Navigation MUSt be improved

[Racingsail]

I've been zooming around in my noob cutter and have found teh game to be very enjoyable. the biggest gripe that I have so far is that there is no apparent mechanism to aid with navigation. There were two basic methods of navigation during the period, dead reckoning and shooting day and night sights with a sextant. These need to be reflected in the game IMHO.

 

[Macjimm]

You will find some great maps in the forums that are helpful to determine a heading and distance. One provides time per average speed. There are no currents or wind drift so navigation is just about a simple as it could be without a magic position indicator.

The sextant wouldn't be practical with the speedy time lapse in Open World. I would be hard pressed to complete a sighting at such a hurried pace.

[LeBoiteux]

It's only a matter of a couple of hours and you'll get used to current way of navigate. 

 

Start with coasting from an island to the nearest : look at a map, get your direction with your compas, sail to the nearest island ; then to the next one.

Then try with longer distances.

Some ports will quickly become reference points to you. Easy to sail to and from.

 

All depends on what you want to do in NA :

- do you only want to sail to the nearest pvp hotspot and create an outpost ? Coasting with do the trick.

- do you want to explore and sail everywhere ? Being lost for some minutes is part of the fun. You'll quickly find a port that'll make you know where you are.

- do you want to sail to a given port (for trading or conquest) ? You'll learn quickly how to do it.

 

Fair winds. 

[SeaMist]

This:

 

http://burningsail.com/

[Bramborough]

I don't want a constant real-time position on the map.  I like navigating by DR.

 

That said, I think it would be reasonable to implement two position updates per 24 game hours.   First, a noon sun line (i.e., a line along ship's latitude, not an actual ship's position).  Second, a midnight position determined by star sightings.   Clear weather should be a prerequisite for both.  In addition, the night-time position update shouldn't necessarily be pin-point accurate.  A noon sun-line is relatively easy, but getting a tight 3-way fix off 3+ star shots shouldn't be automatic. 

 

Perhaps when ship's officers are implemented, one could be a Navigator, whose competence might improve the accuracy of these positions, particularly the night star-shot. 

 

Separate but related, I also think there should be some elementary drawing capability on the in-game map.  At least an ability to plot a desired course, some method of calculating time/distance, and a moveable compass rose to fine-tune course headings.

 

Don't get me wrong; I don't want navigation to be automatic, or much easier than it is now.  And I'm getting around okay as it is.  But I do want some basic approximation of the navigational methods available to late-18th-century mariners.  Rather than simplify, I think such measures would actually add a little complexity to long open-ocean transits (would give us a bit more to do than "point & hope").  Would also add more fun; it's pretty gratifying to make landfall at exactly the desired location, particularly in a sail-driven vessel which had to tack a few times due to shifting winds.

[charognard666]

I've been zooming around in my noob cutter and have found teh game to be very enjoyable. the biggest gripe that I have so far is that there is no apparent mechanism to aid with navigation. There were two basic methods of navigation during the period, dead reckoning and shooting day and night sights with a sextant. These need to be reflected in the game IMHO.

 

In fact, some navigation tools should be cool, but we don't "need" it. With some times, you'll lurn how find your way in OW, it's not really hard...

 

There are many other important features and mechanics tweaks to do i think.

[mouse of war]

Yes, logically navigation should be improved.

 

But actually, after a little more sea-time you'll probably find that it's not too difficult to get where you are going

 

And the uncertainty that remains adds a certain 'je ne sais quoi' to the experience

[mikawa]

Ok, my opinion:

navigation should not be improved, because I like it as it is: you have to navigate through landmarks - that really fits very well in the game concept. But why not allowing the spyglass in open world too? You can spot enemy fleets earlier by scanning the horizon and you can spot towns earlier too, which lets you easily adjust your course.

[Hethwill]

Plan route before leaving port. It is not even remotely challenging after a while, although sometimes one gets lost, which is nice.

 

Take one session to sail about your chosen nation area and learn the landscape. You will start to know which town is which just by the landscape and landmarks.

[Quineloe]

I wonder how many people are by now using F11 coordinates and the map or the free camera to scout ahead.

 

IMO the following things should be added to the game

 

- OW spyglass so I can search for landmarks in the distance

- lighthouses with actually bright lights

- same for towns, they're too dark in the evening. Are they expecting a Luftwaffe raid?

- consistent maps. Shallows no ship can cross should not be solid land on the map, as seen for example at Brewers where the map shows one opening, the world shows two

- some tool to roughly estimate your current position.

 

And as much as the naysayers dislike all of this: All of it is realistic.

[KittyHawkes]

although i understand where you´re coming from, i must agree with some of the above: it´s just not necessary. Sure, at first you go like "wtf am i?"...but after a few days latest you´ll find out that it´s nearly impossible to get lost in this game, due to the (while huge, no doubt) rather limited area we are in.

The spyglass would be great though and is more or less on it´s way... i also would like to have a ruler/ distance measuring tool, which i believe would be a rather useful addition to the compass so you could better calculate how long your ttravel goes...

more accurate navgation is just not needed at moment, really not. Maybe if the devs decide to make storms actually have influence (sight hindrance aside), so they throw you off course and such things, then it might be actually a MUST to have such tools... currently you just go straight no matter what, which makes it rather clear where you´re going... the map is pretty accurate.

note: dont get me wrong, i´m not against your position, i think it would be nice to have stuff like that, even more if it was needed. It´s just not important enough right now and other things clearly have more priority. It has been discussed that much already, that the devs probably know already that features like that are wanted, so i wouldn´t worry too much about a future installment...

just not right now

Edited April 11, 2016 by KittyHawkes

[mikawa]

The measuring tool would be great. Just draw a line between two points and see approximately (regarding the current wind situation) how long it would take you to go there. You can decide whether you will arrive at a port battle in time or not, rather than wasting time to travel there, just to recognize that you were too late ....

[FIGHTS_ON]

Agree with most of what has been posted above. I have been playing for only a few days, but actually enjoy the challenge of Dead Reckoning (DR) - with a little "aim off" that navigating across vast swaths of sea that the game provides. If i may add my 2 pennies to this topic:

 

if navigation was improved, then combined with the "real Time" communications (chat pages - already in game) then we run the risk of over simplifying some of the team play tactical (operational level) game play. Not that I got to the fight in time, but I enjoyed watching the chat on the Brit Fighting Net yesterday trying to get ships to "meet SW of Port XX South East of Jamaica" - rather than introduce to the game some sort of 21st century DATA link with real time positions of ALL ships. Part of the attraction of this game is trying to find the fight AND entering the fight from an upwind (or otherwise!) advantage based on scanty information.

 

For those players enjoying the trading aspects, the risk/balance case of Coastal navigation (= not getting lost, but RISK of getting caught) versus the challenge of open sea navigation (where am I? but best chance of getting to destination safely & quicker), the current navigation modelling is about right.

 

Not a priority, but I support the telescope in Open World (+ brighter lights in ports at night) and the idea of a noon sun sight line of latitude briefly(?) displayed on the Map view (Branbourogh's post #5). Of course with the highly accurate True compass and accurate in game clock, a noon sun could be used for longitude as well (!).......

[Macjimm]

The measuring tool would be great. Just draw a line between two points and see approximately (regarding the current wind situation) how long it would take you to go there. You can decide whether you will arrive at a port battle in time or not, rather than wasting time to travel there, just to recognize that you were too late ....

http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/9071-domoxs-burning-sail-nav-map-now-with-map-data-arrival-estimation/

Some players suggest that the distance/time measurement (see link above) should be an in game tool. For some reason they feel Alt Tabbing and using a support diminishes the game. Others seem to think it doesn't make much difference to Alt Tab or press a keybinding.

Check it out. It works well.

http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/8451-shrouded-recluses-map-with-accurate-coords/

I enjoy using ShroudedRecluse's map with Photoshop. You can measure the angles and distances right off the map with the tools provided. The conversion is 230km per 1000 PhotoShop units.

[Anne Wildcat]

Give it some time, you will get lost but then start to find your way around.

Stick to one direction until you find a port in the distance. Once a port is found, head to it to find out what port it is, then use the map, m, to figure out which direction you need to go.

Also, at night, in a storm or in dense fog, drop sails and wait until you can see more.

A basic cutter is a free ship that is fun to get lost in.

If you are desperate, tp to your capital or log out & log in again when you can tp.

[Vllad]

They give you X/Y coordinates. The only way to make it any easier is to give you an auto pilot.

[maturin]

 

 

That said, I think it would be reasonable to implement two position updates per 24 game hours.   First, a noon sun line (i.e., a line along ship's latitude, not an actual ship's position).  Second, a midnight position determined by star sightings.   Clear weather should be a prerequisite for both.  In addition, the night-time position update shouldn't necessarily be pin-point accurate.  A noon sun-line is relatively easy, but getting a tight 3-way fix off 3+ star shots shouldn't be automatic. 

[Quineloe]

They give you X/Y coordinates. The only way to make it any easier is to give you an auto pilot.

 

They're not supposed to be used for that and I'm certain this will disappear very soon.

[Vllad]

They're not supposed to be used for that and I'm certain this will disappear very soon.

 

That's fine but the point I was making is how can people possibly be complaining about navigation when they provide everyone x/y coordinates now?

[codyproxy]

I have not really trouble with navigating, but sometimes i just wish i could draw on the map, or set a point on the map temporarily. I've created 3 missions. I go to the first one, easy. So i join battle, being busy for 20 minutes or more. Than i get out of the battle to OW, but i don't know my exact position not anymore - which is kinda BS if you knew it before, and because you are on the open sea, you don't have landmarkers.

 

I also think that if you are in a party, you should be able to see each others mission markers (or be able to switch to another one's map in the party).