A plead to all the player base: how toxicity can ruin a game and it's community for good

[ObiQuiet]

Appropos:

http://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2016/03/29/472207613/when-you-become-the-person-you-hate-on-the-internet

[Quineloe]

Harassment, racism, threats should not be tolerated, but normal trash talk should IMHO...

 

Its one thing to harass something personally, its another to call them a garbage player and call them out of their lack of skillz.

 

Trash talk is fun to me, there is a line, and the devs I'm sure will set it, I just hopes its not to hardcore to limit normal trash talking is all i'm saying.

You remind me of this guy

 

 

Yes it's allowed

 

no, it's not needed

 

and no, people aren't "pussies, liberals, immature" or whatever for disagreeing with you on this.

Edited March 29, 2016 by Quineloe

[Blood Eagle]

Its always needed, some people just want to watch the world burn....

[Quineloe]

You actually need the abuse and the toxicity?

Assuming you end up chat banned, and you fight in a port battle where the other 49 players would just go GL HF GG all battle long, with no one shouting any sort of insult or profanity at the other side, and you can't do anything about it, what would happen? Would you tear yourself up like Rumpelstiltskin?

[Blood Eagle]

You actually need the abuse and the toxicity?

Assuming you end up chat banned, and you fight in a port battle where the other 49 players would just go GL HF GG all battle long, with no one shouting any sort of insult or profanity at the other side, and you can't do anything about it, what would happen? Would you tear yourself up like Rumpelstiltskin?

 

 

Actually I don't insult anyone, I just enjoy reading others that do... I'm sorry if this offends you..... meso sorry.....

 

#SORRY

Edited March 29, 2016 by Dirtydiggler

[Prater]

So when in USA chat you say Tattered Flags - Flags without the L, that isn't an insult? 

[Quineloe]

You think you are offending?

I am just very curious what it's like to be dependent on internet drama and trash talking.

[Slamz]

Appropos:

http://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2016/03/29/472207613/when-you-become-the-person-you-hate-on-the-internet

 

The one problem I find with this sort of thing is that some people's definition of trolling is too broad. Essentially anything you to do them that they don't like is trolling and makes you a bad person. (There were several pirates who thought we were very bad people for using chainshot on them. Apparently that was against some kind of rule.)

 

I prefer more the golden rule: I will do unto you as I expect you to do unto me, which in video games, generally means within-the-rules-but-otherwise-unbounded murder, and smacktalk within reasonable constraints (for some values of "reasonable").

 

Like I think some people have the idea that I gank them but then they gank me and are all like, "OH, HOW'S IT FEEL NOW", as if I was trolling them before and really didn't expect it to happen to me. Well it actually feels like totally expected normal gameplay to me and something I should have been watching out better for, thanks for asking. The threat of the gank literally makes this game more interesting and fun for me. I would be sad if nobody ever tried to gank me. It would take all the thrill out of running that Trader Snow full of iron around.

 

One man's trolling is just another man's totally normal gameplay.

[Blood Eagle]

So when in USA chat you say Tattered Flags - Flags without the L, that isn't an insult? 

 

That got me chat banned, I have reformed my ways, SORRY, I prefer tattered tots now

Edited March 29, 2016 by Dirtydiggler

[Jeheil]

In all things balance. A bit of banter too and fro with the odd barb shouldn't get anyone in trouble.

 

But there is a line, extreme racism (* see note), bigotry, sexism, long term personal abuse (bullying), extreme profanity.

 

Now one mans insult is another mans 'joke'. I was born in the North of England and live in Australia....'Good morning you pommie b@sterd' is a common greeting and one that shows great affection....to a casual onlooker...who is looking to find offence...it is racist and contains traces of profanity.

 

However for 90% of us, 90% of the time, we all 'know' when a line is crossed.

 

The dev's seem to have a fairly hard line against abuse and harassment and I cheer for that (assuming it is levelled appropriately).

 

So as a community, when you first see a little bit of toxic...just pipe up with a "calm down mate, no need to get xxxx, happy sailing sir" or some such defusing statement. Enough of us do that and the general 'toxicity' level shouldn't get to high.

 

I almost always have clan/brit chat open as part of 'not getting killed by enemy fleets' and I have rarely seen anything in there that made be think 'ouch'....

 

* Note : Important - From approx. 1066 to 1880 it was, pretty much by law, impossible to be racist (as a Brit) to the French. This rule should be maintained...predominantly due to the French being....well French.

[ObiQuiet]

The one problem I find with this sort of thing is that some people's definition of trolling is too broad. Essentially anything you to do them that they don't like is trolling and makes you a bad person. (There were several pirates who thought we were very bad people for using chainshot on them. Apparently that was against some kind of rule.)

Yep, that's one problem: people who put 100% of the responsibility on the source of the offense. The other is those people who insist that the responsibility lies 100% with the recipient, and believe that the source has zero no obligation to be considerate.

[Ratline]

As the guy in red n black posting above shows, some people just get off on thinking they offend others. It seems to be beyond them to grasp that, in general, folks are not offended. We just don't see why we should put up with that crap.

[Steelfury]

There's always going to be a few bad eggs in a community, but the thing is not to let that attitude spread, I've been in quite a few port battles with the Pirates & Danes where we've been bantering back and forth for half the battle, and you know what? I look forward to these battles and enjoy playing against these guys. It's the ones where I offer a 'gg' after a battle & all they can do is insult me or don't reply - manners cost nothing people, and if you can't be an adult about a game then you're in the wrong game.

[Billy Ruffin]

There's always going to be a few bad eggs in a community, but the thing is not to let that attitude spread, I've been in quite a few port battles with the Pirates & Danes where we've been bantering back and forth for half the battle, and you know what? I look forward to these battles and enjoy playing against these guys. It's the ones where I offer a 'gg' after a battle & all they can do is insult me or don't reply - manners cost nothing people, and if you can't be an adult about a game then you're in the wrong game.

This is where it comes all apart for me. Being nearly 63 I haven't got a clue what "gg" would mean if you messaged me, or the x's that you see, or a whole load of other acronyms that seems to be a part of messaging nowdays! I'd be happy with a smiley or winking face   

[Taralin Snow]

"gg" typically means "good game".  you also see this as "gf" (good fight) or "o7" (this represents a picture of a person saluting, o is their head and 7 is their arm and hand).

 

"x" is done so that your name appears in chat, so that your name can be right-clicked, so that other people can do things like open a trade window with them or invite them to their group.

[Vernon Merrill]

gg= good game...  

 

X= usually just a mark to make it easier for a mate to invite you into a group

 

I admit I had to google what TLDR meant today...  apparently its "Too Long, Didnt Read", meaning that person couldnt be bothered to spend more that 10 seconds actually listening , or reading, someone else's point of view...  

 

Ahhhhh, the 21st century...  Good times!

[Migui]

And don't forget about the dank memes.

What a time to be alive.

[Billy Ruffin]

I'll still to winkies and smilies I reckon. TTFN! 

[Jack Marslow]

It seems a vast majority of the time most people's idea of fun in this game is to make everyone else's expiences as awful as possible.

[Lannes]

The problem is that people forget that this is a GAME, one's life or living does not depend on it.

Everyone has to start communicating like an adult. That is, everyone has an opinion, many opinions; none of them are sacrosant; they are just opinions, relative to one's point of view.

When making an argument one should not be attacking the person, that is, don't make it an 'ad hominem' argument.

 

Above all don't take anything personally. It's a game made up of avatars, not real people.

Edited April 4, 2016 by Lannes

[cheatos503]

Fellow captains all around the globe, i want to bring this up as the game is fairly new and awesome, and the community is still being built up. I've been playing for two weeks and the amount of toxicity i've been experiencing and the levels of smug/entitlement/arrogance are unbelievable for a game as new as this with a player base that is not comprised by kids.

I want to raise awareness about this topic: the blatant and increasing toxicity over chats, global, nation-wide and mistaking in-game rivalry with something else.

First of all, lets not forget this: we are all players ROLEPLAYING a war in a videogame. This means that the fact that you get into my mission and sink my ship doesn't mean that you hate me and we couldn't be friends or share a beer in real life.

I am going to say this again. In this game, i play a spanish captain in pvp1. In other games, i have been a dwarf. I have been a space politician. I have been many things. And just because my choice is different than yours doesn't mean we have to hate each other even if our goals are straight against each other and we are going to be rivals.

Right? Well, doesn't look like.

It doesn't matter which nation you are, we all like to win, we all like to become better, to achieve our objectives, small ones or strategic and bigger ones. And that's just fine, but don't forget that we are here for an ultimate goal: to have fun and have a good time.

As a player, i am going to try to fight anyone else and i am going to contribute to the development of my nation. And i expect the rest of the playerbase to do the same. But i don't like to see this game drowning in toxicity after a couple of months.

We all can have a moment of getting warmed up because losing sucks. Or because we have a bad day, whatever. It's fine. But please, don't make this community to become something to be ashamed of.

We have the opportunity to create an awesome world where wars happen, where PVP happens, yet people is not there creating a toxic atmosphere that alienates casual players or makes people being fed up and burnt out just because of it.

The game is still early access, wipes will happen, nothing is there for granted. So take it easy bros!

Becoming a self-entitled asshat is way too easy. We can still be gentlemen even if we fight each other. Don't be that guy please. Because this game deserves something better.

o7

 

LOL, you are kidding....aren't you? Really? This is a thing.....hmm.........*sigh*.

 

Let me get this straight, You are upset over the fact that in a RP heavy game such as this (and it's a little creepy btw) that there should be nothing but "Golly gee, " and "Gosh Darnit"?

 

Now before you get on your high horse and all defensive, let me see if i have all the facts here.

 

 

 We are participating in a game that:

 

• romanticizes an era of Slavery, murder, genocide, and political revolution. All in the name of greed, gold,and power
• One of the core mechanics of the game involves wholesale murder of people on boats, then commit armed robbery as a means of success.
• This is a competitive PVP game, with alot of time end effort going into the ships we sail, and we go out on them in an effort to capture, kill and plunder our targets
• The primary role for us to play in this game is that of a sailor, Im not sure if you've heard the term "cursing like a sailor"
• This is not The Simpsons, Therefore its unreasonable to assume any of us are RPing Ned Flanders, (well aside from the OP)
• There is a large degree of national pride at work in this game (guess you havernt seen the World Cup either)

 

So while considering these points, go ahead and ask yourself this:

 

If your ancestors who lived in this very bloody time could see how you are safe and sound, in front of a computer where your only struggle in life is virtual. And only mere words can hurt you, would they be proud of how you are turning out or would they hang their head in shame? Or would they simply laugh at your amazing and Manly way you take charge and ask us all to be polite when murdering each other

 

At the time, Captains were actually extremely civilized and downright respectful of each other, even when attempting to blast each other out of the water.  Please take a page from history and treat your fellow Captains with the respect required of you by the forum rules.  Warning Issued.  - H. Darby

Edited April 4, 2016 by Henry d'Esterre Darby

[Migui]

I'm afraid you got it all wrong and are changing the facts to suit your wrong argument. You should read my post and the rest of the thread to understad before jumping to hit reply.

 

I come from EVE Online after many years. This game is a kindergarten compared to EVE in everything, and more specifically, in toxicity, backstabbing and treason. But you know what? Even when people are insanely against each other, when personally people needs help, we all stick together and put our differences aside.

 

This is not a matter of thick or thin skin, it is a matter of being adults and respecting each other. Nothing more, and nothing else. Being warmed up by the situation and swearing is one thing, but the boundary between that and becoming a toxic community where no one can stand each other is really thin.

Edited April 4, 2016 by Henry d'Esterre Darby
Removed moderated content.

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

From my perspective it seems like the moderators (green names) rarely if ever act, only uttering a warning now and then in chat which is often disregarded. It feels that they do not feel empowered to act, that if they act they would themselves get in trouble or perhaps the guidelines are too vague for them.

 

We issue quite a few bans.  Some of us announce it, and some don't (I usually issue a game warning, and then if they persist the 24 hour ban follows quite shortly after).  Quite often, the offender suddenly goes silent and it may not be apparent that we're doing anything about it.

 

If you're being toxic or violating the rules, we'll get you for it, no worries about that.

[Fastidius]

You don't need PVP to have a toxic atmosphere in an online game.

 

Some of the most vile stuff I've ever seen happened in EverQuest

that was a game design issue....basically the time zones were pitted against each other to get the spawns. 24 hour spawns means MONTHS before seeing a boss mob,  Days to have them spawn epic bosses.

 

And Verant made a mint when the news articles came out on fox/bbc.  

 

the game was basically about ganking bosses into time zones for the first 3 expansions.......also VT key was Ridiculous   7 day camping to get a shard was harsh

[Fastidius]

I dunno, seems reasonably ok on the forums and in game to me.  Yeah there is the od bit of line dancing in some parts but no blatant over the line and smash you over the head trolling.

 

Most of the national flames are about timers...and well timers suck because you change them to what suits you not what suits them when you have them......everyone is sad when the kid with the ball has to go home.  no content  for you!!

 

I don't see the grumblings back and forth as toxicity as much as passionate pointing of fingers.