Exciting OR RNG crafting is back, and I have a problem with it.

[King of Crowns]

18 minutes ago, Batman said:

So no more "specialised" ships? With 3 slots, you had to sacrifice something in return for being super OP in one category, for example boarding or penetration. With 5 Slots we now go back to super OP ships. Now you can still have a full boarding set up with stronk masts or on-the-spot-turning. Great.

Now its even more about which player has more high end upgrades on the ship than skill.

idk. a lot of it has to do with the build of the boats. with thickness being nerfed into the ground we will have to see.. but yea playeers that play more will be rewarded with better ships in this build. I'm not sure if that's a bad thing....

[King of Crowns]

1 minute ago, NicklasK said:

@admin Just gonna quote myself again since the discussion seems to have gone off track.

At the very least consider the suggestions rather than outright dismissing them - we're all players and would like to share our opinion with you to make YOUR game better. There is no reason that the above method cannot be combined with RNG (Letting RNG choose the trim if you don't do so yourself). But by implementing at least some of the above mentioned ideas will add content to a game severely lacking it.

We all love the combat aspect, but most of us are dying for content when not actively fighting. This could possibly put more trade ships back into OW and out of the protected zones - This is a good thing is it not?

Try to keep your head cool and be respectful to your community. You're game developers now, not modders. Let us try to have a meaningful discussion about this rather than just throwing mud at each other.

YOUR... is key word. its their game they can make it how they want. and they apparently want this in the game. so we all have to deal with it. 

[Percival Merewether]

Just now, King of Crowns said:

YOUR... is key word. its their game they can make it how they want. and they apparently want this in the game. so we all have to deal with it. 

But as testers... should we not test and provide feedback? Or should we simply just sit and play and put money in the pockets of the developers? I assume we're here for a reason.

[admin]

6 minutes ago, NicklasK said:

@admin Just gonna quote myself again since the discussion seems to have gone off track.

At the very least consider the suggestions rather than outright dismissing them - we're all players and would like to share our opinion with you to make YOUR game better. There is no reason that the above method cannot be combined with RNG (Letting RNG choose the trim if you don't do so yourself). But by implementing at least some of the above mentioned ideas will add content to a game severely lacking it.

 

We are not dismissing them. We understand their beauty too. But I think AND KNOW Endymion builders only found out its awesomeness AFTER they built it during the sea trials. And i like this more than your beautiful proposal. You get the ship you get not the ship you want.

[King of Crowns]

36 minutes ago, admin said:

Well i disagree.

Thank you for sharing your opinion of course. And yes you are totally right. 60% of players love a little luck 40 % hate it. Powergamers and minmaxers will hate it. Majority will be ok with it. 
There is even a video on this subject by a guy who made magic the gathering great..

This feature stays.

he said right here that he has read your thoughts. and he wants it in HIS game... @NicklasK soo....... we just have to deal with it... its that simple. 

[Percival Merewether]

9 minutes ago, admin said:

We are not dismissing them. We understand their beauty too. But I think AND KNOW Endymion builders only found out its awesomeness AFTER they built it during the sea trials.

@admin I respect your stance on wanting to keep RNG in-game, and I'm glad to hear that feedback is taken seriously. We all want the game to move forwards.

I think it's important to find gameplay oriented solutions to in-game problems rather than RNG solutions. I love the expansion of ship modifications as mentioned. I just feel that this was a missed opportunity to give some meaning to trading and crafting.

Edited February 1, 2018 by NicklasK

[Sir Texas Sir]

I like the perks for crafted ships as an added bonus over note ships and AI ships.  Though not sure I like the extra slots though.  Maybe once some testing see if that is over kill. I would just keep it to the random perks for player crafted ships and keep all ships 3/5.   Though still think the refited LGV should be a 3/5 ship too.  Maybe give the BP as a more expensive PvP reward and if you craft it you get a 3/5 one instead?

[Bristol Fashion]

@admin

I posted this idea in the patch section but it seems more appropriate here. I love the element of randomness in ship outcomes but to give players a little more control, what about the idea of letting the clan owning a port pick a category of buff that they find preferable for that particular port. Any ships built in that port have higher odds to get that buff over something else. If you build in an AI owned port like the uncapturables it's a total random.

This would give players a reason to set up shipyards outside of safe zones (putting more trade ships hauling mats into the ow and in need of protection) as well as make some ports known for building certain types of ships, which could add more flavor. Put a cool down on how often the clans can set their build preferences so they can't change each time they want a new ship type.

[Percival Merewether]

1 minute ago, Bristol Fashion said:

@admin

I posted this idea in the patch section but it seems more appropriate here. I love the element of randomness in ship outcomes but to give players a little more control, what about the idea of letting the clan owning a port pick a category of buff that they find preferable for that particular port. Any ships built in that port have higher odds to get that buff over something else. If you build in an AI owned port like the uncapturables it's a total random.

This would give players a reason to set up shipyards outside of safe zones (putting more trade ships hauling mats into the ow and in need of protection) as well as make some ports known for building certain types of ships, which could add more flavor. Put a cool down on how often the clans can set their build preferences so they can't change each time they want a new ship type.

Now we're getting somewhere - less randomness is the key 

Edited February 1, 2018 by NicklasK

[VirtuallyIdiotic]

I like the crafting change. Just saying. 

[Guest]

My two cents. What if there were no extra gifts/trims? What if it was like it was last week? You build a ship the way you want it, considering the build and its pros and cons - boom, you build it. Now, the Devs have simply built in a random gift, bonus for ship builders. Thats Great!. It only becomes a problem when you begin to fear someone else will have better than you, more than you...good grief. It becomes worse when people start complaining that they cannot manipulate the gift or farm what gift they want..... Come on. Let it be just a welcomed bonus. Craft your ships with the same mindset you always have.

[Fatality]

2 minutes ago, Headless Parrot said:

My two cents. What if there were no extra gifts/trims? What if it was like it was last week? You build a ship the way you want it, considering the build and its pros and cons - boom, you build it. Now, the Devs have simply built in a random gift, bonus for ship builders. Thats Great!. It only becomes a problem when you begin to fear someone else will have better than you, more than you...good grief. It becomes worse when people start complaining that they cannot manipulate the gift or farm what gift they want..... Come on. Let it be just a welcomed bonus. Craft your ships with the same mindset you always have.

pathogenesis

[Landsman]

1 hour ago, admin said:

But if you get the 5 5 3 ship - it will be a ship to hold on to and spend 1 pt for fleet control for.

Yeah but who would risk sailing this 5/5 perfect trim ship and losing it? They will only keep it in docks and use it as wanking material... And even if some top dog PvP players would use it and beat me with it, I would simply feel cheated since the gear advantage / difference is too big...

[TommyShelby]

@admin 
Perhaps nerfing modules/books/trims to miniscule values (Like old 0.5% Copper Plating) would make more people welcome the RNG Crafting. 

Reasoning; 
If modules/books/trims provided such small bonus it will make them "Nice To Have" instead of "Must Have". 

[Doug Maoz]

I could be persuaded that the minor bonuses are OK, and a fun little RNG. However the possibility of 3 vs 5 perm slots should probably be removed. This was always a problem with the old system, where 2/5 or 3/4 ships were relatively worthless.

Also, I believe this disrupts the overall balance of permanent mods, since you can have 5 speed mods or 3 repair mods + 2 thickness on permanent slots. Where is the need to make a choice? 

1 hour ago, admin said:

But if you get the 5 5 3 ship - it will be a ship to hold on to and spend 1 pt for fleet control for.

Who puts nice ships in fleet???

[Landsman]

1 hour ago, Wraith said:

No one wants ships that are too valuable to sail, or too valuable to not sail.  This crock falls in both categories depending on the type of player you are, with no middle ground to be had.

@admin This is the problem with it. The few super rich or extremely lucky top pvp players will sail these top notch fantasy ships and wipe up the average joe captains that would be too afraid to sail it ( if they could get one at all ) because they can not afford to lose a ship like this / don't want to risk it. Just think about / consider this, please.

[NavalActionPlayer]

1 hour ago, admin said:

Well i disagree.

Thank you for sharing your opinion of course. And yes you are totally right. 60% of players love a little luck 40 % hate it. Powergamers and minmaxers will hate it. Majority will be ok with it. 
There is even a video on this subject by a guy who made magic the gathering great..

This feature stays.

To my fellow gamers - give up offering feedback, it is pointless. This lot just don't want or care about your views. Hell, they don't seem to even want anyone but themselves playing 'their' game.

[King of Crowns]

2 minutes ago, NavalActionPlayer said:

To my fellow gamers - give up offering feedback, it is pointless. This lot just don't want or care about your views. Hell, they don't seem to even want anyone but themselves playing 'their' game.

cry more. 

[Bristol Fashion]

1 minute ago, NavalActionPlayer said:

To my fellow gamers - give up offering feedback, it is pointless. This lot just don't want or care about your views. Hell, they don't seem to even want anyone but themselves playing 'their' game.

Oh bugger off with this drivel. The devshave changed many things in this game in response to player feedback including items in this latest patch release. Don't throw a hissy fit because they disagree with you on this one.

[Slim McSauce]

I don't mind slight RNG, but with this update I was hoping for solid incentives to be a crafter and using crafted ships over note ships.

While I think this is a step in the right direction, its still missing something. Some RNG isn't bad but this is entirely RNG, not tied to shipyard level, crafting level, materials or anything.

I think that's what a lot of people don't like about it.

[Percival Merewether]

11 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

I don't mind slight RNG, but with this update I was hoping for solid incentives to be a crafter and using crafted ships over note ships.

While I think this is a step in the right direction, its still missing something. Some RNG isn't bad but this is entirely RNG, not tied to shipyard level, crafting level, materials or anything.

I think that's what a lot of people don't like about it.

As previously mentioned, I'd like RNG removed completely. I do however see your point and I agree that there is some fun in the new implementation. I'm sure some compromise can be made.

Admin argues that my suggestion would benefit "powerplayers" more than casuals. I believe the exact opposite since only "powerplayers" have the resources to make 20 ships in a row to get the best builds. I'm curious to hear what other people think?

What if the chances of getting a better build was higher? That too would benefit the casuals - even better would be to chose the type of trim (mast/hull/crew). Not a fan of either of these two ideas, just throwing them out there.

If we can combine this with some kind of gathering of material using Trademissions then I'm sold! More ships in OW

 

Edited February 2, 2018 by NicklasK

[maturin]

Y'all doth protest too much.

 

Ships are living things. You can't conceive a child without some mutations in the genes.

 

For instance, Endymion was the only ship of her class to be so fast.

[Sir Texas Sir]

2 hours ago, Coraline Vodka said:

How about a compromise, keep the fun rng bonuses but please limit perm mods to 3. 5 is far to many. @admin

Now that I think of it if 5/5 ships are super rare than I wouldn't mind it, but it needs to stay a super rare and maybe even limit it to folks with level 50 crafting as something you can get on a 1 in 100 chance when crafting a ship.  Though I would prob stick with just one extra slots not two.

Edited February 2, 2018 by Sir Texas Sir

[King of Crowns]

8 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

Now that I think of it if 5/5 ships are super rare than I wouldn't mind it, but it needs to stay a super rare and maybe even limit it to folks with level 50 crafting as something you can get on a 1 in 100 chance when crafting a ship.  Though I would prob stick with just one extra slots not two.

that means we just need to vend 99 ships and keep one.

 

[Rhodry Heidenrich]

5 hours ago, Wraith said:

Two extra permanent slots, with super trims and the OP skill books stacking is not just a "nice extra bonus." It's a must-have for competitive RvR and PvP fleets and should never be a RNG outcome.