>>> Beta 1.06 Feedback<<< (FINAL UPDATE 6th Release Candidate)

[musicbox]

Friendly A.I is completely busted, torpedoes are damn-near useless because the ship A.I won't fire half the time, even on STATIONARY, IMMOBILIZED TARGETS.

[havaduck]

@Nick Thomadis Update on partial pen fiesta:

 

These guns were used:

 

141!!! 12 Inch AP hits needed to sink this heavy cruiser, lucky me I got an ammo detination otherwise it would be more.

I am just not penning despite the chart giving me around 90 % chances. Look, thery are barely ANY penetrating hits or overpenetrations. With 12 Inch AP shells thats frankly rediculous.

 

Maybe this heavy cruiser was to heavly armored, lets try an light cruiser like the Leprous below.

80!!! AP his barely any overpenetration OR penetration. I just didnt have the pen it seems. AND there is an ammo detonation. AND the ship didnt actually sink, it just surrendered.

 

I am using + 115 % armor. The heavy cruiser had +78 % (something like that) and their light cruiser Leprous from the picture above has 96 %. Does that mean the enemy has to use H-44 class ships to get through my 16" belt?

 

At first I was thinking mabe I am firing HE but no, look!

This is the battlecruiser that was leading the formation and thus largely has been closest to the targets. It also did therefore the most damage.

 

Now the same ship again, but specifically hovering over the 12 " guns: We can see that basically the entire complement of HE shells is still there, whilst the AP have been uses up by a chunk. Also again, basically no penetrations, no overpenetrations.

 

Something is broken with these pen calculations .......

 

€: and just to be clear, no SAP either.

Edited June 29, 2022 by havaduck

[Plazma]

 

11 hours ago, ZorinW said:

Here is one BASIC problem with the Dreadnought III and Battle cruiser IV hulls. They are unbalanced before you touch them. It should be like it is on the Battlecruiser V. BY default the center of mass should be dead center of the hull.

Though this 6% offset can't explain the 100% fore offset once the build is finished.

I can easy go to 16,9% pitch and 6,6% roll, but the designee is not in my style. Also I noticed that putting small gun on the end of the ship making 35% offset, but putting 14.9" gun in this same place made something like 5% offset. Also if I put the guns close to the citadel my pitch go crazy even up to 50%. 

 

I ended on 20,3% pitch and 8,5% building something similar to the Bayern class battleship. (the main difference are 19" torps vs 23.6", weight 34,000t vs 32,500t, main guns are 14.9" instead of 15") 1914 year when I designed it. Not sure what kind of ship should be 21 or 22,5. 

Anyway I am not happy with the results and with the way how I build the ships in 1.06. Something is broken.

About pen calculation I think something change it very much. Like not only we have slop armor horizontal, but also vertical, so the effective angel is now horizontal+vertical. But if my theory is good why we don't have a much more ricochets? 

Sometimes I see the 12" heavy shell TNT AP with 33" armor penetration is stopped by 6,5" of armor at range 1km. I noticed it on the update 16 or 17, but nothing happens...

Right now I building 12.9" gun with only 5% long barrels, super heavy shells with TNT and Capped-ballistic II to be able pen deck or belt. Or/with small guns (usually 2" 4" 8" guns) to spam the hits. 

 

Edit:

I found nice infographic, unfortunately for me is in russian: https://imgur.com/a/QAIuXWa 
I hope devs find this. 

Edited June 29, 2022 by Plazma

[Skeksis]

15 minutes ago, musicbox said:

Friendly A.I is completely busted, torpedoes are damn-near useless because the ship A.I won't fire half the time, even on STATIONARY, IMMOBILIZED TARGETS.

Try reducing friendly AI speed to ‘cruising’, or even less.  

[Norbert Sattler]

The VP reset bug seems to have made a return, sort of.

I led some 26k to 7k against Italy. Then I made peace with Germany and in the same round I got the message that Italy declared war on me (whom I never peaced-out with) and the VP were 0 to 0 again.

Italy and Germany at the time were also at war with each other, so it's not a case of them being pulled back in by an ally... also as mentioned I never got a peace-message from Italy.

[Skeksis]

We’re seeing alot more deck and partial pens. What else has changed, pitch roll higher, citadel added, is there a connection, yeah probably. 

I'm thinking this is all working as intended. Needs more discovery by us though.

Edited June 30, 2022 by Skeksis

[itolan1752]

2 hours ago, Danz_Von_Luck said:

Very hard to say tbh as every other turn the nations im at war with declare war again which resets the VP so ending a war is impossible atm for me

Same problem. VP reset is little annoying.also sometime war end suddenly ("suddenly" mean I didn't got peace sign. the war just end). I can't let enemy pay anything, too.

This happened when my enemy have others enemy. (though I never let enemy fight me alone, there is always has others nation join us, even I was the first one who declare war)

also, most of 1890s CA& CL hull's pitch/roll are still ridiculous.

I don't even put anything on it. CLs are worse than this.

Thought about this game so far:

I know this game have many many problem/bug, but also have many many things that plan to add. others nation in campaign, mine, submarine, complete tech tree, etc...,

(BTW. How does developer plan to add USA,JP and china in campaign? could we have Global map at coming update?)

so far, I think the developer is lack the clear stage goals.

for example, we fight pitch/roll problem in recent update after add engine room(I forget detail, maybe pitch/roll problem is early than add engine room?). but engine room is not only thing need to add in hull,maybe main gun's ammo room? propeller room? after add these, do we need fight pitch/roll problem again?

(BTW. Where ammo store now? all in gun turret? or in the space which in the below of the gun? I want to know because this may effect balance,too.)

And about diplomacy, I think it is good start. because if developer don't test long campaign, they can't test diplomacy,too.

(previous campaign has default war ,default alliance, and campaign end by a signal nation get K.O, even they add diplomacy in that, it doesn't use)

But there is one thing I agree, after they release 1.06, they need get seriously to fix bugs/problems that many player talk about.

[havaduck]

30 minutes ago, Skeksis said:

I thinking this is all working as intended.

I would like to challenge that.

That light cruiser in my example has 6" of armor at the most. Lets just say I hit at an angle that doubles the effective armor (obviously didnt riccochet). Lets say I get no normalisation despite using a capped AP shell. Lets also say I alway shot at that sharp angle and ignore me pumping AP into its broadside.

That puts us at 12 ".

Lets double it again because the cruiser has +96 % armor rating. Thats 24 ".

I basically cant pen that with 26 to 44 " the used 12" guns have at the relevant distances.  (and thats was more than being gracious considering its 26" at 10! km).

 

[admiralsnackbar]

7 minutes ago, havaduck said:

I would like to challenge that.

That light cruiser in my example has 6" of armor at the most. Lets just say I hit at an angle that doubles the effective armor (obviously didnt riccochet). Lets say I get no normalisation despite using a capped AP shell. Lets also say I alway shot at that sharp angle and ignore me pumping AP into its broadside.

That puts us at 12 ".

Lets double it again because the cruiser has +96 % armor rating. Thats 24 ".

I basically cant pen that with 26 to 44 " the used 12" guns have at the relevant distances.  (and thats was more than being gracious considering its 26" at 10! km).

 

I am not sure if the current game even has normalization when calculating armor penetration. 
A krupp steel 6 inch plate can stop a 12 inch shell at a sufficient angle and difference, the penetration values I saw seemed reasonable, but the fact that you can put 6 inches of belt armor  [plus citadel armor] around a light cruiser to parry 12 inch shells might be the bigger issue. I find it relatively easy to armor up my light cruisers in the early game to the point where they are immune from all conventional penetration damage save hits from bigger caliber BBs at relatively close range. 

[Kiknurazz91]

British Destroyer leader in campaign mode 1940 starts at 63 pitch and 52 roll. WTF is that lol I cannot get it lower than 58p and 50r. Playing in a battle my destroyer looks like its bobbing for apples makes me sea sick watching it.

[havaduck]

7 minutes ago, itolan1752 said:

also, most of 1890s CA& CL hull's pitch/roll are still ridiculous.

 

Ah yes, thats reminds me:

The follwing is to be read in the exact same voices and emotional tones:

 

 

Oh noe .......

You just have to ballance it.

Well I am open to suggestions.

Remove some equipment to reduce roll and pitch.

Its empty! It doesnt have any equpiment.

Game help you are there to advise me, so advise me!

Well you just gotta find out what equipment causing the escessive pitch and roll. You just gotta figure out what the design needs using the center of mass indicator.

Its a god damn raft, it doesnt even have any equipment yet and its fúcked!

See this is your problem, you were never serious about the craft!

 

Literally how this feels .......

[Candle_86]

Well this is unplayable, got into a war with Germany and AH as france, Brittian and Italy signed an alliance with me and we went to war. Then because my fleets are fighting Germany and AH, my standing with them dropped until they declared war on me suddenly. How the hell does this make any god damn sense. The campaign is hard broke with this bug.

 

Events

Germany and Me went to War

AH Delcared war on me for going to War with germany

Britian asked to be my Ally as they where already at war with AH, accepted

Italy asked to be my ally 2 turns later, accepted

Moved my fleets of the AH and German Coasts

Britian and Italy over 2 years went from 100 to -100 standing and declared war on me. While we where in an alliance. Since when do allies hate it when you help them fight a war?

Edited June 29, 2022 by Candle_86

[Carl_Bar]

1 hour ago, admiralsnackbar said:

I am not sure if the current game even has normalization when calculating armor penetration. 
A krupp steel 6 inch plate can stop a 12 inch shell at a sufficient angle and difference, the penetration values I saw seemed reasonable, but the fact that you can put 6 inches of belt armor  [plus citadel armor] around a light cruiser to parry 12 inch shells might be the bigger issue. I find it relatively easy to armor up my light cruisers in the early game to the point where they are immune from all conventional penetration damage save hits from bigger caliber BBs at relatively close range. 

 

I think you misunderstood what he was saying. At best under ideal conditions you might see a Light cruiser stop anything with 24" of pen or less on the belt. The guns he's using have 26" of pen at 10,000m which is far greater than the range he's engaging at. there's simply no way for the belt to actually stop the shells.

 

 

That said whilst this is all from what i saw in the previous beta, (going to start a new campaign soon on the latest update), my experiance from turning on low priority events is that very little is actually striking the belt in the first place. It's all hitting the deck and bouncing from there, (which often makes sense given the amount of deck armour in play vs the deck penetration). I've also noticed the excessive deck hits isn't completely consistent. Sometimes after sinking an enemy or switching targets under AI control it will revert to a more expected mostly belt hits. but it's not somthing i can make happen on demand.

[SodaBit]

2 hours ago, havaduck said:

 

Ah yes, thats reminds me:

The follwing is to be read in the exact same voices and emotional tones:

 

 

Oh noe .......

You just have to ballance it.

Well I am open to suggestions.

Remove some equipment to reduce roll and pitch.

Its empty! It doesnt have any equpiment.

Game help you are there to advise me, so advise me!

Well you just gotta find out what equipment causing the escessive pitch and roll. You just gotta figure out what the design needs using the center of mass indicator.

Its a god damn raft, it doesnt even have any equipment yet and its fúcked!

See this is your problem, you were never serious about the craft!

 

Literally how this feels .......

Look, I know this is kinda an extreme option, but at this point it might be worth considering.
Can we just revert back to when the citadel didn't have such a massive impact on stability?
Or remove the citadel's influence on stability entirely?
I know it's not realistic, but holy f*** the realism isn't worth it at this point

[Skeksis]

Sorted

Edited June 30, 2022 by Skeksis

[kjg000]

6 hours ago, o Barão said:

This is so strange.

This is at very long distances in an update 2 weeks ago. If we zoom in, we will see this...

LQ shadows cast from the superstructures to the ship deck and turret.

And now we have this again...

Shadows ON

Shadows off.

Not going to bother you again with this. But it is very strange to me.

Sorry if this has been covered, I'm away from my computer at the moment and haven't been keeping up.

Have you considered the weather? Are the shadows changing because it's overcast?

[Nick Thomadis]

*UPDATE 20* (30/6/2022)
- Fixed critical campaign bug which caused wars to be declared multiple times.
- Fixed other bugs which prevented peace treaties to be achieved.
- Various improvements on the campaign AI.
- Battle AI improvement to keep a more effective distance.
- Improved GDP mechanics to affect better the province growth. The growth of each province is saved so that if it changes hands, it will generate the respective income (Due to the new mechanics, if you attempt to load old saves, the growth will be zero for the whole game, so the saves must be reset).
- Fixed bug which prevented you to select your port if an enemy task force was very near to it.
- Fixed other minor bugs related with task force movement.
- Improved tension mechanics so that tension will not be caused if you have good relations with a nation, unless you amass a very large fleet.
- Improved further the instability mechanics for the ship design, based on your feedback.
- Fixed some minor problems reported for the new hulls.
- Fixed issues of ballistics to evaluate angle of hit better, affecting mainly the deck hits which previously could often cause full penetrations or overpenetrations at a small angle of hit.
- Fixed buggy tooltip offset for monitors with uncommon resolution settings.
- Fixed problems that increased a lot the building time of ships.

PLEASE RESTART STEAM TO RECEIVE THE UPDATE (Saves had to be reset)

[Spitfire109]

22 minutes ago, Nick Thomadis said:

*UPDATE 20* (30/6/2022)
- Fixed critical campaign bug which caused wars to be declared multiple times.
- Fixed other bugs which prevented peace treaties to be achieved.
- Various improvements on the campaign AI.
- Battle AI improvement to keep a more effective distance.
- Improved GDP mechanics to affect better the province growth. The growth of each province is saved so that if it changes hands, it will generate the respective income (Due to the new mechanics, if you attempt to load old saves, the growth will be zero for the whole game, so the saves must be reset).
- Fixed bug which prevented you to select your port if an enemy task force was very near to it.
- Fixed other minor bugs related with task force movement.
- Improved tension mechanics so that tension will not be caused if you have good relations with a nation, unless you amass a very large fleet.
- Improved further the instability mechanics for the ship design, based on your feedback.
- Fixed some minor problems reported for the new hulls.
- Fixed issues of ballistics to evaluate angle of hit better, affecting mainly the deck hits which previously could often cause full penetrations or overpenetrations at a small angle of hit.
- Fixed buggy tooltip offset for monitors with uncommon resolution settings.
- Fixed problems that increased a lot the building time of ships.

PLEASE RESTART STEAM TO RECEIVE THE UPDATE (Saves had to be reset)

The battle AI improvements affect Academy and Customs too, yes?

[Fangoriously]

New Experimental battleship still has the fire arc issue, the dreadnought appears fixed. Also, the heavy cruiser derivative is gone? Checked every year between 1905 and 1921

[admiralsnackbar]

It looks as if the bribe you pay to avoid war is now based on gross naval income. And a gross naval income bribe of 100% is insanely expensive. This has forced me to have a fleet ready at the beginning of the game. 

 

Edited June 30, 2022 by admiralsnackbar

[Aloeus]

Looks like pitch and roll has been normalized for a lot of the trouble hulls before, that is much appreciated. 

[jtjohn1]

Launched my normal Germany 1920 campaign.  Set everything up.  July 1920 (So 6 turns in) it locked up on Ship building again.  Gave it my normal 2-3 minutes of waiting then closed it.  Is there someway to indicate that it's actually doing something?  That way I will just wait and not wonder if it's locked up for good this time.

[TheSublimeGoose]

5 hours ago, havaduck said:

@Nick Thomadis Update on partial pen fiesta:

Honestly, armor (and penetration) have seemed pretty borked in-general for the last few patches. The numbers you see on the guns seemingly have no correlation with how they actually perform. I can have a 35in fore belt, 120%+, so 77in total. I face my vessel directly towards the enemy, and heck, that heavily angled, 77in of armor will barely stop 9in guns. I understand that it's a work-in-progress, but something doesn't feel right. 

[IshPR7777]

1 hour ago, Nick Thomadis said:

*UPDATE 20* (30/6/2022)
- Fixed critical campaign bug which caused wars to be declared multiple times.
- Fixed other bugs which prevented peace treaties to be achieved.
- Various improvements on the campaign AI.
- Battle AI improvement to keep a more effective distance.
- Improved GDP mechanics to affect better the province growth. The growth of each province is saved so that if it changes hands, it will generate the respective income (Due to the new mechanics, if you attempt to load old saves, the growth will be zero for the whole game, so the saves must be reset).
- Fixed bug which prevented you to select your port if an enemy task force was very near to it.
- Fixed other minor bugs related with task force movement.
- Improved tension mechanics so that tension will not be caused if you have good relations with a nation, unless you amass a very large fleet.
- Improved further the instability mechanics for the ship design, based on your feedback.
- Fixed some minor problems reported for the new hulls.
- Fixed issues of ballistics to evaluate angle of hit better, affecting mainly the deck hits which previously could often cause full penetrations or overpenetrations at a small angle of hit.
- Fixed buggy tooltip offset for monitors with uncommon resolution settings.
- Fixed problems that increased a lot the building time of ships.

PLEASE RESTART STEAM TO RECEIVE THE UPDATE (Saves had to be reset)

Good job!!

[Aloeus]

On the topic of armor issues...

this aft belt is .8" of 80% armor, so 1.4" or so. The ship I was shooting at was roughly perpendicular, but even at the range I was at I would have 2.4" of deck pen, let alone the 27 or so inches of belt pen. Even without the high number of deck hits something is off with the armor calculations.