The Overwhelming Inbalance on PvP1:

[Yar Matey]

Maybe this is just anecdotal evidence, but it appears to me that there is a very severe imbalance that has developed between the 2 warring alliances.  I speak of the American/British/Dutch alliance (and possibly Pirates, I have seen British screening for pirates at port battles) vs the Danish/Swedish/French/Spanish alliance.  I will refer to them as the ABD alliance vs DSFS alliance respectively.   

At the port battle at Castres the screening fleets of the DSFS Alliance faced an overwhelming amount of ABD's and grossly outnumbered the DSFS's.  From my calculations at this port battle it appears that the ABD alliance was able to field 75 ships that I can count.  There were 2 screening battles and the port battle which was completely full of ABD's and both of these battles had ~1/2 or less the amount of players from the DSFS alliance, and I believe that most of the French 1st rate port battle fleet got pulled into another battle with god knows how many ABD's in that one.  

Also, I have noticed that Sweden had a few players (appears to be a whole clan) switch to the British Nation along with a few others (not in this specific clan switch to the ABD's).  This is on top of LV and however many pirates he has pulled into the British nation along with the large influx of American players, and now the "quitting" Danish (which I have only heard rumors of).  I guess everyone wants to be on the wining side and no one wants to be the loser right?

Like I said, this is only anecdotal evidence, but if what is happening what I think is happening, there will be a collapse of the DSFS simply by the overwhelming numbers on the ABDs side.  

Now I am not blaming anyone or here to sling mud, I am simply telling you my observation, and I do not think such a player inbalance is good for the long term health of this game.

Discuss.

Edited January 30, 2017 by Yar Matey

[SirSamuelHood]

I believe that the ROE concerning screening port battles needs to be severely reworked. As many other have said, if instead of 1/5 your target's BR needed to tag, that went up to 4/5 or 3/4 near port battles, main battle fleets would no longer be able to be easily pulled into battles by groups of frigates.

 

I do not mind being pulled into a screening battle if it's with ships of the line and I'm still going to get a good fight. I could care less about the port, I want to get some smashing done. What needs to go is 25 first rates being pulled in by a bunch of frigates who then do naught but kite and shoot sails.

 

What happened today at Castries to the French, and yesterday to us at Orinoco, should not be able to happen as easily as it does at present. 

[Pelennor]

This topic has been discussed for months and nothing has been done. It is shocking to see how many good players left DSFS and NA due to unbalance... and we got the exact same situation on PvP2 !

If someone can explain me the developers point of view to justify their inaction, I would be grateful.

[Potemkin]

15 minutes ago, Pelennor said:

This topic has been discussed for months and nothing has been done. It is shocking to see how many good players left DSFS and NA due to unbalance... and we got the exact same situation on PvP2 !

If someone can explain me the developers point of view to justify their inaction, I would be grateful.

Not much anyone can do about it when its the player's own choice. It sucks but its going to happen and has been happening and will continue to do so untill there are only a few playable nations and when that happens there wont be too many people left to gloat to.

[Sir Texas Sir]

Regions need to reset along with alliance after a set time to start the map over again.  The will still prob fall back into the same alliances, but than it wouldn't be so stale as they have to regroup over and over.   

[Pelennor]

For sure you can introduce mecanics to balance PBs, lot of suggestions were made on this forum.

[Leku]

Why you want to balance every stuff in this game?

It`s damn sandbox FFS !!!!!!!!

[Kloothommel]

This is where te player attrition tactics came to hurt the dsfs alliance most. Even the "hard core" is slowly being demotivated by a lot of things. massive screening, attacks at very inconvenient times (to call it something else for a change), etcetera.

If a hard core of RVR players gets demotivated, what do you think has already happened to a lot more casuals?

Especially with a large coordinated attack like that. I personally think/guesstimate that if our alliance can't even come close to those numbers.

Like I said, sandbox or not, one half of the sandbox is a lot emptier than the other one. And if the other kids don't  have anybody to play with, they will also move to a different sandbox, leaving as well.

It's a fact that this game, if played too hardcore vs more casual, the hardcore will drive away the more casual, as they find they don't have the time to invest to compensate for the enemy offensives.

Edited January 30, 2017 by Kloothommel

[Yar Matey]

23 minutes ago, Leku said:

Why you want to balance every stuff in this game?

It`s damn sandbox FFS !!!!!!!!

Firstly, this is not a sandbox game.  I do not know where people get this BS idea in their head.  Secondly, the ADS alliance has been hitting the DSFS alliance hard, especially our strong hull regions.  If we lose our strong hull regions, then it is GG and we lose because everyone knows that anything less than strong hull is inferior for port battles.  

The recent problems with this game are both developer caused and player caused.  The regional bonuses are broken and severely imbalanced and on top of this, your nation or ally needs to own the region to build PB ships and we have a massive player imbalance with lopsided sides.  Eventually the DSFS will collapse and I do not think it is good for the game in general.

under the old system the collapse of a nation was not too terrible because a dedicated player group could rebuild a nation.  However, under the new game mechanics this impossible due to the regiononal trims, and scarce recourses.

Edited January 30, 2017 by Yar Matey

[Fletch]

You cant balance anything in a game where people freely switch nations. Yet again players crying to the devs to fix something for them. It was players crying to the devs to fix diplomacy that created the big alliances because you were all crying about rogue clans.  Stop expecting the devs to fix every single disadvantage for you and start thinking of new tactics and game plans to achieve results. Where were the Spanish last night? I didn't see any yet they are your allies, is it the other tides fault because some of your allies don't show up and the others did?

[saintjacktar]

It really tickles me to see these posts, when less than 12 months ago the US was on the brink (by a single clan) by the Pirates aided by the DSFS, Britain was under siege and the Dutch were in a never ending state of war for the Northern Coast of South America and nobody said anything and now the tables have turned and its a bloody soap opera in forums. The map wipe happened and what blossomed from the ashes of the "Pirate 2nd Coming" was a unified US nation and a united coalition that cooperates, communicates and mobilizes effectively to combat the multitude of enemies and even against questionable tactics, abuse of "exploits" #testing and strategic land grabs. we have managed to come out victorious. ..... so gg I suppose, better luck next map wipe.

regards,

[Kloothommel]

The next map wipe will not change much I am afraid.

We need to figure out how to make the game survive this lean period.

Edited January 30, 2017 by Kloothommel

[Leku]

31 minutes ago, Kloothommel said:

This is where te player attrition tactics came to hurt the dsfs alliance most. Even the "hard core" is slowly being demotivated by a lot of things. massive screening, attacks at very inconvenient times (to call it something else for a change), etcetera.

If a hard core of RVR players gets demotivated, what do you think has already happened to a lot more casuals?

Especially with a large coordinated attack like that. I personally think/guesstimate that if our alliance can't even come close to those numbers.

Like I said, sandbox or not, one half of the sandbox is a lot emptier than the other one. And if the other kids don't  have anybody to play with, they will also move to a different sandbox, leaving as well.

It's a fact that this game, if played too hardcore vs more casual, the hardcore will drive away the more casual, as they find they don't have the time to invest to compensate for the enemy offensives.

You guys and few others from various factions plays this alpha like finished game. Instead of having fun and letting things flow, you whine when something doesnt goes your way.

You act like addicted maniacs that shows up few times in a row during night for stupid port battle that matters NONE. And you blame others for your own addiction and attrition.

Seriously whats wrong with you people? You act like kids that plays multiplayer MMO sandbox game for the first time. If so i suggest you to check what it means before you actually buy another game like this.

There are certain people in my nation that for example sits on amazing amount of gold and resources, and they still keeps hoarding them even more. I kindly ask why?
If that brings them joy? Ok. I can understand that.

But why instead of doing pointless stuff ( well besides having fun for some - there are such weirdos ) such people dont try to pvp a bit more? I wonder.

20 minutes ago, Yar Matey said:

Firstly, this is not a sandbox game.  I do not know where people get this BS idea in their head.  Secondly, the ADS alliance has been hitting the DSFS alliance hard, especially our strong hull regions.  If we lose our strong hull regions, then it is GG and we lose because everyone knows that anything less than strong hull is inferior for port battles.  

The recent problems with this game are both developer caused and player caused.  The regional bonuses are broken and severely imbalanced and on top of this, your nation or ally needs to own the region to build PB ships and we have a massive player imbalance with lopsided sides.  Eventually the DSFS will collapse and I do not think it is good for the game in general.

under the same old system the collapse of a nation was not too terrible because a dedicated player group could rebuild a nation.  However, under the new game mechanics this impossible due to the regiononal trims, and scarce recourses.

Well devs removed sandbox from genre at steam. But still check about game on steam.

Quote

ABOUT THIS GAME

Naval action - open world multiplayer sandbox

Naval Action is an exciting, realistic, and beautifully detailed naval combat game immersing players into the experience of the most beautiful period of naval history - when sailing ships ruled the seas.

Freedom – Build ships, trade, sink enemies of your nation. You can attack anyone almost everywhere. Remember that every action could have consequences. So don't attack everyone - or you will become a pirate. Conquer almost every port in the Caribbean, but remember! other adventurous captains will try to ruin your plans.

When i bought this game arround end of the march 2016 it was advertised as mmo, open world, sandbox. Not indie stuff. I knewed that i`m buying game that is in development and certain things may happen. I dont burn myself to play this game like it`s realeased ( something that danes for example did ) because its wrong. Instead when i have free few hours and i can spent them playing cpu games. Reporting stuff here and there, suggesting this and that.

You guys love to generalize a lot.

First you had no objections when you were hitting Dutch before port reset. You said you were looking for fair fights ( danes ), done it by mistake ( spaniards ), and didnt want to end like this ( french ). Yet it didnt stop you from 2 porting us. It didnt stop you to pull multiple flags, and attack from 3-4 sides when you knewed we cant handle all of you same time. It didnt stop you from trading flags which made any possibility to intercept flag carrier null. It didnt stop your alliance to set 2-4 AM timers on our prime ports Fort Zoutman and Fort Oranje to block us in capital only.

After port reset you resisted when we asked nicely to stop abusing certain broken mechanics like for example warsupply bombing. We were saying that it`ll only lead to hatred, disgust, generaly bad emotions, and push our playerbase back. You didnt care about it then.

You guys use double standards a lot. It`s clearly visible.

Now enjoy being crushed. If thats make you stop game? So be it. We`ll taste conquering capital on danes. We`ll test that mechanics and see what happends. We`ll conquer your strong hull regions. You can take them back. You dont have stocked ships? Your problem mates. Enjoy fighting for it back.

When we`ll crush and stomp you we`ll start looking for changes and switching sides. And how to rebalance stuff.

Till then o7

[Chimera]

It's the same as it was before the wipe just the other way round. One group/alliance drops a little in activity and starts to loose a bit of ground, more people leave, they loose more ground and so on. 

[Guest]

No shit it's unhealthy and is going to irrepairably wreck conquest, it is naive that people have been expecting anything else once 1/4 of the eastern alliance up and left and when people saw no point in fighting at EU primetime if theyre just gonna lose ports at US primetime anyways (thats why I stopped doing PBs at least). If you target player attrition you get player attrition, now I'd be more than happy to fold and let the other kids play with themselves - while they pretend that it was their uncanny cooperation and organization that had them win 

As for the sandbox issue, even for a sandbox there are very few options left for people at such an event that there might be in other sandbox games.

- We don't have a humongous map where you can move to the other side of it when things are looking bad elsewhere.

- We don't have any areas that are separate for conquest that people can retreat to in the meantime (e.g. high-sec), only capitals and freetowns that let you play as a rover.

- The painless switching to the pirate faction was removed.

- We don't have any easy server switching for people to hop onto another one when they're sick of this one - now that is an issue that one of the proponents against globalism makes - that even if we run global servers it might still be a bad idea to only have a single server because when that one fails there's nowhere else for people to go.

Edited January 30, 2017 by Guest

[Leku]

4 minutes ago, rediii said:

The problem is that you guys don't stomp us with gameplay and better portbattlefleets or just by winning portbattles. You guys stomp us with boredom (kiting portbattlesfleets, which both sides do i guess because it's a valid tactic atm) and the flips at non EU primetimes. That has realy hit our morale and many don't give a shit anymore. Also the mighty screening is a factor but again, it's a valid tactic atm.

Pampatar, La vega, Savannah and Santo Domingo were not lost because of a good portbattles, they were lost because we had not the possibility to field enough players.

Thats exactly what your alliance done before port reset. Exactly that.

Enjoy playing like this. Instead of abusing broken mechanics, we`ll use mechanics against you.

[saintjacktar]

33 minutes ago, Kloothommel said:

The next map wipe will not change much I am afraid.

We need to figure out how to make the game survive this lean period.

The US extended it's olive branch in the form of the diplomatic parley and your representatives were unable to have, honest, fair and civilized dialogue. We were under no obligation to do so, but in the interest of preserving the game and protecting our player base as well as yours we opened the floor to your diplomats. Some ideas were put forward but I was forced today to describe the parlay to a US member who was unable to attend as "trying to pick the corn from a turd" so I don't see why we should discuss this further the issue is yours, not ours and therefore the solution should be solved by the hierarchies within your alliance.

regards, 

[Guest]

Just now, Leku said:

Thats exactly what your alliance done before port reset. Exactly that.

Enjoy playing like this. Instead of abusing broken mechanics, we`ll use mechanics against you.

Just like every other nation even before the Dutch got hammered, no need to pretend that it has only affected your side. Do you not think the French thought exactly that when the Dutch advance that brought them to 2 ports was made when a bug meant that port timers couldnt be set?

[Kloothommel]

The "but your side did it too" agruement is a bit empty as almost everybody has suffered this.

[Leku]

2 minutes ago, Aegir said:

Just like every other nation even before the Dutch got hammered, no need to pretend that it has only affected your side. Do you not think the French thought exactly that when the Dutch advance that brought them to 2 ports was made when a bug meant that port timers couldnt be set?

Same bug didnt allow us to put timers on same ports.
We stoped at castrice and moved back.

Whole war we were kindly asking france to stop this war and allow danes&swedes to handle it by themselves. They refused.

I dont remember any of you coming to dutch when we had 5+ ports and offering anything. I dont remember you offering us peace at any moment. I dont remember us trading flags to hide flag carriers. I dont remember us setting timers at 2-4 AM.

Dont you dare comparing this two situations. They look similar on paper only. But in reality they are totaly different.

[Kloothommel]

True. Dutch were one ported knowing the map reset was around the corner. Just like the Danes were one ported the reset before that. Your point?

[Guest]

Just now, Leku said:

Same bug didnt allow us to put timers on same ports.
We stoped at castrice and moved back.

Whole war we were kindly asking france to stop this war and allow danes&swedes to handle it by themselves. They refused.

I dont remember any of you coming to dutch when we had 5+ ports and offering anything. I dont remember you offering us peace at any moment. I dont remember us trading flags to hide flag carriers. I dont remember us setting timers at 2-4 AM.

Dont you dare comparing this two situations. They look similar on paper only. But in reality they are totaly different.

So what if it affected both, so does everything else. Is it excusable then because you guys "could've traded flags too"? Is it excusable then because you guys "could've put timers at 2-4am too"?

No one cares about what was offered, because losing through scummy methods does not make people even slightly amenable to diplomatic solutions.

Now do you want to go on with this pointless "he did this, we did that" trend and bring in the Spanish one-porting too? And the Swedes when fighting the Danes + Dutch too?

[Leku]

17 minutes ago, Kloothommel said:

True. Dutch were one ported knowing the map reset was around the corner. Just like the Danes were one ported the reset before that. Your point?

None. Deal with it. No idea how Danes got one ported but yours campaing @ dutch were very low. Enjoy paying back.

12 minutes ago, Aegir said:

So what if it affected both, so does everything else. Is it excusable then because you guys "could've traded flags too"? Is it excusable then because you guys "could've put timers at 2-4am too"?

No one cares about what was offered, because losing through scummy methods does not make people even slightly amenable to diplomatic solutions.

Now do you want to go on with this pointless "he did this, we did that" trend and bring in the Spanish one-porting too? And the Swedes when fighting the Danes + Dutch too?

What if affected both? Well they could easly take it back as we couldnt set port timers. We were kindly asking them to withdraw which they refused. I didnt saw ANY scum method in dutch campaigns since i started playing at end of the march. If anything crusade on pirates was the closest one, which i can accept as scummy.

I dont know how spain or swedes or danes get one ported. Since im playing dutch nation plays properly and gently. We refuse to use low tactics. We always had others nations communities in mind and we disengaged before we could crush enemy and hurt them. (pirates excluded)

Now you guys are crying because you are starting to loose. I would understand if all of your nations got pushed back to 1 regions only, but now with alliance mechanics you still have plenty of room to play safe, farm shit, and whatever you want to do in your free time.

For me these situations are totally different.

[Cmdr RideZ]

DSFS controls the closest copper/silver regions for pirates.  (That are deep water, most are not really interested from shallow waters at all)  Pirates cannot have allies, and do not have copper nor silver region in their control.  Could you imagine a reason why pirates would be interested to help ABD alliance?  Who can you blame from the current situation?

Pirates seem to be really bad in port battles anyway.  So not a big thing.  I have also understood that pirates are attacking every nation pretty equally atm.

[monk33y]

Or for example when the pirates were pushed back to a few ports. Being attacked by all nation's at the same time! I'm guessing you have forgotten all  the nation's launching flags against the last remaining pirate ports. Throughout the Attack window! I didnt see any Danes/Spanish etc (or any nationals for that matter) if I remember correctly certain Danes users said they would not be happy until the rats were forced from the game!

Now us ex pirates have long memories, now the alliance we are part of are willing to see the Danes/ Dutch etc crushed and beaten from the game, you are in uproar!

It's not fair etc!!! 

The Dutch/danes / all nationals have very selective memories. Either you play on a level playing field or you don't!!! This it's #testing (exploiting) when you win, but when you loose you call for a fair and level playing field. 

I hate auto correct on phones it is a pain in the arse!

Edited January 30, 2017 by monk33y