Hotfix 5 for patch 9.97 - event changes + minor fixes

[admin]

Hotfix was deployed today. 

1. There are now 4 admiralty pop events during the day to bring more timezones into the picture. They alternate daily as before.
2. Capture zones were updated for all ports to take into account first port battle experiences
3. Time to win the port battle if you control all 3 capture zones was slightly increased (from 14 mins to 20 mins)
4. Bug with bow leaks causing abnormal number of leaks due to collider placement - fixed. 

Update

Mast thickness was reverted back to old numbers on 4th rates and above. At the moment changes are not in the game, will be done in the next hotfix.
5th rates and below mast bonuses (compared to the pre-patch level) are now 10% (hp) and 5%(thickness)

[Puchu]

no mast pen fix  

[Vernon Merrill]

Agreed Puchu...  HP buff was great...  Thickness was overkill...

[HachiRoku]

yeah mast thickness was perfect before imho. increasing hp was a great move

[Corona Lisa]

27 minutes ago, admin said:

Hotfix was deployed today. 

1. There are now 4 admiralty pop events during the day to bring more timezones into the picture. They alternate daily as before.
2. Capture zones were updated for all ports to take into account first port battle experiences
3. Time to win the port battle if you control all 3 capture zones was slightly increased (from 14 mins to 20 mins)
4. Bug with bow leaks causing abnormal number of leaks due to collider placement - fixed. 

Do you also changed the turnrate of the pirate frigate?

[elite92]

7 minutes ago, JonSnowLetsGo said:

Do you also changed the turnrate of the pirate frigate?

they changed many turn rates i think because the put a 3% turn speed bonus on pirate perk of the officer, go check it

[Ned Loe]

34 minutes ago, Puchu said:

no mast pen fix  

Let's test little more. 

[Puchu]

Wind there is nothing to test. The thickness on masts is higher than the cannon penetration in duels. There is literally nothing you could test about it. Shooting masts in duels is completely remooved. It is 100% replaced by the less skillfull chaining.

(I know what you are trying to say. Wait till the changes settle, you will all see that being demasted is not fun for the demasted, And you basically cannot defend vs demasting, whereas with desailing you allways are still somewhat maneuverable and desailing has diminishing returns like crew killing and you can defend against desailing by yard and sail setting. But trust me, there are many things happening on a regular basis that are not only not fun, but actually infuriating in NA which are much worse than the occasional demasting.)

Edited December 22, 2016 by Puchu

[Zoky]

Why increase HP? Was it that bad?

[Puchu]

I have no idea who claimed it was bad! Not a single forum post from the last patch is about that. (A little hp increase is fine but i dont think it was needed.)

[van der Clam]

Minor fix needed to be able to move paint schemes to warehouse. If you're not going to allow us to craft them, please don't make us waste warehouse space with them. They're not even stackable.

[Yar Matey]

1 hour ago, Otto Kohl said:

IMHO it was ok. But as i said in other post (which was deleted of course - welcome to North Korea), propably too many dev's friends or mods has been demasted recently... Thats the only explanation to me since i also saw no complaining on the forum about demasting.

I was thinking the exact same thing when I saw moderator "Wind" defending the changes to mast thicknesses while pretty much everyone else was saying the mast changes were bad.  I too am having many of my posts deleted, even under general discussion, where we are supposed to be allowed more leniency of off topic discussion. 

[Ned Loe]

1 hour ago, Hodo said:

Hell I am getting warnings for posting to many memes or videos to illustrate my point.  But I guess some people dont like being made a fool of when they are wrong.  

 

And this mast thickness issue is pretty bad.  Even with 24lb long guns you are hard pressed to penetrate the masts on a rattlesnake.   

It's not an issue it's a test process. It will be tuned down eventually I am sure. Test your patience for few weeks maybe?

[Kiithnaras]

I tend to agree with the vein of this discussion - masts are annoyingly-difficult to pen now. Throw on top of that the carronade pen nerf. I would -gladly- take this mast HP buff while returning mast thickness to October levels (or maybe even June levels?).

For reference, a Constitution started with a mast thickness of 75cm - Med 24s could pen those at a rather significant range (500m +). Maybe not June levels.

Sometime between June and October, the first mast-thickness buff raised that to 96cm - Able to be penned by med 24s at around 250m. Not bad, probably a good balanced level.

Presently, a connie's mast thickness is 103cm - One would have to apply consistent damage with med 24s inside 100m in order to reliably damage those masts. Longs could extend that to 250m, just barely.

Carronades are all but useless at penning anything but paper maché outside 100m. A 42pd carronade would have trouble penning a connie's mast even at 100m! (102cm pen vs 103cm thickenss).

Yeh, I'd be cool with dropping mast thickness back one update with the HP buff to masts. It would allow us to do reliable damage to masts while making demasting take longer.

Now as for carronades....(uses different thread)

Edit: And Wind, I can't speak for others, but I like to theorycraft and wargame, and I'm pretty good at predicting results. I don't think anyone here is calling for an immediate, full-stop roll-back. Personally, I don't mind testing stuff - I'm still gonna play the game and have piles of fun with it either way. I'm just sayin' I can get a good measure of where the wind blows. ; )

Edited December 22, 2016 by Kiithnaras

[Ned Loe]

17 minutes ago, Kiithnaras said:

I tend to agree with the vein of this discussion - masts are annoyingly-difficult to pen now. Throw on top of that the carronade pen nerf. I would -gladly- take this mast HP buff while returning mast thickness to October levels (or maybe even June levels?).

For reference, a Constitution started with a mast thickness of 75cm - Med 24s could pen those at a rather significant range (500m +). Maybe not June levels.

Sometime between June and October, the first mast-thickness buff raised that to 96cm - Able to be penned by med 24s at around 250m. Not bad, probably a good balanced level.

Presently, a connie's mast thickness is 103cm - One would have to apply consistent damage with med 24s inside 100m in order to reliably damage those masts. Longs could extend that to 250m, just barely.

Carronades are all but useless at penning anything but paper maché outside 100m. A 42pd carronade would have trouble penning a connie's mast even at 100m! (102cm pen vs 103cm thickenss).

Yeh, I'd be cool with dropping mast thickness back one update with the HP buff to masts. It would allow us to do reliable damage to masts while making demasting take longer.

Now as for carronades....(uses different thread)

Did you test demast with a 3:1 ratio? Take 2 friends and go try to demas Conie with caros/longs at different ranges. See if it works. 

3:1x100=+300% Damage

If damage to sails from 3 Frigates (combined) vs Conie equals to pre patch damage output of one ship, then we are fine. 

[Kiithnaras]

1 minute ago, Wind said:

Did you test demast with a 3:1 ratio?

Wat?

[Jean Ribault]

5 hours ago, admin said:

...

1. Bug with bow leaks causing abnormal number of leaks due to collider placement - fixed. 

 

Bummer, I was having fun with that. 

[Guest]

@Wind Look at the trinc to see why the thickness buff was overkill.

trinc's largest gun - 18 lb long 

18 lb long gun max penetration = 109cm

trrinc's new mast thickness = 112cm

So at ANY distance, a trinc could not demast another trinc. This is a problem, and should be fixed quickly instead of "testing" for 2-3 weeks. It's not just my opinion, historically similar sized ships could demast each other, and often did.

 

I realize that even before this patch one trinc would struggle to demast the other, but at least it was POSSIBLE...

[Ned Loe]

12 minutes ago, EliteDelta said:

@Wind Look at the trinc to see why the thickness buff was overkill.

trinc's largest gun - 18 lb long 

18 lb long gun max penetration = 109cm

trrinc's new mast thickness = 112cm

So at ANY distance, a trinc could not demast another trinc. This is a problem, and should be fixed quickly instead of "testing" for 2-3 weeks. It's not just my opinion, historically similar sized ships could demast each other, and often did.

 

I realize that even before this patch one trinc would struggle to demast the other, but at least it was POSSIBLE...

Devs should stick with 3vs1 ratio (read ^ post) . Like I said before only new players demast in 1vs1 and if you hunt traders in most cases you slightly damage sails and rage board when you tag at the right wind angle. This simply means that Conie can easily fight 3 Frigates and be able to show force and not loose sails fast in gank situations and 'maybe' survive. This makes Naval Action rating system work. Player should know that even with 3 frigates it should be difficult to take on a heavily armed 4th rate and and not suffer casualties. 

Today gankers jump people, demast, sink and get away undamaged. Game breaking imho. 

Just my opinion, please don't get mad.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Wind said:

Devs should stick with 3vs1 ratio (read ^ post) . Like I said before only new players demast in 1vs1 and if you hunt traders in most cases you slightly damage sails and rage board when you tag at the right wind angle. 

What you just said isn't true at all. I use demasting often in 1v1 fights, and it works very well if you know what you're doing. 

Yes I don't have as many hours as someone here, but with nearly 1000 hours I don't think I'm "new" anymore.

In fact, I would argue you have to be somewhat experienced to use the tactic at all, because new players can't aim well enough to bring down a mast.

Edited December 22, 2016 by Guest

[Guest]

@Wind Your comment about 3:1 isn't true. If NONE of the individual shots are penetratrating, those masts will never fall.

[Kiithnaras]

@EliteDelta It isn't impossible. Just practically implausible. Not penning doesn't do zero damage, just much less than full damage. Basically, yes, you're better off shredding sails than attempting to demast at this point.

And crap, yeah. There was apparently a third mast thickness update. Connie is now at 113cm, didn't realize that. At that thickness, another connie could -only- pen another connie's masts at 50m with 42pd carros or 24pd mediums, or 100m with 24pd longs. That's just silly.

@Wind I see, you're talking 3v1 combat, with 3 people focusing on demasting one. There is no point to that, though. With three ships, some sail damage, and aggressively-clever maneuvering, three ships would simply box in the one and rageboard in much less time than it would take for those same ships to demast the one. Demasting is only practical when numbers are roughly-even where boxing in is not an option and where pushing the opposing ship up into the wind is not practical. It also hampers a fun tactic I like to use helping out newer players in smaller ships by demasting and decrewing ships larger than they're sailing so they can get assists/kills and decent damage on them without stealing the show.

[Ned Loe]

10 minutes ago, EliteDelta said:

@Wind Your comment about 3:1 isn't true. If NONE of the individual shots are penetratrating, those masts will never fall.

I have tested it myself. If you take 3 guys in light frigates and kite from range, you will chew anyones sails. It's just a mater of time. Since Naval Action uses only 1 repair system (many people exploit it by dragging time demasting) and once victim used a sail repair it's over for him. I like what Devs did, this gives people in heavier ships a chance vs a wolf pack. Nerfing sail damage forces gankers to come close and fight broadside to broadside and this is what is causing public outrage. Why? because people got used to easy kills and forgot how much it hurts if you come close around a 4th rate, so they stick to range kiting. Range kiting is a huge time consumer for other players and is very bad for this game. On the other hand, you can still try to kite at closer ranges, but eventually heavier ship will start chewing your armor and odds will get more even. 

[Kiithnaras]

Just now, Wind said:

I have tested it myself. If you take 3 guys in light frigates and kite from range, you will chew anyones sails. It's just a mater of time. Since Naval Action uses only 1 repair system (many people exploit it by dragging time demasting). Nerfing sail damage forces gankers to come close and fight broadside to broadside and this is what is causing public outrage. 

A) Not outraged, just annoyed.

B ) Demasting and sail damage are entirely different creatures.

C) Afaik, sail damage was not nerfed and not what we're discussing, it's the ability to damage masts at any range that doesn't involve sticking one's bow up the enemy's stern.

D) If you really want a game that boils down to just sailing up close side-to-side and slugging it out, we're going to painfully disagree on -many- topics. Broadside slugfests are the least interesting part of naval combat.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Wind said:

I have tested it myself. If you take 3 guys in light frigates and kite from range, you will chew anyones sails. It's just a mater of time. Since Naval Action uses only 1 repair system (many people exploit it by dragging time demasting). Nerfing sail damage forces gankers to come close and fight broadside to broadside and this is what is causing public outrage. 

I agree that sail damage will happen, but the masts won't fall. 

It is true that damage can be done without penetrating, but even 3 frigates (with 18lb long cannons) vs 1 conni won't be enough damage to knock down any masts - because the shots won't be penetrating.

 

I am only arguing against the thickness increase, not the hp (life). Increasing ho just means it would take a little longer to demast, which could be okay.