surfimp Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 (edited) The changes to teleport are steps in the right direction, but it's still not going to entirely remove the abuse of that mechanic for low risk trading. Using the trader tool, it's quite easy to get precise distance to ports, all you need to know is which port you want to TP to, then sail in the open ocean to a spot where it (or a similar compatible friendly port) is simply nearer than any undesired ports as shown in the trader tool. Then you click the TP button and voila, you're safe in the harbor, cutting out (potentially) a significant part of the journey. This means the only reliable places to capture traders will be at origin ports, destination ports will be much trickier as it won't take long for people to figure the above out and how to maximally exploit it. Teleport just has to be gone, period. Edited June 8, 2017 by Sansón Carrasco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhammer500 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 (edited) 25 minutes ago, admin said: You still have to master the lower level ships, but it is a bit easier now. I dont understand the first rates tree tbh, there is no order for them its mainly in terms of which people prefer so i think they all should be the end. Makes no sense to get a Vic to 3 slots then a Ocean then a Santi due to the vast amounts needed to craft them no one will do that. Edited June 8, 2017 by ironhammer500 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niels Terkildsen Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 2 minutes ago, Sansón Carrasco said: The changes to teleport are steps in the right direction, but it's still not going to entirely remove the abuse of that mechanic for low risk trading. Using the trader tool, it's quite easy to get precise distance to ports, all you need to know is which port you want to TP to, then sail in the open ocean to a spot where it (or a similar compatible friendly port) is simply nearer than any undesired ports as shown in the trader tool. Then you click the TP button and voila, you're safe in the harbor, cutting out (potentially) a significant part of the journey. This means the only reliable places to capture traders will be at origin ports, destination ports will be much trickier as it won't take long for people to figure the above out and how to maximally exploit it. Teleport just has to be gone, period. Or just disallow teleporting with anything in the cargo hold. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfimp Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Just now, Niels Terkildsen said: Or just disallow teleporting with anything in the cargo hold. If teleporting has to be kept for some reason - and I'm not at all convinced that it does - then it should send the ship back to the port it last departed from. Without the means to transfer goods in a battle instance, this would completely alleviate the possibility of abusing teleport to get a (risk) free ride somewhere. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werewolf Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 2 hours ago, Gysendorf said: And btw when do you fix the Login failed with the SteamAPI which is since MEST 09:30? Dont you want players on your servers? Depends. When do you stop whining? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niels Terkildsen Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 8 minutes ago, Sansón Carrasco said: If teleporting has to be kept for some reason - and I'm not at all convinced that it does - then it should send the ship back to the port it last departed from. The problem with that is that it's too useful (for other purposes than trade): You can sail out into enemy territory, fight battles, then sail away from activity and teleport home without "risking" the return journey. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfimp Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Just now, Niels Terkildsen said: The problem with that is that it's too useful (for other purposes than trade): You can sail out into enemy territory, fight battles, then sail away from activity and teleport home without "risking" the return journey. I agree. Teleport must go if this game's promise of a player-driven economy and an open world primarily populated by player vessels is to be realized. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Texas Sir Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 18 minutes ago, ironhammer500 said: I dont understand the first rates tree tbh, there i no order for them its mainly in terms of which people prefer so i think they all should be the end. Makes no sense to get a Vic to 3 slots then a Ocean then a Santi due to the vast amounts needed to craft them no one will do that. If your in a clan just trade the ships. That is what most of us been doing with the light ships. I'm sure we will prob do the same with the bigger ones. Trade it, go fleet grinding to unlock slots and than give it back to the owner or for the smaller ships to some one that hasn't unlocked that ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niels Terkildsen Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 (edited) I agree. Teleport must go if this game's promise of a player-driven economy and an open world primarily populated by player vessels is to be realized. The only reason for the teleport to exist is that you may get stuck - bugs do happen. I think teleporting to the nearest deep water port providing that your hold is empty would be a good solution. I can't see how that could be abused for any purposes. Edited June 8, 2017 by Niels Terkildsen 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhammer500 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Just now, Sir Texas Sir said: If your in a clan just trade the ships. That is what most of us been doing with the light ships. I'm sure we will prob do the same with the bigger ones. Trade it, go fleet grinding to unlock slots and than give it back to the owner or for the smaller ships to some one that hasn't unlocked that ship. Trading doesnt work, seems the exp is locked to your captain not the ship, so if it sunk you keep ur exp progress so no big deal but losing a 1st rate is a major deal and people tend to pick the best one not work their way up due to the cost. Out of all of them which do you pick first? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Texas Sir Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Just now, ironhammer500 said: Trading doesnt work, seems the exp is locked to your captain not the ship, so if it sunk you keep ur exp progress so no big deal but losing a 1st rate is a major deal and people tend to pick the best one not work their way up due to the cost. Out of all of them which do you pick first? No I'm saying I unlock a ship and I give it to you to unlock. Than when you get your 3 slots you give it back to me. Now that ship is unlocked for you and you can move on to the next ship in the tree. That way you don't have to buy and craft a new ship. The clan just passed one ship around so every one can unlock there ship knowlege instead of having 25 pickles you just use one and trade it around clan members. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhammer500 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 2 minutes ago, Hodo said: No he is talking about trading the ships so you dont have to buy a dozen ships you dont need. Hmm still think its a waste of time imo, just let us grind the xp on a single ship type or Name then make us go up a tree. 3 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said: No I'm saying I unlock a ship and I give it to you to unlock. Than when you get your 3 slots you give it back to me. Now that ship is unlocked for you and you can move on to the next ship in the tree. That way you don't have to buy and craft a new ship. The clan just passed one ship around so every one can unlock there ship knowlege instead of having 25 pickles you just use one and trade it around clan members. Yea but as the ship gets higher and higher the chance someone wants to pass around a 1st rate or 2nd rate becomes pretty low. Also why should i grind grind and grind exp in one little ship when i spend all the time and effort to make a bigger one? Seems backwards Hey there you made ur big ships well done, now u need to spend months in small ships in order to unlock slots for that big ship.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charognard666 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 You know, you can be effective without a ship and all slots unlocked Skill isn't all about some % here and here... there is nothing that forces you to use a ship until you have unlock all slots.. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niels Terkildsen Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 11 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said: No I'm saying I unlock a ship and I give it to you to unlock. Than when you get your 3 slots you give it back to me. Now that ship is unlocked for you and you can move on to the next ship in the tree. That way you don't have to buy and craft a new ship. The clan just passed one ship around so every one can unlock there ship knowlege instead of having 25 pickles you just use one and trade it around clan members. This works fine for big clans, but for small groups or solo players this isn't quite that easy and requires you to invest a lot more time and resources into building/acquiring ships that you don't really want to sail, but that you need because of this arbitrary ship knowledge tree. Just one more feature to add to the many that favour the big clans... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhammer500 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 21 minutes ago, Hodo said: I am a solo player and I have done just fine on the ship grind, I have the Brig completely unlocked and the Navy brig. I havent bothered with anything bigger because I just dont sail them. Yea but if you sail 1st rates then its a long ass grind which tbh is pointless and boring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hiclipucli Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 thx you CUT BACK my hard work profit every hotfix... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhammer500 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Just now, Hodo said: Not disagreeing with you. But that is the price you have to pay to play with those floating billboards. We could just scrap the need to grind exp and have a time based skill system like Eve online, ok people might rage pretty hard if the devs put a block on being able to sail a 1st rate like say train for 365 days cause u need X skill and Y Skill and Z skill before u can train 1st rate skill. Why cant we simply train say 1 day for first slot, 1 week for 2nd, 2 weeks for 3rd, 1 month for fourth and idk 2 months for 5th? Cause atm the contant grind grind grind for exp seems to make it take soo much longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiithnaras Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 (edited) 8 hours ago, admin said: knowledge slots changes I will express my appreciation here that this is a step in the right direction. However, I still don't feel that this is an ideal solution. Rather than simply rehash what I've written previously, I went and made a quaint little table that illustrates exactly what I've been harping on about. This system will allow players to sail the ships within the classes that they want to without feeling pressured to grind their way up from the bottom, but it will still maintain a steep XP cost to fully-unlocking a ship class and make mastery of said class something of a major accomplishment. Comparing Player Rank XP to my proposal, this would scale with the player progression nicely - players would almost have the third Sloop slot unlocked when they have enough Leadership to command Brigs, have the first 2 or 3 slots on Brigs when they're ready to move on to Light Frigates (depending on whether or not they care about the Cerb), have finished the 3rd and be partway to the 4th slot on Light Frigates when they reach Rank 7 and are ready for Heavy Frigates, and so on. Using this system, you could also tie Trader ships into the same ship class pools, giving them a cap of 5 slots as well (LGV would clearly go into the Light Frigates, Indiaman would either be a Heavy Frigate or Super Frigate type). You like? 8 hours ago, admin said: Hull and Rig repairs now share cooldown to provide more depth in combat tactics Not sure this is the best idea (will still check it out and see how it plays). I might suggest instead locking out other repair options (other than Urgent repair) while the crew is in the process of conducting a repair, so while they would be on separate cooldowns, repairs could only be conducted on sails or hull at a given moment, not both. Big props on the rest of the fixes and changes, though! Edited June 8, 2017 by Kiithnaras Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pada Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 (edited) Can you please tell us if you still work on signaling. Or did you gave up on that? I'm running with 4 perks atm waiting for it to come back. Edit: And please reduce the repair kit used to repair in open world. I'm a bit damaged on one side and it takes 3/4 of of my 50 hull reps i carry and have to sail back to port to get more. They should last way longer. It's just annoying to be forced to sail for 40 min until you are ready again to pvp after every fight. Edited June 8, 2017 by Pada 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greybuscat Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 3 hours ago, Liquicity said: Why would you ever attack a freaking cutter? 1) its boring as hell 2) you dont get anything out of it To be a bastard. Are you seriously trying to pretend griefing doesn't exist in online games? Why raid the starting areas in World of Warcraft? Why blow up someone's hard work in Minecraft? Why camp spawn points in old FPS games? First change was good, but we need to be on the lookout for other ways they can be exploited or used to exploit others. 3 hours ago, Liquicity said: How can you "grief" a player by sinking a ship he can just replace for free? I dont think any players with a bit of game experience even bother about cutters. I'm trying not to be a jerk here, but do you not value your own time? Even if you have an infinite supply of it, lost time means lost gold and stalled progress. And I think you're being incredibly short-sighted with your assumptions about what players will or will not do to noobs. Even if it isn't a problem now, which I doubt we can fairly judge based on anecdotal evidence, what about a year from now? What if the amount of players rapidly inflates on final release, from new purchases and returning old-timers? Shouldn't we be planning for that game? ******************************************************************************* The Basic Cutter needs to be viable for the first couple of hours, needs to not be a griefing magnet, and needs to not be a tool for exploitation by experience players that ruin PBs, set-piece battles, etc. All three of these are equally true and equally can ruin the game for someone. Don't be the person that only cares about the parts that can affect you. /self-righteousness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liq Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 4 minutes ago, greybuscat said: I'm trying not to be a jerk here, but do you not value your own time? Even if you have an infinite supply of it, lost time means lost gold and stalled progress. But you're wasting your time aswell? I never understood the mentality of 'Haha I'm wasting your time right here", because its not only the prey's time. I know there are some douchebags killing bambies in the starter gear over and over again, not much you can do about it Unless there was some sort of mechanic which let you have a "noob-time" for a week (starting from when you bought the game) or something in which you're not attackable by other players, as long as you're in the cutter. May still be exploitable tho 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elite92 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 (edited) nvm. Edited June 8, 2017 by elite92 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Peckington Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 (edited) 7 hours ago, admin said: Basic cutter is now a basic pve farming ship. It will not be able to attack players and join pvp battles and outlaw battles (battles originated against the player) as reinforcement. It will still be pulled into combat instance if he is in the pull circle. Interesting. All in all, it looks good. P.S. Thanks for the new set of Forged Papers! Edited June 8, 2017 by Arthur Peckington Spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remus Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 2 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said: If your in a clan just trade the ships. That is what most of us been doing with the light ships. I'm sure we will prob do the same with the bigger ones. Trade it, go fleet grinding to unlock slots and than give it back to the owner or for the smaller ships to some one that hasn't unlocked that ship. Works for solos too. I've just sold my Privateer by listing it in the shop. I pity the next guy: fir and crew space, it's horrible, but at least they'll get it cheap. At least from now on all my grind ships I can make myself. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrdoomed Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 2 hours ago, Sansón Carrasco said: I agree. Teleport must go if this game's promise of a player-driven economy and an open world primarily populated by player vessels is to be realized. A simple 2 or 3 hour cooldown would go miles in balancing everything from the econ, to having REAL front lines and safe rear areas , to minimizing revenge ganks or zerg rushes to capture or raid. It would also let players who want slower pace pve could find a noce quiet far off place and not worry about people just teleporting from port to port popping out for a peek at a free kill. As long as you can mangage your outposts from a single place then there is zero excuse to need constant teleports unless you are literally just bouncing from gank to gank or peekaboo stalking easy kills. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts