Jump to content
Game-Labs Forum

'Historical' Submod of J&P Rebalance mod, release thread


Recommended Posts

FILES IN SECOND POST

** Current Version: 1.3.1 **

This is the release thread of my 'Historical' mod for UGCW, a submod of the J&P Rebalance mod. I would like to first and foremost thank Pandakraut and Jonny for their copious help in the past six or so months, when I first started undertaking this project. Without their patience and help, this would have been completely impossible.

 

The Story:

Briefly, I started developing this mod innocently in -- I think -- September, I had no notion that it would come to consume a huge portion of my spare time, and that I would mod into it so many things.

But the new ability to have near complete access to the code proved an irresistible “mission creep”. What started as a desire to just reduce casualty numbers has spiralled into a more-or-less complete overhaul, not only of the original game but of J&P.

 

The Gist of It:

The broad theme of the mod has been to make the game more historically authentic, both in how it looks and how it plays. There are really too many changes to list them all here (that's what the changelog is for), so I'll try to synthesize all the changes into a handful of categories. These are: visuals, unit sizing, pace, mechanics, and career paths.

  • Visuals -- The submod looks very different than J&P and vanilla. There are numerous changes to visual effects, like smoke, projectile velocity, etc. And the units themselves are much smaller. Individual unit sprites are less than half their original size and far more numerous, because I wanted a more realistic look. The amount of guys you see on screen is usually now about 1:2 versus the unit's HP, whereas before it was usually more like 1:10.
  • Unit Sizing -- Unit sizes are different across two vectors: the amount of units (regiments, previously brigades) that can fit in a brigade (previously divisions), and the amount of men per unit (HP). Brigades are limited to three regiments per, but you get a lot more of them. Unit sizes are capped out at 1025 for infantry, 250 for cav, 150 (6 guns) for artillery; and skirmishers are a bit special, in that their max number increase as the campaign goes on. This is to reflect their increase usage during the war and evolving tactics (a subject of some dispute apparently, but the option is there in the submod). I wanted a control feel that was a little more authentic and involved, with more complexity of subunit than monster brigades.
  • Pace -- Everything is a lot slower, even than J&P, which was already slower than vanilla. There are a lot of ways this is accomplished, but the effect is a more measured play and more importance of making the right movements at the right time. I find that positioning has become more important in the submod, because if you don't have people in the right place at the right time, things can spiral quickly.
  • Mechanics -- There are so many changes here, it's hard to account for them all, although most of the actual unit balancing is from J&P. Generally, I've tried to rely less on high AI numbers for difficulty, and instead creating handicaps for the player. Positioning is really big, especially your units locations versus each other and to the general(s) on the field. Your generals now give vision to units, and keep them moving at their top speeds. He is far more important, and while it is still possible to have units operating far away from him, they'll only be able to if they're very high skill. They can even start 'lagging' behind their orders a little (the units separate from their command arrow a bit!). Also, units, especially infantry, must stay near their brigade or suffer debuffs in efficiency.

    There are also big changes to things like skirmishers. I've tried to make them completely different than infantry. They are still very deadly but lose morale very quickly even from fire from inferior units. They are far more spread out, visually, and a bit faster in their base skirmish and fallback speeds. Snipers are also completely different, now support units rather than direct combat units. 

    There is a lot more, please read the changelog.
  • Career Paths -- I've tried to make each career path more important, to allow for more specialized play-styles. Politics now gives a higher dividend of recruits and money versus the base, which you'll need because recruit rewards are 80%(!) reduced and money about 20%. Training now allows experience to be gained up to 2x faster. Logistics gives you more officers available in the academy. AO is very important now, as it reduces all of the movement debuffs from not being around general, from not being around brigade, and from losing vision away from general; it now doubles as the 'command & control' career path. Recon now allows your general himself to see farther from elevation; so if you have a general-centered play-style (slow moving), you might want to go for this instead so that he can spot for artillery. Also, information about enemy units is vastly reduced by default: you now get rough estimates about unit strength and character, and Recon points help you see more of that.

This is just a synopsis of all the changes.  Please see the changelog for a full list of changes. Again, thanks to Jonny and Panda and everyone who gave feedback and encouragement on the discord; and to Fiasco whose interest first pushed me into trying to mod.

Edited by adishee
  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 198
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

FILES IN SECOND POST ** Current Version: 1.3.1 ** This is the release thread of my 'Historical' mod for UGCW, a submod of the J&P Rebalance mod. I would like to first and foremost thank

This is an amazing mod, and I want to stress it’s far more than I’ll ever contribute to this game. I’d love to do a proper review, but there are a couple of oddities I don’t think were intended as par

Allow me to preface any further communications by saying I really do appreciate the sub mod, the work put into it and for the most part I am really enjoying the slower more thought out approach to the

Posted Images

Posted (edited)

Download link, v1.3.1 download

v1.3 changelog : download


Version 1.3 is the biggest release yet of the submod. It was originally to be called v1.28, but with the huge changes included in the mod I've opted for the more pronounced number of 1.3. It started out mostly as an incremental upgrade to incorporate the latest J&P features, but mission creep has led to another complete transformation of the core mechanics of the mod/game. These core changes are, in brief: a) a completely new morale engine, b) a completely new efficiency/cohesion engine centered around brigade cohesion, c) officers with personality traits and reputation, d) and a completely novel system of commanding units. These are only the primary changes and there are many, many more.

'Ironman' mode is set to on by default. This mode is a lot of fun, on medium difficulty even for an experienced player I have found. It can be switched off in the Historical config.

Edited by adishee
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Warbacon said:

The mod does not seem to be working for me.

I unzipped it into the correct folder just as I did with the J&P mod and it has changed nothing in the game. 

Do you have a historical submod folder under /Mod/Rebalance after unzipping? Full default path below.

C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Ultimate General Civil War\Ultimate General Civil War_Data\Mod\Rebalance\historical submod

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, pandakraut said:

Do you have a historical submod folder under /Mod/Rebalance after unzipping? Full default path below.

C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Ultimate General Civil War\Ultimate General Civil War_Data\Mod\Rebalance\historical submod

I got it to work by moving the zip file into the Ultimate General Civil War_Data and then unzipping it there. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

@Keith68 , glad you got the submod working.

That's intentional, your troops' spotting range decreases if you move your general away from them. I did this simulating the concept that information is more useful to the general than the troops, sort for the player to role-play as the general.

So try moving your general close to them to restore their vision. If you put points into Army Organization, this effect will diminish and your troops will be able to spot longer distances without the general. I did that to simulate a delegation of command.

Also, try detaching some skirmishers because they have longer spotting range.

Hope that helps!

Edited by adishee
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Keith68 said:

First impressions spotting is really harsh, my troops can't see the cannon on the walls of the Potomac fort even when they have stormed the fort walls and are in the fort!

I also have a bit of an issue with the sight distance of troops.

I currently have 3 points in Army Org and 4 in Recon however even with skirmishers I can not see infantry or cannon that is directly in front of me across a creek. 

Their infantry and cannon are able to hit any unit I currently have deployed all the way back to the 627 (Tyler) 1st Ohio.

20200319122259_1.jpg

Edited by Warbacon
Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi @Warbacon.
 

Okay, this is a tiny problem with First Manassas, because on that first stage there is no general. That means those initial reinforcements are quite vulnerable.

I suggest that you wait for the full force to arrive and then try to link them up with your general. Obviously not ideal, but in all honesty you can't take that bridge anyway with that force.

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, adishee said:

Hi @Warbacon.
 

Okay, this is a tiny problem with First Manassas, because on that first stage there is no general. That means those initial reinforcements are quite vulnerable.

I suggest that you wait for the full force to arrive and then try to link them up with your general. Obviously not ideal, but in all honesty you can't take that bridge anyway with that force.

Allow me to preface any further communications by saying I really do appreciate the sub mod, the work put into it and for the most part I am really enjoying the slower more thought out approach to the battles. I only want to put in my two cents to things I think may need a look see and do not mean to put down or degrade any part of the sub mod or work done. 

I hear ya, did not expect to take the bridge with such low numbers and the higher ground taken by the enemy. However not being able to see anything that close just seems a bit extreme in making the point of needing a general to see further and operate at a higher level. 

One other thing I may add about the effectiveness of the cannon. I understand that not having the general close by and being overseen by captains will put a bite into the abilities of the cannon crews but both cannon in the screenshot went through all their ammo and got a combined 49 kills. Not sure if this is something from the original mod or if it can even be remedied but wow that seems really low. Seeing how we have a time limit on taking points during any battle having them do such low damage does little for us being able to pressure the enemy. Perhaps there is a learning curve I have yet to make it over, it's just a tough one to work around trying to make best use of the cannon in a time limited senario.  

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
58 minutes ago, adishee said:

@Keith68 , glad you got the submod working.

That's intentional, your troops' spotting range decreases if you move your general away from them. I did this simulating the concept that information is more useful to the general than the troops, sort for the player to role-play as the general.

So try moving your general close to them to restore their vision. If you put points into Army Organization, this effect will diminish and your troops will be able to spot longer distances without the general. I did that to simulate a delegation of command.

Also, try detaching some skirmishers because they have longer spotting range.

Hope that helps!

Is it configurable in any way?  By distance perhaps?  The idea makes sense, but in real life troops without a general nearby would still understand 'something' was in front of them even if they didn't know exactly what it was or could see the big picture.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Warbacon said:

Allow me to preface any further communications by saying I really do appreciate the sub mod, the work put into it and for the most part I am really enjoying the slower more thought out approach to the battles. I only want to put in my two cents to things I think may need a look see and do not mean to put down or degrade any part of the sub mod or work done. 

I hear ya, did not expect to take the bridge with such low numbers and the higher ground taken by the enemy. However not being able to see anything that close just seems a bit extreme in making the point of needing a general to see further and operate at a higher level. 

One other thing I may add about the effectiveness of the cannon. I understand that not having the general close by and being overseen by captains will put a bite into the abilities of the cannon crews but both cannon in the screenshot went through all their ammo and got a combined 49 kills. Not sure if this is something from the original mod or if it can even be remedied but wow that seems really low. Seeing how we have a time limit on taking points during any battle having them do such low damage does little for us being able to pressure the enemy. Perhaps there is a learning curve I have yet to make it over, it's just a tough one to work around trying to make best use of the cannon in a time limited senario.  

Thanks @Warbacon, I welcome criticism.

Honestly, the allied cannon in that battle are basically useless. They're 6-pounders and only effective if you're firing canister in close. I didn't do anything to change that from J&P, and the morale damage in the submod is a bit higher for cannon, esp for canister shot.

I usually mass all five or six batteries you get for that battle and perch them on that hill, eventually they will do  little damage. 

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Keith68 said:

Is it configurable in any way?  By distance perhaps?  The idea makes sense, but in real life troops without a general nearby would still understand 'something' was in front of them even if they didn't know exactly what it was or could see the big picture.

I didn't put any option in to configure that, no. I see what you mean, it was a risky design decision, but I was / am trying to make the game much harder without simply adding more AI troops to slaughter. I had to get creative. This function makes your general(s) much more in demand and requires them to keep the armies running in good order ... like how I perceived it might have been.

Ultimately, you can deploy skirmishers forward if you really want to see what's there. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Warbacon said:

One other thing I may add about the effectiveness of the cannon. I understand that not having the general close by and being overseen by captains will put a bite into the abilities of the cannon crews but both cannon in the screenshot went through all their ammo and got a combined 49 kills. Not sure if this is something from the original mod or if it can even be remedied but wow that seems really low. Seeing how we have a time limit on taking points during any battle having them do such low damage does little for us being able to pressure the enemy. Perhaps there is a learning curve I have yet to make it over, it's just a tough one to work around trying to make best use of the cannon in a time limited senario.  

This is mostly base mod stuff. A lot of damage is tied up in having good stats, officers, and weapons and these allied units have none of those. If you let 6pdrs blast away at anything more than half range they do very little. You can see why in the updated weapon tooltips that show the range damage multiplier. The 6pdrs can do well at canister as Adishee mentioned though. I usually park them up by the middle ford and let them gain stats by shooting the unit there until the rest of the army shows up.

Rest assured, experienced artillery crews with better cannon can be incredibly strong. The 6pdr is basically just for that lead up to Shiloh when you are scrambling to field anything you can.

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

@adishee Thanks for the hard work.... I have been playing this game for a while because I loved the fact that this game covers a period in history not given some gaming love. I have played the campaigned at all levels and from both camps as well as the rebalance mod Jonny and Pandakraut. Now, I just started a new Union campaign after the latest update to the rebalance mod, does your mod overwrites theirs or can it be used in conjuction with theirs?

thanks

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, i64man said:

@adishee Thanks for the hard work.... I have been playing this game for a while because I loved the fact that this game covers a period in history not given some gaming love. I have played the campaigned at all levels and from both camps as well as the rebalance mod Jonny and Pandakraut. Now, I just started a new Union campaign after the latest update to the rebalance mod, does your mod overwrites theirs or can it be used in conjuction with theirs?

thanks

Hey @i64man, thanks for your kind words.

This mod it is not compatible with any other, unfortunately. If you try to continue your J&P campaign after installing the submod, things will probably get very weird because many things are different. Basically starting a new campaign is required -- but of course you can switch back and forth between campaigns if you want, all you have to do is install whichever mod you want at the time and they should match to each campaign. I think. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, adishee said:

Hey @i64man, thanks for your kind words.

This mod it is not compatible with any other, unfortunately. If you try to continue your J&P campaign after installing the submod, things will probably get very weird because many things are different. Basically starting a new campaign is required -- but of course you can switch back and forth between campaigns if you want, all you have to do is install whichever mod you want at the time and they should match to each campaign. I think. 

@adishee, Thanks for the explanation. I will give it a try. Lucky for me on my new campaign is still early enough that I can start new 

Link to post
Share on other sites

I like the concept but I am having ghosting problems, all units, mine and AI, seem not to be were they are visually everytime they move. The units seem to move substantially faster than the visual representation of them. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Schonhult said:

I like the concept but I am having ghosting problems, all units, mine and AI, seem not to be were they are visually everytime they move. The units seem to move substantially faster than the visual representation of them. 

@Schonhult, can you say more about the effect? I used to have some mechanic that was kind of like that, but I took it out because it wasn't what I wanted.

Being closer to the general makes all of your units move faster, and units being near other units in their brigade makes them more efficient and thus faster as well. You need to keep that in mind when playing in the submod.

 

*Edit*, Okay I do see what you mean, I am seeing it on my current Union playtest campaign. This is a remnant of the old effect that used to be much more pronounced, which I reduced. I made it to simulate units getting outside of an effective command and control coordination, so that they kind of get lost.

Two ways to reduce this debuff: keep your general near your units; and invest in Army Organization points, which double in the submod as command and control points. This will let your units operate more independently of your generals, like a command delegation.

Edited by adishee
Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, i64man said:

@adishee when starting a new campaign as the union,  do you start with the same units as usual or do you get units based on the state? I.e. 10th Pennsylvania?

@i64man, you start out with units that are named the same as in vanilla, but after that your units get auto-named (at least inf and cav do) by state. In 1.2, I've changed it to abbreviated state names by popular demand. (10th PA.)

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

@ adishee, I think something is not quite right.I see the limit on the new brigades is 1025, but the names are only base on the officer incharge... see the screenhsot attached... I downloaded the file and extracted the files using 7zip... once open, I copied the files into the respective folder

20200322134706_1.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...