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Cetric de Cornusiac

A new approach to Portbattles, with troop ships involved

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Also honestly, I think forts should be buffed.

At long distances they are useless and most important, they are being killed quite fast by mortars. Either decrease mortars performance (fire rate/reload, accuracy) or buff forts and towers.

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20 minutes ago, Christendom said:

Why are we restricted to 25v25?  Can unity 5 not handle more?

can we fill a couple 25vs25 pbs during us time? numbers were at 230 yesterday

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I miss the old days where you could cap the towers in old PB's via boarding.

Just a thought to implement this sort of ground assault feeling the OP was looking for.

Add a landing zone near towers, and forts that allow you to "board" (assault) the fortifications and attempt to take them through force of manpower. That will give you the use of marines as they were intended. Also yes i'm suggesting allowing players to be able to capture and use the forts/towers and or leave crew on them (the marines) to turn the guns on the enemy.

PS
I like mortars, I don't like how we pretty much have to use them in most PB's
 

Edited by Capt Trashal Early

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26 minutes ago, rediii said:

going to boarding instantly

And you seriously cannot board a troop ship. Now this is the suicide mission you were talking about. Because you cannot bring enough soldiers with you to fight 2000 troops on board that ship and expect to win the boarding.

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Hmmm

Legends testing had the Fort control circle.

If these could be enabled by the Marines transports ( rise presence to 100% abstraction of sending the launchers with the parties ) with subsequent boarding action vs Fort - player controlled, then transfer Fort artillery to player in exchange for his SOL made transport.

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This would be a good feature in the game. Have one transport ship controlled by the ai with the regular fleet commands we already have in game plus an extra one for going to shore and unloading the troops.

make that a 3rd rate ai controlled and everybody has to clear the path for it. Make it buffed up so it can’t be sunk quickly and eliminate the circles completely. Port battles would be a lot more fun. Specially the screening!

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Why not limit the port battles to 20 vs 20 then get each side to be supported by troop ships for the aggressor and floating gun batteries for the defender? I guess you could have gun platforms for the aggressor too but there are fewer examples for them being used offensively. You could as the defender set where and how to use your platforms tactically, offering low profile fire support to the port as was historically common

Edited by Fluffy Fishy

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1 hour ago, rediii said:

Do you play in portbattles ... right now?

Because a mortar brig can do a lot more than a troop trnasport and noone wants to sail this ship already.

You think about portbattles and the players that do them too roleplay-like I think. :D

 

Because there is another problem aswell, can I jjst take fast ships and suicide into the troop ships, kill them and get killed in the process?

Losing my whole fleet but winning the PB

I love sailing that boat. I can not imagine anyone not wanting to sail it. Yes you get sunk a lot, yes you do not get respect from the people in the 1st rates, yes no one will defend you but hey thats all the fun of it.

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13 minutes ago, Fluffy Fishy said:

Why not limiy the port battles to 20 vs 20 then get each side to be supported by troop ships for the aggressor and floating gun batteries for the defender? I guess you could have gun platforms for the aggressor too but there are fewer examples for them being used offensively. You could as the defender set where and how to use your platforms tactically, offering low profile fire support to the port as was historically common

It could work if we really have this hard limit due to the engine.

Anything that makes PBs more interesting, even if we have to sacrifice some things, is welcome for me.

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Dont know how difficult it is for the devs to develop bu if a port battle would be like a lot of FPS games there is a limit of slots available.

A port battle shouldnt be all 1st rates. So instead of having the system with the BR you can have a system that allows x amount of 1st rate, x amount of 2nd, etc etc.

This way then you can add a troop carrier in there as well and have a specific target for them to go to. Lets say they have a circle D and for the bigger ports even an E next to the big square forts.

This would mean a lot more coordination and tactics. Capital ships can attack, smaller frigates can defend circles or harras big ships. Smaller support vessels also have their objective like capturing circles, destroying the forts and dropping troops off.

Just some random thoughts.

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Just now, Jake Newport said:

Dont know how difficult it is for the devs to develop bu if a port battle would be like a lot of FPS games there is a limit of slots available.

A port battle shouldnt be all 1st rates. So instead of having the system with the BR you can have a system that allows x amount of 1st rate, x amount of 2nd, etc etc.

This way then you can add a troop carrier in there as well and have a specific target for them to go to. Lets say they have a circle D and for the bigger ports even an E next to the big square forts.

This would mean a lot more coordination and tactics. Capital ships can attack, smaller frigates can defend circles or harras big ships. Smaller support vessels also have their objective like capturing circles, destroying the forts and dropping troops off.

Just some random thoughts.

BR limits give you absolutely freedom of choice. Your proposal impose hard limits to that.

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32 minutes ago, Jake Newport said:

This would mean a lot more coordination and tactics. Capital ships can attack, smaller frigates can defend circles or harras big ships. Smaller support vessels also have their objective like capturing circles, destroying the forts and dropping troops off.

Here is someone who understood what I am after.

--

While everybody is concentracting on the actual battle, let's not forget the troop ship needs to be planned aforehead and 'aimed' at a certain port, requires resources for getting set up and all this. A strategic aspect I want to remind of.

Plus more drama in the accompanying screening battles and on the path the invader fleet has to take, as everyone will be looking for that transport to sink it before it reaches destination.

The Captain who commands that ship must have nerves of steel. His reward should be high in case of success, which adds to the attractivity of that position.

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1 hour ago, Simon Cadete said:

Have one transport ship controlled by the ai with the regular fleet commands we already have in game plus an extra one for going to shore and unloading the troops.

In case nobody volunteers for that difficult job, it would be an AI ship. But I clearly favor a human player commanding that ship, just to prevent 'stupid AI running into disaster' and predictability issues.

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1 hour ago, Intrepido said:

BR limits give you absolutely freedom of choice. Your proposal impose hard limits to that.

in theory it would give you choice. Inpracticality you always see the same ships over and over. A trinc, a belle poule never seen them in a port battle. But yeah i have seen port battles where every side has practically the same set up and very few players

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1 hour ago, Intrepido said:

It could work if we really have this hard limit due to the engine.

Anything that makes PBs more interesting, even if we have to sacrifice some things, is welcome for me.

Heated shot for defensive forts??

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1 hour ago, admin said:

Landing would be impossible if there is no Naval Dominance in the area. Current screening action and port battle just simulates the achievement of the dominance through zone control and once you destroy defending fleet your imaginary troop ships operate without any interference capturing the port. 

Thus - troop ship might not add anything to the game if not designed properly (to cover all potential abuse or griefing).
But if this abuse or griefing is solved then troop ships might shine (though they can still be abstracted).

 

But there maybe another way of making it a bit more interesting/spiced up. 

A town has a pre-determined garrison size known before. 

1. The attacking fleet needs to win the Port Battle as a pre-requisite for a second stage. The original Sid Meyer's Pirates type of attack comes to mind where we had a two staged battle to sack/capture a town. Ship action followed by a simple ground battle. 

2. Once the Battle won, we could only secure the town if the available crew level on the surviving ships are bigger-than the defending garrison size. 

  • There could be a boarding type mini-game completing the assault on the town defences.  At the existing form this might not be a good one i grant, but it maybe possible to create a little mini-game on a hex board to defeat the garrison forces. 

I know, after the 1.5 hrs battle and screening action, a player want nothing of this.

What if the land based action is offered to players not participating in the fleet action  and could be done from any ports via an interface where a kind of mini strategy module is played by players against AI or enemy players. Developed the right way it would certainly mean a lot of content and fun/frustration for everyone. what it would certainly do is to involve a lot more people in the process of RVR even if they cant sail in a battle fleet. More people getting the rewards and partaking in all the fun. 

How would you select who will do what is another thing:)

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3 hours ago, admin said:

Troop transports, elite fleets, gold caravans - have the problem
The problem with gold caravans (ai or player) or troop transports is this - Instanced battles

Instanced battles are absolutely impossible to work around as we want 500-2500 players in the open world at the same time. 

You can keep the troop transport in battle - forever. See the troop transport - attack, kite for 1.5 hours, repeat.
Second problem is 50 ship limit. 10 troop transports means 10 less ships in battle for your side.. 
 

maybe add a "Transport Refit" for people to carry marines and only enough sailors to work the sails. You wouldn't want too many guns to increase your speed. The sole purpose being to get close to the shallows, hitting a landing button, then your are pretty much done for the battle. You need x number of marines to storm the beaches and take the town while still making sure your fleet is big enough to hold off the enemy.

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4 hours ago, admin said:

Landing would be impossible if there is no Naval Dominance in the area. Current screening action and port battle just simulates the achievement of the dominance through zone control and once you destroy defending fleet your imaginary troop ships operate without any interference capturing the port. 

Thus - troop ship might not add anything to the game if not designed properly (to cover all potential abuse or griefing).
But if this abuse or griefing is solved then troop ships might shine (though they can still be abstracted).

Well then..Port can be taken only in multiple battles then..1st one is a fleet vs fleet.

2nd one..troops vs...shit yeah, against whom?

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24 hour open instance PB's with a running point tally.  Eleminates zone concerns, eleminates only certain groups from entering, promotes national over clan. Port defensives can be fleshed out.

 

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Obviously it would take some graphics work, but otherwise how difficult would it be to have the forts/towers function as "ships" commanded by player captains? Sailing model is simple: 0 turn rate, 0 max speed, 0 sailing physics. Massive armor, massive HP and Structure. Incredible crew protection for the large crew. Give them mortars as well as large guns. In most PB there would 3 of the 25 captains assigned to the forts.

In order for the attacker to win a PB, they have to board and capture the forts. 

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13 hours ago, Ser_Slack said:

24 hour open instance PB's with a running point tally.  Eleminates zone concerns, eleminates only certain groups from entering, promotes national over clan. Port defensives can be fleshed out.

 

This idea might work in the future but as stands there are some nations with literally bugger all players. (Poland) They would just get stomped by player numbers.

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5 hours ago, Capt Jubal Early said:

This idea might work in the future but as stands there are some nations with literally bugger all players. (Poland) They would just get stomped by player numbers.

When has this not been so?

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Just now, Ser_Slack said:

When has this not been so?

2016 :P Before the introduction of Russia, Prussia, and Poland :)
At some point the game will return to increased player numbers once they get the reviews under control and release.

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2 hours ago, Capt Jubal Early said:

2016 :P Before the introduction of Russia, Prussia, and Poland :)
At some point the game will return to increased player numbers once they get the reviews under control and release.

Stay optimistic. I don't see it. Some different changes have to be made before people will return. I could be completely wrong but I doubt it. I just gave my thumbs up review on steam this last weekend. Pretty rough crowd.

 

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