The Pirate Discussion: An Open Letter to the Developers and Naval Action Community

[William the Drake]

It should be painfully apparent that the conversation surrounding piracy and its place in Naval Action has flared up once more. Tensions are high, passions are enflamed, and insults are begging to fly once more. The the rise to prominence of pirate population ever since the release of Early Access has, I believe facilitated and substantiated this atmosphere: there are many many new faces joining the conversation, both pirate and non, who are unaware of the length and intensity of the pirate conversation that took place before their arrival. 

 

In top of this, the implementation of the Open World and the evolution of Port Conquest has called into question many aspects of Piracy in Naval Action. There are many who wish to see piracy changed, myself included. However, these suggestions and conversations are often lost and muddied by the heated confrontations and name-calling. Furthermore, there seems to be no interest from the developers on these topics, further entrenching the individuals taking part in them even deeper into their attacks and defenses, with often cringe-worthy results. As such, I am writing this open letter to both the developers and the community at large, as a final plea to make things civil, or at least closer to civil than they are now.

 

To the Developers

 

I am fully aware and completely understand that certain aspects of the game are viewed as more immediately important than others; certain aspects of game-play or management that are seen as "need-to-be-done-yesterday" I completely understand this, and respect your decisions as developers of this great game when it comes to what takes the spotlight when it comes to new content to be developed and tweaked.

 

This said, I feel the need as both a player and Pirate to urge to to reconsider the place that Pirates and Pirate Mechanics holds in the current stage in development. Pirates and their place and function in the game are in dire need of attention, especially seeing as we the 2nd largest population in the game and growing! There are and have been many voices crying for some sort of change when it comes to the pirate mechanic. I do not personally agree with all of them, and I personally have suggested a number myself. However, what is most striking is the perceived lack of interest by the devs regarding any discussion on piracy. As a simple player, I acknowledge that discussions may be taking place behind closed doors, however the lack of interaction on the numerous pirate discussions is disheartening with all involved. No clear answers are provided as to what the plan for Pirates is, be it specific or general.

 

I implore you to begin taking a more active part, be it for or against, in the Pirate conversation; this has now evolved from the early conversation of if pirates should be included into a more complex how they should be included.

To the Community

 

New-Coming Pirates: I will be blunt here: while things may seem contentious now, understand that great strides were made simply in having pirates included in Naval Action, much less having them operate on an equal level as the nationals. Many a passionate word was spit over whether pirates had a place in the game at all. These were dark times, and one I personally was glad to see pass.

 

However we again find ourselves at an impasse, and if there was any lesson to be learned from the pre-Early Access struggle, it was that heated words and pointless fighting will get us nowhere. One of the common tropes I see brought up is painting any national who wishes to change piracy as someone who simply wants to "nerf" them for their own gain, or one who is "jealous" that the pirates are doing well. These claims are ludicrous at best, and often without merit. I have personally yet to see a truly de-powering suggestion by any player, national or otherwise. What is often the case is that pirate players take any challenge to the current system as a possible affront and attempt to label it as a nerf, thus attempting to delegitimize the suggestion. There is a fallacy there yet I am not sure which. Hasty Generalization perhaps?

 

First and foremost: This comes up every time there is a major pirate discussion, and it is just plain false. Almost never, 99.9% of the time no one, I repeat no one is proposing that pirates not be allowed to pilot large(er) ships. Perhaps limits on producing them, but not piloting them. This is almost always brought up by pirates who actually want to be Nats as an argument that people want to nerf pirates. It's not, and they don'. So stop it!

 

Furthermore, there seems to be a saddening disdain for anything considered "historical". Pirates who see an argument that supposedly suggests a change to pirate mechanics based on historical context is again scrutinized and shot down without proper criticism and analysis. While it is true that there are many aspects of the game that are ahistorical, this does not mean that a historical suggestion cannot lead to interesting or unique gameplay. Simply writing off a suggestion because "the Nationals are even less historically accurate" ignores the problem, suggestion, as well as any possible conclusion. Again, another fallacy I'm sure, and again I'm not sure which.

 

Old-Guard Pirates: We know that change in-game comes slowly at times, and we also know that yelling at each other through our screens does not make anything better. Please assist the devs, the moderators, and your fellow captains in trying to keep peace and order in these discussions: don't just contradict a stance, offer some reason and insight as to why (this goes for our greenhorn pirates as well!)

 

Nationals: You are just as guilty in paint pirates with a broad brush as some of us are with you and the alleged "nerfs"; yes we like the idea of being able to play pirates. No that does not make all of us "Wanna-be Jack Sparrows" and this should never be a legitimate response to an argument. And you can bet it's an Ad Hominem argument at that! It has no merit, and it does nothing other than rile up nerves and cause tension! Are there a few who voice a want for the romanticized pirate? Yes! Are they the majority of the pirates who are voicing suggestions for pirates and piracy in-game? Absolutely not! So stop using it as an excuse and offer some real responses instead of trying to write us all off as ignorant children! We need you as an proper counterweight to us to ensure that whatever pirate system may come about, it is competitive and fun, and this will never be if you continue to avoid the argument and see us as a bunch of Hollywood hooligans running around trying to "commandeer" the game. The notion is just as ludicrous as those suggested by pirates of nationals. 

 

Everyone: If there is one reason we are all here, it is because of our love for the time-period, for the Age-of-Sail, and our passion for it is shown in our willingness not only to play and test the game but also to come here to suggest what we as players feel would best improve it, not only for ourselves but for everyone else who plays. It should never be expected that we will agree on everything (it would be far too boring that way) however we should be willing to constructively criticize each others' ideas without it turning into a schoolyard shouting match. When that happens we all lose. If there's one thing that I've learned from reading the National News forum is that we all hate losing.

We are here to have fun and to help make this game as great as it has the potential to be. Every time we resort to insults and avoiding points, we hurt the chances of making the game great. The atmosphere of the forums during the initial pirate discussion was downright depressing, and I wish more than anything to avoid returning to that atmosphere. I implore each and every one of you, including myself, to avoid these pointless altercations and do what you can to keep the whole thing civil. Thank you.

Live long and prosper

Fair winds and following seas,

[Guest raat]

Pirates shouldn't be allowed to craft ships.  Pirates shouldn't be allowed to capture ports.  That would go a long way to keeping them from swarming the entire game.

 

Pirates instead should be what the devs said they would be, "hard mode".  Right now, it's the easiest faction to play.  You can get double xp by damage farming your friends, you have the most numbers because every casual coming through wants to play pirate, AND you have the same crafting and gameplay mechanics as Nationals.

 

Pirates should be a unique gameplay experience that actually is difficult, but fun.  It should be for the hardcore PvP crowd.  The deck should be stacked against you (as it was historically by this time frame).  And you shouldn't have the National infrastructure that allows you to craft ships bigger than something a single crew could craft (not even sure if a single ship's crew could craft even a cutter...).

 

Pirates should get ships through capture, and be able to raid Ports for plunder, but not conquer them.  There also should be no "Pirate" ports.  Just let them base out of "Free Towns", and that should be all that's necessary.

 

As it is, the hordes of casual Pirate noobs that swarm this game, but still play as a regular Nation on the same vein as Great Britain, France, or Spain is ridiculous and is driving away a number of players from this game because of they didn't want (and were promised) this wouldn't be just another Pirate Game.

[maturin]

Day Z in Naval Action.

 

Make it happen, and I roll pirate tomorrow.

[Ruthless4u]

Currently there is no reason to play pirate.

I was hoping it would offer a challenging gameplay alternative vs the nations. My original plan was to play as a national, learn the ropes and Reroll as pirate. Now there is literally no point. It would be like playing any other nation.

Given the various statements by the developers saying they won't be a nation, it would be harder etc, I am very disapointed that at least to this point the developers have failed to live up to expectations.

It's not about hating pirates, as stated I wanted to be one, it's about the developers not going along with what they stated.

[Aetrion]

I think the most fundamental issue with pirates at this junction of the game's development is that the wealth and resource generation in this game does not happen in the open sea.

 

Neither players nor NPC have to spend a significant amount of time at sea in trade vessels to generate resources or money for their faction, which means there is no room for trying to disrupt or appropriate those resources, nor a need to have a fleet of patrol ships to defend the resource operations.

 

Bottom line is, as long as the essential resource generation mechanic of the game isn't driving trade ships around the map, and I don't mean just teleporting them once a day, I mean really driving trade ships around the map, we'll never see an effective hook for piracy, and we'll also never see frigates actually doing what frigates existed to do, which is patrol waters to safeguard such operations.

[Blood Eagle]

Pirates as of right now have alot of potenial for game breaking abuse. We already know its the easist faction to farm damage. Consider how easy it would be for pirate clans to cheese conquest. Lets take random pirate clans cordinates and re-rolls to another faction. They intend to go pirate and are only re-rolling to sneak into said national, find the best ports, figure out the times when that national faction has the most numbers ect..

 

They could easy sneak attack a national this way setting up inside the national and striking while most nationals are offline, jumping pirate and taking a ton of ports at one given time.

[ObiQuiet]

Well said, Drake.

The limitations on pirates mention by Raatha are both necessary and likely sufficient.

Hear them! HEAR THEM!

[Bleakbeard]

I think the most fundamental issue with pirates at this junction of the game's development is that the wealth and resource generation in this game does not happen in the open sea.

 

Neither players nor NPC have to spend a significant amount of time at sea in trade vessels to generate resources or money for their faction, which means there is no room for trying to disrupt or appropriate those resources, nor a need to have a fleet of patrol ships to defend the resource operations.

 

Bottom line is, as long as the essential resource generation mechanic of the game isn't driving trade ships around the map, and I don't mean just teleporting them once a day, I mean really driving trade ships around the map, we'll never see an effective hook for piracy, and we'll also never see frigates actually doing what frigates existed to do, which is patrol waters to safeguard such operations.

I wish I could like upvote this again. Until a fundamental economic and open world overhaul comes, there is no point to playing a pirate in a historical context.

The Open World is too compressed and the ratio of player warships to merchants is off kilter.  Nationals need to be driving merchant ships in sufficient numbers to incentivize privateering and pirating.  Driving merchant ships should be the National's primary means of income instead of combat.

On a side note, what was the historical ratio of warship to merchants?

Edited March 2, 2016 by Bleakbeard

[Warrax]

Pirates shouldn't be allowed to craft ships.  Pirates shouldn't be allowed to capture ports.  That would go a long way to keeping them from swarming the entire game.

  Pirate Game.

I wanted to air my own thoughts on the ideas expressed above ...

I completely agree that pirates should NOT be allowed to craft ships. To curb abuse, then, FreePorts should not support any outposts - which prevents all purchase and illicit trading. Furthermore, this would historically accurate: Pirates never has a ship commissioning industry.

Dear Pirates - you want a ship? Go get it off the high seas.

That said - pirates SHOULD be allowed to craft upgrades and other items.

[Bleakbeard]

I wanted to air my own thoughts on the ideas expressed above ...

I completely agree that pirates should NOT be allowed to craft ships. To curb abuse, then, FreePorts should not support any outposts - which prevents all purchase and illicit trading. Furthermore, this would historically accurate: Pirates never has a ship commissioning industry.

Dear Pirates - you want a ship? Go get it off the high seas.

That said - pirates SHOULD be allowed to craft upgrades and other items.

Dear Nationals,

Your larger warships need to have higher maintenance costs. And sailors should have individual wages subtracted from your total periodically.

If you want to make money on a steady income, you should have to drive a merchant ship in a less compressed world and without a teleport.

Edited March 2, 2016 by Bleakbeard

[Quineloe]

Admin has stated that they cant radically alter the faction anymore. Too many would be unhappy.

Apparently that's not the same as repeatedly wiping our assets.

So yeah we're stuck with Brethren of the Coast 2.0, easy mode piracy full of Jack Sparrows.

It seems moot to post ideas as long as the status quo is here to stay

[Malachi]

Great post, Drake!

[Ruthless4u]

Admin has stated that they cant radically alter the faction anymore. Too many would be unhappy

Got a link/qoute?

[Quineloe]

He said this on braincages twitch stream 3 or 4 weeks back. There was an unannounced impromptu Q&A session. Its probably on his youtube channel.

[Ruthless4u]

He said this on braincages twitch stream 3 or 4 weeks back. There was an unannounced impromptu Q&A session. Its probably on his youtube channel.

That's unfortunate, although I did watch the stream I don't remember it being stated.

[Tindahbawx]

Isn't it more important to get the full economy and diplomacy of the game up and running first, before you can even consider what changes you want to make to pirates and how they are going to interact with those systems?

 

You're asking for a faction to be changed before you even know how its going to function with other parts of the game that aren't in yet. Its completely backwards. FOR NOW, Pirates  have to be able to take land and capture ports because the current economic system REQUIRES it for them to be able to do any crafting of ship, which is currently required for them to participate in the game in any meaningful way.

 

When you're building a house you get the walls and roof up first before you start laying down the carpets.

Edited March 2, 2016 by Tindahbawx

[ObiQuiet]

Admin has stated that they cant radically alter the faction anymore. Too many would be unhappy.

Apparently that's not the same as repeatedly wiping our assets.

So yeah we're stuck with Brethren of the Coast 2.0, easy mode piracy full of Jack Sparrows.

It seems moot to post ideas as long as the status quo is here to stay

IMO turning off new crafting and preventing purchase of new pb flags would not be that drastic. No other change.

That preserves pirate players existing work. It may cause some re rolling to other nations. Both are good.

If we don't like that, then it's even possible to rename the existing servers to "Pirate Action EU 1", etc and create a new shard with these minor rule changes. It's not preposterous, it's do-able as far as I can guess.

Edited March 2, 2016 by ObiQuiet

[Ronald Speirs]

I agree with the OP and raatha, there is alittle pirate in all of us but atm they are just another nation so why even call them pirate as they are no different other then pirate frigate, lets work together to gather good ideas to make them hard but fun.

1.) They shouldnt be a choice at start of game, having to go through nationals till lets say lt commander when they see that the ranks are boring and want to make a name for themselves and sail bigger and better things then they can go attack friendlies and traders

2.) They should own a few pirate havens and also be able to access the free towns but not capture ports, raidng should be a thing and they should have to do raids to gather resources for refits and building modules

3.) Pirates should have unique abilities so overcrewing and being able to load up with heavier quarter decks so they dont become to OP, increased Morale.

4.) Anything bigger then the Mercury to buy before having to capture bigger ships and having to capture more of the same ships to create durabilities.

5.) Refitting ships from the standard ship should require raiding resources and then using them to alter ships to handle better amd sail faster as they never wanted to be caught.

6.) Raiding: They cant loses their havens and cant capture other ports, attacking ports so requiring attacking traders to restrict resources getting to port for an hour let say before it says its being raided, the they go into boarding or something and the more pirates involved that win their boarding the more resources they get, and after all the boarding they go into a battle icon and any defender around get the chance to jump in and try stop their resource traders escaping while the pirates escort them to a retreat zone without them sinking.

6.) Heard an idea from somewhere about different pirate groups fighting over different pirate havens to have more control over their resources and refit abilities.

7.) Reputation, so the more violent and attacking they are the more notority they gain and the bigger the prize on their head and the more money gained by defeating them in fair contest

8.) Hiring themselves out for other nation tactics and gain better reputaion with factions and maybe changing teir ways if they want to go back to national ways but at the cost of their pirate refits.

The more i write the more crazy and hardcore and exciting it sounds, theses are just brainstorming ideas to make pirates a unique and exciting nation and bring them away from the pack but a tough slug once you lose your way with nationals.

Its just ideas and i hope that others can see anything else to add or improve on as i see this being good fun with a great challenge and more achievement for those pursing it.

Regards Speirs

Edited March 2, 2016 by Ronald Speirs

[Mrdoomed]

Using alreasy whats in the game.

1. Give pirates the abilty while in port to change name and faction display to other factions to simulate false flag. Breaks when they attack.

2. Purates can use any port because nobody knows they are acually pirates and not free traders.

3 when pirates attack a port and win it becomes neutral all assets including player made items and ships are divided up per loot system to attackers. Port loses the abilty to buy sell and produce for a time and may not be re capturd per cool down.

4. Pirates get more crew per level and better moral and boarding bonus built into levels.

5 pirates can pick pirate hot spot ports amd they show up only on pirate world map as a pirate hq.

Everything is in gane nobody gets screwed and pirates as a nation are gone.

[Prater]

There is still the problem of when nations are defeated, players and clans from the losing side turn pirate.  Unless that is fixed, eventually most people will be pirate.

[Mrdoomed]

There is still the problem of when nations are defeated, players and clans from the losing side turn pirate. Unless that is fixed, eventually most people will be pirate.

Unfortunately that is going to be like changing human nature and the people who are try hards. The answere could be as simple as not letting people just " become " pirates by a few kills or cuz they want to. Often when men became pirates in real life they lost everything including thier identity, contacts , friends and of course assets. Perhaps going pirate means a fresh start in everythong including level. That wouls similate the real transition but still allow people who pick pirates or are pirates nkw to keep playing .

EDIT...i think that penalty should be for all faction swaps because on my server peolle just hop to the best faction the winning faction the faction with action then change again. Changing a faction should have consequences.

Edited March 2, 2016 by Mrdoomed

[GrapeShot]

Prater,

That's a seperate issue. It stems from clan wars being foisted upon all the players via port battles.

Edited March 2, 2016 by GrapeShot

[OTMatt]

Admin has stated that they cant radically alter the faction anymore. Too many would be unhappy.

Apparently that's not the same as repeatedly wiping our assets.

So yeah we're stuck with Brethren of the Coast 2.0, easy mode piracy full of Jack Sparrows.

It seems moot to post ideas as long as the status quo is here to stay

I hope they reconsider, now is as good a time as any other since we're still in early access.

Make the change quick during wipe and let the players adapt.

[Prater]

Prater,

That's a seperate issue. It stems from clan wars being foisted upon all the players via port battles.

 

It isn't a separate issue.  It happens because of the current pirate mechanics and how easy it is to turn pirate without any consequences.

[William the Drake]

Isn't it more important to get the full economy and diplomacy of the game up and running first, before you can even consider what changes you want to make to pirates and how they are going to interact with those systems?

 

You're asking for a faction to be changed before you even know how its going to function with other parts of the game that aren't in yet. Its completely backwards. FOR NOW, Pirates  have to be able to take land and capture ports because the current economic system REQUIRES it for them to be able to do any crafting of ship, which is currently required for them to participate in the game in any meaningful way.

 

When you're building a house you get the walls and roof up first before you start laying down the carpets.

 

I feel you are correct here, but allow me to take that house analogy a bit further: Don't thing from the perspective of the builder, think from the perspective of the architect; the planner: sure you wan't the superstructure constructed first, however you also want at the very least a general idea of all the details prior to even breaking ground. Yes, there needs to be a fully fleshed out economy before pirates can have a unique response to it, absolutely.

 

However, considering that pirates are the 2nd largest population in the game, at least some things need to be addressed before going any further. I'm not much of a builder, but I love LEGOs so I'll use this analogy here: ever build anything with LEGOs? Even if one single piece is defective or out of place, the whole thing becomes near nigh impossible to complete or begins to look very different from the initial plan. Now one can stop, remove a few pieces and replace the defective one immediately, or they can wait until the whole thing is done and go back and meticulously remove pieces to get to the defective one. 

 

Do pirates need a major overhaul to be a unique part of the game? Yes. Does that overhaul need to happen immediately and all at once? Absolutely not.

As I said, I agree 100% that there are other mechanics that need to be completed before pirates can have a separate mechanic for them, however, there are a few aspects that can be changed now, and what I perceive as simple enough to be done immediately (or at least very soon) that can begin this process of differentiating pirates:

1. Make players "Go" Pirate- simple as removing pirates as a starting option and having the only way to become pirate is to attack a friendly. Again, this is an initial, bare-minimum function. This alone could later be fleshed out even further.
2. Stop Pirate conquest and conquest of Pirate Ports- This one is a little trickier, mainly because of where player's have Warehouses set up, but first, have pirates unable to capture ports and have pirate ports unconquerable. 

I understand that because it requires that we wait for other content to be developed that initially all we will be doing is removing content for pirate. Yes this will rile many up. However, if we have a clear and concise roadmap and goal from the developers of what it will mean for pirates in the long run, I think it will work. If it means a unique pirate faction and mechanic down the line, then I am more that willing to sacrifice aspects now for more dynamic and fun pirates later. A short-term gain and long-term loss.