Joegrag Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 The Frigate was finished in 1684 and it was able to carry a maximum 60 guns in total ( 5 pounders and 12 pounders ). It s length over all was 125 feet and the breadth was 34 feet. It started it s service in 1684 as an escort ship until it sank and burnt down in 1693 after it was attacked by 2 french frigats and a fireship Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim DeGrim Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Silly question, is it Dutch or German? (my apologies if I offend either! The spelling to the untrained eye looks like it could be either) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Witte de With Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 That's got to be german. No offence taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Danforth Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 That big ol' horse would make a great target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weirdguy Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 It has a German name, but I believe it was actually Dutch. Germany didn't exist at time for that matter. And technically it isn't a Frigate. This is a full "Ship of the Line", a 3rd rate. Again, ship model makers need engineering blueprints to be able to make ships. However, I already have the prints for the Friedrich Wilhelm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BungeeLemming Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 Actually she was a frigate. Shipdesign changed a lot in the 17-19th century. And the Friedrich Wilhelm zu Pferde is a 1680 design. A lot of old frigates had two decks. Only when shipdesigners went ahead and could built longer vessels the typical one decked frigate would evolve. You can compare the size of this frigate (late 1600s) and one of the late 1700s like the Hébe class: Friedrich von.. (1680): 125 feet. (38,1 m) ->54 guns Hebe class (1781): 152 feet. (46.3 m) ->40 guns Thats 100 years apart You can observe such development within every class of ships. frigates and ships of the line especially. Have alook at the armament of rated ships and you see what kind of improvement the structural inegrity experienced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirones Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 build by dutch for the Kurbrandenburgische Marine like some other ships 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Witte de With Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 So Dutch in build, German in name and service. She does remind me of the Batavia in many (obvious, I think) ways. The somewhat lower poopdeck on the Friedrich illustrates another evolution in shipbuilding. http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Batavia_(ship)?uselang=nl#mediaviewer/File:Batavia-NL.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balck Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 As Dutch as it gets, design wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weirdguy Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Actually she was a frigate. Shipdesign changed a lot in the 17-19th century. And the Friedrich Wilhelm zu Pferde is a 1680 design. A lot of old frigates had two decks. Only when shipdesigners went ahead and could built longer vessels the typical one decked frigate would evolve. You can compare the size of this frigate (late 1600s) and one of the late 1700s like the Hébe class: Friedrich von.. (1680): 125 feet. (38,1 m) ->54 guns Hebe class (1781): 152 feet. (46.3 m) ->40 guns Thats 100 years apart You can observe such development within every class of ships. frigates and ships of the line especially. Have alook at the armament of rated ships and you see what kind of improvement the structural inegrity experienced. I think it has more to do with languages and what ships are called in each language. The plans I posted are in German, intended for making model ships. The word "Fregatte" does translate to English as Frigate, but what I want to know is what Frigate is supposed to mean. As in where did the word come from. In Naval Action I wouldn't dare call this ship a Frigate. It is a 3rd rate Ship of the Line. It would probably help to avoid confusion when ship classes and names are used in a game by kids who probably have no idea what nautical terminology means. Even Port and Starboard mean nothing to newbies/land lubbers. So, my vote is to call Friedrich Wilhelm zu Pferde a ship of the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 The look of these ships is so unique, and aesthetically more pleasing than the later ships of the period. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balck Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 The look of these ships is so unique, and aesthetically more pleasing than the later ships of the period. Agreed. My favorite time period for naval design was mid to late 17th century. I think it is because each ship had a personality of its own. There weren't preset classes per say. This didn't prevent them from producing massive numbers however. The number of ships involved in the large/decisive battle of the period dwarfed Trafalgar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thalion Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Well, the ship itself was built in Pillau and finished in Königsberg (both Prussia) by a dutch shipbuilder named Gillis C. Peckelhering. So it is a definately a ship with dutch design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SchurkjeBoefje Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Well, the ship itself was built in Pillau and finished in Königsberg (both Prussia) by a dutch shipbuilder named Gillis C. Peckelhering. So it is a definately a ship with dutch design. Peckelhering?! That probably means 'salted herring', hahahaha. What a surname. We silly Dutch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ned Loe Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 Friedrich Wilhelm zu Pferde aka 'Alexander' The construction of a biplane designed vessel began in 1680 and was designed by Gillis C. Peckelhering in Pillawperformed. The ship was launched on 25 April 1681 in Pillaw from the stack. It was then in Königsberg completed and put into service in October 1684. The construction costs of classified frigate Frederick William on horseback were 70,000 florins . 1685 Ship of Pillaw was in the new home port after Emden laid. In September 1691 served as Konvoier on the route from Emden to the Shetland Islands . In July 1692 met Frederick William on horseback from Emden to sea towards West Africa and the West Indies . On 31 October 1693 ship to 22 clock situated twenty sea miles west of was Cape Spartel of three French ships and Brander attacked and applied. The ship burned on November 1, 1693 and completely lost. The envisaged in the design maximum armament was 60 cannons. 1692 had the ship, however, armed with only 20 and 5 Dreipfünder twelve guns. The manning of the ship swayed while serving between 160 to 250 men. 1687 served on the ship 250 sailors and 50 soldiers, in 1689, 150 sailors and 50 soldiers and 1,692 sided 160 men to serve on the ship. Captain of the ship was Jan Le Sage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mass Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 Nice find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BungeeLemming Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 hmm.. merging gone wrong. Still the thread was already here and I wanted them together 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brigand Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 That's not really a frigate is it? looks more like a (nice looking) regular ship to me. ~Brigand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SchurkjeBoefje Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 That's not really a frigate is it? looks more like a (nice looking) regular ship to me. ~Brigand I believe the term 'frigate' was used rather loosely in the 17th century, describing various forms of warship. Later on it become more synonymous with the single decker fast warship that we now consider "the" frigate of the age of sail. Even today, 'frigate' is a not very well defined term for a warship. Is it defined by function? Size? Multiple possibilites there and also used rather liberally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Austrum Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 I believe the term 'frigate' was used rather loosely in the 17th century, describing various forms of warship. Later on it become more synonymous with the single decker fast warship that we now consider "the" frigate of the age of sail. Even today, 'frigate' is a not very well defined term for a warship. Is it defined by function? Size? Multiple possibilites there and also used rather liberally. Your correct about Frigates, they really are kind of all over the place describing alot of differently designed vessels all throughout history. It is kind of like if something didn't exactly fit neatly somewhere else, it was called a Frigate. Anyway, there are alot of 2 deck Frigates that bear strong resemblance to larger SoLs but they are still classed Frigates. I think it had to do with what guns it mounted taking into account number and size or it seems like it anyway. 2 Deck Frigates seem to all mount 9lb and 12lb guns where 4th rate SoLs mounted 18lb and 24lb guns though that is just speculation on my part. Of course then for a long time you had a standardize type of ship that represented a Frigate which seemed to encompass basically any single gun deck ship with more than 20-Guns. Of course even their the lines got blurred. The Constitution which was designed as a Frigate, really had more in common with a 4th rate SoL as far as firepower and armor anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brigand Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 I believe the term 'frigate' was used rather loosely in the 17th century, describing various forms of warship. Later on it become more synonymous with the single decker fast warship that we now consider "the" frigate of the age of sail. Even today, 'frigate' is a not very well defined term for a warship. Is it defined by function? Size? Multiple possibilites there and also used rather liberally. Thanks, I noticed my terminology was too strict. ~Brigand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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