Baron Von WeisenCracker Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 (edited) Guys ... c'mon ... figure it out ..... do NOT set sail with a ship you CANNOT fully man! If the crew part of your readout is in RED, do not set sail! Way too many guys with <60 man command, On PvE1 server, are trying to roam around in 200+ man ships! Scenario 1: Had one guy jump in a battle with me, claiming he wanted to cap the target ship (Navy Brig) -- he was in a Brig.. it wasn't until he rammed the target at the 3 minute mark, that I realized this FOOL was manning that Brig with 60 crew! the Navy brig just spanked him for his insolence, probably in less than 2 rounds, and took his ship, before I could get over to help him. Now I had no issue with taking down the NB myself .. but this fools cutters disallowed me from capping it, as they shot the crap out of the NB, even as I was capping him, and sunk him underneath me! Scenario 2: me and another friend were going to battle in a Surprise and a Renommee, to capture a Surprise, when this fool in an understrength Mercury shows up in battle with us, touting he wants to cap the surprise. We (my friend and I) .. just said ok ... and left the battle! (I can only presume he lost his Mercury!) Edited April 20, 2016 by yankyaeger 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirones Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Essex and BP sail very well undercrewed at 200 with reduced armament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ingerad Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Within limits undercrewing is fine. Not understanding the implications of undercrewing however will get you into trouble every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arvenski Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 (edited) What those fools weren't getting, it sounds like, was that boarding is dependent on how many crew you have, not how big your ship is. I mean, really: an undercrewed Mercury wanted to cap a Surprise? Yeah, I wouldn't expect that to work. At least, not unless he was able to stern-camp the Surprise and wear its crew down, and I'm guessing that's harder when your maneuverability and rate of fire are reduced by being undercrewed... Edited April 11, 2016 by Arvenski 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Certified2Fly Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Undercrewing 5th rates with only 200 crew works just fine. Much more effective to sail a Surprise slightly undercrewed than a Niagara at full crew. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prater Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 (edited) Undercrewing 5th rates with only 200 crew works just fine. Much more effective to sail a Surprise slightly undercrewed than a Niagara at full crew. I disagree with you there. I'd rather have 20 guns at optimum performance than 44 at sub optimal. Undercrewing is fine when you are sailing with a large group or fighting ai in a quiet area. It is not fine when sailing in a pvp hot zone alone. edit: Though, I guess last time I undercrewed, was before the crew changes when there were extreme penalties (2% reload penalty per missing % of crew). Now it is much easier to undercrew. Edited April 11, 2016 by Prater 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusterGut Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Guys ... c'mon ... figure it out ..... do NOT set sail with a ship you CANNOT fully man! If the crew part of your readout is in RED, do not set sail! Way too many guys with <60 man command, are trying to roam around in 200+ man ships! Scenario 1: Had one guy jump in a battle with me, claiming he wanted to cap the target ship (Navy Brig) -- he was in a Brig.. it wasn't until he rammed the target at the 3 minute mark, that I realized this FOOL was manning that Brig with 60 crew! the Navy brig just spanked him for his insolence, probably in less than 2 rounds, and took his ship, before I could get over to help him. Now I had no issue with taking down the NB myself .. but this fools cutters disallowed me from capping it, as they shot the crap out of the NB, even as I was capping him, and sunk him underneath me! Scenario 2: me and another friend were going to battle in a Surprise and a Renommee, to capture a Surprise, when this fool in an understrength Mercury shows up in battle with us, touting he wants to cap the surprise. We (my friend and I) .. just said ok ... and left the battle! (I can only presume he lost his Mercury!) Well currently I have a 240 quota of crew and I'm sailing a Frigate (280), nearly bagged a consti with it as well an I had 16 crew killed and about 20% damage. Who says its wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrdoomed Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Shhhhh i like running across large undermanned free ships wrapped in a bow just for me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeheil Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 I think undercrewing where only you take the risk is fine. At post captain, I can fully crew a Trinc and undercrew a Consti. If I choose to kill AI missions, then I take all the risk. If I agree with my clanmates to do some AI fleeting for XP, Gold, Ship Capping, then I check with them first its ok for me to undercrew. I never (other than emergency help) jump in with strangers and have an undercrewed ship as it shares the risk with them. I never undercrew in PvP (Port Battles etc) coz I need to SAIL and SHOOT and REPAIR stuff as well as repel boarders. So its not undercrewing on its own that is the 'bad thing' its where and with who you do it. In my Op. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spud Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 I think there is also the financial side of undercrewing, sometimes you can buy a higher level ship cheaper than the best ship you can sail at that time. For example, I am post captain. Trinco's sell for 250k and up, because they can't be bought from NPC's. Conni's can be bought for 155k, and if you are lucky you can get a teak wood with green speed or stifness, so not utter garbage. Conni's are also widely sailing around as AI, easy to cap. Conni's are very common and trinc's are less common, so when undercrewing a conni. You have more firepower than a trinc, more armour than a trinc, cheaper than a trinc, less likely to get capped as the value is lower than a trinc, gaining more XP and gold because of the higher firepower. I had a trinc, and sold it as I can comfortably sail a conni with less gold at risk, while also being sure that I am not putting my teammates at risk by sailing a severely undercrewed ship. I am prety sure this situation applies for other ranks too. I would never recommend sailing a ship with a very very low crew, I sail my conni at 77% and would never go below this figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eishen Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 (edited) Mission Running specifically is much easier with undercrew ships at some levels . In fact the Frigate and BellePoule are ships best used undermanned as Master and Commander (by 30 souls) than in his own Post Captain Level (where you can fully man eXes and Trinc) Surprise/Reno as Lieutnant Commander are also not bad proposition to undercrew , if you go mainly grinding missions. As said by Lander I am currently discovering grinding mission at Post Captain Level can be done efficiently with a Consti while you reserve your Trinco for PvP. Hint : Do not forget your Extra Hammocks. Edited April 12, 2016 by Eishen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galbatorix Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 (edited) The problem isn't undermanning, the problem are the players who doesn't now how many crew they carry and how many crew the ship needs. I have seen a rank 1 player with a navybrig. Edited April 12, 2016 by Galbatorix 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spud Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Mission Running specifically is much easier with undercrew ships at some levels . In fact the Frigate and BellePoule are ships best used undermanned as Master and Commander (by 30 souls) than in his own Post Captain Level (where you can fully man eXes and Trinc) Surprise/Reno as Lieutnant Commander are also not bad proposition to undercrew , if you go mainly grinding missions. As said by Lander I am currently discovering grinding mission at Post Captain Level can be done efficiently with a Consti while you reserve your Trinco for PvP. Hint : Do not forget your Extra Hammocks. I run my extra hammocks on the consti, these are common (or fine not sure) extra hammocks at 7 crew extra. I bought this live oak strenght build (and stifness i think) fine consti with 2/4 upgrades. I have put some fine planking on it and the thing has 8126 armour. Mind you a base 3rd rate has 7700 armour. Flag captain missions are very easy in this, and I could recommend it to anybody. Sailing and handling is about as good as the trinc in my experience, the only downside is that you can't afford to lose crew. If you pay 155k for a reasonable coni, you will have loads of fun and even if you sink it 4 times in a row, you can probably still buy a second one for less than you would buy a descent trinc. For the low levels sailing undercrewed to less than 50%, that is not ideal. But to be fair, who will bother ganking a Brig on a missions? If he can do missions more easily and level up faster, thats a good idea I wish I had back then. But entering a fight thinking you can take on the world because you have a "big" ship is not a good plan. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KuroNyra Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Used a constit with 79% of undercrew yesterday in PVP. Was fine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Used a constit with 79% of undercrew yesterday in PVP. Was fine. Did the same for a little while but was using full complement of 12 pounders and fine lightweight ropes for good measure. It would keep up with the job, but just. Not really advisable and as Prater points out, it can be fine in a group but if you happen to come across competent captains it will be long odds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KuroNyra Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Did the same for a little while but was using full complement of 12 pounders and fine lightweight ropes for good measure. It would keep up with the job, but just. Not really advisable and as Prater points out, it can be fine in a group but if you happen to come across competent captains it will be long odds. Well, to be fair. I did used it only in a PVP for a massive PVP session in the British seas. Yesterday evening actually, so I wasn't one of the biggest target, but still I was focused for a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leviathan Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 It is definitely much easier to undercrew and still have acceptable levels of performance than it was prior to the crew patch. However, if you are severely undercrewed as described by some in this thread it will catch up to you eventually. You can hide a lot of shortcomings in large fights, but against a competent captain or a 3v3 type fight you need to get everything you can out of your ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spud Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Did the same for a little while but was using full complement of 12 pounders and fine lightweight ropes for good measure. It would keep up with the job, but just. Not really advisable and as Prater points out, it can be fine in a group but if you happen to come across competent captains it will be long odds. Specificaly the consti has so much more armour and firepower compared to the next highest battle rated ship the trinc, that even undercrewed it is far better, its obviously also a 4th rate vs a 5th rate so difference should be higher. I would not say the same of a frig vs a surprise, i would much rather sail a fully crewed surprise in battle than my undercrewed frigate. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Specificaly the consti has so much more armour and firepower compared to the next highest battle rated ship the trinc, that even undercrewed it is far better, its obviously also a 4th rate vs a 5th rate so difference should be higher. I would not say the same of a frig vs a surprise, i would much rather sail a fully crewed surprise in battle than my undercrewed frigate. Indeed. Although I did the same with the Frigate but kept using the 12 pounders below until rank. The Surprise I always use it full 6 pounders, it has its own flair that way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maturin Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Tell it to the real Royal Navy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scubasteve04 Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Undercrewing is fine for missions and grinding. Those who under crew in PvP have not experienced real PvP. I have finished some pvp battles in a 3rd rate with less than 200 of the 650 crew remaining. People WILL de-crew you, especially if they see you under crewing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maturin Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Undercrewing is fine for missions and grinding. Those who under crew in PvP have not experienced real PvP. I have finished some pvp battles in a 3rd rate with less than 200 of the 650 crew remaining. People WILL de-crew you, especially if they see you under crewing. It's pretty sketchy in 1v1. But in a group fight where ships spend most of the time engaged on one broadside only, it is a disadvantage that is easily managed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prater Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Specificaly the consti has so much more armour and firepower compared to the next highest battle rated ship the trinc, that even undercrewed it is far better, its obviously also a 4th rate vs a 5th rate so difference should be higher. I would not say the same of a frig vs a surprise, i would much rather sail a fully crewed surprise in battle than my undercrewed frigate. I'd rather have the Trinc fully manned. A Trinc fully manned can easily kill a Coni at 350 crew. A Trinc fully manned has a good chance of killing a fully manned coni, of course it depends on what the ships are running and the captain, but I've had pretty good success with my Trinc. I've been in several battles lately where I, a Trinc, get the kill on 3rd rates, even though 3rd rates are also fighting the 3rd rates. I had a 2v2 battle recently vs 1 Trinc and 1 Coni, where I got the kill on both ships. The Trinc on my team had a different loadout, and did about half as much damage, and was barely hurt (I brawl, my teammate no so much). The Trinc can be a beast depending on how you use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fletch Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 (edited) Conni is a great ship under crewed at Post captain. Also for mission grinding its always better to take out a ship one level above your own, it tanks the mission better and still gives decent firepower. Edited April 12, 2016 by Edward the Black 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Beard Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Undercrewing works fine. Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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