Liq

Naja, erstens mal hast du mich direkt zitiert, da liegt es nahe dass die Anspielung dann auch an den zitierten getichtet war. Zweitens; eine OpenWorld im MMO kennt grundsätzlich den fairen kampf nicht, und wenn dann sind sie sehr selten (durch zufall) oder abgesprochen. Meinem Empfinden nach gehört Ganken / Geganked werden folglich nunmal dazu; mit dem Grundsatz, dass man immer nur mit dem in ein Gefecht gezogen werden soll, was auch in Reichweite ist/war (aka. 3 Minuten jointimer, simuliert dies ein wenig).

Wie kann man alleine in einer Surprise mit dem vorbehalt nur gleichgrosse oder grössere Schiffe anzugreifen (war bei mir zumindest so bis zu dem Zeitpunkt als ihr mich nach einem 1v2, die 2 wart ihr, mit einer 10 mann revengefleet begrüsst habt) als Ganker bezeichnet werden? Mittlerweile ist mir aufgrund des "normalen" Spielerverhaltens, nur anzugreifen wenn man 2-3x die Schiffskraft hat, das alles jedoch auch total wayne. Free for all

It already IS risky going to enemy waters, the possibility to get caught is still there if you mess up. What are the alternatives? Sit in greenzone and wait for someone stupid enough looking for pvp, in enemy waters cause thats the only place to find it?

Well then, incompetent enemy forces. I made experiences pre invis. Times where I was surrounded into literally every direction, surrounded by ships which should have never been able to reach me / us cause they were not in the 3 min range.

Eh it doesnt even necessarily need to be a fair battle IMO. I still think the Main point, which needs to be defended, is that you should ALWAYS get into battle what you see (more or less, 3 minute timer simulates that fact). Some players enjoy ganking more, and I think we should let them, because its part of an ow mmo. I liked the suggestion of implementing an auto improoved Social Perk which let the battles stay open until the def. side had max. 1.3 - 1.5 times the BR of the attacking side. But some players didn't want to force balance into an OW MMO. How exactly do you plan to get away when you get kicked out straight to OW from a battle without any additional effects such as invis? I've seen Koltes sailing around solo before aswell. I know you guys like to counter revenge fleets with your own reinforcements. But when sailing around solo, the chance of evading a revenge fleet, without any invis., is next to non existant, no matter the ship. You really don't need to be a genius to anticipate where the guy leaving a battle is going to sail, and since you can literally camp on the exact battle pos, that makes it even easier for them.

now add a 3-5min "you cannot attack" timer (can still be attacked) after leaving a battle; in your scenario, the traders brig would have had the possibility to sail off into an odd direction (because of the speed boost and invisbility), and then log off (2 min logoff timer), so cannot be attacked by you again, since you have just left the battle aswell and have the "you cannot attack timer". We were saying this, that the "you cannot attack timer", needs to be drastically increased after leaving a battle, since day 1 when invis was added. But I haven't seen a response from admin so far.

well sure it did change revenge fleets? It basically removed them completely? I'm trying very hard to understand your points, but I simply cant, it doesn't make any sense at all to me. Ganking is what defines an OW MMO; such a game barely ever has any equalish ow pvp. I agree we need some sort of rookie protection, but at some point, if you're sailing a ship alone without any reinforcements in Range, it's basically your fault to get sunk, it might be harsh but such is life. it feels like we're talking at cross-purposes, probably because we have different expectations from the game.

So how exactly is this supposed to proove that getting kicked back out straight to OW, without any effect, is working as intended? Because it seems to proove the opposite to me? Also, weren't you constantly complaining about gankers and forming a ganking heaven? Well then, well done on taking out a captain-rank with probably all his assets

well the 3 minute join timer simulates the fact that only ships in range, 3 min OW time covers a lot, should be able to join and get to the target. If we're going to get rid off invisibility, the 75x compressed OW will allow players to camp on an exact battle pos and wait for someone to pop out; a target they should never and would never have reached, because they were not in range (3 min join timer). Anyway. I kinda want to see no invis / no speedboost now, at least as a TEST, see how much PvP actually gets created and see whether or not those that are initiating the PvP, therefore sailing to enemy waters, will get tired of it pretty fast, because they will have to deal with players which would never have reached them. I'm also curious to see where players imagine PvP to happen , if not in national waters. "Let's randomly sail half way to nowhere and meet that spanish player group, because they totally have a reason to be there".

How is actually giving the initial idea of a 3 min join timer, which decides which ships are in range of the battle and which are not and therefore dont have any right for taking a revenge, a reason, idiotic? Might aswell have forever open battles then. Seems much less idiotic, right? /sarcasm off

Well in this case its mostly coincidence though that you met that player leaving a mission, compared to ACTIVELY waiting on an exact battle pos (f11 coords posted by the guy being attacked). It still is an issue though, I agree. Maybe grant a shorter invis timer when leaving a mission, so that it gives the guys leaving mission a fair chance to gain some distance from nearby bandits; and at the same time cant be abused by hopping in and out of a mission on purpose.

Those on the pics are studding sails tho

Huh? Thats a pretty old occasion. We didnt have either but we did have battlescreen which also somewhat did the job of preventing silly revenge fleets. Exactly. Sometimes you get caught off guard because an enemy was IN RANGE. your revenge fleet mates most lf the time are NOT in range (3ish minutes), why should they be able to get to a target they never would have gotten to? Ganking sucks and happens to everyone, but that doesnt mean there should be a free revenge mechanic simply because we cant run OW and battles in the same speed instances.

So tell me mr skully, where do you expect players to meet for pvp if not in national waters. Ganking is part of pretty much any ow mmo. But most of them dont know the revenge squad phenomena cause thex dont have 2 dimensions. Instanced battles and therefore 2 travelling speeds bring the need to make a workaround .

Im guessing singleplayer (with an open world à la watchdogs)? (Brace for "finish your first game first" Comments)

I think wind should remain an important strategical factor, also for open world. Sailing ships are supposed to have their positives / negatives depending on their type. With no OW wind you wont be able to push your enemy into a situation where he cannot escape anymore, e.g. try to get downwind of him in OW and by doing so cut off his escape

Im guessing you mean 250 mbits aka 31.5 mb/s ? 250 mb/s aka 2000 mbits would be a "little bit" overkill lol

Because by the time you make the first, initial, engagement, and nothing joins after 3 minutes, nothing was in range to help out. it's an MMO. ganking happens. The fact that you can camp on an exact battle pos. (f11 coords) and therefore get to an enemy you were never supposed to get to, is a wonky mechanic. Can you describe to me how you would see the future of pvp? And where do you see it happening? Not in national waters anymore, thats for sure. So then where is the reason for players to actively LEAVE their national waters?

we had tp-to-port before the wipe for a good while, because camping on battle pos. was being considered a wonky mechanic. and the vast majority accepted it and supported it. simply because you shouldnt be able to bypass the 3 minute timer which determines if anyone is close and allows you to join an engagement vs a hostile ship. a scout? won't bring you that far if the fleet outside is any smart and spread out; no invis at all will be extremely fun No way out for noone coming out of a battle.

lol It was not purely for solo hunters. It was implemented for the whole community because camping on a battle pos is retarded and makes zero sense Personally I stopped playing the game for other personal reasons; for the short time I was playing when the invis was around, I was enjoying it. But most likely never going back to playing the sandbox as intensively as I used to at times, both because personal reasons and the way the game is going NA Arena to the rescue. Can't recommend sandbox to anyone seeking for pvp.

why would you want bovenwind / copper plating / crooked hull now? 2% speed each, some even with severe downsides. Totally not worth it. My teak teak surp does 12.6 knots according to stats, works fine. Well you know you can combine the carpenter upgrade with the perk. and the skill book. all together you can make much more out of repair, which can allow you to win in outnumbered situations aswell I also think the idea of invisibility is fine, although some tweaks are still needed. It did what it was supposed to, stopped revenge ganks, captains across the map in a port can no longer TP to a nearby port and sail to battle pos. profiting from the 75x OW compression IMO it does need to be tweaked in a way that during invis youcan't see other ships though. And / Or increase the "you cannot attack" timer afterwards.

Can you give us a few examples or super good and super expensive perma upgrades? Since speed mods got nerfed to oblivion I dont think they're that much of a must have anymore. And other decent mods, like northern carpenters, +4% repair, are like 10k gold per Something I don't understand: > builds fir / fir surprise, because gotta go fast > meets an enemy surprise, doesn't want to fight him because his ship is too weak. Why the f. did you decide for a fir fir build then in the first place.

Why it was added? Because we got two dimensions. 1) Battle instances and 2) 75x compressed (ow sail speed and downscaled map) open world. Now, if you attack someone (most likely in enemy waters, as tehre is no reason for anyone to be in the middle of nowhere in no nations waters), the probability of him calling out the engagement in nation chat / discord / teamspeak is pretty high. The 3 minute join timer is meant to simulate the fact that only ships in RANGE should be even able to join the engagement. But before the invis. timer, this wasn't the case, as the parties in battle HAD to leave the battle instance max 15 minutes after the battle was over. And guess what, due to the 75x compressed open world, you would veeery often meet a welcome fleet, aka revenge fleet, outside, which was NOT in range (3 minutes ish, which is a LOT for open world aswell) of the initial battle. All in all, the revenge fleet were profiting from a speed boost aka 75x compressed OW to get to the battle instance and just wait for the players to get kicked out to open world. Why give one side such a bonus, but not to the guys in battle? I think I know your answer. Because they were in hostile waters right? Well thenmight aswell prohibit any PvP. Ganking (though some revenge fleets often didn't form to ganks but also fair ish engagements) is PART of an OW MMO.

I say we should all chillax a bit. NA Arena seems to be pretty close. Have some biff there. Unload our pressure there, kick each others head in until we can't swim anymore :D. Gives the undoubtful BEST ASPECT of the game, combat, especially pvp, some promotion. If they allow us to record / stream it, new customers might be interested. But I still have to say; as long as there is no really helpful UI and starter manual INGAME, not some youtube tutorials, the new player retention rate will stay low.

this I probably spent my first 100-200 hours doing PvE mostly. And I was happy doing it. I almost stopped playing after getting to the Santisima, because I thought I had seen everything. It was kind of a coincidence that I kept playing. I went to another nations capital with some clanmates in some renommées, we found ourselves a lone victory and caputed it. From then on I learnt to enjoy PvP and the endless possibilites it has. AAA games give you content for what, 40-50 hours?