fox2run Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 2 hours ago, mikawa said: The problem are players joining in minor ships. So the decision was to restrict port battle participation only to clan members. I agree that [clan] environments are a pain but this is common in all multiplayer online games ... sad but true, nobody sees you so people feel like they are protected by anonymity ... A game like Warthunder is known to most. Clan-membership or TS is good to have to get the upper hand in a fight. But its not like you cant get into a fight without it. Nor is it impossible to have a certain airplane. Think of clans or TS environments in the same way here in NA. Its good to coordinate a fight on TS but it shouldnt be mandatory like it is now in order to get into PBs or sail in SOLs. Yes, players could come in smaller vessels but if that is a problem it would be better to make limits on the vessels allowed in a port battle than to say to 50% or more of the community that they are not welcome in "our" game. If losses a bearable players would fight more often. They also need a cause to fight. As it is now, I cant enjoy the big battles. Hell, I even gave up on knowing the not so obvious mechanisms that should lead to a fight. Why the hell is it made so complicated? Simplify it and kick the clans to a tactical level where they belong. kind regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr RideZ Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 I am a casual player. I have 2 hours to play per day. My clan says that we do hostility missions. I have time to sail 2 of those, I earn 1.2 million. Yesterday we did missions as well, but enemy came to defend and I lost my L'OCean. Later that day we did OW PvP and I lost my Constitution. How many days I have to play to earn back what I lost? One big issue NA had was that people could not afford to lose ships. They did not want to do PvP or only if they had superior numbers. NA waters are full of uneven fights, 99.9% are uneven. Will this income rate be enough to grow your sacks so big that the next time you are at BR disadvantage, you take that fight and see what happens. Would be also interesting to see if our "pro" players finally grow balls big enough that they actually sail something else than a speed boat. I did not name anyone, not my fault if you felt a sting in your heart. Does it really matter if we have some HC players who have 100 billion on their account, if at the same time we have a server full of players actually playing Naval Action? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fox2run Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 Just now, rediii said: If you dont understand the meta or just dont want to accept it dont call good players "speedboat" drivers and challenge them that the, shall come with something different. Honestly they come with that because you can decide if you want to fight or not and minimize your losses. You dont do that which is ok and your problem but dont expect to get a 1st rate a day with 2h playtime... Ehm... Why not? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fox2run Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 Just now, rediii said: Same topic you discuss everywhere. If you want to join a portbattle another clan worked for ask them. Shouldnt be too hard. you cant go on a raid in wow with a group who doesnt want you to join too. Same with warthunder.(what a bad example) you cant group up with people that dont wanna play with you Ehm.. Why should my participation in game-content I paid for be open for discussions in a teen-ts-environment. I simply cannot understand this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vazco Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 (edited) 4 hours ago, admin said: If you want people to get to pvp fast you have to give players an option to recover losses fast. That's true, however it can be also archieved without creating superinflation. Right now trading will become useless, price of goods will start to change and economy will die. It won't be profitable to eg. bring an oak wood to capital, as you will earn more from missions. As a result, you won't be able to buy anything from anyone, even though everyone will have a ton of cash. It could be handled eg. by partial insurances (eg. 80%), which would be based on time from the last time you lost a ship. This would not destroy economy and crafting, in the same time it would get people to PvP fast after a loss of a ship (except for exploiters who would want to sink eg. 10 times per day). Edited September 12, 2017 by vazco 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 8 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said: I am a casual player. I have 2 hours to play per day. My clan says that we do hostility missions. I have time to sail 2 of those, I earn 1.2 million. Yesterday we did missions as well, but enemy came to defend and I lost my L'OCean. Later that day we did OW PvP and I lost my Constitution. How many days I have to play to earn back what I lost? its a lot easier now. Several large missions will recover the losses. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vazco Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 btw, if we have a situation like now for longer, fixing a mess that economy will become after superinflation would require a wipe... If you plan to fix economy, better do this fast... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 Just now, rediii said: you need 4 players to easily do a hostility mission group content exists in all games and works fine. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fox2run Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 1 minute ago, rediii said: It doesnt. Group up with other adults in chat and grind a portbattle and fight it, no problem there Grind a port battle? They are as hard to get as any small battle. We need easy to get battles. Open battles. With a lot of ships in them. Why is this so hard to make? (And please dont come with your arena-argument...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeheil Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 Do shallow hostility Fox is you are looking for easy battles, 10 mercs, you can spank em in a 4th up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fox2run Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 4 minutes ago, Jeheil said: Do shallow hostility Fox is you are looking for easy battles, 10 mercs, you can spank em in a 4th up PvP that is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikawa Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, admin said: its a lot easier now. Several large missions will recover the losses. After having played yesterday for 2h I fully agree. I made 400k only doing 5th missions. 1st rates should be special ships so people should not expect to get easy replace for it in 2h playtime. This would be ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeheil Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 yeh well the whole idea in PvP is to stack the odds in your favour...like ya know..... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jodgi Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 @Peter Goldman Did you notice your got your wish granted? Prince is a riot to sail with manual foremast yardwork. Turns fantastic and can slow down and reduce turn radius very effectively with staysails work. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tobosaku Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 Unfortunately any profound idea to "fix the economy" is contrary to the idea that one needs to have a fast recovery from losses to guarantee pvp-action. From my perspective the main issue which will always lead to hyperinflation sooner or later is the hybrid npc/player economy. Why not use the early access stage to find out if there are still enough folks eagerly waiting for a real player-driven economy? Sure, every clan has their supply chain. But if planned economy would lead to good and competitive economies, Naval Action would have been an USSR product and not from Ukraine... wouldn't it? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr RideZ Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 49 minutes ago, rediii said: If you dont understand the meta or just dont want to accept it dont call good players "speedboat" drivers and challenge them that the, shall come with something different. Honestly they come with that because you can decide if you want to fight or not and minimize your losses. You dont do that which is ok and your problem but dont expect to get a 1st rate a day with 2h playtime... Speed meta is strong. Repair kits are broken, which really does not make it any better. There are plenty of ships in the game, as long as people are just sailing few of those -> The game is broken. The "pro" players are really so damn worried if they lose a fight that they simply cannot sail anything else? Oh, yes they actually are. Increasing income is a cheap "fix" for speed meta. Even if speed meta will be fixed properly, higher income rate is needed in general to support larger playerbase. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bach Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 3 hours ago, admin said: limits under review I don't think the limit is the problem. The limit is one of the few things to encourage a nation to act like a nation. the problem in this particular instance is the location. Without obvious known locations of a port blockade the smaller and possibly dual boxing Danish group can avoid the British groups wrath by "hiding" while gaining hostility. In effect they blockade by NOT actually blockading and instead avoiding any real ships in the area. Move the missions to a common location, let the British jump into the Dane missions and the sand box will solve the problem. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr RideZ Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, rediii said: speed is mostly about wood not about the ship except big ones. Repairs are also not broken. CD could be 2-3 min higher yes but its not broken. makes it more about skill and decicionmaking. even more in big fights. Wood types sure could be in better balance but repair kits are actually affecting to the game a lot. Repair kits definitely make speed meta stronger and definitely makes it harder for small fleets and solo players. Also repair kits are affecting to ship builds, which supports the current speed meta. Everyone already hates me from my walls of text where I state "my facts". I probably should not start, so maybe someone else can do it this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jef Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 (edited) 22 hours ago, Liq said: Reveal hidden contents > Surprise attacks Essex > Essex gets Santisima and L'Ocean reinforcment Yeah this makes no sense... Also what is the maximum range for people to call in reinforcements... There is no indicator at all for anyone raiding/searching for PVP to know where the reinforcements circle ends. If it is the region(and I believe it is) look at the map... There is no incentive to raid Dutch traders anymore, as their entire region is basically protected, same for the French, and for the Brits. Where else will you be able to find people in a huge world, except for their capitals with a player count of 300-400 (let alone during the evening where it drops to 100 and lower) I hope the reinforcement circle can be tuned down, and also the way the first rates popup in a battle like this, is purely ridiculous... At this point, I'm putting the game aside as I'm NOT interested in PVE, hence why I joined a PVP server Edited September 12, 2017 by Jef 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liq Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 13 minutes ago, Jef said: Yeah this makes no sense... Also what is the maximum range for people to call in reinforcements... There is no indicator at all for anyone raiding/searching for PVP to know where the reinforcements circle ends. If it is the region(and I believe it is) look at the map... There is no incentive to raid Dutch traders anymore, as their entire region is basically protected, same for the French, and for the Brits. Where else will you be able to find people in a huge world, except for their capitals with a player count of 300-400 (let alone during the evening where it drops to 100 and lower) I hope the reinforcement circle can be tuned down, and also the way the first rates popup in a battle like this, is purely ridiculous... At this point, I'm putting the game aside as I'm NOT interested in PVE, hence why I joined a PVP server Ya, when I first read about reinforcments coming back I thought it was meant to reduce the 5v1 or similar ganks near capitals, so the player attacked could get reinforcments to about 1.3 times the BR of attackers. But apparently its meant to provide a huge safezone and completely cover the eco of most nations, on a pvp server No real point to be playing anymore for a solo hunter, but at least Arena is close. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodo Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 So my assessment of the patch is as follows. After 30-60min of playing lastnight. It is a solid 6 out of 10. While it fixes some grind issues with ship XP, gold and marks, it does break other things and increase inflation. The reduction in material weights was a very good change, but the lack of adjustments on the actual cargo ships or trader ships is not helping. A Trader Snow is still useless compared to a Trader Brig. And a Brig is useless compared to the LGV. The other issues of population balance. The nations still see no point in being balanced, and are even further from being useful than before. I wont go into the reinforcement issues, as others have already clubbed that to death. Then the PB mechanic really hasnt changed so the meta will remain the same. Thus it will get boring very fast and continue to lose players in the RVR area because PVP is just easier and cheaper. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liq Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 4 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said: At this point Santa Cecilia is one of the more useless 5th rates. Mine never leaves port. I tried it in PvP couple of times and I would rather use a Surprise that I dislike pretty much... IMO It still is the best allrounder frigate. If only there were ways of getting them so we didnt have to worry about losing them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 49 minutes ago, Liq said: Ya, when I first read about reinforcments coming back I thought it was meant to reduce the 5v1 or similar ganks near capitals, so the player attacked could get reinforcments to about 1.3 times the BR of attackers. But apparently its meant to provide a huge safezone and completely cover the eco of most nations, on a pvp server We are very very sure that legends will find their audience. And will make sure you are happy there. But we have to make players here (in the open world) are happy too. In terms of the open world, Capital waters are safe. Nations protect them. You can still sink the target there (just like in EVE - the harshest game of all) but its very very hard so its basically suicide ganking. Current rewards will support this play style. Capital waters and uncapturable zones provide the way for players to build up and venture on their own convenience. We attempted for the year and a half to find the way to make it work but it does not works as even the harshest worlds have some safe areas for the players. The new design document on solo hunting near enemy capitals looks like this Current design is the final design for the open world. Nations tax players to protect them against modestly skilled hunters. Very skilled hunters can still overcome this challenge. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said: Reinforcements are retarded, because they spawn only 1st rates. they are fine as their only goal is to deter the average attacker and protect the player. Eve online spawns huge ships as well. and actually stops your ship (we don't and you can escape). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 Just now, Peter Goldman said: They should spawn some 5th rates too. AI at current game state is too stupid, 1st rates ram each other, tack the wind all the time and it's very easy to avoid their broadsides. I killed multiple times French players that tried to follow "Dread Fleet" of 12x 1st rates or so. Ignore AI, kill the player and run away. They will learn. you just need to enter fleet and help them fight you. But the design will of course improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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