Alts for port battles activities - BAN WARNING

[van Veen]

44 minutes ago, Teutonic said:

again, if you guys are seriously ok with "how" this was done.

 

then no one is going to like what is coming.

I think hardly anyone is ok with the way it was done. The same way hardly anyone was ok with the way San Juan was "captured" by Sweden. But it was deemed legal gameplay. So, most players got over it, except for the Danish who lost the port of course. 

However, it seems that Swedish players have a very unique view on this topic: San Juan was ok, Truxillo is not. And now Swedes threaten to go full alt war. Well ok, if you do that, it'll make @Liq's tribunal seem very absurd: go to tribunal and then threaten to do exactly what you deemed tribunal worthy. This is close to the very definition of hypocrisy, wouldn't you agree? 

And why are you so worried about a British port being captured by a minor Swedish clan? 

[Liq]

Just now, van Veen said:

I think hardly anyone is ok with the way it was done. The same way hardly anyone was ok with the way San Juan was "captured" by Sweden. But it was deemed legal gameplay. So, most players got over it, except for the Danish who lost the port of course. 

However, it seems that Swedish players have a very unique view on this topic: San Juan was ok, Truxillo is not. And now Swedes threaten to go full alt war. Well ok, if you do that, it'll make @Liq's tribunal seem very absurd: go to tribunal and then threaten to do exactly what you deemed tribunal worthy. This is close to the very definition of hypocrisy, wouldn't you agree? 

And why are you so worried about a British port being captured by a minor Swedish clan? 

San Juan: Belonged to HAVOC, in Danmark. Got pissed off by "privateers" not helping the nation effort. Changed Nation, ALL of us. Retook San Juan, which was ours. Important: ALL of us did the nation switch.

Truxillo: BASTD, British, using a swedish alter to capture the port, while they stay British. Port is now locked in an alter clan. BASTD remains British.

Can it be any more obvious?

[Dark123]

3 minutes ago, Liq said:

San Juan: Belonged to HAVOC, in Danmark. Got pissed off by "privateers" not helping the nation effort. Changed Nation, ALL of us. Retook San Juan, which was ours. Important: ALL of us did the nation switch.

Truxillo: BASTD, British, using a swedish alter to capture the port, while they stay British. Port is now locked in an alter clan. BASTD remains British.

Can it be any more obvious?

what was with santo domingo?

[Liq]

1 minute ago, Dark123 said:

what was with santo domingo?

??

[Dark123]

2 minutes ago, Liq said:

??

dutch time

[Dark123]

1 minute ago, TDK said:

Santo Domingo was held by SNOW and was given to LIONS. But since you cannot gift a port to a clan in your own nation, the Swedish kindly helped in taking the port from SNOW so LIONS could take it back from Sweden.

nope. long time ago. havoc was dutch.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Liq said:

San Juan: Belonged to HAVOC, in Danmark. Got pissed off by "privateers" not helping the nation effort. Changed Nation, ALL of us. Retook San Juan, which was ours. Important: ALL of us did the nation switch.

Truxillo: BASTD, British, using a swedish alter to capture the port, while they stay British. Port is now locked in an alter clan. BASTD remains British.

Can it be any more obvious?

Who are u to enslave some members to the same clan forever regardles of wether that clan chooses to switch or not. What if some BASTD players decided to move and some didn't..

You have an exceptionally biased view of this matter, and I'd like to point out that you don't have all the facts and you refuse to acknowledge similarities between SJ and Trux simply because you 'feel' they are different.

SJ got flipped by a swedish clan, thus preventing other swedish clans from doing host on SJ and get the port. That some/all HAVOC players then switched to Sweden is for the PB irrelevant.

Truxillo was flipped by a swedish clan, thus preventing other swedish clans from taking the port. The use of foreign allies/mercenaries has already been tested and deemed working as intended. You may not like it, but to tribunal someone for doing what the mechanics allow, whilst still maintaining that your abuse of the mechanics was acceptable is the very definition of hypocracy..

Rather than taking Trux as an example it would prob be better to argue out of a hypothetical example thus removing the irrelevant emotional factor.

[gimli_balinson]

6 minutes ago, TDK said:

Let's not forget that Swedes could only pull this on San Juan because it was declared legal before they did it. They did the same before at Bluefields, which has held by British alt clan RIVAL. The main accounts of RIVAL player were and still are HAVOC members (Dutch back then). RIVAL removed every friendly clan from friendlist and HAVOC captured the uncontested port. Reasoning "The Brits had no use of it".

A Tribunal was started, but Ink declared this method of port swapping to be legal.

Dude u made my day 😂😂😂😂 bluefields 😂😂😂😂 empty 😂😂😂😂 maybe i drunk to much but i remember to see 20 british 1 rathes there also some from bast 

[Liq]

3 minutes ago, Lars Kjaer said:

SJ got flipped by a swedish clan, thus preventing other swedish clans from doing host on SJ and get the port. That some/all HAVOC players then switched to Sweden is for the PB irrelevant.

 

If you actually think that CRC clan is legit, you're a fool

There are no complaints within Sweden about HAVOC owning San Juan, which they've owned before. We put everyone on the friend list anyway.

Edited February 10, 2020 by Liq

[Guest]

Just now, Liq said:

If actually think that CRC clan is legit, you're a fool

There are no complaints within Sweden about HAVOC owning San Juan, which they've owned before. We put everyone on the friend list anyway.

I know of clan that has a complaint. I trade with them for stuff they need elsewhere.. And wether u have ppl on the friendslist is irrelevant. 

[Dark123]

Just now, Bryan Von Gyldenloeve said:

Pretty sure Swedish players can come on friendlist of this new clan to.

Well legit. What game rule is it Breaking. You claim it is not legit. Plz tell what rule it breaks?

they are pissed. thats all. havoc isnt the owner of the port

[Smoothie]

delete plz

Edited February 10, 2020 by Smoothie

[AeRoTR]

@Liq I still believe you to be decent guy, not only a very good pvp, but a good person, but your clan HAVOC, you do not know them well. You do not know their history, so your actions seem funny. Why don't you let Rediii, Liam etc. to make the forum fight. They are used to mud, but instead you are in the mud. Do not do this, let them pvp on forums, you pvp on the game. o7

[van Veen]

18 minutes ago, Liq said:

San Juan: Belonged to HAVOC, in Danmark. Got pissed off by "privateers" not helping the nation effort. Changed Nation, ALL of us. Retook San Juan, which was ours. Important: ALL of us did the nation switch.

Truxillo: BASTD, British, using a swedish alter to capture the port, while they stay British. Port is now locked in an alter clan. BASTD remains British.

Can it be any more obvious?

What you describe as key difference is the context and the purpose, but this is irrelevant as to what happened factually. 

In both cases an alt clan from another nation was used to create an empty port battle. That is the key. Everything else doesn't matter. 

In San Juan, the defending clan was an alt, in Truxillo the attacking clan was an alt. The friendlist was used at San Juan to block out defenders, at Truxillo it was used against the attackers. 

This just proves that the same method can be applied offensively and defensively. But it's still the same. 

[eneibesmuB]

You're really good at twisting the facts

[Archaos]

28 minutes ago, Liq said:

San Juan: Belonged to HAVOC, in Danmark. Got pissed off by "privateers" not helping the nation effort. Changed Nation, ALL of us. Retook San Juan, which was ours. Important: ALL of us did the nation switch.

Truxillo: BASTD, British, using a swedish alter to capture the port, while they stay British. Port is now locked in an alter clan. BASTD remains British.

Can it be any more obvious?

So to use your logic, Truxillo was a BASTD port, they got pissed off with HAVOC taking GB ports and decided to give the port to a small Swedish clan. It is their port and they can decide who they give it to.

Your argument does not work. If San Juan was HAVOCs and all HAVOC changed nation, how come the port did not become neutral? Someone must have stayed in Danish nation to remove all other Danish clans from friendlist till HAVOC had raised hostility and taken port. Why did HAVOC not just let the port go neutral and join in the free for all to raise hostility on the port? Because the only way they could guarantee getting the port themselves was to play loosely with the rules.

May not be exactly the same as Truxillo, but surely even you must see that it is a similar abuse of game mechanics.

[VirtuallyIdiotic]

5 minutes ago, Archaos said:

So to use your logic, Truxillo was a BASTD port, they got pissed off with HAVOC taking GB ports and decided to give the port to a small Swedish clan. It is their port and they can decide who they give it to.

Even calling that alt a clan is a joke. It is one alt with the soul purpose to exploit the holes in the RvR system to prevent a total loss of Truxillo. 

7 minutes ago, Archaos said:

Your argument does not work. If San Juan was HAVOCs and all HAVOC changed nation, how come the port did not become neutral? Someone must have stayed in Danish nation to remove all other Danish clans from friendlist till HAVOC had raised hostility and taken port. Why did HAVOC not just let the port go neutral and join in the free for all to raise hostility on the port? Because the only way they could guarantee getting the port themselves was to play loosely with the rules.

HAVOC and the other Danish clans burned bridges between one another far in advance and the Danish clans were removed from the Friends list a long time ago as requested by the Swedish clans who were requested to help flip San Juan for HAVOC and their return to Sweden. Hence, why it never went Neutral. It was not something that occurred in a day or even a week. This was going on for a full month after HAVOC had enough with the other clans of Danmark and vice versa. The deterioration of Danmark was not a single individual or even a single clans fault, but rather the inability for the clans to come to compromises and work together in a functioning manner. If Danmark was a much larger nation their inability to see eye to eye could easily be overcome much like you see in Great Britain where obviously not every clan is on the same page but are still able to function as a nation. In a smaller enviroment this is not sustainable. 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, VirtuallyIdiotic said:

Even calling that alt a clan is a joke. It is one alt with the soul purpose to exploit the holes in the RvR system to prevent a total loss of Truxillo. 

 were removed from the Friends list a long time ago as requested by the Swedish clans who were requested to help flip San Juan for HAVOC and their return to Sweden. Hence, why it never went Neutral. 

Wait. So Sweden abused an alt to run hostility on a danish port and prevent DK-NG from defending?

That sounds a lot like alt exploitation to me.

[Liq]

5 minutes ago, Bryan Von Gyldenloeve said:

Havoc is still in DK. Just active when they want to buy poods.

 

[image]

What ports is the "HAVOC alt can" holding?

Right - none

[Archaos]

1 minute ago, Liq said:

What ports is the "HAVOC alt can" holding?

Right - none

Because they handed it over to Swedish HAVOC. 

This directly contradicts what you said about all HAVOC leaving Denmark before SJ was captured.

[Liq]

Just now, Archaos said:

Because they handed it over to Swedish HAVOC. 

This directly contradicts what you said about all HAVOC leaving Denmark before SJ was captured.

changing nations is a PROCESS.

What matters is in the end, the whole clan changed nation and is making active use of the port in question

Whereas BASTD put it onto an alter clan while staying British.

(Some people on global discrd said BASTD was going to switch to Swden. Yeah right, what about that?)

[Archaos]

1 minute ago, rediii said:

guess we can give all danish ports to HAVOC alt clan if alts are allowed in RvR now.

Or get a lot of british ports with british alts and make them free for all.

Or attack ports to block other people from attacking a port.

unlimited exploitabilities.

You are missing the point, I feel what was done at Truxillo was wrong, but so too was what happened at San Juan. Both cases although slightly different relied on some form of alt to ensure the port was handed over to the person or clan that the owner wanted. There are probably many other cases the same.

[Archaos]

1 minute ago, Liq said:

changing nations is a PROCESS.

What matters is in the end, the whole clan changed nation and is making active use of the port in question

Whereas BASTD put it onto an alter clan while staying British.

(Some people on global discrd said BASTD was going to switch to Swden. Yeah right, what about that?)

How do you know that they are not planning to do that? and anyway as someone pointed out HAVOC still have alt clans in Denmark, so they did not all move as you say.

[Archaos]

2 minutes ago, rediii said:

its different sorry. You might try your best to twist the facts as much as possible but in the end it's a swedish alt that was used to flip the port to sweden so it can't be attacked by sweden.

San Juan was flipped with swedish ships, no alts involved.

And was it not a HAVOC alt still in the Danish nation that kept ownership of San Juan till HAVOC had captured it?

Its not twisting the facts. So tell me which clan owned San Juan when HAVOC attacked and how many members were in that clan and was there any connection between HAVOC and the Danish clan that owned SJ when you captured it. Were other Danish clans prevented from defending the port?

You selectively choose facts to justify your position by saying no alts were involved in the flipping of SJ, but you conveniently forget that some form of alt or player who had no intention of remaining Danish held the port and did not defend it as well as stopping other Danes from defending the port.

[Liq]

16 minutes ago, Archaos said:

How do you know that they are not planning to do that? and anyway as someone pointed out HAVOC still have alt clans in Denmark, so they did not all move as you say.

 

Leftover HAVOCS in Danish are inactive players.

Edited February 10, 2020 by Liq