Remove trade goods entirely

[Raekur]

At this point since it seems that a lot of the threads are moving towards empowering the strictly pvp players, why have trade goods? If the trade goods were removed real's could still be gained through combating AI and doubloons are gained from combating players. So the generation of money remains intact even with the removal of trade goods. At this point trade goods do not really serve any function other than to give the illusion that there is a supported aspect of this game other than pvp. Removal of the trade tool will prove that.

[Vernon Merrill]

I would venture a guess to say that there are probably 2 traders to every 1 hunter on the PvP server, who's only goal is to make as much money as possible and every now and then pew pew with some AI in a lonely corner of the map.

 

And that is ok.

[Hethwill]

When you bump, out of nowhere while in a pleasure cruise, a treasure fleet of 6 players, each one with 4 indiamans, you know that trade stuff serves a purpose.

At least they made it look proper. Was a fantastic age of sail moment.

Not everyone has the same imagination or expectations.

[Angus MacDuff]

That's a very bitter and cynical OP.  I don't trade often but I have to on occasion.  PVP and PVE fighting doesn't pay the way it used to, so you have to do the occasional trade run to pick up some Reals.  There is fun in making money via trade, because of the risk factor.  Many players do nothing but trade...so why would you take that away from them??

[Georg Fromm]

8 minutes ago, Raekur said:

At this point since it seems that a lot of the threads are moving towards empowering the strictly pvp players, why have trade goods? If the trade goods were removed real's could still be gained through combating AI and doubloons are gained from combating players. So the generation of money remains intact even with the removal of trade goods. At this point trade goods do not really serve any function other than to give the illusion that there is a supported aspect of this game other than pvp. Removal of the trade tool will prove that.

A good idea, of course, by implication, also take 50% of the players their motivational base, removed with all needless merchant ships 30% of the shipping traffic from the game. And while we're at it, we're still taking out 50% of the players who do not see PvP as their only main occupation in this game.

Maybe there are similar great suggestions, I think we can do it without problems to drive the game in 2019 against the wall.

[Raekur]

43 minutes ago, Phaserburn said:

Who do the hunters hunt without traders moving goods around?

Well right now the only hunters I have seen are in max speed builds so that they can rape a trade ship and have enough speed to run from a warship.While I know there used to be some very entertaining hunters (Metastatic) some of the ones I have encountered so far have been nothing short of cowards going for the non challenging kill. Remove the trade goods, it removes the easy marks and leaves you the pvp game that everyone seems to want.

[Angus MacDuff]

10 minutes ago, Raekur said:

non challenging kill

Deserves to die.  I'd far rather have a challenging fight.  Unescorted traders, some without guns...on a PVP server.  Make it challenging.  Escort your traders.  Some traders are very good and add another level to the game.  Last night @Hethwill spotted a large group of traders in convoy.  Too big a bite for the solo hunters.  That sort of play means opponents must plan for that and bring interesting content to the game.

[Raekur]

That works fine if you are part of a large clan, what about the players who are either just starting out or part of a small clan? We need to abandon this train of thought that the best option is joining a large clan is the only solution. I have been part of several large clans and the majority of them are led by egotistical little twats who refuse to work with other clans and feel that a dictatorship is the best approach. Add to this the recent posts that are going to change a large portion of where players are. Now the hunters can find their prey in single locations instead of having to guess. See the trend, not the occurrence.

[Dalai Lama]

Welcome to NAL

[Angus MacDuff]

I just don't see the issue.  I brought some traders to MT the other night and sailed right past a brit Req that was camped at the edge of the green zone.  My lead ship was a warship and he escorted me in.  No tag.  Players who do nothing but trade have an acceptable loss rate (we've chatted).  Trade is a vital part of the game and properly executed trade runs are very satisfying for those who do it.  The "easy meat" traders just have to learn to be challenging.

[Dalai Lama]

I already suggested to make trade more rewarding... the thrill if you will make it with those valuable goods into MT during primetime should be rewarded by a big profit. High risk = high profit. Also creates content if done right. And you can very well defend yourself as trader, even alone... wouldnt hurt though to give traders/trading some more love though like special rewards/skills/books.

Adding player delivery contracts could pice up things too.

[Eyesore]

If anything ... trade should be the fuel to make war.

It would help if trade would have an impact/influence on ports/regions (may suggestions have already been made).

[Macjimm]

14 hours ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Make it challenging.  Escort your traders.  Some traders are very good and add another level to the game.  Last night @Hethwill spotted a large group of traders in convoy.  Too big a bite for the solo hunters.  That sort of play means opponents must plan for that and bring interesting content to the game.

Players can create more interesting content than game mechanics will ever do.

Squadrons of players, using a variety of warships escorting traders. Some groups have a scout sailing ahead, in a very fast vessel that will report back if a threat is found.

Other players trade alone and prefer to deliver resources to players rather than grinding goods between port shops.

But having trade goods is easy cash for traders, and puts more targets out to sea.

[Hethwill]

Doing NA activities together, even if it is simple escort of a friend in his indiaman, cements a group.

Do not let your trader/crafter friend sail alone. Always escort him and have a good time.

You have no idea if a raider is beyond the horizon. And if there's one, then there will be battle !  And both you and your buddy will have a good time ( or not ).

 

[Raekur]

So I guess that if you are a solo player due to time limitations or one that after joining a few clans got fed up with the ego of some of the clan leaders that the only option is to look for a different game to play. There is already a multitude of things stacked against the new players is it crazy. Missions where you face 2 to 1 odds against ships that are automatically stronger than you. Very low chances to gain experience to gain levels without having to spend 30 min to gain just 100 xp taking out traders. So why not just "persuade" players to sail just warships and do pvp. Remove the trade goods and grant greater money gains from attacking players. Instead of slowly screwing over the players that are not hard core PVP just focus the game on pvp and let the ones that do not want to play that kind of game go elsewhere instead of making then the SHEEP that the hunters can bolster their ego on.

[Hethwill]

On 2/5/2019 at 3:52 PM, Raekur said:

hunters I have seen are in max speed builds so that they can rape a trade ship and have enough speed to run from a warship.

This is exactly how raiders of trade at sea operate since antiquity to our modern age. Amazing... 😲

( only difference, and a major one, is that in NA many raiders simply do not care about the cargo prize... but some "interpretive" players try to emulate history by means of using the game mechanics as best as they can  )

[Angus MacDuff]

40 minutes ago, Raekur said:

So I guess that if you are a solo player due to time limitations or one that after joining a few clans got fed up with the ego of some of the clan leaders that the only option is to look for a different game to play. There is already a multitude of things stacked against the new players is it crazy. Missions where you face 2 to 1 odds against ships that are automatically stronger than you. Very low chances to gain experience to gain levels without having to spend 30 min to gain just 100 xp taking out traders. So why not just "persuade" players to sail just warships and do pvp. Remove the trade goods and grant greater money gains from attacking players. Instead of slowly screwing over the players that are not hard core PVP just focus the game on pvp and let the ones that do not want to play that kind of game go elsewhere instead of making then the SHEEP that the hunters can bolster their ego on.

You're just ignoring what people are saying here.  Trading is easy.  Making money is easy.  Yes, trade ships will be killed/captured, but more will get through and that is a fun aspect of the game.  Solo trade is very rewarding once you figure it out.  Figuring it out is extremely rewarding and satisfying.  Why you gotta be so negative, man?

[Raekur]

52 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

This is exactly how raiders of trade at sea operate since antiquity to our modern age. Amazing... 😲

( only difference, and a major one, is that in NA many raiders simply do not care about the cargo prize... but some "interpretive" players try to emulate history by means of using the game mechanics as best as they can  )

That is part of the issue with raiding now. Raiding is done to gain money or resources. The raiding that is being conducted now is nothing other than being pure malice. No loot is taken away, no trade ships are being captured. It is all winding up on the bottom of the ocean. So, if that is the way the game has evolved, remove the trade goods and lets just pit warship vs warship. Let the game move towards conquest of ports and the battles between the warships of rival nations instead of this waste a couple of hours of my time just so that some paper thin ship can run up and beat the idiot AI into ground round and thus cost me 60% of my cargo...just to have it repeated because any trade ship with cargo is incapable of getting away.

[jodgi]

28 minutes ago, Raekur said:

remove the trade goods and lets just pit warship vs warship

I'm ok with that, but you're not listening to the other guys telling you they like doing trade runs and like hunting traders.

To you I'm probably one of the "pure malice" guys. Is it so bad that all I want in this game is to shoot at ships? I tag anything I see unless it's way stronger than me or a requin. I don't play games to care about money so why should my raiding adhere to the ideas in your passive aggressive post?

[Angus MacDuff]

1 hour ago, Raekur said:

The raiding that is being conducted now is nothing other than being pure malice. No loot is taken away, no trade ships are being captured. It is all winding up on the bottom of the ocean

Absolutely not true.  But it is selective.  When I cap a trader I look at the cargo and decide if it is worth my time to bring it to port.  If I am deep in enemy waters and there is no consuming port nearby, then yes I will sink it for the doubloons (player traders).  I have gleefully taken well loaded traders back to my ports regardless of time is the cargo is worth it.  There is no malice in killing a player trader.  It's simply economics.  Sinking an Indiaman has given me 2600 Doubloons, but sometimes their cargo is not very valuable, or they're empty.  If I engage 3 Indiamen with my Herc, then i'm not looking to capture (cause I can't!).  I just want the battle, cause y'know...it's a PVP game.

Edited February 12, 2019 by Angus MacDuff

[Hethwill]

I get what you mean, and i'm with you regarding the "trade raiding" rewards should be ... well... the prized goods...

But... you suggest to completely remove a layer that stops deadtrack several player's favorite gameplay - trading and the guys that prey on trading.

Many players dump the trade goods you carry, but for others they are a source of income. 

[Raekur]

And with the latest patch, trade ships are now even easier to take out...anyone seeing a pattern here yet... 

The main reason I made this post was that as a trader I am getting sick of the aspect of the game that I enjoy being spoon fed to the hard core pvp players simply because they spend most there time running around in Bermuda/Teak ships hunting traders for easy kills instead of just going after other warships. So I call BS on these twits who complain that there is not enough pvp. What they want is to be lazy and go only after easier targets like traders. Saw proof of that yesterday where one pirate instead of going after an equal class ship turned and ran after a friend of mine in a LGV and was making better speed then she did, so that showed that his ship was built for only going after much weaker targets and not for anything in the same class he was. Seal clubbing player perhaps...

[Eyesore]

Some outfit their tradeships to fight ... not for speed (as it wouldn't help anyway).  Repelled and even managed to sink a few 'raiders' that way. Sure, you will lose a certain percentage of your tradeships, just calculate that into your prizes ... losses are unavoidable.