furyGer Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 some plans from a swedish draftsman sailtyps of ships privateer frigate with 28x 28pnd maindeck-guns (Swedish pnd is smaller as english, i mean, more to 24pnd) Frigates (but perhaps merchants with frigate-sails?, look the hullform) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachi Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 (edited) As the title says, a small collection of my favourite plans by my favourite 18th century shipwright Navy Bellona - class 1783 -1785, 40 guns (24p) *done* af Chapman frigate 1803, 40 guns (24p) *done* 18-pounder frigate ca. 1765, 38 guns, concept ANM *done* 8-pounder frigate 1779, 24 guns, concept *done* Cutter 1783, 10 guns *done* Gun Boat 1775 *done* Merchant vessels East-Indiaman 1803 *done* Ship-rigged merchant ca. 1785 *done* Brig ca. 1800 Snow 1773 110-gun ship concept, ca. 1797 Armament: 30*42-pounders 32*30-pounders 30*18-pounders 18*12-pounders Crew: 1010 94-gun ship concept, ca. 1797 Dimensions Length 202' (swedish fot) Breadth 53' Draught Forward 22' Draught Aft 23' Armament: 30*42-pounders 32* 30-pounders 32*18-pounders Crew: 828 Konung Gustav IV / Gustav den Store, 74-gun ship, 1799 Dimensions Length 165' (swedish fot) Breadth 46' Draught Aft 19' 7' Armament: 28*36-pounders 30*24-pounders 16*12-pounders Crew: 695 contemporay model: http://digitaltmuseum.se/011024822502?query=Gustav%20den%20Store&pos=0 Improved Wasa-class, 62-gun ship, 1782 (plan of Rättvisan, http://collections.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/81290.html) Dimensions Length 166' (swedish fot) Breadth 45' 9'' Draught Aft 19' 6' Height of gundeck above water 7' 4'' Armament: 26*24-pounders 26*18-pounders 8*6-pounders Crew: 564 Later: 26*36-pounders 26*24-pounders 8*6-pounders Note: not all ships received the heavier armament due to the lack of sufficient 36-pounders Ships in class: Kronprins Gustaf Adolph 1782 - 1790 Fädnerslandet 1782 - 1864 Ömheten 1783 - 1789 Rättvisan 1783 - 1812 Dygden 1784 - 1793 Äran 1784 - 1874 Försiktigheten 1784 - 1825 Dristighenten 1785 - 1869 Manligheten 1785 - 1864 Tapperheten 1785 - 1825 contemporary model of the Gustaf Adolph: http://digitaltmuseu...=Modell, Gustav Bellona-class, 24-pounder frigate, 1782 Dimensions Length 156' (swedish fod) Breadth 40' Draught Aft 17' 6'' Height of middle gunport above the water 7' L/B ratio 3.9 Armament 26* 24-pounders 14* 6-pounders Crew: 342 Ships in class: Bellona 1782 - 1809 Minerva 1782 - 1789 Diana 1783 - 1802 Venus 1783 - 1789 (1812) Fröja 1784 - 1834 Thetis 1784 - 1818 Camillia 1784 - 1842 Galathea 1785 - 1854 Eurydice 1785 - 1858 Zemire 1785 - 1790 af Chapman, 24-pounder frigate, 1803 - 1825 Dimensions Length 154' (swedish fod) Breadth 39' Draught Aft 18' Height of middle gunport above the water 7' 7'' L/B ratio 3.95 Armament 26*24-pounders 2* 12-pounders 12*8-pounders Crew: 330 18-pounder frigate concept, ca. 1765, ANM Plate XXXIII (the plans from chapman.net are horribly distorted, this one is corrected) Dimensions Length 145' 6'' (imperial) Breadth 38' Draught Aft 17' Height of middle gunport above the water 6' 4'' L/B ratio 3.83 Armament 26*18-pounders, 12*6-pounders At least a decade ahead of it´s time when Chapman made the plans for this ship (the first french and british 18-pounder frigates were launched in the late 1770s). The guns are mounted on sliding carriages to reduce the number of men needed to operate them. And, as far as I know, the ingame 'frigate' is loosely based on this design. 18-pounder frigate concept, 1798 Dimensions Length 149' (swedish fot) Breadth 37' 7'' Draught Foreward 15' 6'' Draught Aft 17' 1' Height of middle gunport above the water 7' L/B ratio 3.96 Armament 24*18-pounders, 12*6-pounders 8-pounder frigate Dimensions Length 121' (swedish, 117' 10'' imperial) Breadth 32' Draught Aft 13' 1' Height of middle gunport above the water 6' 4'' L/B ratio 3.78 Armament 24* 8-pounders, 10* 3-pounders Cutter, 1783 Dimensions Length 68' (swedish) Breadth 27' Armament 10* light 12-pounders Gunboat, 1775 Dimensions Length 98'' (swedish) Breadth 20' Armament 4*12-pounders Crew: 100 Gustaf den III., East-Indiaman, 1803 Dimensions Length 161' 6'' (swedish) Breadth 43' Depth in Hold 16' 10'' Draught Aft 22' 6'' Armament ? Merchant, ship-rigged, ca. 1785 Dimensions Length 110' (swedish) Breadth 33' Depth in Hold 13' 6'' Armament 22*6-pounders ? If someone has the plans for Ulla Fersen, please send a PM Edited January 20, 2016 by Malachi 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeBoiteux Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 (edited) Interesting post. However, I'm not very fond of Thread Titles in the Shipyard beginning by "My Favorite..." or "Poster's Name Plans". What about setting up a more neutral and useful convention for plan thread titles like this : "Nation - Ship class - Time Period" ? Ex : "Danish Brigs (1700-1750)" It'd be easier to navigate in the Shipyard Forum, wouldn't it ? And contributions from various posters could be easily added. Edit : - in case of nations with only few known plans, we could have only one thread : "Venetian Ships (18th century)". - in case of a thematic thread with ship plans from various nations : "Internat. Exploration ships (1700-1820)" Edited November 28, 2015 by LeBoiteux 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachi Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 Good point, gonna change the thread title asap 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 there are some beautiful decorated frigates in that book. pure awesomeness. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachi Posted January 15, 2016 Share Posted January 15, 2016 (edited) Added 94-gun ship and 36-gun frigate to the OP Edited January 15, 2016 by Malachi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomms123 Posted January 15, 2016 Share Posted January 15, 2016 (edited) Added 94-gun ship and 36-gun frigate to the OP That is actually a plan he did of HMS Victory Edited January 15, 2016 by Tomms123 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maturin Posted January 15, 2016 Share Posted January 15, 2016 That is actually a plan he did of HMS Victory Aren't the topsides and beakhead totally different? At a minimum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachi Posted January 15, 2016 Share Posted January 15, 2016 (edited) That is actually a plan he did of HMS Victory Uhm, what? That´s definitely not his drawing of Balchen´s Victory Added af Chapman, Bellona-class and a merchant vessel. Edited January 15, 2016 by Malachi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachi Posted January 17, 2016 Share Posted January 17, 2016 (edited) Added 110-gun ship, Konung Gustav IV and improved Wasa-class Edited January 17, 2016 by Malachi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomms123 Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 Uhm, what? That´s definitely not his drawing of Balchen´s Victory Added af Chapman, Bellona-class and a merchant vessel. You're right, I found the drawing he did of it ^^ http://digitaltmuseum.se/011024827286?owner_filter=S-SMM-SM&query=ritning&producer=chapman,%20fredrik&advanced_search=1&pos=46 Also you got most of the drawings he did under this: http://digitaltmuseum.se/search?owner_filter=S-SMM-SM&query=ritning&producer=chapman,%20fredrik&advanced_search=1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachi Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 A pity most of his drawings aren´t available online yet (e.g. the Gustav Adolph-class and the Diana/af Chapman) And I ordered the drawings for the Ulla Fersen of 1787 (a really cute little 6-pounder frigate with a V-shaped hull) and his concept for a 26*30-pounder frigate he made in 1797, I´ll update the OP when I get those Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BungeeLemming Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 Where can you get these plans? Do you have a goo high resoluion source for such? Cause I am very interested in the Wasa 1782.. I had a quick go at her in blender. Seems like a lovely square ship to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomms123 Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 Where can you get these plans? Do you have a goo high resoluion source for such? Cause I am very interested in the Wasa 1782.. I had a quick go at her in blender. Seems like a lovely square ship to me. All plans of swedish ships since like 1500 (if they didnt perish in one of the fires of the librarys) can be found in the Swedish Riksarkivet or Krigsarkivet. Dont know if you have to be a Swedish citizent to be able to get the drawings. Some of them are digitalised but some of them are in their original drawing or a copy they have made. Some of them can be found on the internet (like the link i posted). If Im not wrong the Wasa 1782 can be found on the internet dont remember right now where. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BungeeLemming Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 fyi the Wasa class was laid down a few weeks ago. constuctions got delayed several times due to RL issues (studying stuff) and a lot of re-doing correcting etc. But here is what I got thus far: enjoy! alternative link: http://imgur.com/cBIAYBP 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapling Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 fyi the Wasa class was laid down a few weeks ago. constuctions got delayed several times due to RL issues (studying stuff) and a lot of re-doing correcting etc. But here is what I got thus far: wasa_1782_hull.jpg enjoy! alternative link: http://imgur.com/cBIAYBP Looks like a great start! Has there been any progress on this work? I'd love to see both the Bellona and Wasa class in the game. Some of af Chapman's other designs are very fine as well, and would be a nice addition at some point in the future, but these two are really more of a must-have. It seems to me that they formed the backbone in the Swedish navy at an appropriate time (ca 1790), with many ships built that saw multiple battles and long services. A concern of mine, however, is how the armament of the Wasa class would fit into the game. I'm now talking about the later 26 x 36 lb + 28 x 24 lb + 6 x 6 lb armament, or thereabouts, that they per my understanding carried around year 1790. Wouldn't it outgun the Bellona 3rd rate SOL? I wouldn't say no the Hemmema class (the archipelago frigate with the ridiculous armament 22 x 36 lb + 2 x 12 lb) to dominate shallow port battles, but I'm not greedy, that can wait. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OTMatt Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I would like that 8 pounder frigate in the game. I love me some pocket frigates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BungeeLemming Posted March 4, 2016 Share Posted March 4, 2016 The Wasa is making progress. Sadly I dont have the time to work on her a lot. I am currently doing the headrails and due to lack of time I am struggleing to get stuff done. But I may supply you with some progress pictures once I am done with the bow section. About her armemtn: yep she would be some sort of super 4th rate or even a 3rd in regards of firepower. Also she wasnt a bad sailor. Faster than her appearance may make you think. Malachi has exact numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachi Posted March 4, 2016 Share Posted March 4, 2016 (edited) The 'improved Wasa-class' from the OP is the Gustav Adolph-class (10 vessels, Wasa had one sister ships), actually. The Gustav Adolphs were 2 feet longer, had a proper forecastle and higher bulwarks. And they were goood sailors indeed: 10 3/4 knots close-hauled with one point of leeway, 12 1/2 - 13 knots running free and needed ca. 2 and half minutes for a complete tack. Wouldn't it outgun the Bellona 3rd rate SOL? Not really. Swedes didn´t use carronades until the early 1800s and the swedish pound weighed less than the british pound (425g vs 453,6g) Edited March 4, 2016 by Malachi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 191171 Posted March 4, 2016 Share Posted March 4, 2016 here Wasa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomms123 Posted March 4, 2016 Share Posted March 4, 2016 (edited) here Wasa Any way you can post it so you can see it better? Edited March 4, 2016 by Tomms123 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapling Posted March 4, 2016 Share Posted March 4, 2016 The Wasa is making progress. Sadly I dont have the time to work on her a lot. I am currently doing the headrails and due to lack of time I am struggleing to get stuff done. But I may supply you with some progress pictures once I am done with the bow section. About her armemtn: yep she would be some sort of super 4th rate or even a 3rd in regards of firepower. Also she wasnt a bad sailor. Faster than her appearance may make you think. Malachi has exact numbers. It's understandable that you have limited time, I am writing to make sure that you know that the time you put in is valued by the community! Please do provide pictures when the bow section is done, it would be very appreciated! I don't think she looks slow at all! Being a two-decker does that, I think. The 'improved Wasa-class' from the OP is the Gustav Adolph-class (10 vessels, Wasa had one sister ships), actually. The Gustav Adolphs were 2 feet longer, had a proper forecastle and higher bulwarks. And they were goood sailors indeed: 10 3/4 knots close-hauled with one point of leeway, 12 1/2 - 13 knots running free and needed ca. 2 and half minutes for a complete tack. Not really. Swedes didn´t use carronades until the early 1800s and the swedish pound weighed less than the british pound (425g vs 453,6g) Impressive numbers! So sailing wise it should be something like the USS Constitution? Perhaps a tad slower? Well, using the numbers I gave above, and the in-game Bellona numbers (from wiki), the broadsides are something like 580 kg for the Gustav Adolph (what did they use for chasers? 2x24 bow and 2x6 stern?) and around 700 kg for the Bellona (all cannons). While this is still a significant difference, with the GA having about 80% of the broadside weight of the Bellona, the latter presents a much larger target, and its cannons are of smaller caliber. Now if the Bellona is fitted with carronades where applicable, it would still have the edge at close range. From a distance my guess is that the GA-class would at least be a very tough opponent for a Bellona, especially considering their fine sailing characteristics, which would allow them to keep said distance. I guess there will be lots of balancing as more ships are added, and the GA-/Wasa-class shouldn't provide any particular problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachi Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 (what did they use for chasers? 2x24 bow and 2x6 stern?) By looking at the plan/model of the Gustav Adolph I´d guess 2*36-pounders, 2*6-pounders at the bow and 2*36-pounders, 2*6-pounders at the stern. And I´ve no idea about the speed of the Constitution in our timeframe. But only very few frigates managed close to 11 knots close-hauled while 13 knots running would have been considered good performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BungeeLemming Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 So this is her appearance atm: http://imgur.com/a/F3riL headrails will look pretty similar like that in the picture but they are not final. whats missing is a lot of side-decorations and ornaments. The stern will need some ornaments as well but I am not sure if I should do them myslf since if (and thats a huge if) the ship is accepted by game-labs they will propably do it themselfs. also these black rails are the top end of the nets for the crew's hammocks. just like the ingame niagara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BungeeLemming Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 update? http://imgur.com/amnfFpb Everything above that ornament rail on the sides is meant to be black. until that blue-ish part. Which should be smooth instead of aprupt.. Ive got to do that for sure but I have to learn all of that texturing from scratch. I once knew how to UV texture and do all the neat things but thats years ago-.- 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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