Heat map to help facilitate pvp and rumor system

[Bach]

Playing for the better part of the year now I have a recommendation for a hot fix and one for future game enhancement.

The map is large and sail times can be long. In many ways this a good thing. In others not so much. With the advent of the crew patch coming players will find themselves further challenged. I don't mind the long sail so much if I know what I most likely am getting at the end of it. It's the long sails for nothing that cause the problems.

Hot fix - solution is a simple Heat style map modification to allow players to note where pvp is most likely occurring. The system already tracks how many battles are in play and as such should be data already at hand. Convert this data into a visual on the game "m" map so players can deduce where pvp is most likely to occur before they set out on a long fruitless sail.

Long term - Rumors passed from sailor to sailor, merchant to buyer, brothel whispers and even missionary news was commonly passed anytime people met in the 17-1800s. This effect should be available in game. Perhaps it's a heat map showing battles, trade purchases or rumors of SOLs docked in port. Rumors could be less than super accurate ways to get player interaction going and help facilitate players being able to utilize more of the sand box.

Edited June 13, 2016 by Bach

[Mrdoomed]

We used to get ship notes relaying news of players locations and times spotted. I often used that to hunt people but that was taken away some time ago.

Sadly most things that led to open world pvp are gone.

[Bach]

We used to get ship notes relaying news of players locations and times spotted. I often used that to hunt people but that was taken away some time ago.

Sadly most things that led to open world pvp are gone.

Sea hunter players, like yourself, are under represented in these forums. You don't need to know where your prey is. You just need some clues to set the hunt in motion. This is kind off what I thought rumors or even bribes might be like. Say you visit the port master of La a Habana, slip him a few gold pieces and he gives you a list of ships in port or that visited in the last game day. Something like that. Would also allow for bounty hunting.

I recently spent and hour talking to a well educated Econ player. He taught me things about the current system I didn't know as well as some of his complaints. To him, his game is in defeating other merchants in the markets. When he sees certain commodity prices rise or fall he knows if he is winning or not. The true merchant princes of the game are also under represented as most of the forum is filled with solo crafters who have no real need for a true economy to play in.

There is more, much more, to a sand box than just RvR.

Edited June 14, 2016 by Bach

[Mrdoomed]

Sea hunter players, like yourself, are under represented in these forums. You don't need to know where your prey is. You just need some clues to set the hunt in motion. This is kind off what I thought rumors or even bribes might be like. Say you visit the port master of La a Habana, slip him a few gold pieces and he gives you a list of ships in port or that visited in the last game day. Something like that. Would also allow for bounty hunting.

I recently spent and hour talking to a well educated Econ player. He taught me things about the current system I didn't know as well as some of his complaints. To him, his game is in defeating other merchants in the markets. When he sees certain commodity prices rise or fall he knows if he is winning or not. The true merchant princes of the game are also under represented as most of the forum is filled with solo crafters who have no real need for a true economy to play in.

There is more, much more, to a sand box than just RvR.

I agree. It seems so much emphasis has been put on port battles and how fast to make it getting to them and what can fight there and teleports to get them there withut sailing in tje ow to get near it.

Hunting was , and still is in rare occasions, so much fun. Our small clan played as pirates of history and would hunt in small ships along coasts looking for prey and when we would get a news page from a victory battle we used it to know where the pirate hunters was and where nt to go. We also used them t hunt players we had vengeance with. It was also quite a shock when ine time i captured a ship and the rumors was about MY LOCATION lol.

Not sure what good the news would be now since the player can just teleport to other side of the world without waiting now but those days where great fun.

I think the game lost A LOT of players who find no interest in port battles but loved playing their own version of Master and Commander. I wish the devs would do more to get people in the open world instead of out of it.

[SeaMist]

It sounds like a gankers wet dream.........

[mikawa]

Yes, now I remember them! Why are the ship notes gone?

I am rather sceptical if a heat map is the right way ... But I fully agree that sailing for nothing than a few XP points is causing a big problem ... Sailing out means to expose your ship to dangers - this should be rewarded by far more than a few XP points.

 

But what about PVP? I think it will be improved if it has good rewards, rewards you don't get from PVE at least not so much. It's all about balancing. Let's say we have war points. They are aquired by

 

- won battle in PVE - 1 Point

- won battle in PVP - 10 Points

- sailed along an enemy coast spotting ships - 2 Points per ship (represented in the map for all players, tiny signs which slowly fade to nothing during 10 minutes)

- spotted battle sign which is not PVE - 1 Point per sign

- entered enemy harbour as smuggler - 3 Points per port

- crossed 3 territories - 3 Points

 

and probably many more ...

 

What to do with the war points?

 

- aquire permission to sail a SOL (yes it's not that easy any more, you must get your permission from admiralty and this once for each SOL you want to sail)

- gather items that are non-craftable (Officers...)

- additional modules which are not craftable (Bow chasers...)

- get ships that are not buyable (Bloody Hermione, Yacht...)

- aquire feudal titles (Earl, Lord, and so on)

- get a blueprint of your choice (!)

- replace one lost dura on certain ship (maybe 1000 points worth)

 

and probably many more ...

 

Edit: last line deleted, it was redundant....

Edit again: added blueprints above

Edit again: added replace lost dura

Edited June 15, 2016 by mikawa

[admin]

Hot fix - solution is a simple Heat style map modification to allow players to note where pvp is most likely occurring. The system already tracks how many battles are in play and as such should be data already at hand. Convert this data into a visual on the game "m" map so players can deduce where pvp is most likely to occur before they set out on a long fruitless sail.

 

 

The problem with heat maps lies with cheating.

 

To create heat maps (kills, sinkings, locations) we will need to send the data to the client. If it is sent to the client it can be hijacked and used to provide information on your location in the OW to all players using external tools. 

 

Its a great idea but it has a lot of loopholes for exploiting. 

[qw569😳]

The problem with heat maps lies with cheating.

 

To create heat maps (kills, sinkings, locations) we will need to send the data to the client. If it is sent to the client it can be hijacked and used to provide information on your location in the OW to all players using external tools. 

 

Its a great idea but it has a lot of loopholes for exploiting. 

You can publish this information like API.

[admin]

You can publish this information like API.

but then it will be yesterday's heat map and will be mostly useless?

[maturin]

Heat maps are supposed to cover a long period of time, right?

[Vernon Merrill]

but then it will be yesterday's heat map and will be mostly useless?

 

Disagree, respectfully.  A day old map would actually be BETTER in my opinion because it would still provide an idea for new players where they need to be to find action.  Yet at the same time not providing a pinpoint location to find a certain player.  

 

Its more of a general guide. 

 

That being said, I would not consider it a high priority, personally.

[qw569😳]

but then it will be yesterday's heat map and will be mostly useless?

it better then nothing.

 

====

Это лучше, чем ничего.

Наблюдение и анализ прошлых данных позволит ответить на вопрос, куда плыть чтобы найти PvP или избежать его.

[Ned Loe]

There is always a way. We need this bad. If you let players know where is the action you will boost pvp and also make players fight. Do not record active fights, record finished battles. 

 

1. Zone A - Start collecting information after each player kills an NPC/Player, but do not send it to the client yet. After 10 minutes send report. Do not include players who are still fighting, only report battles that are over. 

 - 5 minutes is enough to vanish into your vast ocean. 

 - Do not put zones or circles! Use swords as center point of all battles sent. This means somewhere in this zone was Acton 10 minutes ago. 

 - When player moves mouse over swords display info about: Amount of players, kills they did, gold taken and approximate zone range.  

 

It should look like this:

 

Swords. 

Local fishermen report sightings of smoke in the distance. 

 

Report expires in 30 mins. (Report will be removed after timer is up). 

10 Players.

23 NPC Kills.

3 PvP Kills.

Gold Taken 267000

Approximate Zone Range: 10mi.

 

This means, you will have reports every 10 minutes and will erase reports every 30 minutes or any timer you preset. 

 

Also, anyone is using an app called Waze?

https://www.waze.com/

 

In this app/map people send reports and confirm what other people reported, if it's a faulty report, other people's reports remove event Icon.

 

Same thing can be implemented here, but every report should cost gold or something. 

[Bach]

I like the idea of the reports costing gold and perhaps make them only available in port.

[Bach]

but then it will be yesterday's heat map and will be mostly useless?

I'm not so sure. I have spent many a gaming year bounty hunting live players. We're mostly creatures of habit. More so once the crew patch removes ship teleports. This should cause players to become less random in their movements in game. Consider a squadron of British players for example. They most likely have a defensive ship near Kingston, an offensive ship near their chosen battle front, an NPC hunter/mission runner somewhere and a merchant ship near their factories. Once the crew patch comes into play these ships become dedicated to the regions they are in. So even if you gave the sea Hunter day old information the odds are still high that this particular players and ships will still be operating in these areas.

Additionally being creatures of habit, if we track this day old data over time patterns of national or clan specific activity will emerge. Let's say I'm bounty hunting some dastardly pirate in the Black Hand clan. If I track his clan mates and find their patterns I may just collect his bounty.

Besides all that, like someone else said, it's better than nothing.

Edited June 15, 2016 by Bach

[mikawa]

An actual map where ended battles are pinned would be awesome.

[ajffighter86]

It sounds like a gankers wet dream.........

 

I think the map would have to reflect relatively equal player activity on multiple nations. If you are sailing around by yourself, you won't have to worry about your general location being highlighted in a heat-map. Besides, someone interested in PVP is not going to sail 2 hours to find one player to gank, but they might sail 2 hours to central America if there's dozens of players ripping each other to shreds every day (unless of course they are avoiding PVP, in which case, the heat map would still be useful for the opposite reason)

Edited June 15, 2016 by ajffighter86

[Skully]

The problem with heat maps lies with cheating.

 

To create heat maps (kills, sinkings, locations) we will need to send the data to the client. If it is sent to the client it can be hijacked and used to provide information on your location in the OW to all players using external tools. 

 

Its a great idea but it has a lot of loopholes for exploiting. 

Hence my suggestion for red dots for everyone for every post-battle. Without any form of indication of nation or composition.

http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/14627-where-is-the-action/

[Domox]

I had this on burningsail.com for a bit but it only met limited use, there was also the issue of people posting notices in places to lure people in. But maybe it's better than nothing?

[Skully]

I had this on burningsail.com for a bit but it only met limited use, there was also the issue of people posting notices in places to lure people in. But maybe it's better than nothing?

Hmm, that sounds actually like a great idea. I'm just not sure whether it would scale right though, it could get messy on the map.

If we have it in game we could have anonymous notes, nation notes, clan notes and individual notes. Add a timeout and a limit to control spamming and voila: PvP controlled rumour system.

[EL LOCO]

Heat Map ..  a definite must in this game.   Resets every server reset.   The bigger the battles the bigger the red circumference.    Port Battles should be included as well.    Only when battle is over .

This will give us a better idea of where the true action is.  I can understand this historically as all action was the hot topic in taverns in those days and sailors get around.  I spend too much time moving around my 8 outpost with my 20 ships without knowing what is really going.

 

Heat Map is a must.  a must.

[Skully]

but then it will be yesterday's heat map and will be mostly useless?

If we tie in server time, then it would make sense. People want to find action in their TZ and that is semi-hard to do.

[Uilleam]

I like the idea of a heat map, maybe a red dot where battles occurred yesterday, fading to yellow after 2 days, then white afterc3 days, then gone after 4?

An option for paying a bribe then for more details would be nice, with a limited chance of getting some Intel on the days battles.

There were comments on different play styles (PvP versus trading, versus crafting). I created a thread about possible victory conditions and I think the ideas/ viewpoints mentioned here would or could be helpful on that thread also.

[Mrdoomed]

If this is implemented PLEASE make a option to turn this off. All these suggestions on colored dots and circles spread around the map like pox fadding after days is going to drive me insane.

I was able enough to figure out where action is on a server with bout 60 people on it and cant see why i will need my screen littered with measles ruining my immersion.

Thanks.

Edited June 21, 2016 by Mrdoomed