Pirates - a personal view on their role in the game

[woodenfish]

Let me begin by saying this post is not a reaction to what's been going on on pvp global. Within my clan, and within the game, we've been thinking about what the role of pirates should be for some time, both to make the game more interesting for everyone and also to make being a pirate more interesting as an option.

Lets get the screams of no from the current pirates out of the way first:

• Pirates should not be able to capture ports.
• Pirates should not be able to build anything above a pirate frigate and it should be insanely difficult for them to own/run anything above a 3rd rate. In fact I'm not even sure if they should be able to own anything above a 3rd rate.

Why? Because pirates never rocked up in Victory's - they never had the resources to build/maintain such ships, that required a national effort.

So what should pirates get to make up for these restriction?

• They should be able to make ports in places where other people can't, maybe in 6-10 locations around the map. They can build an outpost and move their ships for free once a week via TP. That would allow them to suddenly appear in an area and cause trouble. The nation force in that area would have to deal with it. If they did, the pirates could melt away again.
• They should be able to raid ports, allowing them to raid all the resources they can carry - up to a maximum of 50% of the resources of each player in the port (They see just the totals of each resource and then it gets removed from players resources on a percentage basis). Each port can be hit once a week. That would force nations/clans to look after their hubs. 
• They should be able to be hired by nations to do thier dirty work - temporarliy sailing under the flag of that nation whilst fulfilling missions for them.
• They get to fight outlaw battles with each other.

 

I think this would make pirates an interesting option and something different instead of how they are now, which is a nation with additional benefits. Currently everyone should play pirates in order to have a level playing field. All other nations are at a disadvantage.

Edited August 12, 2017 by woodenfish

[Pelennor]

Your point of view is totally legit.

An other one can say that in a sandbox game, pirate Republic can raise as a nation, and pretend to play a major role in Caribbeans.

[CaptainCaveMan]

What are the Developers plans with the game...are they trying to make it realistic?  If so then your point is valid...Pirates never were a nation, their role was typically a chaotic interrupter and not as a nation.

[Captain Dug]

I agree pirates are not very realistic on the current game and this would help. I don't think pirates should be able to raid ports for 50% that seems very OP.

Edited August 12, 2017 by Captain Dug

[Hodo]

54 minutes ago, CaptainCaveMan said:

What are the Developers plans with the game...are they trying to make it realistic?  If so then your point is valid...Pirates never were a nation, their role was typically a chaotic interrupter and not as a nation.

I dont think they have any idea what their plans are any more... 

[Rebel Witch]

9 hours ago, Hodo said:

I dont think they have any idea what their plans are any more... 

which may be hope for the games future because if the Devs were convinced to stay on the current path this game has no future, sadly.

[JobaSet]

11 hours ago, woodenfish said:

Let me begin by saying this post is not a reaction to what's been going on on pvp global. Within my clan, and within the game, we've been thinking about what the role of pirates should be for some time, both to make the game more interesting for everyone and also to make being a pirate more interesting as an option.

Lets get the screams of no from the current pirates out of the way first:

• Pirates should not be able to capture ports.
• Pirates should not be able to build anything above a pirate frigate and it should be insanely difficult for them to own/run anything above a 3rd rate. In fact I'm not even sure if they should be able to own anything above a 3rd rate.

Why? Because pirates never rocked up in Victory's - they never had the resources to build/maintain such ships, that required a national effort.

So what should pirates get to make up for these restriction?

• They should be able to make ports in places where other people can't, maybe in 6-10 locations around the map. They can build an outpost and move their ships for free once a week via TP. That would allow them to suddenly appear in an area and cause trouble. The nation force in that area would have to deal with it. If they did, the pirates could melt away again.
• They should be able to raid ports, allowing them to raid all the resources they can carry - up to a maximum of 50% of the resources of each player in the port (They see just the totals of each resource and then it gets removed from players resources on a percentage basis). Each port can be hit once a week. That would force nations/clans to look after their hubs. 
• They should be able to be hired by nations to do thier dirty work - temporarliy sailing under the flag of that nation whilst fulfilling missions for them.
• They get to fight outlaw battles with each other.

 

I think this would make pirates an interesting option and something different instead of how they are now, which is a nation with additional benefits. Currently everyone should play pirates in order to have a level playing field. All other nations are at a disadvantage.

All of that Sounds great problem is Pirates will never be anything more than a crippled NATION.  The Nations would not allow us to have something they don't have. You can hear that now with Pirate on Pirate or anything in past 2 years we got they didn't.  If we had Raids only and didnt have to capture ports.  Nations would come up with some reason they should get it also.  100% Fact.  Every time a good idea comes out to make them different it gets shot down.  "Why can they do that and we can't it's not fair" it is not like, we are already gimped with Pirate Den.

WHAT THEY SHOULD DO IS REMOVE PIRATES AS A NAMED NATION AND BE DONE WITH IT.  At this point it would not matter what they replaced Pirate name with.  Pick a Nation in the world, then name them that, make them all the same.  The word "Pirate" is the only real thing that is different from a nation and that is 99% of the problem.

They could call  the map Westeros and give everyone dragons not ships. And we all be the same, its the word "Pirates" people have a problem with.  Nothing more and nothing less.  It's a common enemy they can't beat. Look how easy it is for them(everyone), to band together when just one person makes shit up about pirates and then everyone follows along with absolutely no clue what they are talking about. 

Edited August 12, 2017 by JobaSet

[Malice_s]

Maybe the pirates should have a completely different play style

 

This is only a proposal.

I know that there will be haters and supporters to this – let the chips fall where they may.

 

I propose to change the pirate in a fundamental way to make them a more historically correct force and to offer a completely different game play option to Naval Action than the other nations. Making the Pirates uniquely different.

 

To do this these are the following proposed changes;

 

• Historically Pirates were the only faction that would attack traders even the major nations did not treat traders as military targets. I propose that the pirates are the only faction that can attack traders both AI and Player traders.

   

• Pirates can cap the trader ships (including AI) and flag it to their cause, sell it or break it down to supplement their crafting of new ships. (tweak possibly needed on the materials a broken down ship supply)

 

• They can while wearing the black never sail more than a fourth rate.

 

• They can hold a letter of marque off any of the other nations and once they have this they can participate in the line-ship port battles and all game play that the other nations have.

 

• They can raid any shallow water port (not capital and do not capture a region by doing this) and turn this into a forward operating base (FOB) at any time with no notification to the targeted nation until the next down time – at which time this port will be clearly marked on the world map as pirate controlled. This town will be marked in open world as captains sail to it as contested prior to downtime (so traders and other players have to pay attention). This port will then follow normal port battle proceedings, the pirate nation may possibly hold a limited number of these FOB's (number could be determined by community). But supporting a large number of these may be a logistical challenge for the pirate community so maybe a number is not needed therefore making every shallow water port susceptible (this would be more historically correct). This way they can affect all nations equally.

 

• Pirates like the rest cannot have outposts in free ports,

 

• This proposal may change the loot requirements off traders so that the pirates can sustain a ship building and trading market to make gold.

 

• With a letter of marque a pirate can play as that nation. He cannot attack same nation traders but can attack any other nations traders.

   

• In open world a Pirate under letter of marque is only designated by the word privateer in his title (like a contraband title).

 

• This means pirates can have arrangements with nations to cripple production of other nations with with a mercenary flavour. (they may even find a way to play both sides for a profit – Pirates remember)

 

• Attacking a trader does not drag in same nation ships, or opposing nation ships. Though when a trader battle forms either nation can join the battle as per normal, this can remain the same even if the pirate is wearing black or the colours he has under with a letter of marque.

 

• Pirates can attack any war ships and normal BR counts take affect, even when under a letter of marque.(though not the same nation when under letter of marque).

 

• All shallow water ship blueprints are available to the pirate nation, marks system to remain the same.

 

• The pirates can establish outposts in any pirate controlled port (after downtime for any port captured by a raid.)

 

• They cannot farm but can have workshops and shipyards. (same mechanics and pricing as current game play), their supplies being determined buy raiding traders. (as mentioned earlier this may mean the loot of traders has to be tweaked). They can sell any of the loot at any port either with a smugglers tag while wearing the black or under a letter of marque as per normal trader function currently in game.

 

• Trader loot tweak to include modules to do with speed and sails modifications to be a random drop on AI and a possibility to drop if a player has them installed (low chance). Loot to include same current chances to books and ship knowledges off AI.

 

• Rank progression for pirates – they can still mission up to fourth rates as per current game play to gain experience (XP). After this they have a choice the faster option being under a letter of marque to then mission as per a other nations or slower option while wearing the black by continuing with missions at fourth rate being the highest available, this caters to those pirates that never want to wear the colours of another nation under marque. All other streams of XP gain to remain available to those wearing black. Raids can then also offer an XP increase for these players as well.

   

While I may not have covered all the challenges that this game offers and if there are further additions let the community decide, this is meant as an opportunity to make a completely different gaming style for those wearing black.

 

I believe with these changes it will offer an alternative and a more historical and challenging role to the Pirate style and how they can control the game balances.

 

While the Pirates will never own great tracts of ports, this will offer more than enough challenge and chance to influence the game through an alternative game play option to the other nations.

 

This is only an idea and may have merit or it may not as said before let the chips fall where they may.

 

thanks Hodo for your comments where i originally posted this.

[Captain Lust]

14 hours ago, woodenfish said:

Let me begin by saying this post is not a reaction to what's been going on on pvp global. Within my clan, and within the game, we've been thinking about what the role of pirates should be for some time, both to make the game more interesting for everyone and also to make being a pirate more interesting as an option.

Lets get the screams of no from the current pirates out of the way first:

• Pirates should not be able to capture ports.
• Pirates should not be able to build anything above a pirate frigate and it should be insanely difficult for them to own/run anything above a 3rd rate. In fact I'm not even sure if they should be able to own anything above a 3rd rate.

Why? Because pirates never rocked up in Victory's - they never had the resources to build/maintain such ships, that required a national effort.

So what should pirates get to make up for these restriction?

• They should be able to make ports in places where other people can't, maybe in 6-10 locations around the map. They can build an outpost and move their ships for free once a week via TP. That would allow them to suddenly appear in an area and cause trouble. The nation force in that area would have to deal with it. If they did, the pirates could melt away again.
• They should be able to raid ports, allowing them to raid all the resources they can carry - up to a maximum of 50% of the resources of each player in the port (They see just the totals of each resource and then it gets removed from players resources on a percentage basis). Each port can be hit once a week. That would force nations/clans to look after their hubs. 
• They should be able to be hired by nations to do thier dirty work - temporarliy sailing under the flag of that nation whilst fulfilling missions for them.
• They get to fight outlaw battles with each other.

 

I think this would make pirates an interesting option and something different instead of how they are now, which is a nation with additional benefits. Currently everyone should play pirates in order to have a level playing field. All other nations are at a disadvantage.

 

[Guest]

As a pirate since I first started playing. All I really ask for is the ability to teleport from free ports. My clan is currently based in a freeport to harass a certain nation and we are completely and utterly starved for resources because we need to sail 300+km just to do some production. We can get all our ships by capturing them, but we can't make repairs, we can't buy repairs if they are not listed (they never are) and we can't keep up with production thats far away without sailing super long distances twice a day.

Raids sound interesting, all the other mechanic changes are really unnessecary for me.

[Rebel Witch]

If there are no ports for carebears and casual players to keep their stuff safe, then raids will further ruin this game and players who do not wish to be robbed will leave.

Raiding is a great idea for the all out pvp players , they can go to that level of robbing each other, fighting and defending.

The problem with naval action currently is that the server lumps everyone into one dog eat dog server so players who keep losing, who cant defend themselves who just want more casual gaming experience , they have no where to hide, no where to turn and so sure the aggressive players get to laugh and giggle and have their fun robbing everyone they do not give a shit about what it does to the players who do not want that kind of gameplay yet are forced to keep losing their stuff. This is why naval action keeps losing players because of this kind of game mechanic.

Look at my idea for one server, two maps. I think raiding would be great for the hardcore pvp map but there must be an area of the map or a map where players can turn too if they need pve or just keep losing.

[Odol]

1 hour ago, Rebel Witch said:

If there are no ports for carebears and casual players to keep their stuff safe, then raids will further ruin this game and players who do not wish to be robbed will leave.

Raiding is a great idea for the all out pvp players , they can go to that level of robbing each other, fighting and defending.

The problem with naval action currently is that the server lumps everyone into one dog eat dog server so players who keep losing, who cant defend themselves who just want more casual gaming experience , they have no where to hide, no where to turn and so sure the aggressive players get to laugh and giggle and have their fun robbing everyone they do not give a shit about what it does to the players who do not want that kind of gameplay yet are forced to keep losing their stuff. This is why naval action keeps losing players because of this kind of game mechanic.

Look at my idea for one server, two maps. I think raiding would be great for the hardcore pvp map but there must be an area of the map or a map where players can turn too if they need pve or just keep losing.

Judging by your avatar you were an Eve player.  And I cant believe you are complaining about how the server lumps people.   You must have been a commodities trader in that game and never left the station.  

 

And if you want to be a pirate, then you should expect PVP... sorry but you cant be a carebear and a pirate, that would make you a veggie tales pirate. 

[Rebel Witch]

4 minutes ago, Odol said:

Judging by your avatar you were an Eve player.  And I cant believe you are complaining about how the server lumps people.   You must have been a commodities trader in that game and never left the station.  

 

And if you want to be a pirate, then you should expect PVP... sorry but you cant be a carebear and a pirate, that would make you a veggie tales pirate. 

Judging by your dumb comments about me you are either a troll or an idiot who cant read. I am not complaining in the previous post, i am offering suggestions because in my opinion certain mechanics are not healthy for the server population for "this" game. maybe read more of the forum and my posts and you will see I am trying my best to offer suggestions to help the Devs make this game better with my opinions.

Or if it will make you feel better, yes i played EVE for ten years and just stayed in one station doing trades all the time. Now start offering up suggestions to help the game or go play your little pirate games.

[Zoky]

1 hour ago, Odol said:

3 hours ago, Rebel Witch said:

 

Judging by your avatar you were an Eve player.  And I cant believe you are complaining about how the server lumps people.   You must have been a commodities trader in that game and never left the station.  

There are no carebears in EVE. There are people on front lines and people that make guns for people on front lines 

Edited August 13, 2017 by Zoky

[Odol]

On 8/13/2017 at 3:18 PM, Rebel Witch said:

Judging by your dumb comments about me you are either a troll or an idiot who cant read. I am not complaining in the previous post, i am offering suggestions because in my opinion certain mechanics are not healthy for the server population for "this" game. maybe read more of the forum and my posts and you will see I am trying my best to offer suggestions to help the Devs make this game better with my opinions.

Or if it will make you feel better, yes i played EVE for ten years and just stayed in one station doing trades all the time. Now start offering up suggestions to help the game or go play your little pirate games.

Sorry you seem a bit offended by that. 

But EVE is not a place for carebears or nice guys... it is a place full of fighting and building stuff to fight. 

[Skully]

Historically you became pirate by circumstances. Heck, a nation came about the same way. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Revolution

Last week, we saw on Global the emergence of true pirates. As the Global French lost their final (capturable) ports, they turned from nation to piracy.

So ironically it should not be history, rules or realism that defines pirates, but players and their (re)actions to circumstances.