Hethwill Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 if it is a 2 enemy v 5 your side, why should you enter ? ( i'm following OP opening words, where weakest side gets reinforced ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Crimson Sunrise said: not quite so u can sail from charlseton to the mouth of the harbor in a few seconds in OW but it takes only a couple minutes depending on ur ship to traverse that distance in battle Ohh really.. i already tested that distance with good wind on my teak teak Connie, took me maybe 20 sec at Max in OW and at least 15-20 mins in battle and that was even when i joined the battle just nnw from the square fort. Edited January 18, 2019 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vernon Merrill Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Just now, Crimson Sunrise said: think of it like this a battle has just started outside brunswick u are in charlseton it takes u a couple hours to get down to brunswick from CT u happen across the battle currently outside the port ur allied ships are in battle condition several have been sunk but a few are still in battle with the enemy, what could possibly prevent u and ur allies that followed u from engaging the enemy to save ur fellow ships Sure. As long as you start in the battle instance a few hours sail away... fine. Battle instance is only 90 mins, however... and just for the record, there are far more historical instances of battles within sight of cities/reinforcements where winds and tides prevented friendly forces joining than there are of people sailing hours to an UNKNOWN location hoping to help a friendly vessel. In fact, I cant even really think of ANY. You'd have to be extremely lucky to stumble upon the location. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Cadete Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, Licinio Chiavari said: LGV has higher BR than Niagara (or an Indiaman more than LRQ): would you consider defensive tag a bad idea? Sorry i’m Not up to date on the games mechanics but to me a defensive tag is/ was always done with the intention of not actually fighting but running away, dividing fleets, hold a ship until reinforcements or a gank squad arrived. Other than those reasons I don’t know why someone would defensive tag anything. If people don’t think they can sink a ship or put up a good fight they should be courteous enough not to waste someone else’s time. Btw I don’t direct this at you. This is just talking about things in general Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angus MacDuff Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Vernon Merrill said: Sure. As long as you start in the battle instance a few hours sail away... fine. Battle instance is only 90 mins, however... and just for the record, there are far more historical instances of battles within sight of cities/reinforcements where winds and tides prevented friendly forces joining than there are of people sailing hours to an UNKNOWN location hoping to help a friendly vessel. In fact, I cant even really think of ANY. You'd have to be extremely lucky to stumble upon the location. Too bad the French fleet in Brest didn't get a text message that Villenueve was in trouble. They could have popped out and beat Nelson! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Sunrise Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Just now, Chevalier du Ethuville said: if it is a 2v5 why should you enter ? ( i'm following OP opening words, where weakest side gets reinforced ) because that 2v5 might actually be 2v1 with 4 allied ships sunk or it could be 2v5 the 2 being our side still alive with 1 ship. either way if our side is loosing or is wining why not reinforce to help. thats the point of reinforcing a side it to aid either allies or to simply engage in pvp. most ganks that happen the i have see especially when i used to be US nation was a lone single ship hunting traders and less experienced players even if those players are in larger ships. i'll give u an example i used to be US i was out in my epic 4th rate aggy with 2 allied ships we were out doing missions outside reinforcement zone we got tagged by 2 brits in trincs the battle was 2 v 3 it ended up 2 v 1 i lost my 2 escort ships and was left to defend myself. i drew out that battle as long as i could till they gave up. but i could of been reinforced had that timer not closed the battle there were 6 allied ships where my battle was but they couldnt join to help. i was still alive even tho i was several hours out from shore using inbattle speed and time to travel distance. but help was right about the battle and i was still alive. this is why battle shouldnt close because ur presence could tip the balance of a battle u could end up helping or ensuring and enemy or ally's destruction or safety Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Then the 2 were better than the 5. Learn and improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Sunrise Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Chevalier du Ethuville said: Then the 2 were better than the 5. Learn and improve. yes learn and improve that 5 could be a single indiaman and 4 escorts the escorts were taken out and the india could of be crippled but still alive. that battle could of had 4 first rates and a fleet of smaller ships sitting outside but unable to reinforce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 You let go whatever you want lol. This is a leisure past time activity. Leave me out of your pasture @Wraith. I like time and scale in my wargames and i have no problem in saying it. Devs do whatever they want. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Licinio Chiavari Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Chevalier du Ethuville said: Then the 2 were better than the 5. Learn and improve. Speaking of number or BR involved makes, sincerely, no sense. A single skilled and well geared veteran can smash incredible odds. And really never risking the ship against a bunch of random casuals. Battle closed for "weaker" side is utter BS. "Weaker" based on what?? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z4ys Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 2 minutes ago, Wraith said: of ports isn't a bad one (you shouldn't be hunting outside an enemy nation port or free port if you don't want to be joined on). I agree when ports wouldn't be always a few min sail away but let's be honest everyone sails along coasts/islands. The time to get close and start the tags always end up withing town view range. Battles with just the blue sea around a rare. Especially scrap that around gustavia. The tag window is so short sailing and hunting there ain't fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Sunrise Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Just now, Chevalier du Ethuville said: You let go whatever you want. Leave me out of your pasture. I like time and scale in my wargames and i have no problem in saying it. Devs do whatever they want. would u be able to elaborate on the scaling and time scale used in regards to battle and to OW in correpondence to why the battle timer was reduced from 3 minutes to 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Licinio Chiavari said: "Weaker" based on what?? If the 5 lose ? they lost the battle. That's all there is about it. More battles will happen for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angus MacDuff Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 2 minutes ago, Licinio Chiavari said: Weaker" based on what?? I am the weakest link! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Crimson Sunrise said: would u be able to elaborate on the scaling and time scale used in regards to battle and to OW in correpondence to why the battle timer was reduced from 3 minutes to 2 Do the test. Sail in OW from point A ( port ) to a imaginary point B ( another port ) where a battle is. Sail in battle the same distance. Take notes. Enjoy understanding. 3 minutes, i'll leave an entire squadron out of sight, you will NOT see your enemy in the open sea. You will not know they are there, you think it is you versus that one enemy. Suddenly, because 3 minutes, 5 more guys jump you and you lose your ship. What you see is what you get, and 2 minutes average OW speed is enough to enter any battle you see. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Sunrise Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 minute ago, JG14_Cuzn said: @Crimson Sunrise just curious.....what is your ingame name? sadly that will remain anonymous as it is not prevy to the current topic which is pvp and how it should be modified to fit a small reality that makes pvp less and less enjoyable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Thing is, if Signalling is coming back or if everything comes back. Arena circle is a odd choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angus MacDuff Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Just now, Crimson Sunrise said: sadly that will remain anonymous as it is not prevy to the current topic which is pvp and how it should be modified to fit a small reality that makes pvp less and less enjoyable Credibility…. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Sunrise Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Chevalier du Ethuville said: Do the test. Sail in OW from point A ( port ) to a imaginary point B ( another port ) where a battle is. Sail in battle the same distance. Take notes. Enjoy understanding. why will u not simply provide information would not doing it ourselves yield conflicting results based on ships used upgrades, quality of ship, skill knowledge, material ship is made of. would this not be a breach of forum rules to give misleading and incorrect information? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Just now, Crimson Sunrise said: why will u not simply provide information would not doing it ourselves yield conflicting results based on ships used upgrades, quality of ship, skill knowledge, material ship is made of. would this not be a breach of forum rules to give misleading and incorrect information? debate debate debate even more and not a single test done ? cya o7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim McSauce Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Vernon Merrill said: There is really only ONE fundamental truth regarding the concept of a PvP server: IN ORDER FOR SOMEONE TO "WIN", SOMEONE ELSE HAS TO "LOSE".... The question is: How much should should losing suck and what is the tolerance level for players dealing with "loss"... My guess is that differs for all... Of course if all you are willing to sail is purple/gold lineships, then you are agoing to have a far different take on what the ROE's should be... I'm absolutely DYING to see how many people would sail their gold Bellona into "shrinking circle/patrol zone style" battle.... They would treat them as gold ironically. Call it fools gold and a fool's good fortune in a fight I agree with the Admins thought process here, PvP lacks commitment people only fight the battles where they have the advantage. This is especially true when mods and ships come into play, too many reasons not to fight, and making it too easy to pick and choose your battles to suite your advantage. Edited January 18, 2019 by Slim McSauce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vernon Merrill Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 4 minutes ago, Slim McSauce said: They would treat them as gold ironically. Call it fools gold and a fool's good fortune in a fight I agree with the Admins thought process here, PvP lacks commitment people only fight the battles where they have the advantage. This is especially true when mods and ships come into play, too many reasons not to fight, and making it too easy to pick and choose your battles to suite your advantage. Believe it or not, I actually agree with you for once.... People want to sail all the biggest ships with the best gear, but they are deathly afraid of actually losing it. And instead of using ships/gear that they can afford to lose, they'd rather stay in port. The state of NA 2018/2019 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Sunrise Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Wraith said: Which begs the question, how do you make losing still feel like winning? My take on this was always that losers should receive battle rewards commensurate with the damage that they did. The moaners complained that people could level up too quickly this way but unless people feel ok about going out and getting wrecked, because they are still advancing in a perceptible way, then PvP will still suffer from the, "I'm only fighting if I know I'm going to win," mentality. That's why I like the Reinforcement zones turning away from Reinforcements to be no-ship loss PvP areas. I think this would change the nature of these zones into hotbeds of PvP action. we dont need more pvp in R zones we need to stop PvP from happening outside captial ports and non-capable ports there is no reason any nation or player should be ganking traders and starting players outside that nations capital, it just further pushes new players away and gives more players the reason to stay in port. using US as an example their capital always has some nations player ships sitting outside or killing players up and down their coast. its shouldnt be happening Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim McSauce Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Wraith said: Which begs the question, how do you make losing still feel like winning? Well. You can't. You should ask, How do we make losing feel less like losing? Something has to carry over from that battle whether it's doubloons, XP, or reals. There has to be an acknowledgement to the side who fights hard and is defeated, that they did a good thing in fighting a good hard fight. To non-decisive battles as well. If someone gets attacked, and you jump in to help and drive the attacker away, there should be some kind of medal and reward for that action. It should be recognized that you achieved something meaningful and saved another player's ship and items. Every battle should have that conclusion that rewards both sides for playing well. Edited January 18, 2019 by Slim McSauce 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iroquois Confederacy Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 A different thought is that if it is too easy to escape, why not make it so damaged hull/sails slow you in the OW as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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