this is.

We had a guy just like this in Aces High back in the day, he ended up telling us he was a secret agent with the CIA.

2 million on hand but panties in a bunch over this trifle...

Wait a minute!... "EL LOCO"...

[Captain corn blower]

You know the game is petty good it was better be for the wipe .it was simpler and user friendly , if you wanted somthing you traded or combated saved and bought it you could craft high level ships and buy them , no stupid marks system that's been changed now 3 times .

A lot of the complaints are more over personal issue ! that ship faster then mine. I lost part on my nation his cannon balls are bigger then mine.DEVs  keep it simple and fun . don't try and reinvent the wheel over and over. Put out and in game email survey what you liked before the wipe and after ,then make the game better !!.

 

 

[Rouleur]

4 hours ago, jodgi said:

The history buffs here have taught me that only goes for the endy.

More likely a tea clipper managed more than 15Kn, rather than a fighting ship built over 50 years earlier. The Endy was the fastest Brit frigate of its time but not sure about whether it managed 15Kn - good to see some historical evidence though.

[EL LOCO]

5 hours ago, jodgi said:

I've heard birds tweeting that testbed will be used again.

Letting these ships go past 15 knots is like letting a Spitfire16 punch through mach 1 "for balance reasons" in a flightsim. Most of us are somewhat detached from the history and realism aspect, but it won't do to let them run that fast.

Wrong.  French Frigate recorded speed in 1799 was 16 knots.     

[EL LOCO]

1 hour ago, jodgi said:

We had a guy just like this in Aces High back in the day, he ended up telling us he was a secret agent with the CIA.

2 million on hand but panties in a bunch over this trifle...

Wait a minute!... "EL LOCO"...

I worked for a gaming software company , then Microsoft.  quit.    Became a stock trader to this day.   I like to play games that don't require my 100% attention while I trade the qqq's and spy options. (used to play poker online til they made that illegal)   I am retired and live in 3 different places each year.    That is the truth.    I want to see a game that listens to everyone and not the carebears or just the pvp'ers.    This patch was a slap on the face.      

[Rouleur]

7 minutes ago, EL LOCO said:

Wrong.  French Frigate recorded speed in 1799 was 16 knots.     

Which ship and source please. Was it a max in ideal conditions or regularly achieved?

[JeanJacques de Montpellier]

5 hours ago, jodgi said:

I've heard birds tweeting that testbed will be used again.

Letting these ships go past 15 knots is like letting a Spitfire16 punch through mach 1 "for balance reasons" in a flightsim. Most of us are somewhat detached from the history and realism aspect, but it won't do to let them run that fast.

Yeah, true. But in a air-sim the performance is based on real values. In Naval Action, it is based on magic-bonuses-nonsense. This is the main difference. NA is really far to be realistic, it is a fantasy-clans game, where you can imagine moving a ship.

[Koltes]

14 hours ago, koltes said:

IMHO The speed mods needs to remain the same as they where. Speed Bonus Coefficient (SBC) is worked in Linear Coefficient formula that is applied to each upgrade/mod used.

Formula: SBC * SpeedBonus% + BaseSpeed = ActualSpeed

1. Each ship has its own Speed Bonus Coefficient (SBC) that determines how the same mods/upgrades applied to this particular ships. For example 5% Gazelle should give lesser speed buff to 1st rate than it gives to Renommee. By simply adjusting the coefficient we can control how this particular ship is sailing
2. Speed cap is removed and by adjusting SBC we balance all ship speeds according to their base speed and POS profiles.
3. Ships of the same rates could have different SCB making each ship truly unique. On example, however, they are the same for comparison purpose.
4. Permanent upgrades have stuckable  penalties. 2nd upgrade -1%, 3rd ugrade -2%

There you have it. No speed cap. Every single ship using same speed mods but because of SBC they are applied differently and we dont have Connies racing Pickles. The last column is your highest speed. Obviously coefficient needs to be adjusted to fit with all speed upgrades and skills. Buts some speed mods needs to go anyway.





 

12 hours ago, admin said:

what is the point of sailing anything but renommee?

What is the point sailing Renommee now? It still has no strengths only weaknesses left.
What is the point sailing Endymion if speed cap also kills its speed bonus?

Buff Pirate Frig speed so its on par with Reno and Endy and voila we have 4 ships that can solo hunt (including Surp) providing you remove speed cap.

Before speed cap patch Reno was the fastest too, but only handful of people were sailing it. Having no armor and lacking firepower it makes it a challenging ship to handle. Most of my mates preferred more firepower too. In fact when my Reno was making 16.7 kn on 150° POS (it was specifically this POS as she suck on other angles) only myself and my mate @Pelennor were sailing the Reno out of all my entire clan.

You have no chasers and sacrificing Area Control perk is already a big nerf. Lots of ships can run away from you beam reach or close hauling. The only thing this ship has is superior speed on very narrow POS and good turn rate. Even though a good 4th rate captain should be able to shake it off.

Today we have ships lined up on 15kn cap on the same POS. They are all the same. Cant run, cant chase. The only difference to this is Surprise as it has strength in different POS. Today every man and his dog sailing Surps. That is no different situation, just a different ship.

Having same upgrades, applied differently due to each ship having their own specific coefficient will allow you to balance the speed however you like, balance it and remove speed cap.
Also 30% extra sailing crew is way out of hand.  Make each mod 5% crew requirement, the total negative then will be 15%, not 30%. In real life you dont need extra crew, Its the same crew that work on those tasks.

Even now, with all the nerfs, we would cry less if the speed cap was removed. This at the end of the day was our ultimate desire to have.

 

Edited July 22, 2017 by koltes

[William Drayman]

Since the last hotfix, I have had several wild problems with the game.

1. Ludicrous speed - My ship in tyhe open world does regular bursts (up to 3 minutes long) of up to 55 knots. I do not believe this is packet loss or lag, as my ship never drops speed below normal. I did trade runs yesterday, some at half the time it normally takes.

2. No engagement - I am unable to engage enemy ships at all, the attack button simply does not work. I have relogged several times, with no improvement.

3. No bug report - F11 reports cannot be submitted at all. I can fill out the report, but the submit button does nothing.

Location is Queensland Australia, ping is around 350, which is the best I ever get. Up until the hotfix, I experienced none of these things.

*EDIT - if this is the wrong place for this, please advise, I could find nowhere else to put it.

Edited July 22, 2017 by William Drayman
clarification

[Captain Lust]

10 hours ago, Quineloe said:

I find it a good indicator that the only players complaining about these changes are the players who 6vs1 jump into missions to gank and only ever show their stern to an equal strength revenge fleet, to the point where they even shoot to sink each other once they've outrun their opponents to prevent them from getting another shot at capturing their raceboat Constitutions.

That's pretty much what i was thinking... even if i didn't know his playstyle and ships, the bias is showing waaaaay too much...

[Captain Lust]

5 hours ago, Prater said:

Dr. Zoidberg, you don't want an Open World mmo with a huge map as Naval Action has been advertised as.  You want Naval Action Legends, the arena game, which can be found here.  You say 99% of sailing has no action, so leave Open World to those of us who want Open World, and wait for legends so you don't have to have those boring sails.  P.s.  You do realize you bought an Age of Sail game, right, that must include boring sailing right?

I think the main problem is not enough players. Yes the game is a massive time sink but it would be way more fun if you could meet more enemies while sailing around. Also there shouldn't be sealed bottles but you should find wrecks in OW like epic events / deadmen chest but rarer, so you can get at least something for sailing around... i think this is what they were trying to do with fishing / sealed bottles but let's be real here, those 0-2 LHC and ~ 50k worth of garbage don't make me even bother going for any wrecks... can't even get upgrades... Sorry for off topic.

[Jakob.Kettler]

Hallo Entwickler und Community,

ich sehe eigentlich nur folgende Probleme bei der aktuellen Entwicklung des Spiels:

- einseitige Ausrichtung des Spiels in Richtung Portbattle (Strategie vor Taktik)
- damit verbunden das Erschweren von Seegefechten
- unnötige Änderungen von gut funktionierenden Dingen, zum Beispiel Schiffseigenschaften (Geschwindigkeiten, Drehungen)
- damit verbunden fehlende Änderungen in notwendigen Spielmechaniken (z. B. Wirtschaft)
- Bei den Änderungen fehlt das Fingerspitzengefühl: Entweder wird der Holzhammer ausgepackt oder die Änderungen werden zeitgleich durch andere Änderungen ad absurdum geführt, siehe gestern: Entschärfen der Upgrades und Knowledges (Ja!!!) - Änderungen an den Hölzern (Nein!!!)

Und ganz nebenbei ist die 15 Knoten Begrenzung die sinnloseste Änderung seit vielen Monaten. Ich denke, sie wird wegfallen - allerdings dauert der Prozess der Erkenntnis unendlich lange. Die Frage, warum Schiffe nicht mehr als 15 Knoten aufgrund ihres Konstruktes fahren dürfen, wurde nie beantwortet. In der Physik spielt die Rumpfgeschwindigkeit die entscheidende Rolle: schlank gebaute Schiffe wie die Renommee und Endymion sollten deutlich schneller sein, als Bellonas und Victories.

Wann fällt die 15 Knoten Begrenzung?

Jakob

 

Hello developer and community,

I actually only see the following problems with the current development of the game:

- one-sided orientation of the game in the direction of Portbattle (strategy before tactics)
- combined with the aggravation of naval battles
- unnecessary changes of well-functioning things, for example ship properties (speeds, rotations)
- associated missing changes in necessary game mechanics (eg economy)
- The changes are missing the feeling of the finger: either the wooden hammer is unpacked, or the changes are made ad absurdum by other changes, see yesterday: defusing the upgrades and knowledges (yes !!!) - changes to the woods (no !!!)

And by the way, the 15-knotes limit is the most senseless change for many months. I think it will be dropped - but the process of knowledge lasts for an infinite time. The question of why ships can not drive more than 15 knotes due to their construct has never been answered. In physics the hull speed plays the decisive role: slender built ships such as the Renommee and Endymion should be significantly faster than Bellonas and Victories.

When is the 15 knotes limit undone?

Jakob

[Zoky]

3 hours ago, Captain Lust said:

That's pretty much what i was thinking... even if i didn't know his playstyle and ships, the bias is showing waaaaay too much...

Why don't you ask me what's my playstyle instead of spreding bs about me? I'm die hard PvPer and I sail same ship (pirate frigate) since before the wipe. I usually operate either alone or in 2 mans hunting group. Now I will tell you exactly why I think that these changes are idiotic. They didn't change anything about relative speeds of ships. Speed build coni is still same speed as speed build surp or speed build pirate frig. All they did is they made speed mods waste of upgrade space and pissed of lots of people from small clans like mine who have invested a lot in those upgrades. And if you think that sailing profile will save your surp think again. Tag range is smaller now (spawns points in battle are closer then they used to be)  so its easier to achieve good tag. And with good tag its bye bye surp.

[Quineloe]

 

8 minutes ago, Zoky said:

I usually operate either alone or in 2 mans hunting group.

So @Zoky, you did indeed not, on June 25th, jump a mission outside Port au Prince with two Swedish players with a group of 7 SORRY pirates, including Otto Kohl and noone? That did not really happe, right? Because you operate alone or in 2-man hunting groups. Totally didn't happen, right?

That's the one time I've seen you. Maybe you are the hardcore PVP player, always looking for a challenge, you claim to be. But you know what they say of first impressions, right?

 

Quote

small clans like mine

*chuckles*

Edited July 22, 2017 by Quineloe

[Zoky]

16 minutes ago, Quineloe said:

So @Zoky, you did indeed not, on June 25th, jump a mission outside Port au Prince with two Swedish players with a group of 7 SORRY pirates, including Otto Kohl and noone?

Is that the same june 25th that you used 2 revenge fleets against us each with 20+ ships? And it wasn't 7 but 6 pirates, 5 conis and me in pirate frig. So please don't play innocent you dirty national scum

[Quineloe]

No, I clearly was talking about June 25th 1988, when the Netherlands won the Europe Cup in the finals against the Soviet Union.

You call it revenge fleet, we call it protecting our waters. You do literally the same thing when we go to MT. You might wanna lay off the insults here, it's pretty rude and you're not in the RP section.