Provide more protection for Traders. (NPC Fleets for hire)

[Ned Loe]

Naval Action is home for many hardcore traders who sail long distances in order to make hard earned coin. I have a big respect for those people and I would like to suggest NPC Fleets/Escorts to make their journeys safer from ganks or other threats. With Fleets making it's way back to NA I think devs must give Traders some love and protect them.

 

Here is an example of how NA is loosing players in easy way and doesn't realize it - Player spends 1 hour sailing to load his ship with goods and another hour to bring it back to his destination, but right before he reaches his destination port he gets attacked by 2 players and they take his ship and all his cargo. Problem - 2 hours lost, money, cargo lost and most importantly the reason/will to go back and try again vanishes. Player loosing his interest because he knows he is an easy prey and wasting 2 hours on nothing is not his thing. -1 Player for NA. Bad review etc..

 

Now. On the other hand, if traders will be able to hire Fleet/Escort they will be able to fight or maybe have time to escape. These NPCs will give traders new hope. This will result in more fun battles when 2 players jumped a solo Player.

 

In the end, traders can hire Fleets/Escorts based on the amount they want to invest and loose when ganked, but such investment can result in safe cargo shipments and fun gameplay. 

[Hyperion74]

Ya know, that isn't a bad idea. Another option would be player sailing in a convoy with escorts. That would take some planning and would not work for "single" players.

[Jean Ribault]

It should be seriously considered.  I personally have narrowly escaped a few instances in the past.  But I would've had naturally larger stones if my fleet escort were with me.  Sometimes it helps to hide with a big AI fleet in the shipping lanes, but why not make it personally your own for a little bit of coin?

[Skully]

I know the player base is a bit low at the moment, but what else is barring you from getting players to give you an escort close to harbors?

[Ned Loe]

I know the player base is a bit low at the moment, but what else is barring you from getting players to give you an escort close to harbors?

If developers want to be successful they must create environment where players operate on their own and don't rely on other players and their availability. No one has time to sail for 1-2 hours with every trader in the game and why would you take other people away from pvp just to help and protect traders? This is not logical. 

 

NPCs can take care of that and provide more protection and entertainment in gank situations for both parties. Such Escorts must only be attachable to solo or grouped Trader ships. This means - Traders should be able to hire stronger ships and combine them if they sail in the group.

 

There is also must be a rule concerning attack vs traders. Anyone who attacks trader alone or in a group will not be able to spawn their fleets in that battle vs trader while trader ships can. (This rule is for Players in Trader ships only).

 

Close harbors are risk free in 90% of cases and require little to no escort. We are talking people who sail long distances, we also look at what is happening in general and not single cases.  

[Vernon Merrill]

Put an ad on the national chat and offer to pay. Someone who is looking for something to do will be willing to sign up. Done. I think we're trying to make things a bit too lovey-dovey personally. If you want to make a bigger profit by running goods instead of using deliveries, you should also accept the risk. And not for nothing, the LGV and Indiaman are already OP'ed to give them a fighting chance.

[Hethwill]

I already think twice before engaging traders with escort, usually by buddies or tagging along a npc fleet roaming around...

 

... yes, let's make player traders unreachable now that the game balanced them INTO PLAYING other than teleporting.

[Bach]

I'm one of those guys that like to haul long distances. When I first started EVE I would make my money buying low in one system and selling it high three systems away. The same holds true in NA. I often sail a frigate to the forgott n edges of NA with my smuggler flag on. When I get to out of the way ports I cap a trader and go shopping in the ports. It's easy to buy thousands of coal at 23 gold. Take that to La Habana and it will sell for 60 gold. Iron for 250 gold.

I think you mean well but are making the assumption traders are weak. That's not really the case. The truth is that many traders simply aren't trying to plan ahead. They just think of hauling things from point a to point b. If they get caught some blame the hunters that caught them. I don't. Those hunters make the game for me just like pvp groups do for you. Figuring out how to get past them and how to run from certain ship types is the excitement and challenge in my game. Otherwise I literally am just hauling stuff from point a to point b. They also help separate the men traders from the boy traders. If I plan a strategy and get the skills to smuggle goods in hostile markets while other merchants don't that is how I beat them in the merchant aspect of the game. That's what puts me at the top of the smuggler boards so to speak.

So, I'm not saying the fleets are a bad idea. In fact they are already coming back with the crew patch. I'll be able to create my own fleets at that time and will probably choose x2 captured rattlesnake escorts for my cargo ship. But please be careful over simplifying aspects of the game. Not ever contest in the sand box is direct pvp. Some of it is chase and be chased contests.

Edited June 21, 2016 by Bach

[hellshammy]

Maybe pay a lower rank captain in a frigate some money to escort ya and you wont have these problems,less profit but at least you have some security.As somebody stated above,to much hand holding wanted,more player driven action needed

[Æthlstan]

Escort duty is usually boring because hunters will not attack a trader with an escort. I wont waste my time being an escort even if I am paid to do it, as I have rarely lost cargo trading, and I always trade without an escort.

 

To be clear, I think having the option to have NPC escorts is a good one. We dont need bored players on escort duty.

Edited June 21, 2016 by Æthlstan

[Vernon Merrill]

That's not true at all. If I see a trader with an escort, that's a big sign that says "this guy is carrying something good"... And I'd more than likely give it a go, depending on what I'm in.

[Skully]

You sail out with the ganker fleet and when you come back, you go in with the fleeters. On open sea itself you don't really need an escort, that's a reasonable risk to take.

 

Gankers love to have a trader ship around, as Vernon says, it's a perfect bait. Keep an eye on the wind, make sure you have fast tacklers. You may find yourself in battle alongside the gankers. But that just spices things up.

[Hethwill]

Escort duty is usually boring because hunters will not attack a trader with an escort. I wont waste my time being an escort even if I am paid to do it, as I have rarely lost cargo trading, and I always trade without an escort.

 

To be clear, I think having the option to have NPC escorts is a good one. We dont need bored players on escort duty.

 

And kill pirates playing piracy and privateers playing privateers. Roger that. Let's have NPC handle it all, why not

[Ned Loe]

I understand many pirates want to keep everything as it is, so they can have an easy prey. No matter what Pirates say I recommend devs to review this suggestion. Understand, every ganked player could be -1 player for NA and you are contributing to less resources on the market and less traders supplying national markets.

 

Promoting safe Trading and also fun and more pvp is developers main goal. In the end, I only suggest and don't have right to tell what is right and what is wrong. 

[Mrdoomed]

I understand many pirates want to keep everything as it is, so they can have easy prey. No matter what Pirates say I recommend devs to review this suggestion. Understand, every ganked player could be -1 player for NA and you are contributing to less resources on the market and less traders supplying national markets.

Promoting safe Trading and also fun and more pvp is developers main goal. In the end, I only suggest and don't have right to tell what is right and what is wrong.

Sounds about right. 1 month before pirates get changed so they will only be going after trade ships we should make player trade ships (that FINALLY have to trade instead of teleport ) impossible to capture for a pirate.

Wonder why this game is dying?

[Bulwyf]

Put an ad on the national chat and offer to pay. Someone who is looking for something to do will be willing to sign up. Done. I think we're trying to make things a bit too lovey-dovey personally. If you want to make a bigger profit by running goods instead of using deliveries, you should also accept the risk. And not for nothing, the LGV and Indiaman are already OP'ed to give them a fighting chance.

 

Neither of these ships has a real chance against the bulk of warships that hunt them, Renomees, frigates and up can all take them with relative ease though the Renomees is a bit marginal. 

 

Escorts are not easily come by as most people can make more readily by missions etc, if they are after action then its not a good option either, friends are sometimes willing but often not available at the time so some system of escorts would be much preferred.

 

I have used deliveries when I transferred nations and it is the single most efficient way to blow  your gold with minimum return. Way way overpriced.

Edited June 21, 2016 by Bulwyf

[Hethwill]

-1 Trader or -1 Trader Raider... well... all comes down to choices I guess. I am all against solo mechanics that kill the social part of the game. After all asking clan buddies or nation chat for a escort is not hard and there's always help.

 

But hey if Fleets are done smart by all means, close the discussion. AI is dumb as a door and won't stop a boarding.

[Bulwyf]

I'm one of those guys that like to haul long distances. When I first started EVE I would make my money buying low in one system and selling it high three systems away. The same holds true in NA. I often sail a frigate to the forgott n edges of NA with my smuggler flag on. When I get to out of the way ports I cap a trader and go shopping in the ports. It's easy to buy thousands of coal at 23 gold. Take that to La Habana and it will sell for 60 gold. Iron for 250 gold.

I think you mean well but are making the assumption traders are weak. That's not really the case. The truth is that many traders simply aren't trying to plan ahead. They just think of hauling things from point a to point b. If they get caught some blame the hunters that caught them. I don't. Those hunters make the game for me just like pvp groups do for you. Figuring out how to get past them and how to run from certain ship types is the excitement and challenge in my game. Otherwise I literally am just hauling stuff from point a to point b. They also help separate the men traders from the boy traders. If I plan a strategy and get the skills to smuggle goods in hostile markets while other merchants don't that is how I beat them in the merchant aspect of the game. That's what puts me at the top of the smuggler boards so to speak.

So, I'm not saying the fleets are a bad idea. In fact they are already coming back with the crew patch. I'll be able to create my own fleets at that time and will probably choose x2 captured rattlesnake escorts for my cargo ship. But please be careful over simplifying aspects of the game. Not ever contest in the sand box is direct pvp. Some of it is chase and be chased contests.

 

I wouldn't consider you a trader at all, just a smuggler, if your a crafter like myself there are no benefits from the present system and lots of risks. Bring on the escorts.

[CaptVonGunn]

The ability to post a mission for people to escort traders.. They get x pay from teh system for the load arriving safely and a bonus for any kills or captures defending it in PvP in route

[Bach]

Sounds about right. 1 month before pirates get changed so they will only be going after trade ships we should make player trade ships (that FINALLY have to trade instead of teleport ) impossible to capture for a pirate.

Wonder why this game is dying?

I'm sorry OP. I know you mean well for us traders but MrDoomed is right. Over protecting kills the game off just as fast as players leaving from being what they consider unfairly attacked. It's a lesson POTBS paid the price for. We just can't say we have a pvp oriented pirate genre game if we remove the ability to be pirates. Just as many players will quit over this. POTBS proved that already.

What works better than protection is some form of awards for the merchant running the risk and providing the potential prey for the pirate. Instead of looking for ways to make a safer pvp game (can you say oxymoron?) find ways to reward risk taking players.

Edited June 22, 2016 by Bach

[Idle Champion]

Hasn't the possibility of NPC fleeting using a ship you provide and your own hired crew been raised by the devs?

 

Seeing "Rear Admiral Whatsisface sailing on Indiaman, Fleet: Cerberus, Cerberus" or "Rear Admiral Nonotthatguy sailing on Ingermanland, Fleet: Le Gros Ventre, Le Gros Ventre." may be a thing pretty soon.

 

By the same token, seeing "Curse Thatotherguy sailing on Constitution, Fleet: Rattlesnake." may also be a thing. (In this theoretical, the pirate only has one NPC so he can cap and take prizes.)

[Cpt Blackthorne]

I've made this suggestion before in the "Little Things You'd Like To See" topic. Not many people were fond of it...or maybe not fond of me suggesting it. heh. I still would like to see a NPC fleet and be able to right click on it and choose escort, even if it meant paying for the escort.

But there are a few ways to counter these bandits attacking you in your trader, mostly already mentioned: Ask players for an escort, move to another safer location, attempt the transport at a different time, or use smaller and faster traders.

 

Another suggestion I'd like to see are the NPC fleets engaging players on their own. However, the size of some of these fleets are larger than any fleet ever existed and the ships aren't even of the same nation. Seems odd to see 20 Vics sailing with 20 Santis and all the others in one fleet. These need to be scaled down and rearranged with national ships sailing together.

[Æthlstan]

I fail to see how escorts would hurt pirates, as no pirates I know hunt alone. 2 NPC ships should provide no challenge to experienced players.

 

I like the idea of player generated escort missions....tho I think that would be hard to code and very exploitable

[Mrdoomed]

I fail to see how escorts would hurt pirates, as no pirates I know hunt alone. 2 NPC ships should provide no challenge to experienced players.

I like the idea of player generated escort missions....tho I think that would be hard to code and very exploitable

If 2 ai ships offer no real protection then why advocate for it ?

They keep saying they want a player driven world but do everything they can to ensure players never need to interact.

[Bulwyf]

I'm sorry OP. I know you mean well for us traders but MrDoomed is right. Over protecting kills the game off just as fast as players leaving from being what they consider unfairly attacked. It's a lesson POTBS paid the price for. We just can't say we have a pvp oriented pirate genre game if we remove the ability to be pirates. Just as many players will quit over this. POTBS proved that already.

What works better than protection is some form of awards for the merchant running the risk and providing the potential prey for the pirate. Instead of looking for ways to make a safer pvp game (can you say oxymoron?) find ways to reward risk taking players.

 

The game is Naval Action, not pirate action. I don't really understand why pirates are in the game at all and it would probably be an improvement to get rid of them altogether.