Testbed: Content patch - 9.98 deployed

[Jesters-Ink]

22 hours ago, Anne Wildcat said:

Remember, not everyone is a PVP elite.  I applaud anyone that tries to fight even though they might be new to PVP. 1 dur is going to hurt these people the most. But let's test 1 dur & see. ?

The point is this, numbers are falling and the devs are trying to solve this. It may be that dura has nothing to do with this at all and the problem lies elsewhere within the game. Part of the problem is those players don't give feedback on why they left, so their reasons are never realised. Maybe there are only so many broadsides a player can exchange before it gets old and there needs to be something else to do and strive to achieve for this game to survive.

 

10 hours ago, Hethwill said:

Quebec vs. Surveillante by Rossel de Cercy

During the duel not a single rake pass was done, all shooting was broadside to broadside.

One naval author writes "The gunnery duel continued until about one o'cIock when the Surveillante's masts went overboard together" Antoine Vanner, Duty and Daring in the Heyday of Empire[1] 

On the test server, this happens far too quickly, it's no longer the slog it should be. 

[NavalActionPlayer]

18 hours ago, fox2run said:

You guys think too economic. In order to have new players and a good pc)game you need to think SOCIAL.

(wow, heh?).

Whilst not disagreeing - what do you propose to achieve this please?

[Fenris]

Casuals are not leaving because big ships have 1 Dura, i guess it is because they are bored.

If you are not participating in RvR or PvP, you can only trade always the same goods,and rank up by shooting AI.

Players who are casual need entertainment, and that is what NA can not provide at the moment.

Think about that.

 

[Hethwill]

5 hours ago, Jesters-Ink said:

On the test server, this happens far too quickly, it's no longer the slog it should be. 

Was answering the question.

But regarding the game itself the structural integrity play a part no ?

From what I tested before, equally matched ships if not on continuous raking positions will slog it off for a long time. If a light frigate gets under fire from a 64 it will pay dearly if falling out of position. When rakes are correctly applies then it rewards with tremendous catastrophic damage.

IMO the warship(s) vs warship(s) combat initial distance is what is not correct. No way on earth and under all Fighting Rules and Articles of War and Rules of Engagement a warship from a enemy nation would ever come closer than 750m in extreme without being considered ready for combat and open to be fired upon with all cannon.

We still retain the possibility to override such realities and tag a mighty 74 gun with a corvette right under the shadow of a quarterdeck...

[fox2run]

1 hour ago, Hethwill said:

Was answering the question.

But regarding the game itself the structural integrity play a part no ?

From what I tested before, equally matched ships if not on continuous raking positions will slog it off for a long time. If a light frigate gets under fire from a 64 it will pay dearly if falling out of position. When rakes are correctly applies then it rewards with tremendous catastrophic damage.

IMO the warship(s) vs warship(s) combat initial distance is what is not correct. No way on earth and under all Fighting Rules and Articles of War and Rules of Engagement a warship from a enemy nation would ever come closer than 750m in extreme without being considered ready for combat and open to be fired upon with all cannon.

We still retain the possibility to override such realities and tag a mighty 74 gun with a corvette right under the shadow of a quarterdeck...

Yes. The disadvantage for larger Ships are clear. Engaging distances are broken. A Surprise would be turned into a wreck in a matter of minutes versus a line ship. Now the Surprise is the better choice versus any SOL in 1vs1. Something ain't right.

[Ledinis]

Ha! Missed the forum wars more than the actual game over the last 4 months

   Out of all the semi-casual players i know that stooped playing the game the two main reasons were: 1) Lack of PVE content (yes its a shocker but some people who like pvp dont necessarily want to do it 24/7 and like some variation) 2) No meaningful PVP, switching the same port over and over again with no repercussions might be fun for the first 20 times or so, but then it just becomes tedious, the only drive being to beat up the nation that you got into a flame war over in the forums...

   As for retaining the players that stayed for a only 10 hours by increasing first rate durability, thats about as logical as buying a Snickers, because the elephant is purple...

  A player that played for only 10 hours or less is, as stated by many, most likely due to the UI looking like you just bought dwarf fortress, and the lack of tutorial, coupled with a niche genre can put of hordes of players. Its the first impression of the game that makes or brakes it, and when i first bought the game over a year ago, my first thought was OMG i just bought "Microsoft Excel: The Game" first loging in and seeing the UI. Since i played some sailing games in the days past, getting accustomed was to the actual gameplay was not to bad, but for someone who is playing a game like this for the first time with no tutorial it must be a living hell.

  On the subject of ship durability nothing has changed it seems for the past year, there are those who argue that one dura is the way to go, providing facts and ideas as to how they would work to better the experience for both the casual and veteran players, and those who argue that they should have 9 lives and grow twice the size when they sail over a magical mushroom from Mario kingdom, because of raisins (yes raisins, because non have provided actual reasons )

  Lest see the pros and cons of 1 dura ships across the board.

Pros:

1) Players, specially new players rising through the ranks, get to experience more ships (back in January-February 2016 i when i was leveling never have i tried sailing in a Frigate or a Belle Puole, a Surprise, because i was forced to buy and basically pay for 5 copies of a Renome, which lasted till i could sail a Trinc), with crafting cost adjusted to accompany the reduction to one durability, it would diversify the ships used in lower levels.

2) Would give capturing/boarding a ship an actual meaning, other than getting one fifth of a ship that you scrape for 3 wooden planks and one cannon carriage.

3) Would liven up the market, both in the amount of transactions, and the fact that due to captured ships not being considered trash, privateers could be a part of the player driven economy and sell of their prizes.

Cons:

1) People would avoid pvp out of fear of loosing mods - already addressed by 500 people. Mods are an outdated and bad implementation of ship customization, which should have been scraped a while ago.

2)

There is literally only one obstacle in making one durability ships work for all players, and that is reworking the crafting system, which is long overdue anyways.

[Fargo]

1 hour ago, Ledinis said:

Lest see the pros and cons of 1 dura ships across the board.

In addition pro:

-Realism/immersion. Might not be important for everyone, but the game claims to be realistic so it is important. If we refuse realism there should be a good reason for that.

con:

-Less dockspace. Increasing dockspace might technically not be possible (maybe someone into this can tell more). Question is do we need to store 15 ships in each outpost.

-After beeing sunk, spawning in the closest port wouldnt be possible. Assumed that we could choose one outpost to spawn instead, would this be a problem. Could even be a pro that people you sank recently are out of the way a bit longer.

 

Maybe open a new topic for this discussion? 

[fox2run]

7 hours ago, NavalActionPlayer said:

Whilst not disagreeing - what do you propose to achieve this please?

I have made many proposes. Longer ROE joining timers coul be a igniter for more pvp.

I have also suggested some kind of a coombination between lobby and OW. Players not organised in clans with TS can have a hard time to organise themselves in multiplayer. Its actually hard to find some larger, equal - or close to equal - battles in OW. Many players dont like to sail for hours for some fun that maybe doesnt come at all. I had such a night yesterday. My precious time simply make me play other games just to have some fun. 

Imagine a lobby where you could join several combat groups in your Spanish nation. You like to get some gold or XP? Click on the PvP Escort traders mission. It starts in 5 minutes. At the same time players in the pirate nation click on the PVP Spanish golden fleet mission. The two fleet sails out and - tadaaa - meet eachother in OW. 

You like it big? Why not join the PVP Tribute to Nelson with your SOL in the british multiplayer lobby. Once filled the 25 ship fleet sails out on the same course as the other nations fleet - (the french Tribute to Villeneuve-fleet, the danish-norwegian tribute to Peter Wessel fleet or maybe the dutch Tribute to de Ruyter fleet) they will meet eachother at some point in OW and the highest ranking player will have a special pennant on top of the main mast for a month or so.

(Empty spaces may be filled with AI ships.)

All kind of PvP missions and forms could be made. 

Another proposal would be to make some kind of a in-game nation that organise players in different "Task forces". I really miss the nations to be a unit instead of the pirate-like clans we have now. It could be cool to make the players feel they belong to a nation a bit more than now. 

The list could go on - but at least this is a start from me. Now - do you have anything social in mind?

;-)

[elite92]

2 hours ago, Fargo said:

In addition pro:

-Realism/immersion. Might not be important for everyone, but the game claims to be realistic so it is important. If we refuse realism there should be a good reason for that.

con:

-Less dockspace. Increasing dockspace might technically not be possible (maybe someone into this can tell more). Question is do we need to store 15 ships in each outpost.

-After beeing sunk, spawning in the closest port wouldnt be possible. Assumed that we could choose one outpost to spawn instead, would this be a problem. Could even be a pro that people you sank recently are out of the way a bit longer.

 

Maybe open a new topic for this discussion? 

or maybe if u sunk u can spawn in open world in a small ships like a Basic Gun Boat? xD

[Powderhorn]

An overview / overhaul for 1 duras, which seems to answer some concerns, can be found below.  Let's try to keep this focused on the pending patch.

 

[Taranis]

A lot is being said about 1 Dura vs. more Dura....  Although I fall in favor of the 1 Dura approach, there is something I have not seen discussed, which seems to be an elephant in the room: The total number of ships a player can have.  

• Because the map is big - we need to have multiple ports and we need to be able to magically TP to ports
• Because we have multiple ports - we need multiple ships
• Because ports have limits in terms of class size - we need more multiple ships...

After stacking up over 30 gold ships, I find myself wondering whether I would not get more enjoyment on focusing on a fewer number of ships and (upgrading them) making them great, and playing them more - rather than keep building/buying/upgrading more ships to cater to all eventualities.  Thus, I have been selling a lot of my ships recently. 

Fewer ships per player would 1) help the load on the database server, and 2) help foster more PvP.  Again, you can only captain 1 ship at a time - but the economy around the number of ships one has seems wrong.  Also, the resources freed up from fewer ships a single player could have, could be applied to the allowance for clan docks (which IMHO would be a great feature).

[Havelock]

Alright, either the AI evolved or the devs are testing something on testbed... one way or the other, something seems wrong...

 

[elite92]

58 minutes ago, Havelock said:

Alright, either the AI evolved or the devs are testing something on testbed... one way or the other, something seems wrong...

 

did i miss something on patch notes? or it is a ninja change?

[balticsailor]

yeah there where some changes rolled out to the testbed yesterday. Like they renamed PvP and PvE marks, increased the amount of PvE marks rewards by 4x or so and you need provitions and gunpower to craft a cutter now and all regions seem to be 49.8% hostility for all natons (and now some are 100%). At least that are the once i found sofar.

[qw569😳]

7 minutes ago, elite92 said:

did i miss something on patch notes? or it is a ninja change?

Unfortunately, it is too difficult to translate for me

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fforum.game-labs.net%2Findex.php%3F%2Ftopic%2F19014-%D1%82%D0%B5%D1%81%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B9-%D1%81%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B2%D0%B5%D1%80-%D0%BE%D0%B1%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BB%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B5-998%2F%26do%3DfindComment%26comment%3D373038&edit-text=&act=url

Edited February 24, 2017 by qw569

[balticsailor]

For those interesseted the Navy Agamemnon note from the Admiralty store is just a normal Aga with proably a random build. I got a Live Oak Build Strength Pirate Refit one from it.

[TommyShelby]

12 minutes ago, balticsailor said:

For those interesseted the Navy Agamemnon note from the Admiralty store is just a normal Aga with proably a random build. I got a Live Oak Build Strength Pirate Refit one from it.

I was wondering but couldn't be bothered grinding the PvP Marks. 

Is there absolutely no difference between that one and the standard Aggy? 

[balticsailor]

Well since you get a normal aga there can't be any difference. I did some tests if and how you can game the mark system and killed a few AI from missions and to cap some SoLs (you can get one Dura once from the NPC)

[sterner]

Testbed is WIP(work in progress) version of the game.

What is new:

- We decreased hostility requirement to start a PB on testbed. 
- PB will start in 10 minutes.
- Amount of marks is proportionally shared between people participating in killing.
- Increased amount of marks. Min is 1, max is 10.
- Decreased twice ball damage to sails.
- Added information about structure HP.
-  Fleet size is transferred to perks. Captured ship must be added into fleet, otherwise it will be lost. You need to spend a perk point to have a fleet slot, 2 points to open second slot and 3 points to open third slot.
- Admiralty is available only in player's nation towns.
- Skirmisher battle(any battle from lobby) doesn't give marks.
- Decreased influence on fire on board from ball hit.
- Fixed issues and exploits related to fleet cargo functionality.

- Changed battle start formula. Before any attacked ship or group of ship had BR divider 4. Now it is curve, where single ship has 4 divider, but group of ship above 6 has 1.25. It will help to avoid situation when large group of ship can be attacked by small group. Single ship can be attacked by smaller ship. Crew size has great influence. For example, Victory with 40 crew can be attacked by cutter. 

- Changed reward formula. Damage and crew are excluded from gold and XP calculations. You will get reward if enemy sinks and you make kill or assist. Amount of reward is proportionally shared between all participants and depends on inflicted damage.

In progress:

1. Rebalance and content for admiralty.

2. Possibility to transfer loot between own ship, captured ships and fleet ships.

3. Conquest marks for port battles.

[balticsailor]

5 minutes ago, sterner said:

-  Fleet size is transferred to perks. Captured ship must be added into fleet, otherwise it will be lost. You need to spend a perk point to have a fleet slot, 2 points to open second slot and 3 points to open third slot.

it still doesn't work that way yet, i did cap two ships in a mission today without having the fleet peak and was able to send it to my outpost like it used to be.

Edited February 24, 2017 by balticsailor

[sterner]

1 minute ago, balticsailor said:

it still doesn't work that way yet, i did cap two ships in a mission today without having the fleet peak and was able to send it to my outpost like it used to be.

We haven't implemented loot transfer between ships. When it is implement, then send to outpost will be removed.

Testbed is not public version, there are a lot of features that are in WIP state and unstable. But we would like to introduce them to you at early stage.

[Havelock]

31 minutes ago, sterner said:

-  Fleet size is transferred to perks. Captured ship must be added into fleet, otherwise it will be lost. You need to spend a perk point to have a fleet slot, 2 points to open second slot and 3 points to open third slot.

 

Right now, you can buy a perk that gives +1 fleet slot for 1 point, perk that gives +2 fleet slot for 4 points and +3 fleet slots for 7 points. According to the patchnotes, +1 should cost 1 point, +2 should cost 3 points and +3 should cost 6 points. But that way one could get all 3 perks and take 6 ships with them (like, 6 cutters or something lol). Atm you can take 4 ships spending 8 points which is already too much imo. You should need to decide if you take 1, 2 or 3 fleet ships for 1, 3 or 6 points. Dont let them add up.

[sterner]

1 minute ago, Havelock said:

 

Right now, you can buy a perk that gives +1 fleet slot for 1 point, perk that gives +2 fleet slot for 4 points and +3 fleet slots for 7 points. According to the patchnotes, +1 should cost 1 point, +2 should cost 3 points and +3 should cost 6 points. But that way one could get all 3 perks and take 6 ships with them (like, 6 cutters or something lol). Atm you can take 4 ships spending 8 points which is already too much imo. You should need to decide if you take 1, 2 or 3 fleet ships for 1, 3 or 6 points. Dont let them add up.

They are test values, today they will be replaced with mentioned above values.

[Powderhorn]

So, just a few thoughts:

1.  I recommend keeping the 4 points for 1 ship, 7 points for 2 ships.  Think that's a good balance.  Could do 10 for 3.  (Makes them mutually exclusive, but the point values "feel" right)

2.  If you take the perks, add the ships to the fleet, then drop the perks, the ships stay in said fleet.  Is a problem, but, can be resolved by automatically "unticking" ships in the fleet section.

[God Emperor Trump / Alan]

So with this you cannot cap any ships, unless you have the fleet perk?