Is there a place for Signals?

[Lyric]

I've made a couple of posts which touch on Signals, how pivotal they were in naval warfare and how they just cannot fit in the game because of voice communication software.

 

I think there is a way to beat it, whilst still making good use of programs such as Ts3, ventrilo and mumble.

 

 

enemy and ally nameplates.

 

At present you can see all the names of allies, however in the linked post below, the majority of people would prefer NOT to see this information as it is at present as it isn't realistic.

http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/2909-modify-the-names-over-the-ships/

 

Instead, if you identified ships by using a glass on their name, flags or broad pendant, and get rid of the names altogether

Lets be honest, in a typical organised battle, 2 teams will have their formations for about 5-10 minutes of the game, after that it can move into complete chaos with ships scattered from their flag ship and engaging on both sides.  Why? Because they have absolutely no concern of being able to find their leader and fall back into formation with relative ease.  Make them work for it however and this will change.

 

Voice comm servers will still allow a higher degree of communication, but despite it, you will still have to work to know exactly what ships you are amongst.

Edited May 6, 2015 by Richard Bolitho

[admin]

voice comms make all most signals obsolete. But you still have to identify friend from foe looking at the flag.

[Gentry]

On top of that, I think the enemy should remain 'nameless' until you somehow learn the flags of particular enemies through some ingame mechanic in the OW. 

 

Perhaps dependent on how educated your captain is on enemy insignia or from past battles. 

[Lyric]

Of course, telling friend from foe only requires one peek at the flag.

 

However, how do you tell enemy from enemy, and ally from ally?

1) The ship name on the stern [hopefully customizable]. 

2) The broad pendant.

 

You can get voice comm instructions from your flag ship, but it might be that you don't know which one is your flagship for example. Which is why looking at the name/pendant should come into play.

Edited May 6, 2015 by Richard Bolitho

[Prater]

As much as I want there to be signals, combat is way too fast. 

[Aragorn]

As much as I want there to be signals, combat is way too fast. 

 

this is exactly my thoughts as well.

[poosd]

Just a thought from a simple soul.  Didn't most warships have a midshipman or some other rank assigned as a signals officer?  This could also tie in to crew skill levels (Comm. level?)  The ranking officer selects some pre-canned order or movement sequence, the flags go up on the flagship (this can be shown graphically or not depending on how deep you want to program), and friendly ships in range and with visibility (line of sight not blocked by smoke or limited by weather) get a

 

1.  text display to screen with the order or message

2.  "message waiting" text alerting you to go to your "Signals" screen where you send and receive signals

3.  an actual spoken voice saying "orders from flag, all ships form line" or something appropriate for a naval battle.

 

In Silent Hunter 4 someone from your crew is always echoing your orders, telling you what is being detected and letting you know if a radio message has come in.  Maybe something along those lines might be possible.  Now, I am in the Realist camp when it comes to the Age of Sail.  But as Prater says "combat is way too fast", and, if you make me jump to another screen and decode a flag signal message based on "todays code cypher"....well.....you guys think I crash into you a lot now when fighting!  I'll be like a fire ship floating through your fleet....No one will want me on their team....and that would hurt my feelings.

 

Just a thought.

 

Dean

poosd 

[Macjimm]

This is one of those preferences that really separates the players who want immersion from those who prefer the balance of a fast competitive combat.

I’ve played another game where the teamwork renders down to clear communication. We have played with 60 of us on one team and the uniforms and vehicles are dangerously similar when lighting fast reactions are required to stay alive. Factor in the limits of situational awareness in a computer world and cooperative action with mutual support is a huge challenge. Other players use many different hints and cues in an effort to improve awareness but the long term result is that those who pay attention in game and rely on their own sense of awareness (not the enhancements) are better at teamwork.

If I were to express my desire for the removal of nametags and the use of identifying all ships by flags, pendants, sails, paintworks and names painted on the stern some would claim I was fanatically focused on realism at the expense of a playable game. They might say that the restricted views (lack of peripheral vision) and limits to the sense of direction and speed with which some one can look around within game are too great to expect players to keep track of identifying who is who and be effective at fighting.

I think those of us who are serious (not fanatical) could develop our in game senses to be pretty effective at keeping track of the friendlies from enemies. This would take effort but would soon prove to be a more satisfying experience. I only have a few hours per week but I still think this type of teamwork can be developed.

Using unrestricted TS, Mumble, Ventrillo seems very gamey to me as wireless communication would never have been available in the age of sail. It would be possible to limit communication within shouting distance using a mod to TS3. Using some simple flags doesn’t seem that complicated and it would add a fascinating dimension to the game. We could have a few predetermined signals. Yellow flag = hard port, Blue flag = hard starboard, Blue = form line on me, Red = disperse.

I hesitate to express these views because the response from some will be that I should join the navy … afterall it’s only a game.

I think that we can have the competitive combat and the realism that enhances it. Proficiency won’t require people to play for 8 hrs per day.

I like Poosd idea:

3.  an actual spoken voice saying "orders from flag, all ships form line" or something appropriate for a naval battle.

[scepo]

The problem is that a fleet that is using TS will always be at an advantage therefore in game communication should be good enough that fleets that are not on TS do not have a crippling disadvantage. Also game is greatly speed up so flag signals are not feasible.

 

Historically battles were fought in a line for at least 3 reasons relevant here, to provide a way for admiral orders to actually be relayed, to have the ability to disengage in an orderly manner and to not fully commit to battle. Nelson at the battle of Trafalgar decided to engage in a decisive battle, he therefore ordered all his ships to paint their hulls in a distinctive pattern to avoid friendly fire. Painting your hull in that way is not much different than having a easy to understand digital representation while allowing players to customize their ship appearance to their taste. After all since losing a ship by necessity in a game is not as devastating as in real life so decisive battles will be common. 

 

So in my opinion text messaging inside the instance is a must and there needs to be some kind of clear way to recognize friendly ships.

[Alex Starwind]

All topics about signals for some reasons only refer to "in battle" situation, but it is "open world" game and I think some sort of signals system will be very good. Let say I meet some friendly or neutral in open sea and want communicate with him. I don't know if he has TS or any microphone at all. What I need to do? "Scream" in global chat: "Hay you, that guy on frigate with English flag! I want to exchange news with you! (or buy/sell, request help")"? And all guys on frigates with English flag start to respond  With signal system I can raise correspondent flag on my mast and wait for reply. For players who doesn't want learn signals we can add feature into spyglass when you look on signal it wright translation of it in normal English   

[William the Drake]

The possible place of signals and flags has been touched on in the topic: Flags, Ensigns, Banners, while the majority of the post is simply about suggested flag designs, their have been discussions about the role of flags and banners that ranged from communication, commands, identification, etc. Even the idea of flying false colors (mostly for pirates) or not flying a jack at all has been discussed in other topics regarding piracy.

 

I personally thought that implementing command signals, if only for NPCs, would be extremely useful and immersive. Real-time coms do make signal flags between players a bit redundant, although I think there can be some sort of compromise.