>>> Beta 1.06 Feedback<<< (FINAL UPDATE 6th Release Candidate)

[Norbert Sattler]

43 minutes ago, o Barão said:

3- Sneaky AH.

So many ships in the port report, but it is a lie. They only have one TB.

It's not a lie. The window on the top left shows you only the active ships, but mousing over the port shows you all ships, including the ones in mothballed status.

The AI right now builds way more ships than they have crew to man, so the majority of their ships just sits in port to gather dust.

[o Barão]

3 minutes ago, Norbert Sattler said:

It's not a lie. The window on the top left shows you only the active ships, but mousing over the port shows you all ships, including the ones in mothballed status.

The AI right now builds way more ships than they have crew to man, so the majority of their ships just sits in port to gather dust.

Interesting. Thank you!✌️

[o Barão]

Campaign bug report part II (the end)

I provoke the AH to start a war and the Italians decide to join them without a navy? Oh, ok

1920, and they still only have 2km torpedo? 😑

The funny bug where a ship sunk but continue to sail forward for some km.

Interesting since they already surrendered and are not in game anymore.

There was a peace deal between France and AH and in the same turn they declare war again???? But if that wasn't enough....

War reparations? They are joking, right? 🤪

And because of that damn peace deal, I had to wait four more years for them to surrender. The British were my allies in the end, and so now I can't provoke a war against them.

The campaign ended.

 

Cons:

- There are major issues with diplomacy and events related to nations not in game.

- I dislike the fact the moment a nations "dies" is gone forever.

- The AI still have big issues with building ships and recruiting sailors.

- In my 1920 battle it was clear, the AI wasn't upgrading their ships with the most modern tech.

Pos:

- I didn't had a single crash!

 

Edited June 14, 2022 by o Barão

[Skeksis]

7 hours ago, o Barão said:

@Nick Thomadis I made a test run to see what is possible to get if I set the research tech tree to focus on some specific areas. I was also interesting to know how far could I push the technology in an old hull.

The priority was from the start:

- To get radar, Krupp armor and Induced boilers.

- The moment I got the Krupp armor and Induced boilers, I changed the priority to Big guns, turret mechanism and other techs to save weight.

These are the results:

Radar tech in March 1902. The II version was available in May 1903.

Some images to show the tech progression.

Mark 2 main guns.

Mark3 main guns. Double secondaries. Radar.

Triple main & secondary.

Quad tech. Sadly, the hull didn't allow me to place the second main battery 14 inches 4x turret. But there is room.

The final version. 4 main turrets Mark 5: 3x12 inches and 1x9 inches.

The many refits versions of the same hull.

Two notes to consider from my testing.

- Maybe should be implemented a penalty for researching late tech too soon.

- When going for a refit, I would get a warning that I was moving a tower or a turret too far from the initial position. But, I could just save and do another refit to move again the same component more to the side until I get what I want. So this mechanic is pointless?

 

An idea is to only enable research boost for discovered tech, this should slow tech boosting by 50%.

That’s how I play anyway, boost 1 or 2 tech just to get them over the hurdle and timed for new hulls and there design.

Penalties or hard caps seems too controlling, very unsandboxie. 

Edited June 14, 2022 by Skeksis

[SpecTRe_X]

That's also France, Germany is a different story in my experience. In fact, I have a suspicion Germany is the slowest faction when it comes to research.

My biggest issue is how long it takes to unlock modern light cruiser hulls and oil fired boilers relative to everything else. So much boiler tech is trapped behind mounds of funnel tech as if funnels are actually hard to design. Don't forget also that only about half the tech tree is actually implemented. We're still missing subs, mines, naval tactics, etc on the lower third of the screen.

 

[SodaBit]

I've got some campaign feedback here, and I'm really not sure what to make of it.
I was doing a tech-rush run to see how early I can get things like RADAR 3, Oil 3, etc, etc.
War broke out on the continent, managed to stay out of it myself, and I've been watching the other powers fight each other with these very modest fleets, even by 1920's standards. So, I decided to check in and see just how many ships the AI actually had in their ports and.... dear f***ing lord I wasn't ready for this.

Austria here is by far the worst offender, they're down to only using CL's and smaller in the war, while this is just one of their anchorages. I say worse offender because the British and Italians are doing the same sort of thing. The rollcall for each active port on the continent as of October 1920 is as follows:

Danzig - 6 BB, 1 CA, 1 CL
Scapa Flow - 13 BB, 25 CA, 29 CL, 36 TB
Rosyth - 16 BB, 14 CA, 41 CL, 30 TB
Sunderland - 14 BB, 13 CA, 41 CL, 27 TB
Hull - 20 BB, 11 CA, 44 CL, 35 TB
Yarmouth - 34 BB, 25 CA, 90 CL, 68 TB
Dover - 5 BB, 12 CA, 27 CL, 18 TB
Newhaven - 10 BB, 6 CA, 20 CL, 27 TB
Portsmouth - 10 BB, 18 CA, 47 CL, 24 TB
Plymouth - 15 BB, 18 CA, 41 CL, 26 TB
Barry - 30 BB, 30 CA, 100 CL, 86 TB
Liverpool - 25 BB, 38 CA, 82 CL, 54 TB
Limassol - 1 TB
Olbia - 17 BB, 20 CA, 33 CL, 22 TB
Cagliari - 11 BB, 18 CA, 25 CL, 22 TB
La Spezia - 13 BB, 25 CA, 41 CL, 14 TB
Livorno - 9 BB, 16 CA, 29 CL, 23 TB
Gaeta - 15 BB, 10 CA, 35 CL, 26 TB
Naples - 11 BB, 21 CA, 36 CL, 22 TB
Messina - 11 BB, 18 CA, 35 CL, 29 TB
Palermo - 27 BB, 36 CA, 67 CL, 46 TB
Catania - 18 BB, 20 CA, 37 CL, 27 TB
Taranto - 17 BB, 22 CA, 26 CL, 37 TB
Bari - 16 BB, 25 CA, 28 CL, 16 TB
Ancona - 26 BB, 49 CA, 56 CL, 47 TB
Pula - 45 BB, 27 CA, 14 CL, 7 DD, 11 TB
Spalato - 49 BB, 25 CA, 19 CL, 19 DD, 25 TB
Cattaro - 43 BB, 21 CA, 19 CL, 25 DD, 15 TB

As you might have noticed, there are no French ports on that list. The French Empire collapsed a few years back, with the reason given as "Economic Collapse." I didn't check what the size of their mothball fleet was, but given the state of her rival powers, I'd assume trying to build a fleet of truly hilarious size might have contributed to the end of the empire as much as the war which said fleet was being built to fight.
While I'd like to move in and occupy Paris and the rest of Northern France, that can wait, as there are much MUCH bigger issues to attend to.
The AI is literally building itself to death, not even at the height of its power did the Royal Navy posses as many dreadnoughts as the Austrians have mothballed in a single port. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if those last warfighting units were de-activated in favor of building ever more paperweights. 

Edit, with the fate of the British Empire:

Death by paperweight.
And then there were 3.

Edited June 14, 2022 by SodaBit

[Skeksis]

1 hour ago, o Barão said:

Cons:

- There are major issues with diplomacy and events related to nations not in game.

I’m starting to think full diplomacy has been retracked somewhere between updates 9 or 10, defiantly 11. I.e. mostly wars don’t end in update 11. What we have now is continuous campaigns, 1.05 campaigns prolonged.

Also this is new area of development for the team, maybe we’re in the realm of testing concepts?

[admiralsnackbar]

9 minutes ago, SpecTRe_X said:

That's also France, Germany is a different story in my experience. In fact, I have a suspicion Germany is the slowest faction when it comes to research.

My biggest issue is how long it takes to unlock modern light cruiser hulls and oil fired boilers relative to everything else. So much boiler tech is trapped behind mounds of funnel tech as if funnels are actually hard to design. Don't forget also that only about half the tech tree is actually implemented. We're still missing subs, mines, naval tactics, etc on the lower third of the screen.

 

Well the tech trees work in parallel not serial. 
When you say 'how long' it takes to unlock a modern cruiser what is your starting date? I wouldn't necessarily *want* modern cruisers floating around in 1914. 
 

[IshPR7777]

4 hours ago, o Barão said:

Ok, I managed to get dual quads. It is interesting to see how far we can push the old hulls with modern tech. But at the same time there are many constraints which makes them inferior to other new hulls available. Interesting but balanced. Ok

Another option with better towers, but worse stability issues.

I do love your inspiration and creativity with your old battleship hulls but with modern technology in your French campaign. As I said earlier, this is just for fun, interesting and entertaining purposes only. Overall, I like your French campaign about this one

[o Barão]

1 hour ago, Skeksis said:

An idea is to only enable research boost to discovered tech, this should slow tech boosting by 50%.

This will force the player to focus in only what is available at the time, and to research different techs. 

It can be a good solution. +1

 

 

[o Barão]

6 minutes ago, IsmaelMolina2021 said:

I do love your inspiration and creativity with your old battleship hulls but with modern technology in your French campaign. As I said earlier, this is just for fun, interesting and entertaining purposes only. Overall, I like your French campaign about this one

The initial idea was to see how far could I use old hulls against modern ships and still get a win. Sadly, by around 1910, I noticed the AI failing to create a powerful modern fleet for me to fight. So I was never able to test them against a capable enemy. 😒

 

However, I could get some good feedback from the test. 

Is fun to have old hulls in modern battles, but is clear they are not good enough. Low displacement and size will give you issues with stability and problems to place the components in a cramped area. 

Also, using the refit option can seem to be a cheap and good option. But I made around 15x refits in the same old hull from 1890 all the way to 1935. Is it worth it? Maybe not, but sure is fun to see old ships in battle. 😉

[SpecTRe_X]

34 minutes ago, admiralsnackbar said:

Well the tech trees work in parallel not serial. 
When you say 'how long' it takes to unlock a modern cruiser what is your starting date? I wouldn't necessarily *want* modern cruisers floating around in 1914. 
 

Sure, but the individual branches are in series. I typically start as Germany in 1890. You can already get mostly modern CAs (~18,500t) floating around by 1900 as well as BCs around 1905 if you stop researching guns and such once you unlock the 13" M2 and 2 geared turb. The more modern light cruisers take longer than that though. I've made it to ~1912 built a fairly modern fleet but still had those ridiculous CLs with casemate ports on the sides.

It almost seems like the light cruiser tech was accidentally pushed to the end of the line somewhere.

[The PC Collector]

4 minutes ago, SpecTRe_X said:

Sure, but the individual branches are in series. I typically start as Germany in 1890. You can already get mostly modern CAs (~18,500t) floating around by 1900 as well as BCs around 1905 if you stop researching guns and such once you unlock the 13" M2 and 2 geared turb. The more modern light cruisers take longer than that though. I've made it to ~1912 built a fairly modern fleet but still had those ridiculous CLs with casemate ports on the sides.

It almost seems like the light cruiser tech was accidentally pushed to the end of the line somewhere.

Omaha and Svetlana classes say "Hi!"

You realise that casemate main guns for CLs were top tech in WWI era and were still a thing for brand new cruisers well into the 20s, right?

[o Barão]

6 hours ago, CAR DOOR said:

 but they did sink ships in quite large amounts.

Source? And do not use the night battles around Guadalcanal as a reference.

[Plazma]

Somehow I start play 1900 Germany. Mark II all guns and somehow 2" are OP, but not as much like in 1890. If I have choice to take 5" or 2" I will take in 60% situation 2". (The 3" and 4" are joke... 13" also...) 

Some guns are too big even in default length, caliber compared 8" to 9" the 9" is almost 2x bigger, very hard to fit some guns. Maybe is this good or bad I don't know but... The hulls! I have literally 1 CA hull. 

The tech progress general is okay, maybe little too fast, but sometimes you have Krupp II armor, but the Engine is very behind and you can use only coal... Too big randomize. 

Torps are useless... right now I have range 3km the dmg can only kill the DD or TB(not always) and some BB are that strong that can take a bunch of torps.  Is better to chose 2" gun instead of torps. Medium range, low dmg, medium accuracy, not always we see boom. I will like to see maybe a little better range (like 10% more) and 2x more dmg.

DD and TB are OP. The operation range, the cost, low crew reequipment, firepower, speed make them deadly, low cost and very protected (because of low size and speed) ships. But mostly because of 2" gun. But build the DD or TB is the horrible, because of the balance and putting all what you want on that small ship. 

Crew is the main problem, lack of Crew stop me from build next ships.

The GDP are shrinking no matter what... Playing from 1890-1900 as HA I have 2% biggest GDP from the begining, the AI was collapse because of that. 

Length of barrels is must have. The bonus from it is sick. Please Long casemate 2" are better than 9" normal in any situation in my opinion. 

Diplomacy doesn't work good. But generally after 11 updates of 1.06 now we can enjoy playing it! 

[admiralsnackbar]

4 hours ago, The PC Collector said:

Omaha and Svetlana classes say "Hi!"

You realise that casemate main guns for CLs were top tech in WWI era and were still a thing for brand new cruisers well into the 20s, right?

If you play as Germany you get a 'dreadnought armored cruiser' like SMS blucher, which is basically a miniature battle cruiser. I think he is expecting something similar to appear for light cruisers, when in reality there was no 'Dreadnought light cruiser' or "Dreadnought protected cruiser." 

I will say that I think there should be more *variety* in the hull forms of the light cruisers. Right now light cruiser I-IV are basically just Elswick cruisers of increasing size. CL I should be like Eslmeralda whereas CL IV should look like SMS Konigsberg or the HMS Arethusa (basically they look like giant destroyers). But even those later cruisers used single main battery guns and casemate secondary's IIRC. 


 

Edited June 15, 2022 by admiralsnackbar

[SpecTRe_X]

4 hours ago, The PC Collector said:

Omaha and Svetlana classes say "Hi!"

You realise that casemate main guns for CLs were top tech in WWI era and were still a thing for brand new cruisers well into the 20s, right?

Germany is what I have the most experience with and, from the limited research I've done, it does look like Germany was playing with at least semi-modern CLs by 1905 in the Konigsberg class and were using broadside turrets by Dresden and Kolberg in 1906 and 1908 respectively.

6 minutes ago, admiralsnackbar said:

If you play as Germany you get a 'dreadnought armored cruiser' like SMS blucher, which is basically a miniature battle cruiser. I think he is expecting something similar to appear for light cruisers, when in reality there was no 'Dreadnought light cruiser' or "Dreadnought protected cruiser." 

I will say that I think there should be more *variety* in the hull forms of the light cruisers. Right now light cruiser I-IV are basically just Elswick cruisers of increasing size. CL I should be like Eslmeralda whereas CL IV should look like SMS Konigsberg or the HMS Arethusa (basically they look like giant destroyers). But even those later cruisers used single main battery guns and casemate secondary's IIRC. 


 

SMS Prinzess Wilhelm of the Irene class was built in the late 1880s and didn't have any casemates from what I can tell. Germany seems to have toyed with their inclusion from then on with protected and light cruisers alternating the inclusion of casemate guns every class.

[Max Sin]

To be honest, I don't understand people who don't like the rapid development of technology. This is the whole point - that you are wasting all the resources on manufacturability. At the same time, other branches suffer in terms of development speed, if priority is used. A more technologically advanced ship also costs a lot more, requires a lot more maintenance - and they can be built, respectively, much less. So it's all fair. Moreover, no one prevents AI from also raising its development priorities. Game developers, please leave technology speed as it is for now. No fines or anything needed. Now everything works in this regard perfectly and fairly. You invest more money - you get a more technologically advanced ship and in smaller quantities. Do not invest - do a lot of obsolete ones. Everyone makes a choice for himself. And this is good !

[havaduck]

10 hours ago, Skeksis said:

I’m starting to think full diplomacy has been retracked somewhere between updates 9 or 10, defiantly 11. I.e. mostly wars don’t end in update 11. What we have now is continuous campaigns, 1.05 campaigns prolonged.

Also this is new area of development for the team, maybe we’re in the realm of testing concepts?

This. Its now basically what we had in 1.05 minus the VP bug and the option to keep playing after the point at which the AI would have normally lost.

 

 

@Nick Thomadis Dont mind the nonesenecal arrangement of turrets, I was trying to determin what kind of turrets I wanted on my frech battleship and then I noticed this wen I played with barrels a litte ......

Is this intentional? It does seem to be an excessive difference.

Also french battleships seem to be insanely hard to damage below the waterline. It is possible to kill them, but with the main battery not doing much damage and no flodding unit 3/4 of the structural points are gone, it down to the secondaries to either score massive structrual damage oder cause a loss due to fire.

[Nick Thomadis]

*UPDATE 12 * (15/6/2022)

- Fixed campaign bugs in alliances which caused endless wars. Now when a war ends, the relations are properly modified. (Wars between AI nations might still continue without ending, we need to check and fix)
- Improved tension mechanics to not be caused in regions where a nation has no ports.
- Fixed war reparation bugs. Now the player will be able to receive ship reparations and money.
- Various balances for the campaign.
-(WIP) *Engine Room sections become detailed:* Following the new detailed citadel, the engine room is now automatically configured in size and position according to the placement of funnels. The sections where engines are added, affect ship stability and when they are damaged during battle the corresponding engines may become damaged and affect the ship speed accordingly (In a next update you will be able to choose how many engine shafts your ship may support, from 2 to 5. Now the engine shafts are by default from 2 to 3).
- Battle AI balance.
- Gun ballistics adjustments.
- Balances related to auto-design.
- Crew surrenders at 45% losses (from 70%) and ship needs at least 70% crew to be functional in campaign (from 50%).
- Ship Maneuverability affects more the accuracy.
- Acceleration adjustment according to ship design.
- Flooding slight balances.
- Dud torpedoes base chance reduced slightly.
- Other minor.

Please restart Steam to download (Saves not reset - Older saves of ships or campaign may become dysfunctional)

[Fangoriously]

oh what the hell

Ya sure I had cramped quarters became I hadn't noticed crew loss outpacing all the other ways you can die, but it seems that not just the threshold for surrender is much lower now, crew loss is majorly increased. Ive noticed what kills crew fastest is getting burned down by a huge volume of HE hits, but this was just a battle of AP main gun fire exchange, it absolutely SLAUGHTERED my crew here.

[Danz_Von_Luck]

really like update 12 so far especially the relations/tension which seems much more effectible.

 Definite issue so far is the Protect stance is still broken

[Danz_Von_Luck]

Lol I know the Germans struggle for relations in this game but im pissing off people not even on the map lol

[SiWi]

The Update sounds good.

I also like that you seem to deepen all the existing systems (Citadels, Enginges) one of the time.

[kjg000]

Update 12 - British - 1890 start - no ships.

May 1897

So far there are many more events, sometimes more than one per turn, averaging about one per turn.

I'd say it is slightly too easy to avoid war with diplomacy but this should be a minor tweak.

Still seeing the "phantom" ships in other nations ports.

Other nations, Germany in particular, seem to be building more capital ships and fewer annoying gnats (DD, TB). So the proportions of these have improved.

The "Role" listing still seems to be one off, i.e. you need to select "protect" to get "Invade".

 

Just an aside, I wonder how they calculate the specs for guns. I would have hoped they are using a formula based on barrel diameter, length, propellant and some sort of 'Q' factor. The "Q" factor would be to account for the different quality of manufacture by different nations at different times.Then scaling guns would not show strange abnormalities like the 2", 8" and 12". Don't get me wrong, these are my favorite guns but they do show a strange leap in performance compared to other sizes.