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Custom Battles - Planning its Development


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A players suggestion guide for Custom Battles development.    

Essential:

  • All savable scenarios.
  • All designable ships, including enemies (I).
  • All savable ships (could be describable as blueprints).

General:

  • The ability to save during (or while in) battle, to continue 3+ hour battles another day if needed etc. 
  • Transport ship designing.
  • Transport command enable.
  • Set funds, for community competitions and exporting and importing scenarios.
  • Assign captains (with skills - or crew skills).
  • Set fleet locations and directions (II).
  • Set AI retreat level.
  • Set day/night or set the in-game time. 
  • Set weather conditions.
  • Set Treaty limits for auto-design, selectable for both player and AI.
  • Set win conditions, %70 sunk, all BBs sunk, time limit, etc. 
  • The ability to continue the battle after the win condition has been meet (even set this ability).
  • The ability to set the damage level of ships, and/or to set which components are damage. This ability would enable quite a range of scenarios options.
  • Ability to set "Enemy smoke spotted to the ....." range limit.
  • Withdraw or full retreat menu option that allows for a victory. 

 Other Options:

  • Set earliest year (or start year) e.g. 1919 – 1939, to exclude or include older hulls and tech.
  • Auxiliary cruisers, Commerce Raiders (actual designing of).
  • Multiple nations, with options to choose/set allies/enemy (also could be good for AI/auto designing based on nation selection).
  • Select the AI designer logic and priority weighting (e.g. Firepower, amour speed). by @SonicB.
  • Set submarine threat level (for each side), to add/create random event upon entering the battle.
  • Set mine warfare state (to set whatever the system is), to create random events within battle (or again! whatever the mechanic is since we don't know anything about this yet).
  • Survivor rescues, toggle off or on. Also make this part in parcel of win conditions - either on/off too. To make yet another scenario/competition option.  
  • Ironclads (all and any other gimmick additions).
  • Coastal maps, shore bombardment (III).
  • After action report. Including:
    • Damage received/done per ship.
    • Damage totals per side.
    • Ordnance expenditure.
    • Ship logs access.
    • Survivor rescue accounts.
    • Show victory points. 
  • Mod support.
  • Steam workshop support, blueprints and scenario exporting and importing (supporting community competitions).
  • Set division locations (IV). 
  • Pre-battle allocation of ships into divisions. 
  • Aircraft launcher components, for historical recreation decor. They don’t have to do anything/apply any values, except weight, just fill space on the deck so as ships can look authentically correct. Could be Custom Battle only feature.    
  • Reserve forces (V).  

Basically the ability to setup whatever constitutes a battle.

I. If not possible to design every single ship, then what would be warranted is a cap for slots, at least 10 (0-9) designable slots, per side, 'of any class' so we can design a few different BBs, some different CLs etc. etc. etc. I’ve noticed CCs mostly uses Custom Battles for their video’s and I think it’s because scenario building can be varied across such a wide canvas, 1890-1939, TBs-BBs, it gives them the ability to keep producing different content. Add in 10 designable slots per side and all savable, would turn Custom Battles into a long term repeatable content producing asset.

II. Could be as simple as setting locations as north/east/south/west, direction north/east/south/west, for both enemy and your fleet. Coastal maps would work better with such settings. These settings could be used to setup a chase, intercept or charge scenarios (along with setting retreat level etc.).

III. While the campaign might not have terra-firma, Custom Battles could have selective coastal maps with land emplacements i.e.  artillery, building, vehicles etc. that could be destroyed/interactive with.

IV. If ships were pre-allocated into divisions then a map interface could be used to set those division locations, this would expand the editor ability even more. This feature would supersede 'Set fleet locations'. Should be enable for enemy division locations too, to setup multiple attack vectors etc.

V. An ability to assign forces to reserves and have those reserves arrive into battle at set a time or when a condition has been meet. Including an ability to set the direction of entry too. It would be possible to achieve this with an ability to set divisions locations at extreme distances. Ditto for enemies.

Summary:
When development is issued for Custom Battles we want to ‘maximize’ its ‘development allocation’ and so therefore everyone feel free to post and debate your ideas to build a collective guide for developers and help guide Custom Battles future.

 

Edited by Skeksis
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Pirates and rebels maybe.

Maybe a scenario uploader so others can look at other peeps scenarios and play them out, would help youtubers out alot as well.

Oh and troop and civilian boat designers or placers, so we can have beach assualts (without the assualt lol) and civillian and cargo convoys too.

For weather conditions you could set how severe it can be and how frequent it changes, plus changes to accuracy, visibility etc.

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  • Select the AI designer logic and priority weighting (e.g. Firepower, amour speed)

At the moment you can only change the year to produce some sort of restricted result, expanding auto-build with more options would be a very good feature.   

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Being able to build a library of ships would be very beneficial.  The idea is that I can create a battle between the ships I have designed, and put in a library,  without having to design ships for each battle.  

This idea segues into a library of historical ships.  It might be interesting, and fun, to see the Nagato fight the Bismarck, or have a fleet action of  Germany versus Japan in each WWI and WWII.  (Think:  The Germans did not have to give up the Marshall Islands after WWI and needed to defend them during WWII.)

I really want to see the HMS Dreadnought against a late WWII Baltimore class CA.  The ships had similar displacement.  

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6 hours ago, Hardlec said:

library of ships would be very beneficial

And for example, we would only need to build one Bismarck and deploy it multiple times, such a library would be a real time saver. 

Edited by Skeksis
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  • 3 weeks later...

I spent hours designing two ships yesterday thinking they were to be saved. But alas this pollywog to the game was mistaken. In custom battles of course no designs save. If it were possible to save designs, then pick my own designs for all the ships on my side I could basically do a 'very roughly simulated campaign' myself. 

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On 7/23/2020 at 9:45 PM, Skeksis said:

An update guide for the new team regrading Custom Battles development.    

Essential:

  • Scenario saves (see note).
  • Designing all ships (including enemies).*

General:

  • Cargo ship designing.
  • Coastal maps.
  • Set fleet locations and directions.**
  • Set AI retreat level.
  • Set submarine threat level (for each side).
  • Set weather conditions.
  • Multiple nations, with options to choose/set allies/enemy.
  • Select the AI designer logic and priority weighting (e.g. Firepower, amour speed). by @SonicB.

 Other Options:

  • Save ship library, for cross scenario deployment.
  • Ironclads.
  • Auxiliary cruisers.
  • The ability to continue the battle after the win condition has been meet.

 

* If not possible to design every single ship, then what would be warranted is a cap for slots, at least 10 (0-9) designable slots, per side, 'of any class' so we can design a few different BBs, some different CLs etc. etc. etc. I’ve noticed CCs mostly uses Custom Battles for their video’s and I think it’s because scenario building can be varied across such a wide canvas, 1890-1939, TBs-BBs, it gives them the ability to keep producing different content. Add in 10 designable slots per side and all saveable, would turn Custom Battles into a long term repeatable content producing asset.

** Could be as simple as setting locations as north/east/south/west, direction north/east/south/west, for both enemy and your fleet. Coastal maps would work better with such settings. These settings could be used to setup a chase, intercept or charge scenarios (along with setting retreat level etc.).

Note:

 

Summary:
When development is issued for Custom Battles we want to ‘maximize’ its ‘development allocation’ and so therefore everyone feel free to post and debate your ideas to build a collective guide for developers and help guide Custom Battles future.

 

SO GOOD İDEA

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Content source for Custom Battles.

Historical:

  • Reproducing historical ships, not just the Hood and Bismarck or any of the scripted academy missions but all the other ships of history itself.
  • Battle re-enactments, another huge source of content.

The campaign might not have the opportunities to reproduce historical ships, players would most likely play to the campaign needs, this pushes the historical content back onto Custom Battles and the historical volume is huge.

Non-historical:

  • Build the fantastical.
  • Building the best fleets of selected criteria (most popular CC choice).
  • What if nation X vs nation Y scenarios.

Like historical it's unlikely you would build too many fantastical designs in the campaign. Building to whatever players can, like the fantastical, is the volume and that volume is as large as one's imagination.

Testing & designing:

  • Before committing to ship designs and squandering campaign resources, building test designs would be a prudent step for players.
  • Testing game mechanics, figuring out what works and what doesn't (very important alpha and beta tool). 
  • Running campaign battle simulations.

 

Custom Battles can be the ‘equal’ to the campaign if not more, regarding game content. All these freedoms of designing whatever you can gives Custom Battles its value and its content volume/source.   

Edited by Skeksis
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Yes, a library would be helpful. Then I could save the 15, 18, and 21 gun designs I come up with. Not to mention the 40+ torpedo broadside cruiser...And other designs I've seen on youtube.

While I appreciate the historical. My thought it is, its been done and dusted, documented 3 ways from Sunday. Let's look at alternative designs to possibly give the historical a run for the money effectively speaking.

Yes, I support custom battles having far more custom to them than simply ships in the long run.

Landform usage: Solomon Islands and Guadalcanal areas. Possibly a sliver of the Philippines and also a landmass depicting Tsuchima strait as well.

All likely added down the road of course.

And I actually disagree with the designing enemies all the time. Perhaps the option to use a battle template for fleet composition from a corresponding battle to the landmass chosen. Or a series of check boxes perhaps on type of allowed hulls or something similar to where the spirit of the enemy fleet is determined by the options  you picked before the ship design phase.

Edited by Adm.Hawklyn
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On 9/3/2020 at 5:15 PM, Adm.Hawklyn said:

And I actually disagree with the designing enemies all the time

In all of UAD history you are the very first to counter all designable ships. I see your point though, It would be like playing chess on your own, once you've make a move then you would go around and sit in the other chair to be the opponent, a hard way to play the game wouldn't you say.

I suspect most players would leave it up to the AI to create the enemy anyway (or a treaty limit if implemented).

HOWEVER, and that's a big however!...

For historical re-creations players must be able to build every single ship including the enemy, there's simply no other way around it, no other way to re-create history accurately, hence its essential tag. IMO historical re-creation is very marketable (and lots of players here love historical!!!) and thus the vindication for all designable development.

Edited by Skeksis
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8 hours ago, Adm.Hawklyn said:

And I actually disagree with the designing enemies all the time.

I think no one here asking to disable randomizer - we want more options not less.

4 hours ago, Skeksis said:

In all of UAD history you are the very first to counter all designable ships.

I recall at least one another protector of "Surprise me" button. As if someone gonna take it away.

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  • 4 weeks later...

On All savable ships, a.k.a. ships library, blueprints.

Ships library should have file directory support, for user filtering/sorting. 

Better still, if Custom Battles scenario saves is a directory type game save (folder), then it should be setup in such a way that if players wanted to copy/paste ship files (using file explorer) into the scenario saved directory, the game will load those ships into the scenario cache of ships. Basically a standard file system/save structure and not an in-game index system or whatever etc. Ditto for campaign saves (since it's not a MMO and there's no dishonesty when copying and pasting, only to themselves!), i.e. make it moddable. 

Edited by Skeksis
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1.Give a choice to add sandbanks for ships to get stuck on. Or maybe even reefs that can rip open the bottom of your hull. And cause flooding.  Also add a slider to decide how many sandbanks and reefs you want appearing. 

 

2.Icebergs would be a nice addition as well. They can provide cover for smaller ships while also being dangerous if you crash into them. Imagine your rudder being taken out and your ship steers uncontrollably towards an iceberg. Weather effects combined with day and night settings will decide the visibility of the bergs, together with overall ship visibility,

 

The above would be nice to stop the map design from becoming bland with just sea everywhere without obstacles. It would also make you able to use the map to your advantage.

Edited by ReefKip
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Continue from content source post...

I was just alittle curious as to know how Custom Battles could stack up against the campaign volume-wise. And a way to measure it might be in comparing kill content.

So let's try projecting campaign ship kills...

First let's say a starting fleet of:

Startingfleet =
TR      10    
LT       10
DD      24 
CL       8
CA       4
BC       3
BB       2

Some nations will war against each other and so nations won’t face those losses, let’s say a war every 10 years per nation and at 33% losses each war:

LossesToEnemy = 0.33.

But their are 2 sides in each war, let's say 10% losses for the victor:

LossesToVictor = 0.1.

There'll be fleet expansion and/or to cover losses, match expanding empires, expanding expenditure etc, after some experimentation I would say about 120% on an after loss subtotal:

Expansion = 1.2.

But as you take over new regions you going to need to maintain defense forces for all those regions, fight larger fleets, cumulate wealth, etc, and these demands increase over time so expansion wouldn't be static per every 10 years, let's say there's an cumulative effect per every 10 years of 1.5% (to increase the rate of expansion every 10 years):   

CumulativeEffect = 0.015. 

Let's show this as a table, each cell shows BalanceAtYear/LossesToEnemy/LossesToVictor/SubTotal/Expansion:   

         1890                 1900                 1910                     1920                    1930                       Total Built
TR    10/3/1/6/7         13/4/1/7/9        16/5/2/9/11          20/7/2/11/14       26/8/3/15/18          69
LT     10/3/1/6/7        13/4/1/7/10       17/6/2/10/13        22/7/2/13/17       29/10/3/17/22        79
DD    24/8/2/14/18   32/11/3/18/25   43/14/4/25/34    59/19/6/34/47    80/26/8/46/65      213
CL     8/3/1/5/6         11/4/1/6/9         15/5/2/9/13         22/7/2/12/18        30/10/3/17/26       80
CA     4/1/0/2/3        6/2/1/3/5           8/3/1/5/7             12/4/1/7/10          17/6/2/10/15          45
BC     3/1/0/2/3        4/1/0/3/4           7/2/1/4/6             10/3/1/6/9           14/5/1/8/13            38
BB     2/1/0/1/2         3/1/0/2/3           5/2/0/3/4             7/2/1/4/7             11/4/1/6/10            28

                                                                                                                                       Total = 552

Multiply by every nation:

552x10=5,520 projected campaign ship kills.

And if one nation was human:

552x9=4968 ships for the the player to sink.

Even if the figures are alittle off (on the low side) by the time of the campaign end, there's going to be alot sinking's. To be fair it would be quite an effort for admirals to sink 5000 ships in Custom Battles but on the other hand there are a few CCs that are already doing that.

Edited by Skeksis
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  • 3 weeks later...
Posted (edited)

Dev's, I see that the steam store page release date has been updated to "TBA 2021", not even a quarterly goal, so how about pushing some time into Custom Battles to carry the game through the next few quarterlies. I'm sure a few weeks here in development would have huge results in game satisfaction and popularity.   

All designable and all savable is all the inspiration Custom Battles and the game needs. Especially for those CCs, they just keep posting out those videos and they're consistent too, I do wonder what they would 'produce' with a fully operational Custom Battles editor!

 

Bumped again! for the new year.

Edited by Skeksis
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2 hours ago, Skeksis said:

Dev's, I see that the steam store page release date has been updated to "TBA 2021", not even a quarterly goal, so how about pushing some time into Custom Battles to carry the game through the next few quarterlies. I'm sure a few weeks here in development would have huge results in game satisfaction and popularity.   

All designable and all savable is all the inspiration Custom Battles and the game needs. Especially for those CCs, they just keep posting out those videos and they're consistent too, I do wonder what they would 'produce' with a fully operational Custom Battles editor!

 

Bumped again! for the new year.

If nothing else than for the reason saves will greatly aid bug/change testing and validation, not to mention more enjoyable alpha testing. 

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On Blueprints.

Maybe blueprints don’t have to be a completed designed ship, maybe blueprints could be setup in such a way that they can be saved as 'partly designed blueprints', like only a ‘selection’ of components and tech, semi-built e.g.

  • Just a hull but with all the amour, machinery and tech selected, no deck equipment/superstructures (though why would anyone just save a hull as a blueprint but if setup correctly it should be possible).
  • Hull, forward & superstructure, funnel, selected armor, machinery and tech selected, no turrets/weapons.
  • Etc.

Then players could complete the design at a later date. Pass semi-built ships/designs onto others to complete (competitions etc.). Blueprints would have to be always passed through designer tool though. If/when ship saves, blueprints, are implemented then part and partial designs should maybe be consider as an option. 

Edited by Skeksis
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  • Skeksis changed the title to Custom Battles - Planning its Development
  • 2 weeks later...
Posted (edited)

Back trying out UAD new stuff but quickly the same old problems are still there, can't save your design, can't build more than one ship, can't build enemy ships, can't set battle conditions, oh well!

It's like on one hand there's new stuff to try out, new hulls etc but on the other no progression, no Custom Battles progression, no more to do other than to re-create the same old stuff as before from the last update.

IMO I don't think Custom Battles improvements should drop at the same time as the campaign (as indicated by the roadmap), unless Dev's want to unleash everything at once with a big bang so to speak, but I think Custom Battles improvements should drop in an update before the campaign, this should re-start strayed momentum for the game and led that momentum into the campaign giving it its maximum attention thereafter, like no conflict of interest.

Just something to ponder. 

Edited by Skeksis
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Well next patch will have both campaign and custom battle improvements, im guessing they will do smaller patches inbetween all the core patches incrementally adding smaller bits as time goes on, if the Q&A thing is a good indicator to go on.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Posted (edited)

Hull Timelines - Alpha 11 v84 - Custom Battles Data (unlock: off).

British BB hulls.

Battleship I                      1890---1898
Battleship II                                         1899---1905
Battleship III                                        1899---1905
Dreadnought I                                                         1906----1917
Dreadnought II                                                                1912--------1923
Dreadnought III                                                                            1918--------------------------1940
N2/G3 Class                                                                                               1924-----------------1940
Modernized Dreadnought                                                                                  1927------------1940
Modern Battleship I                                                                                                   1929--------1940
Modern Battleship II                                                                                                          1939---1940

British BC hulls.

Battlecruiser I                                                      1907------1916
Battlecruiser II                                                            1912----------1918
Battlecruiser III                                                                            1917---------1928
Battlecruiser V                                                                                          1923-----------------1940
Large Cruiser                                                                                                                   1935---1940
Modernized Battlecruiser                                                                                               1935---1940    
Super Battlecruiser                                                                                                         1935---1940

British CA hulls.

Armored Cruiser I             1890---1893    
Armored Cruiser III                                1894---------1908    
Armored Cruiser IV                                        1897---------1919    
Armored Cruiser V                                                 1900----1919
Heavy Cruiser I                                                                            1920------------1940
Heavy Cruiser II                                                                                          1936---1940
Heavy Cruiser III                                                                                 1925--------1940    

British CL Hulls.

Light Cruiser I                       1890--------------------1908
Light Cruiser II                                       1893----------------1919
Semi- Armored Cruiser I             1892----------------1908
Semi- Armored Cruiser II                               1902-----------1919
Semi- Armored Cruiser III                                      1903------1919
Modern Light Cruiser                                                                        1920---1940

British DD Hulls.

Torpedo Boat                       1890-------------1908
Torpedo Boat Destroyer              1898--------1908
Destroyer I                                            1899---1908
Destroyer II                                                                 1909---1912
Destroyer III                                                                                    1913--------------------1940
Destroyer IV                                                                                          1918----------------1940
Modern Destroyer(Light)                                                                             1920-----------1940
Modern Destroyer (Standard)                                                                             1921-------1940
Modern Destroyer(Leader)                                                                                        1922---1940
 

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