I think admin/devs owe a lot of people an answer, put this issue to rest.

[Mrdoomed]

False flags are extremely complex, I once tried to write up a feature description for them, and realized just how many mechanics either have to change, don't work, etc when you try to do them. To do them well would be extraordinarily difficult. As to capitals moving, there are many complexities here as well, though there have been some good suggestions about having multiple capitals for some nations and/or allowing players to set a "home port" instead.

Thanks for a quick response , and im sure whatever you do will be fine. Until then ill keep on keepen on.

[thp]

False flags are extremely complex, I once tried to write up a feature description for them, and realized just how many mechanics either have to change, don't work, etc when you try to do them.  To do them well would be extraordinarily difficult.  As to capitals moving, there are many complexities here as well, though there have been some good suggestions about having multiple capitals for some nations and/or allowing players to set a "home port" instead.

I think we should probably need to add the distance that ship can be identify first, many distance circles around the ship ( like circle when we tagg a ship to attack ), longuest circle when we click on a ship it will say unditentify, medium circle it will show the flag of the ship ( national that ship belong to ) at this distance we can use false flag to disguised. at closest distance, the ship will be revealed their real national identity even using false flag.

[KrakkenSmacken]

False flags are extremely complex, I once tried to write up a feature description for them, and realized just how many mechanics either have to change, don't work, etc when you try to do them.  To do them well would be extraordinarily difficult.  As to capitals moving, there are many complexities here as well, though there have been some good suggestions about having multiple capitals for some nations and/or allowing players to set a "home port" instead.

 

Kinda off topic, but I would like to know what you came up with.

 

I personally thought that for false flags a mechanic that involved not the captain of the ship, but the ship itself.  

 

A captured ship could fly it's historical flag (and show as the previous captain) until;

 

First: as a random time between 16 and 32 hrs after being captured (reported missing),

 

Second: as a voluntary change (self reported),

 

Third: It engaged in combat that ended with a survivor on the opposite team getting away to make a report. (reported by survivor)  

 

The captain of the ship would not "know" of the state unless self reported.

 

Then it would be a simple attribute of each ship, available to all nations not just pirates (open sandbox), and very limited in that you had to work to get one, had to use the advantage quickly, and work very very hard to get a higher end ship with one.

 

While flying the false colors you could do anything, including join a port battle on the wrong side, that someone from that nation could do.

 

Traders would be fairly common, cutters and the like rather common, and 3 rates and up damb near impossible.

 

That seems simple enough and quite workable to me.

Edited March 4, 2016 by KrakkenSmacken

[KrakkenSmacken]

Now I'm less savory for arguing a position?

Not for arguing a position, for making it personal.

 

 

Admin's already been all over the map on this. We'll see where it eventually lands.

 

 

Admin happens to be a person, and "all over the map" is in fact quite insulting, and this comment added nothing constructive to the conversation.

 

I call that behavior unsavory, what do you call it?

[Prater]

I often bump heads with grapeshot but saying someone has been all over the map isn't insulting or unsavory in anyway. This isn't politics and we aren't running for office. People can say I've been all over the map on things because I do change my mind. Nothing wrong with changing your mind. And just because you change your mind to the exact opposite of the position you held before doesn't mean anything. Since when did being pointed out that you change your mind become an insult unless you are running for public office?

Maybe grapeshot's description isn't the best description, but it isn't far from the truth. A better description might be that originally admin described a system in which pirates would be hard core and historical and that is the idea that many people were sold on. Since then the devs have changed their mind. Nothing wrong with saying that because it is the truth.

[KrakkenSmacken]

I often bump heads with grapeshot but saying someone has been all over the map isn't insulting or unsavory in anyway. This isn't politics and we aren't running for office. People can say I've been all over the map on things because I do change my mind. Nothing wrong with changing your mind. And just because you change your mind to the exact opposite of the position you held before doesn't mean anything. Since when did being pointed out that you change your mind become an insult unless you are running for public office?

Maybe grapeshot's description isn't the best description, but it isn't far from the truth. A better description might be that originally admin described a system in which pirates would be hard core and historical and that is the idea that many people were sold on. Since then the devs have changed their mind. Nothing wrong with saying that because it is the truth.

 

My example was tame, however if you go through the whole thread again, and use find text to see all the comments "liked" by Grape, well he "liked" many of the insulting remarks make by JustMe and others.

 

I really just picked the most obvious one where he called the Admin by name, but there were plenty of others.

 

Ironically I too believe that pirates should have some different mechanics, or in the name of "open sandbox" (which quite frankly I did not think of because of the nature of a "conquest" style game),  everyone should get piracy flavored mechanics (deception, ways to deal with in nation griefers, etc) but as Admin pointed out it's low on the priority list due to customer demand, and they are well aware of all the threads like this.  

 

Throwing insults around and agreeing with comments laced with insults however is "unsavory"

 

I stand by what I said.

Edited March 4, 2016 by KrakkenSmacken

[Prater]

I could care less what you stand by.  The fact remains that saying someone has been allover the map or liking something that isn't insulting, isn't insulting.  There are maybe two questionable things grapeshot has said or liked in this thread and they are questionable, not one way or the other.  He isn't the problem, justme was.

 

Why did you even bring it up when it is several pages back and from a different day?  Just because someone disagrees with your viewpoint doesn't mean they are insulting or unsavory.

[Ruthless4u]

A better description might be that originally admin described a system in which pirates would be hard core and historical and that is the idea that many people were sold on. Since then the devs have changed their mind. Nothing wrong with saying that because it is the truth.

I know I was one of the ones who was hoping the admins would follow through with the original stated intent for pirates. In my mind with the pirates going to be the largest group of players at some point. Given that the vast majority of pirate players ( at least the forum ones) are satisfied with being a dull nation clone instead of having a unique gameplay option things will likely never change.

So now for those of us hoping pirates would actually be something different and possibly more challenging are now left with playing black flag nation. Yippee.

[Captain Comery]

I have an idea to make pirates more interesting and give them that 'hardest faction in the game' bit back. Why not make it so pirates get a % decrease in gold after a battle, say 2 or 4%. However as they have different ranks they get a 2 to 4% increase in experience or maybe the percentage gets taken off repair costs or something.

This makes it harder to get the gold to maintain bigger ships despite the fact it will be easier to crew them.

Feedback?

[akd]

I know I was one of the ones who was hoping the admins would follow through with the original stated intent for pirates. In my mind with the pirates going to be the largest group of players at some point. Given that the vast majority of pirate players ( at least the forum ones) are satisfied with being a dull nation clone instead of having a unique gameplay option things will likely never change.

So now for those of us hoping pirates would actually be something different and possibly more challenging are now left with playing black flag nation. Yippee.

Just switch to Sweden. Swedes are the real pirates.

[Ruthless4u]

Just switch to Sweden. Swedes are the real pirates.

Only if the Swedish bikini team is my crew.

[KrakkenSmacken]

Why did you even bring it up when it is several pages back and from a different day?  Just because someone disagrees with your viewpoint doesn't mean they are insulting or unsavory.

Because it was a comment directed specifically at me that I missed the first time I read through the thread so I had not yet responded to it. Since he brought it up twice and I was the one who used the word unsavory not Admin, I figured I would explain myself.

[Shoeshine]

Just switch to Sweden. Swedes are the real pirates.

Yeah. This is the only thing I think is wrong right now. As I mentioned before. The "hard mode" that Pirates has labled is totally off right now. I would have considered playing them if that were the case. But when I looked it up  before starting playing it seemed the opposite, and it has proven to be easy mode even now when I've played as well. I'm happy I picked Sweden cause boy oh boy do you need to fight for yourself there. Sweden is the only nation that fits into the "hard mode" that devs set up. 

Edited March 5, 2016 by Shoeshine

[jodgi]

Ya, hard mode without benefits.

[Ruthless4u]

Yeah. This is the only thing I think is wrong right now. As I mentioned before. The "hard mode" that Pirates has labled is totally off right now. I would have considered playing them if that were the case. But when I looked it up  before starting playing it seemed the opposite, and it has proven to be easy mode even now when I've played as well. I'm happy I picked Sweden cause boy oh boy do you need to fight for yourself there. Sweden is the only nation that fits into the "hard mode" that devs set up.

So no Swedish bikini team?

[Vandarix]

Numbers. With pirates being at last stated count 2nd largest faction and likely to grow to top spot.

It's a matter of simple attrition, by making them a nation instead of a truly unique and difficult class to play you are setting the stage for them to take over. They literally have no real restriction in game making the faction appeal to everyone.

I believe that after becoming 2nd largest in a matter of weeks by game launch they will be by far the largest faction making all others irrelevant.

Keep ignoring the issue and dodging questions on it and it will kill the game.

Pirates are the 3rd largest faction on pvp2 Brits outnumber them 2:1 Americans 4:1

[Shoeshine]

So no Swedish bikini team?

Ofc there is. DUH!!! 

[Long Beard]

Holly Poop Deck Batman, is this thread still going on? Well shiver me timbers!

[admin]

I often bump heads with grapeshot but saying someone has been all over the map isn't insulting or unsavory in anyway. This isn't politics and we aren't running for office. People can say I've been all over the map on things because I do change my mind. Nothing wrong with changing your mind. And just because you change your mind to the exact opposite of the position you held before doesn't mean anything. Since when did being pointed out that you change your mind become an insult unless you are running for public office?

Maybe grapeshot's description isn't the best description, but it isn't far from the truth. A better description might be that originally admin described a system in which pirates would be hard core and historical and that is the idea that many people were sold on. Since then the devs have changed their mind. Nothing wrong with saying that because it is the truth.

 

Grapeshot has a history of attacking devs without any reason. Also we have not changed our mind anywhere.

We always are very careful with what we say. We previously said that pirates are not a nation. But while everyone is at war with each other (and can attack each other because there is no judicial punishment for doing that) this difference of not being a nation is blurred for you.

 

Regarding you protecting people who don't like us.

 

Its a community and we have a history of protecting silent or less vocal minorities.

Justme said and grapeshot agreed that we are catering to the lowest common denominator  - basically calling the large part of our community 'lowest common denominator'. That is the main reason for our reaction. We will not tolerate when someone thinks he/she is above community and can freely insult them. This happened before when we announced pve servers. We are going to call on people who behave like entitled pricks and punish them.

[Mrdoomed]

Grapeshot has a history of attacking devs without any reason. Also we have not changed our mind anywhere.

We always are very careful with what we say. We previously said that pirates are not a nation. But while everyone is at war with each other (and can attack each other because there is no judicial punishment for doing that) this difference of not being a nation is blurred for you.

Regarding you protecting people who don't like us.

Its a community and we have a history of protecting silent or less vocal minorities.

Justme said and grapeshot agreed that we are catering to the lowest common denominator - basically calling the large part of our community 'lowest common denominator'. That is the main reason for our reaction. We will not tolerate when someone thinks he/she is above community and can freely insult them. This happened before when we announced pve servers. We are going to call on people who behave like entitled pricks and punish them.

Youre the "edited out" man.

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

Youre the "edited out" man.

Care to explain yourself sir?

[Mrdoomed]

Care to explain yourself sir?

Youre awesome! Love your attitude! Its good to see.

[Insomnion]

I personally think its more likely the people upset about pirates, are upset about losing, more then anything. After all, are the upset US players here admiting that they believed the pirate faction was going to be hardcore, so they joined an easier faction, and they're upset because they dont have the advantage they thought they would?

 

I cant speak for all pirates, but I joined the faction my friends from other games had already joined. They joined a faction that was slightly harder then other factions. We had pvp in mind. We had experiance running clans in other MMO's and we all worked together to form a strong pvp alliance. 

 

Unlike the USA who had no problem rolling through the Spanish, who had a HUGE disadvantage, those of us leading the pirate coalition have made special care to go after BOTH of the strongest factions, the USA and British. 

 

Stop making it out to be something its not, anyone who reads these forums knows that if you were winning, this wouldnt even be a discussion.  

 

Where are all the USA players complaining that the spanish had a unfair disadvantage with theyre port capture windows?

 

Added after second thoughts:

 

If there are any other Decent USA or British players that think this kind of viewpoint your fellows are making are embarrassing make a post that your USA and British and disavow your fellows acting this unsporting. 

 

I personally would welcome some changes to diplomacy mechanics in game and making pirates more hardcore also, but thats just because I welcome a challenge. 

 

No matter what happens dont expect us to stop working together, we have 100-200 people that all like each other and are mostly all on the same ts, over 100 on slow nights like tonight, thats not because we have more people in our faction then you either, its cause we respect each other and have worked together.

 

Either way, lay off the developers theyre doing a great job, and deserve extra credit for sticking too theyre values.

Edited March 7, 2016 by Insomnion

[Captain Comery]

@Insomnion- thank you for saying what we have all been thinking, it's about damn time this was said.

All that I can say is bravo!

[Ruthless4u]

I personally think its more likely the people upset about pirates, are upset about losing, more then anything. After all, are the upset US players here admiting that they believed the pirate faction was going to be hardcore, so they joined an easier faction, and they're upset because they dont have the advantage they thought they would?

 

I cant speak for all pirates, but I joined the faction my friends from other games had already joined. They joined a faction that was slightly harder then other factions. We had pvp in mind. We had experiance running clans in other MMO's and we all worked together to form a strong pvp alliance. 

 

Unlike the USA who had no problem rolling through the Spanish, who had a HUGE disadvantage, those of us leading the pirate coalition have made special care to go after BOTH of the strongest factions, the USA and British. 

 

Stop making it out to be something its not, anyone who reads these forums knows that if you were winning, this wouldnt even be a discussion.  

 

Where are all the USA players complaining that the spanish had a unfair disadvantage with theyre port capture windows?

Still don't get it, amazing how no matter how clearly it's spelled out.