Patch 9.65 - Crew and resource production

[Unsubbed]

We thought of that and have the prototype ready but it is not out for one reason.

It helps majority of players BUT allows several wonderful exploits for exploiters

For example you bring 20 ships into battle which do nothing and power level another guy who gets boosted XP

Why couldn't people already do this?  If all 20 players did what you are talking about currently and then just left the battle wouldn't it still count as a win for the 1 guy they were power leveling?  It would be counted as a win I suppose if all 20 people left and gave him the win.  So since people can already exploit the current system, why not just improve it for the vast majority who don't have that many friends in the first place.

[Godream]

Impressions so far:

 

Pros:

 

New UI font is cleaner and crisper and looks far better.

Ships feel much more realistic in their handling in battle. 

Crew management isn't any more tedious then before.

 

Cons:

 

Graphical performance seems to have taken a large hit. Before the patch on maximum settings using FSAA and no MSAA I was getting 39-45 fps. Now I get 31-36 fps with the same settings as pre patch.

Boarding is now a bit more tedious, while increasing brace prep costs removes the just brace until you exhaust the AI preperation boredom it means you are in the button click menu of boredom even longer.

 

Bugs:

 

Trader Snows show having 11 guns showing at ports now in battle and the AI will aggressively attack you, despite only actually having the usual 6 carronades.

Hmmm not sure what happened to your graphics settings...in OW mine are the same as pre-patch and in battle they are quite higher (about 15 fps higher now, ultra settings with no AA and med shadows so ~ 65fps)

[admin]

My concern is a game that only rewards winners while sending losers back to PVE grinding is a game that will have losers quit the game, leaving only winners - which then turns some of the winners into losers, who will then in turn quit.

 

No that's not what you said. You said increasing pvp rewards (which we did) is a wrong direction. Which sounds strange because you contradict yourself. 

Look at the reasoning

• You say - pvp rewards should be increased
• PvP rewards are increased
• You say it is a step in the wrong direction

Most games reward results and most captains on the Franco/Spanish side in Trafalgar were not rewarded even though they fought bravely. We give them damage XP AND increased rewards if they manage to sink someone. You propose to reward someone for just showing up doing some random pew pew into enemy general direction.

 

We reward for kills/assists handsomely and it is a good thing. Stay in battle and sink someone and you will learn something.

[Porpoise]

Everybody concerning about losing precious ships which are hard to get should go to EVE online for 1 month.

 

1) ships are cheap and the rewards for NPC missions were adjusted

- I did 40k gold in 15 minutes ganking NPC fleet with my friends

 

2) 5 durability - divide your ships cost with the durability and you will be somewhere arround 100k per life sailing only golden Trincs and Connies

 

3) Is anybody really that stupid to get ganked 5 times in 1 day?

 

4) If you do not have the respectable fleet, do not sail the big ship alone in hostile waters. You will get ganked. You need to be ninja when going solo/small gang. 

 

5) What do you exactly want? Free ships to turn this game into endless flaw of brainless players "doing" pvp?

 

I got only 1 wish concerning the PVP and that is complete removal of AI reinforcements or reducing its range. When people are so stupid they are running unprotected with traders stashed with gold and not even paying attention to OW they deserve to pay for it. The AI reinforcements system forces you to fight the same class of the ship you have and then the 1:30 exit timer is really funny. 

 

 

And few advices in the end:

 

Do not sail anything you can not afford to lose. That is basic of every sandbox game. 

Edited March 10, 2016 by Porpoise

[Taranis]

Looking forward to trying the patch - that said very concerned about the adjustment made to Marines.  I love that PvP xp has been ramped up - but this game's xp grind is just awful (particularly for a paid for game) and the Marines adjustment is probably going to make sailing undercrewed much much worse...  I hope there is a decent way to solve for that (other than just downsizing ships).

 

Please consider increasing the xp structure (other actions than just pvp should also be rewarded).

[Porpoise]

Looking forward to trying the patch - that said very concerned about the adjustment made to Marines.  I love that PvP xp has been ramped up - but this game's xp grind is just awful (particularly for a paid for game) and the Marines adjustment is probably going to make sailing undercrewed much much worse...  I hope there is a decent way to solve for that (other than just downsizing ships).

 

Please consider increasing the xp structure (other actions than just pvp should also be rewarded).

 

I think the XP curve is actually very friendly. The only limiting factor is the crew size. Now with the new crew management system you can operate undercrewed ships more comfortably I think. 

The learning curve should be preserved. I do not want to see everybody sailing a ship of the line after 5 days in the game. Many peeps think that bigger ship is better. They have to learn it is not always that way.

[Tindahbawx]

I think we would be better off stripping gankers of rewards than giving rewards to gankees.

 

I know I will always run, no matter how much I could earn. Out of spite.

 

Probably shouldnt sail in dangerous waters then.

 

 

My concern is a game that only rewards winners while sending losers back to PVE grinding is a game that will have losers quit the game, leaving only winners - which then turns some of the winners into losers, who will then in turn quit.

 

You play on a PvP server, yes? I cannot understand your viewpoint, you want to encourage people who consistently lose battles?

Edited March 10, 2016 by Tindahbawx

[Quineloe]

No that's not what you said. You said increasing pvp rewards (which we did) is a wrong direction. Which sounds strange because you contradict yourself. 

Look at the reasoning

• You say - pvp rewards should be increased
• PvP rewards are increased
• You say it is a step in the wrong direction

Most games reward results and most captains on the Franco/Spanish side in Trafalgar were not rewarded even though they fought bravely. We give them damage XP AND increased rewards if they manage to sink someone. You propose to reward someone for just showing up doing some random pew pew into enemy general direction.

 

We reward for kills/assists handsomely and it is a good thing. Stay in battle and sink someone and you will learn something.

 

That is not what I said. I meant that increasing the "KILL/ASSIST" Rewards is not the right direction. Damage is negligible for rewards - as proven by my screenshot. Even a lot of damage gives you next to no reward. I've said this before today. You're rewarding damage already - why not boost that part?

 

This isn't Trafalgar, this is a game and people don't stay around in games where they are punished twice.

Edited March 10, 2016 by Quineloe

[Taranis]

I think the XP curve is actually very friendly. The only limiting factor is the crew size. Now with the new crew management system you can operate undercrewed ships more comfortably I think. 

The learning curve should be preserved. I do not want to see everybody sailing a ship of the line after 5 days in the game. Many peeps think that bigger ship is better. They have to learn it is not always that way.

 

I hope you are right about the undercrewed issue.

 

Also, some players may have more limited available time on their hands.  The game should not just be in favor of those that have 10 hours a day to devote to it.  Also, other actions (trading, scouting, crafting,...) should yield xp as well.  But , i certainly can understand that players that have attained high levels want to keep the barriers to entry and a privileged access to better tier ships - as an advantage over the competition.

Edited March 10, 2016 by TaranisPrime

[Quineloe]

 

You play on a PvP server, yes? I cannot understand your viewpoint, you want to encourage people who consistently lose battles?

 

Yes, I want to encourage players who lose battles to continue playing, continue PVPing. So that we don't end up with the POBS scenario, where only winners were left to PVP, and the majority of losers simply avoided it as much as possible.

 

Winners don't need a lot of encouragement, they're already rewarded fairly well, and they're winning. Which in itself is a reward.

[Porpoise]

I hope you are right about the undercrewed issue.

 

Also, some players may have more limited available time on their hands.  The game should not just be in favor of those that have 10 hours a day to devote to it.  Also, other actions (trading, scouting, crafting,...) should yield xp as well.  But , i certainly can understand that players that have attained high levels want to keep the barriers to entry and a privileged access to better tier ships - as an advantage over the competition.

 

I am more concerned about players who reach the endgame quickly and quit because there is not enough contentent except Port battles. While you are grinding, you are always looking forward to the new ship. 

The devs also stated that there will be exploration/scouting content in the future. 

[kitsunelegend]

Over all this seems like a very nice patch, especially the new crew changes! Cannot wait till the weekend to try it out as I gotta work today and tomorrow... ='(

 

However, I'm not so sure I like the changes to the crafting notes....I was the go to person for a while in my clan for making crafting notes. I saved all of my hours and spent a lot of money on making crafting notes, and I'm only level 13 crafting....this will really hurt me, as I am no where near the level required as some people are saying, to make the high level notes now....

 

Please correct me if I am wrong, but do I seriously need to be level 35 or something in order craft high grade notes? Or can anyone that can already craft notes craft all kinds, they just need to proper mats to do so?

 

because, if its the first, then I am boned harder than anything atm....

 

Can someone please clarify this for me?

[surfimp]

 

Maintenance time moved 2 hours earlier required some heroic sacrifices from our QA

 

So is this a permanent change? Meaning maintenance will be at 8:00 AM GMT, all the time?

 

If so, it's bad for my playtime as in the Pacific timezone, I'll get at most 2-3 hours per night before server maintenance. Forcing me to casual status at best... I can't change what time my work ends for the day, or what time my kids go to bed.

 

Oh well at least I'll be forced to get better sleep, maybe not a bad thing

[Lord Ravenburg]

I may not have read all of the detail, or missed some of it?

Can someone inform me how Marines are going to work now? Ships of the line, and dare I say it, all ships affiliated with a military nation, had a contingent of marines over and above the crew needed to man them. It feels totally unhistorical for a ship of the line to essentially become...a troop transport?

Am I missing something? But 50% of your crew going into marines? Does that not make your ship one stern rake away from immobile...or not able to shoot properly? Sure you can board the other player...but you would need to catch them first?

 

The term exceptional instills the idea of being good, however I dont like my chances if I have to put all my crew into sailing, ram the player out of the wind and then board them as some strange Romanesque trireme?

 

Any assistance here would be wonderful.

 

Cheers,

 

Ravenburg.

[Quineloe]

Marines basically turn a set amount of your crew into boarding only crew. My MC Marines turned 40% of my crew into marines. Which means I was sailing a Renommee at 60% crew - it was terrible. I assume exceptional marines would do 50%; turning any ship into something that is basically only capable of boarding.

 

And they don't even prepare for boarding, you still need to assign your regular crew to boarding prep.

 

For solo hunting, you are better off with extra hammocks.

 

For group capturing, they're probably great because you can now just board those big ships without having to decrew them first

[Lord Ravenburg]

AH I see, well looks like I will be removing my marines from my ship very quickly when engaging in PVP, PVE grind tactics will have them replaced for capture.

 

Also, as a point of gripe, Australasia is once again shafted by Server Down Times =P......
 

7:00pm Aus Time, 9:00pm NZ.

 

Le Sigh.

[LittleJP]

Yeah, Marines should've stayed at x percentage of crew above base, and they are constalty assigned to boarding..

[Porpoise]

I do not like the way the marines work either. 

[Snail]

The Marines change is non-sensical. You use an UPGRADE slot to make your ship worse in every aspect except the actual boarding itself?

 

That's not an upgrade. The mod is pretty much useless now, because with it, you've lost the ability you need to put it to use.

 

Revert this.

[Quineloe]

I'd really like more control over my crew. I can either have like 100 guys on the sails on my trinc, or 180. I don't need that many, but I need more than 0.

[admin]

I hope you are right about the undercrewed issue.

 

Also, some players may have more limited available time on their hands.  The game should not just be in favor of those that have 10 hours a day to devote to it.  Also, other actions (trading, scouting, crafting,...) should yield xp as well.  But , i certainly can understand that players that have attained high levels want to keep the barriers to entry and a privileged access to better tier ships - as an advantage over the competition.

 

its better to increase rewards or reduce rank thresholds gradually because it will be hard to take them back from players

we know grind is an issue for many and will address it - but slower than some might expect.

thresholds could get adjusted next. 

The Marines change is non-sensical. You use an UPGRADE slot to make your ship worse in every aspect except the actual boarding itself?

 

That's not an upgrade. The mod is pretty much useless now, because with it, you've lost the ability you need to put it to use.

 

Revert this.

no

 

marines are perfect now

pick the Marines upgrade not on color but on % of crew you want to allocate to marines - you were warned about it in patchnotes. 

In the future marines upgrade (and monkeys) will be abandoned and will be replaced by crew/marines/support people hire. You will decide if you want to hire 100 sailors or 50 sailors and 50 marines. or maybe just 50 sailors to save prize money

 

this is a step towards this. (in locked percentages)

[Quineloe]

The marine change isn't that bad. You can have a real boarding powerhouse with them. They're just no longer fit for solo hunting.

 

It's not like there's a lack of regular boarding upgrades. You can still fill all 5 upgrade slots with +boarding stuff that doesn't have a penalty for your solo trader raiding.

 

The only thing I'd like to see is marines also helping with some tasks so they're not just dead weight before boarding. Shoot their rifles during ship combat (in our era there already are proper rifles developed), help fight fire (you're basically dead with a 50% marine ship if a fire breaks out) and do their own boarding preparation.

Edited March 10, 2016 by Quineloe

[Lord Ravenburg]

Well I have my explanation now, makes more sense. Especially with the future hiring of crew. Although I do still insist historically Marines were an addition to crew needed to man and sail a ship of the line.

 

But games will be games, and balance must be had. I will just chuck a butt tonne of muskets etc on my ships =P. Get better upgrades for cannon dispersion and become a long gun menace. Never liked the old ramming esc combat anyway.

[Bert Beard]

How do you reset your outposts ?

 

Since the patch the outposts I have don't work very well and it's far too expensive to add new ones.

Edited March 10, 2016 by Bert Beard

[Teamski]

The marine change isn't that bad. You can have a real boarding powerhouse with them. They're just no longer fit for solo hunting.

 

It's not like there's a lack of regular boarding upgrades. You can still fill all 5 upgrade slots with +boarding stuff that doesn't have a penalty for your solo trader raiding.

 

The only thing I'd like to see is marines also helping with some tasks so they're not just dead weight before boarding. Shoot their rifles during ship combat (in our era there already are proper rifles developed), help fight fire (you're basically dead with a 50% marine ship if a fire breaks out) and do their own boarding preparation.

 

 

A valid point.  Marines also manned the guns in combat.......

 

-Ski