RNoN, accused of high treason.

[Mighty Bouff]

Frankly Herminator should be the one facing a tribunal for this attempt at bullying other players within the same nation to do as he says - that is toxic.

 

My clan 'disregarded' treaties at the start of EA and its ended up getting us some of the most fun fights and has contributed significantly to how the map looks now.

 

I vote a significant NO to self appointed councils being able to dictate what others in their nation can do.

[Kutai]

On behalf of the Pirates... we do not want them. Please send them to the Brits.

[JCDC]

On behalf of the Pirates... we do not want them. Please send them to the Brits.

 

Well that's not surprising. we all know how the council doesn't like people who want to behave like pirates and do their own thing.

[Samuel Smith]

On behalf of the Pirates... we do not want them. Please send them to the Brits.

look here is the pirates Herminator he also thinks he speaks for all pirates how cute..

[Kutai]

I just think that people who take payments from the Brits and pratically fly their flag should be in their Nation.

[Nash]

I just think that people who take payments from the Brits and pratically fly their flag should be in their Nation.

what nation? pirate nation xD?

[Kutai]

what nation? pirate nation xD?

Your comment makes no sense. Please consider rephrasing and trying again.

[Nash]

Your comment makes no sense. Please consider rephrasing and trying again.

but people tell me I can do anything I want under pirate flag

Edited March 29, 2016 by Nash

[JCDC]

So, you object to pirates acting as mercenaries? bizarre. I mean its an RP game and that's totally legit pirating

 

When will the french be flying the danish flag? or when will the council pirate clans be flying it?

[Kutai]

but people tell me I can do anything I want under pirate flag

Of course you can. However there are always consequences for your actions. Just like real life.

[Nash]

Of course you can. However there are always consequences for your actions. Just like real life.

but.. but

[Kutai]

There will always be people who want to go against the grain. Those who want to rebel against the establishment.

That is a fact of life.

You are free to do anything you want as a Pirate however if it goes against what the majority want, expect for there to be consequences for your actions.

I am a huge believer in people being able to do as they wish and make their own decisions. I will never tell someone what they CAN or CANT do. However If something interferes with the Coalition plans... which is made up from all major Pirate guilds, then we will obviously act against it.

We decide on our direction by vote. Everyone in the Pirate Nation is welcome to contribute to that.

[Quineloe]

So, you object to pirates acting as mercenaries?

 

Only if the mercenary pirates are not fighting against Britan.

[JCDC]

There will always be people who want to go against the grain. Those who want to rebel against the establishment.

That is a fact of life.

You are free to do anything you want as a Pirate however if it goes against what the majority want, expect for there to be consequences for your actions.

I am a huge believer in people being able to do as they wish and make their own decisions. I will never tell someone what they CAN or CANT do. However If something interferes with the Coalition plans... which is made up from all major Pirate guilds, then we will obviously act against it.

We decide on our direction by vote. Everyone in the Pirate Nation is welcome to contribute to that.

 

That sounds lovely and morally correct but 'the consequences' include trying to ruin their game, cyber bullying, lying and trashing their reputation. so, really, its not all that high minded is it. some of the stuff I have seen them subjected to is really pathetic. the lengths people are willing to go to to ostracise them and force them back into the fold is not acceptable. which ironically is the main reason they are now mercenaries. they were still fighting against the british when the campaign of propoganda and hatred was started! its a self-fulfilling set of lies.

Edited March 29, 2016 by JCDC

[CaptainFrosty22]

Really. Why this DRUNKs and other rogue clans joined the Nation if they only want to play like THEY want not like NATION wants?

 

If you are really so pissed about fighting against Danes/Swedes (whoever you want) - switch to Pirate and fight then. People in nations are trying very hard to organise RVR politics, to prevent Nations being reduced to one port and new players leaving because of that. And at the same time bunch of pirates (for some stupid reason sailing under nation flag) are just trying to ruin it. And you actually can't do anything about them. There should be mechanics to lock nations ports for such pirate scum and to be able to attack them on sight!

 

We want to play how we want yes but not how KF wants KF is NOT  the whole nation.

[manuva85]

Preschool

[Hugo van Grojt]

To who it may concern,

 

I am writing this response as a player not as the ingame character Hugo van Grojt, just to be clear. I am copying this response from the other "open letter to the devs" thread, because it applies to this thread here just the same. Replace DRUNK with RNON as you see fit - they are the same for the sake of the argument:

 

The main argument presented by DRUNK and their supporters is essentially the following: 

"Any player should be allowed to play the game as they see fit. Nobody should be allowed to dictate how these players play the game."

 

So, before we go into my argument, let's define and establish some core elements.

 

Let's look at the various primary ways, a player may want to play the game:

1. you want to play as a trader/crafter

2. you want to play PVE (mission running and such)

3. you want to engage in small scale open world PvP (raiding, ganking, et cetera)

4. you want to engage in port battles and SOL fighting

5. you want to participate in the RvR aspect of the game (national wars)

 

Additionally, let us briefly look at what the role of a clan is within the current game mechanics. By joining an ingame clan you, as a player:

1. get a clan tag in front of your name

2. get access to a clan chat and clan mail

That is it, as far as the game is concerned. Nothing more.

 

But what does joining a clan mean for most players? (my personal assumption!) By joining a clan,

1. you join a group of players that most likely share your interests and goals in the game

2. you give authority to the leaders/officials that the clan members elect to lead. 

3. you accept that these clan leaders speak on your behalf during RvR negotiations or national council meetings - for lack of a better system.

 

Okay, now we have established a baseline and the core assumptions. Now, let us explore the original argument using the ingame faction Sweden and Denmark as example:

 

- The majority of players for each nation (organised in the biggest clans, that share a common vision) have agreed not to attack the ports of the opposing faction.

- Some smaller clans disagree with that majority decision and attack ports of the opposing faction using the argument "We just want to play the game as we see fit!"

 

How does the peace decision by the majority of players of each nation prohibit you from playing the game as you want?

1. you want to play as a trader/crafter - you can still do so within the confines of the ports your nation owns

2. you want to play PVE (mission running and such) - you can still do so within the confines of the territory your nation owns

3. you want to engage in small scale open world PvP (raiding, ganking, et cetera) - you can still do so, seeking out enemies that your nation is actually at war with - plenty of opportunities to be had there

4. you want to engage in port battles and SOL fighting - you can still do so, your clan or group of players is free to organise and independent attack on a port of the nation that your nation is at war with. For example, nobody will likely stop DRUNK from attacking a British port.

5. you want to participate in the RvR aspect of the game (national wars) - this is the ONLY part of the game where you are limited. If you absolutely want to wage war against the Danish/Swedish, you actually need to convince the majority of players playing the RvR game that this is the right way to go by increasing your clan member numbers or gaining support from other clans.

 

So, by using some logic, we have established that majority decisions concerning national wars DO NOT prevent players from playing the game as they want. Even if the majority of citizens of a nation agree on having peace between Denmark and Sweden, the players of DRUNK and other small clans still have PLENTY of opportunities to trade, PVE, small scale PvP, do port battles to their hearts' content . The only limit that DRUNK have, is that they should not attack ports that belong to the Danish nation. That is the only limitation of their gameplay experience.

 

My personal opinion in this case is that the interest of the many outweigh the interest of the few in this regard. National wars are a huge community effort that the majority of the citizens of each nation participate in. The enjoyment of the RvR aspect of the game by the MANY should not be nullified by the FEW using the liberty argument.

Or to use a real life example: If you absolutely feel that you can only be free if you run around outside naked, you can do so by moving to the countryside and run around in the forest all you like. But if you do that it in a city you should expect to be arrested because the majority of the city dwellers do not want to have to look at your naked ass. If you defend the right to run around naked in a city because of "freedom" or "liberty" - you are just a troll.

 

TL:DR

Given the assumptions above, it is my strong belief that DRUNK and their supporters do not defend the right to play the game as they want, but rather the right to troll the majority of their nation's playerbase in the RvR aspect of the game. Therefore, a backlash by that majority of players is understandable and I am personally in full support of the majority here, because that is how communities work.

[Mighty Bouff]

I just think that people who take payments from the Brits and pratically fly their flag should be in their Nation.

 

So the rest of you would be under the Danish flag then I guess?

[Herminator]

Hugo, your previous post is the most sensible and reasonable post I've ever seen in this entire community.

Hats of for you sir, and I'll even wash your feet.

[Batman]

I just think that people who take payments from the Brits and pratically fly their flag should be in their Nation.

So, here we have pirates getting upset by pirates who play like actual pirates.

[Captain Underpants]

Lets move on from insulting each other and instead work on some ideas for how Diplomace mechanics etc could be improved. To that end I have posted a new thread with some ideas on it. Please do take a look and give some (polite!) feedback.

 

http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/12650-diplomacy-and-port-battles-a-new-vision/

[Hethwill]

I must say many folks are getting boring and left out on the major strategies, I might be wrong.

 

Therefore they setup their own agendas.

 

We have this in all nations.

[Jonathan Arlington]

First. We didn't pay anyone for those attacks. So it is an unhonourable lie, Sir.

Second. Don't think you should throw with stones in the glasshouse Bro. ???? Or do you really want us all believe that your coordinated attacks with the danes happend by accident.

[Jonathan Arlington]

But back to topic, yes you cannot kick someone now for not handle like the other clans, but I understand the frustrating point of view in building allies, taking time in long hours of diplomacy and than... all is gone... And this happens in a game you are one officer besides other officers of your nation that should all serve the command of his majesty (or president beloved USA ;-) ).

And because of this we need so urgent a diplomacy mechanic.

Edited March 29, 2016 by Jonathan Arlington

[Musuko42]

What the hell is wrong with some people? Clans are OPTIONAL in this game, and anyone who joins one clan is under no obligation whatsoever to obey the demands of any other clan.