Pirate Mechanics

[Nathaniel]

The timers where even shorter a few weeks ago, they got a bit rarer. But the bots got in recently. The only restriction of small battles i see at the moment might be the overwhelming demand. Not sure the game will be able to spawn more than one instance and there might easily be more than 50 volunteers every 10 minutes on the first day.

[Prater]

The event rooms need to have XP and Gold gained or lost removed.  As well as durability loss removed (this way Trafalgars don't diminish a person's ability to take part in Deep Water Port Battles).  Otherwise there is no point in OW.  People can just grind up in the events and there isn't any point anymore.

[Justme]

Just a humble opinion from a player in waiting.

Why not just reduce the xp a pirate player gets for attacking other pirate players, say maybe earn half or even 1/4 less.

While doing this add xp bonus to any national or pirate hunter for sinking/ capturing pirates.

[FloX]

I still stick with my idea of alternative history, I mean if you would be historical correct first rate's at that time werent that populair for nationals. Most fights were between frigates, also i have heard, only 1 ship of the line has been build over there by spain. So start joining spain.

If the pirates back in the day had this ratio they could've done more if they wanted. The way the nationals contained it is by joined forces against pirates so start doing that. Cap our ports and we would be very limited.

 

I agree upon change in portbattles Also like the idea of raiding.

Also stop dragging pirate vs pirate exploits in these discussion i play with a big group we never do it and i haven't seen it happen....

It was probs an old exploit but it aint happening anymore.

just remove it anyways

[Marx]

The "historical accuracy" posts in many of these posts made by Nationals sailing around in a fleet full of rates is humorous.

[Deepgift]

Well then that was a very recent change in the last month. What is the point of OW then?

No need for TDA to travel 1-2 hours down the US coast first thing on wipe. We can just stay in Charleston to level up fast.

 

As I recall thats a part of being a US player is having the capital in a hard to get to place. when you pick a nation something is stated to a similar effect. just like how the spanish start with the most ports. and another faction starts with just one port.

[DeathGenie]

If pirates cannot take ports then other factions should not be able to take our ports either, I'm okay with a mechanic that allows raiding or something instead of taking ports, but if we're removing pirates from taking ports then we need several other mechanics to change as well.

[DeathGenie]

We have said it somewhere already: Pirate on pirate xp will most likely be switched off sooner or later. It provides too many loopholes that cannot be controlled in any other way. Though we know that introduction of assist XP kill XP has reduced the damage farming needs for the gentlemen. 

 

What was unexpected is the pirate organization and unity - which is actually a good thing . And because they mostly fight other nations they don't need XP on each other. 

 

Ah yes the pirate organization was a sudden thing for us too, and @Prater if the only thing you have to complain about is pirates grinding xp on other pirates then stop complaining because it isn't happening, hasn't happened since honor kills were removed. 

[Marx]

Just a humble opinion from a player in waiting.

Why not just reduce the xp a pirate player gets for attacking other pirate players, say maybe earn half or even 1/4 less.

While doing this add xp bonus to any national or pirate hunter for sinking/ capturing pirates.

 

I've yet to see this happen - And why penalize me for fulfilling a contract and hunting down another pirate, my loyalty is to my person band not the nation as a whole, that's what makes us pirates..

[Marx]

If pirates cannot take ports then other factions should not be able to take our ports either, I'm okay with a mechanic that allows raiding or something instead of taking ports, but if we're removing pirates from taking ports then we need several other mechanics to change as well.

The raiding feature in .. similar games worked very well. I also enjoyed the 3 day cooldown before a port could be assaulted again. The current 2 hour window is .. silly given the huge demographic this game currently caters to. Mainly NA/EU

[Justme]

I've yet to see this happen - And why penalize me for fulfilling a contract and hunting down another pirate, my loyalty is to my person band not the nation as a whole, that's what makes us pirates..

I don't see how it won't be an issue once the game opens for a wider base. You have never seen it happen here, but I have never seen it not happen in any game that allows it.

It's not a question as to whether or not players will boost each other, but as of to the scale of it.

[Busterbloodvessel]

We actually don't. Once it goes to EA and our current progress is wiped, pirates will win the race. They can attack each other and earn fast xp and gold. They don't have to even go far from MT. They can sit outside the zone and attack each other without having to hunt or sail. Once they get high enough xp and gold they will be the first into sols and the first to take over the majority of the Caribbean without any nation having the means to combat them. What happened to your stance of pirates being the hardcore criminal mode? Now they are just the fanboy easy mode whose numbers will rival GB and maybe even surpass it, being able to field the most people in any given time zone except maybe the UK timezone. Nationals have to hunt for enemies, pirates can just fight their friends to insure easy gold and xp. I bet on the 1st day of EA several pirates will be in frigates. Within a week, they will be in sols.  Oh, and nationals can't join each other's port battles, so even if all the nations gang up together, the pirates will just outnumber them in the actual port battle.

 

Might work with free ships 'cutters' and 'yachts' but I imagine it will be a lot more fun and faster upgrade to attack bot fleets with a myriad of small craft and capture large prey rather than sink a PvP Cutter! As for larger ship upgrade I see very very little PvP pirate action at the moment (maybe one or two guys only who go on a death list), no-one see's it as a good way of levelling up. (Buster goes back to sucking on pipe).

[Xoosch]

I know it's of-thread but i would not start a new one. Given the numbers of People who became Pirates by failure. Would it not be possible to implement a buyable  Amnesty? It could be become more expensive the longer the Person was pirate or the more Ships he has unrightfull attacked. But at least give them a ingame  way out besides hoping a Dev will be nice enough to reset their Pirate-Status.

[B4NGSPL4T]

I think what this thread has clearly illustrated is that the current mechanics do not work.

From the results the vast majority believe that crafting needs to be limited in some way, either the removal of it completely from the faction or a limitation on what can be crafted. In the long run this does not prevent the Pirates from getting in SOL's, however it does make it more difficult. Someone mentioned that Pirates would simply buy them from other nations, which is true, but my guess is that most nations will not do this due to the competitive nature of the game. Even so, this will make the Pirate faction a more unique faction to play as.

In terms of capturing ports, as you can see currently just over half believe that they should be able to. My thoughts on this are that if a raid mechanic was clearly outlined, it may sway towards that than the latter.


So Dev's, Admin... The people have spoken. What'cha gonna do?

[Reki]

All pirates story in this game was started when I (well, not just me ofc ) said something about pirates as hardcore playstyle faction. I suggest to follow the roots and not allow them capture ports. Instead they could rob ports, using same mechanic as general PB. It will be pretty awesome, if pirates won't be able to craft SOLs, but they should somehow get SOLs to be able attack ports properly in late game. I'm afraid, OS gank only won't be good source of heavy ships and they rarity will stop pirates from attacking port. This faction need special source of SOL's. Maybe capturing during PB, or reward for PB win.

[Deepgift]

So Dev's, Admin... The people have spoken. What'cha gonna do?

 

They have said something, Nats need to work with one another to keep pirates in check. It may have not been spelled out in back and white but from what ive read of them posting about it. the pirates are your problem not the devs.

[Ellis]

I don't think you understand we're saying that pirates should not be treated as just another nation. They should have their own mechanics and unique characteristics, this thread is about implementing those changes and what they should be.

[Prater]

Ah yes the pirate organization was a sudden thing for us too, and @Prater if the only thing you have to complain about is pirates grinding xp on other pirates then stop complaining because it isn't happening, hasn't happened since honor kills were removed.

Just because your group doesn't do it doesn't mean it doesn't happen. We have screenshots of damage farming pirates so it must be fixed.

['Sharpe]

If pirates cannot take ports then other factions should not be able to take our ports either, I'm okay with a mechanic that allows raiding or something instead of taking ports, but if we're removing pirates from taking ports then we need several other mechanics to change as well.

 

I think we would all agree that would be fair. I'd love to see Pirates have uncaptureable ports in key locations so that certain shipping lanes become known for being dangerous. And if nationals want to ship through there, or protect their nearby ports from raiding (instead of full capture) they'd need to concentrate anti-Piracy efforts first.

 

That's like dream state of the game for me.

[manuva85]

I think we would all agree that would be fair. I'd love to see Pirates have uncaptureable ports in key locations so that certain shipping lanes become known for being dangerous. And if nationals want to ship through there, or protect their nearby ports from raiding (instead of full capture) they'd need to concentrate anti-Piracy efforts first.

 

That's like dream state of the game for me.

Aren't these ports called Free Towns? Do Pirates even need own national ports with own player spawn in capitol? If we were to make pirates being created only bcs of ingame players decisions( can only turn pirate not start as one) there would be no need for it. + add compleatly different mechanic for them for riding instead of port battles and we all would be much happier wouldnt we? If we keep current state of game pirates will be present only near mortimer town, bcs you can always clear out other ports and we gonna sooner or later go back to the current state of Pirate blob only close to MT.

Edited January 13, 2016 by manuva85

[Scorpio Shirica]

I proposed that in a different thread.

 

I think it'd be cool if they could buy "Raider" flags in free towns. Then after they win a port battle it becomes "raided" until server reset and loses a lot of its resources. Maybe make raid flags much less expensive since they can't keep a raided town or make it so they get more gold, loot (read: booty) for winning their raids.

 

It would make them unique as a threat everywhere there is free towns, instead of just out of their capital and I've seen a lot of pirates be OK with the concept as well.

 

I also like admin's idea of giving pirates 'nation charters' that allow pirate guilds to form alliances that crystalize into nations, that may allow more emergent gameplay and make it so others' "immersion" is hurt less once they formalize becoming a nation. 

[Lord Vicious]

Tbh i tested  this INFAMOUS PIRATE GRINDING:  (is not worth your time if you can do pve in a big group expecial sinking 3rd rates,consti with others )

 

(pirate on pirate) Pavel vs Pavel,  60 mins, not sinking each other, 900 xp 40k gold

On real pve for 60 mins you get  by sinking ships (3rd rates-consti etc) 2500-3000 xp and 60k gold   + modules drop

 

 

(pirate on pirate )A frig shooting a pavel for 50 mins, not sinking it get 800xp and 35k gold

On real pve for 50 mins you get by sinking ships 1500-2000 xp and 40-45k gold + modules drop

 

 

 

Cutter on Cutter,  i tryed first with 1 side sinking other, too long,and it was getting 120-140xp for 10-12mins+ and only 3k gold.

best way is  boarding with one side losing (making bad counter-choices) 

 

you get 90-100xp every 7 mins (include dock ,undock, moving time, preparation for board, boarding turns etc), so     760-900 xp/h and very very low gold since you not shooting .

 

 

 

Pirate on pirate Grind is not worth the time, if you can pve fleet with others., it also require for be effective that one of the 2 side have a bigger ship that can be pound for much time. otherwise is not worth the effort.  it may be can be used effectively for powerleveling someone, but  he can do it alone by pve fleeting in a faster way and he will get also modules.

 

 

ps: and more your ship get bigger more  the pve in group is worth, now in a victory i am doing an average of 3-4k xp /h with the pve fleet of 7-10 ppl 

Edited January 13, 2016 by Lord Vicious

[Johny Reb]

We welcome all suggestions so thank you for the feedback.

 

Current state of things is the following.

Pirates in real life were limited in numbers. In game pirates nation is second biggest after Britain, there is nothing you can do about it. Many new players will continue joining pirates and some of them will organize into large fleets.

 

Game mechanics already allows pirates to attack each other with no consequences, but even with this mechanics pirates have decided to act united.

 

Nations are provided with all the tools to keep pirates in check by sinking them and denying them ports. If you capture all pirate ports it will be harder for them to build ships. 

This is a defeatist attitude and sounds as if you have just accepted making the pirates a Nation. So many ideas have been given and some you, yourself, have proposed that will limit how many rush to play pirate. Many very, very, good ideas. Ideas that could make the pirate class/faction epic in its design. Its the easiest class to differentiate from others and the depth that could be brought to it would truly set the game apart from others.

 

Pirates have acted united because the current mechanics treat them as a nation instead of a class. There is nothing in the current game that is so immersion breaking as the pirate faction/nation.

 

Everyone in this thread is arguing over pirate on pirate grinding. Who would care if they did, if the pirates were a class and not a nation. If it was difficult to operate large ships because most of their ports were shallow water and their deep water ports were spread out far and wide, would anyone care so much if they grinded faster? If the class was designed as merchant hunters instead of port conquering nation builders would it really matter if they could get into large ships when large ships could never catch the traders? Would pirate on pirate grinding matter if they took the 2X xp away for pirate on pirate kills?

 

Lets look at what would limit the numbers to more historical levels without being artificial in how you do it.

1. You can't choose pirate when creating your character - Many of those who plan on going pirate won't because they will start off in a nation and they will make friends. Many are likely to stay with the friends they make rather than betray them to become pirate.

 

2. Captured or defeated pirates will go to jail for a time. - This is survival mode mechanic and makes the class cautious of others, both pirates and nationals. This would curb the population greatly in my opinion and would essentially make the class less aggressive against the nations. Fights for them will be very planned out.

 

3. Restrict the building of SoLs to the nations - Completely historical, doesn't limit the pirate from getting a hold of one, but will drive some players to the nations because their desire to sail the big ships will outweigh the need to play the rebel.

 

4. Remove access to free towns and replace with a mechanic that allows a port governor to check a box that allows pirate entry. - Historical, and limits pirate maneuverability which will turn some off. If the nations feel that the pirates are getting to strong they can shut down the pirate friendly ports. This will push immature players out of that faction because it will take intelligence and wisdom in the pirate class to smoke out how much havoc they can create before there is backlash by the nations.

 

If you make the class semi-historical which in effect makes it a hard class to play then you will drive out many of the players that want to play Jack Sparrow and wear an eye patch. Shucks most of the pirates I have spoken to or read in these forums obviously want to play a nation in their playstyle. They just want to feel like a rebel doing it. Well I say to bad! Either play a nation or play pirate. You shouldn't be able to do both.

[Frost]

I to would like to see the pirate faction be unique.

1. Don't allow them to capture ports. Let them live out of Free Towns so certain shipping lanes and ports become pirate havens.

2. Give them the Raid flag as described above.

3. Create a hiring system so nationals can hire cutthroat to help them in Port battles, raid ports, secure areas, delay enemy nationals, ect. Let the Pirates ask for ships, gold, and maybe even a limited about of XP upon completion of contract. Or failure cause well their pirates and sometimes they run off with the gold without completing the deal.

4. Add in a build able hamlet that pirates can put on islands in the game. Let them upgrade it so the it has defense towers in the open world. This way pirates can deploy anywhere they want and set up a temporary base of operations. Maybe even make it like a floating deployable structure like a bunch of wrecked ships that gives them an ability to place an Outpost inside. Nationals would need to find and destroy these to rid themselves of the local pirates.

5.Limited crafting. Pirates will need to either steal them, buy them, or be awarded them in merc contracts.

Also why not give them a chance to get ships if they raid the right ports. If they can figure out where TDF does most of their shipbuilding then that Port will have a higher chance of giving a ship to the raiding group. I can see a pirate group scouting figuring out where a lot of ships are being built and raiding it hoping to come away with a SoL.

[Frost]

SoL in limited crafting section to clear that up. I can't edit my posts on this forum for some reason.....

Also give the Pirates a speed bonus to frigates to make them the swarming speed demons they are truly meant to be.