>>>Beta v1.1 Feedback<<< [RC 6]

[admiralsnackbar]

38 minutes ago, Hull_001 said:

Has anyone else tried using alt+right click when moving ships? It seems to negate the wobbly effect of ships. I still prefer the "go this way" of the right click rather than the "go here" of alt+right click.

I would do that if the game had an overmap where you could 'go here' and click at an extremely distant point, but generally the reason you order a turn of your vessels is to orient them in a particular direction relative to the enemy [target] ships and not so that you can just go somewhere within 5km and stop dead. 


The 'Ghost division' system proposed by neph is something i recall recommending myself, because once you can get a single ship to accelerate/decelerate and make minor rudder adjustments in order to position itself at a specific [moving] point whilst orienting its bow in a specific direction, you can use that system as the basis for:

1. Better torpedo evasion logic 
2. Fleet screens at custom distances specified by AI and player
3. Orders to approach an enemy and then maintain a pre-specified distance

The other advantage is for debugging, since it would be possible to visually toggle and see on the battle map where a given vessel is trying to go. 


At any rate, the wobbly  warships problem is I assume a result of the rudder being held too long in a particular direction and the momentum of the ship causing it to continue to turn even after the rudder has shifted. I'm guessing then the act of manually setting the rudder is effectively telling Newtons 1st law to STFU 

If it's game-physics vs. rudder shift timing then this is something of a pickle, because the solutions that we as players are using to avoid the oscillations are either gimmicks that disable the physics or manually steering the ship ourselves to generate an outcome that the game cannot figure out on its own. [idk which]

If the manual rudder button or alt clicking is actually disabling physics then perhaps disable physics in all cases except perhaps when rudder control is lost and call it a day. Either there's a book somewhere which describes how a helmsman of a large ship prevents this sort of thing that could be coded in C#/unity, or the solution involves a lot of trial and error that would frankly be better spent elsewhere. 
 

Edited January 3, 2023 by admiralsnackbar

[Kane]

Has anyone here successfully conducted a naval invasion?

I've attempted about a dozen since the option emerged, most of them on small islands like Marshal Islands, or what have you.  Thus far none have actually succeeded.

The only exception has been in a game as Germany, I initiated an invasion of East Britain, Britain collapsed before the invasion was done, and because the invasion did not end with the war, so I ended up capturing that piece in the end.

Currently as USA, I've made 4 separate attempts to seize the Marshal Islands from Germany, and each time it has failed.  Meanwhile whenever I try invading one of these tiny islands held by a major power, the number of enemy troops on the island somehow skyrockets, despite the fact I have a couple fleets parked on it and the enemy has no ships in sight.

So at this point, I'm just trying to ascertain how borked the system is.  Has anyone had success with a naval invasion?

[Lima]

8 minutes ago, Kane said:

Has anyone here successfully conducted a naval invasion?

I've attempted about a dozen since the option emerged, most of them on small islands like Marshal Islands, or what have you.  Thus far none have actually succeeded.

The only exception has been in a game as Germany, I initiated an invasion of East Britain, Britain collapsed before the invasion was done, and because the invasion did not end with the war, so I ended up capturing that piece in the end.

Currently as USA, I've made 4 separate attempts to seize the Marshal Islands from Germany, and each time it has failed.  Meanwhile whenever I try invading one of these tiny islands held by a major power, the number of enemy troops on the island somehow skyrockets, despite the fact I have a couple fleets parked on it and the enemy has no ships in sight.

So at this point, I'm just trying to ascertain how borked the system is.  Has anyone had success with a naval invasion?

I managed to land on small islands, but landing on something serious, such as Corsica, always turns into a failure (your 100 ships don't matter).

[Kane]

2 minutes ago, Lima said:

I managed to land on small islands, but landing on something serious, such as Corsica, always turns into a failure (your 100 ships don't matter).

So its just bad luck that I can't seem to seize a small island to save my life.  Good to know.  And yeah, I wouldn't even begin to try a landing on a place like Corsica, when I can't even seize the Marshal Islands.

[admiralsnackbar]

2 hours ago, Werwaz said:

I think there are still a number of problems with this update that need fixing before release, namely:

• campaign stability (game hanging up or bricking the computer between turns)
• ship maneuvering, namely the excessively unrealistic oversteering which warrants micromanaging the entire fleet's maneuvers.
• stormtrooper level accuracy for larger (16+ inch) guns. they are already burdened with long reloads and heavy weight.
• abnormally low muzzle velocities compared to historical examples
• displacement caps for shared designs. hacking larger designs in is a pain, and sometimes I just to fight a super battleship that is competently designed. 

I've actually been looking at the resources.assets and seeing what I can do about the large caliber guns. Getting it so that Mark III 15 inch and 16 inch guns are available at their historical times. I was able to mod my own files to get the dates that i suggested in a separate thread. 

I wanted to see what I could do about the accuracy and ROF of the large caliber guns.

Shots per minute for the gun sizes and marks is a value I can edit but it is nearly impossible to know what the resulting in-game reload speeds will be because it is affected by half a dozen factors and I don't know what the underlying formula is. Trial and error is really the only way. Like If I say that Mark IV 16 inch guns should fire 2 rounds per minute it might end up getting 3.5 rounds per minute because of the combined influence of gun length, crew training, tech modules, hidden tech bonuses, country specific gun modifiers, etc. etc. 

In fact they are not even the same for different countries at the same tech level because a US gun and a German or British gun model can all have different default gun lengths. 

Accuracy is even worse. I think the formula is something like...

[{Accuracy at max range [~.032%]}^(hitchancecurver)^(range/max range)]

And then all of that is presumably multiplied by the tech/sea state, etc. etc. 

This explains why cordite I is the best powder always. Higher Max range pushes the whole curve to the right. 

Something to note is that the hitchancecurver is not the same between different gun types. A smaller curver value means that accuracy drops off more rapidly as you go from 0km to max range. This might explain why 2.9 inch is more accurate than 3 inch but I don't know for certain if the interpolated gun calibers are interpolating the hit chance curvers. 

I should also point out that the formula above can't fully explain the difference in mid-ranged accuracy between all guns. 12 inch and 2 inch guns have the highest [most favorable] curvers, but even with those curvers the drop off we see for higher calibers is caused by a variable i can't pin down. 

(I experimented with setting the hit chance at max range and hitchancecurvers to the same number across all guns but the resulting hit probabilities were way too high.)

 

Edited January 3, 2023 by admiralsnackbar

[Alnitak]

4 hours ago, Nick Thomadis said:

*Update 10*
- Fixed many bugs of the campaign that could make it unplayable for various reasons, especially when major nations dissolved and broke into smaller territories. It is advised to start a new campaign to test if a new one is completely free of such issues.
- Fixed Major Offensive bug that prevented losses caused by allies to be calculated.
- Major Offensives can now end promptly if losses are overwhelming for the attacker.
- Fixed bugs of aiming that made aiming to not grow correctly, especially for guns of the left side.
- Fixed various issues that could cause auto-design delays or errors.
- Improved further the shell dispersion mechanics.
- Improved the citadel weight distribution based on recent feedback. Your saved designs may need re-adjustments.
- Fixed probably the last of the crucial formation bugs, causing division speed stalling when a ship got damaged or delay to turns for following ships of the division.

The build should be now close to be a release candidate. Some small updates may come without notes. We hope now the most important bugs have been squashed and the build can be enjoyable for most of you.

PLEASE RESTART STEAM TO DOWNLOAD

It was a fight between germany and Esthonia

The campaign will collapse after finifh a battle and stick on ‘battle’.If you chose auto it will also collapse and can't load in any more.Please fix it soon.

Edited January 3, 2023 by Alnitak

[SirTrafalgar]

4 hours ago, Nick Thomadis said:

*Update 10*
- Fixed many bugs of the campaign that could make it unplayable for various reasons, especially when major nations dissolved and broke into smaller territories. It is advised to start a new campaign to test if a new one is completely free of such issues.
- Fixed Major Offensive bug that prevented losses caused by allies to be calculated.
- Major Offensives can now end promptly if losses are overwhelming for the attacker.
- Fixed bugs of aiming that made aiming to not grow correctly, especially for guns of the left side.
- Fixed various issues that could cause auto-design delays or errors.
- Improved further the shell dispersion mechanics.
- Improved the citadel weight distribution based on recent feedback. Your saved designs may need re-adjustments.
- Fixed probably the last of the crucial formation bugs, causing division speed stalling when a ship got damaged or delay to turns for following ships of the division.

The build should be now close to be a release candidate. Some small updates may come without notes. We hope now the most important bugs have been squashed and the build can be enjoyable for most of you.

PLEASE RESTART STEAM TO DOWNLOAD

Please do not go to release soon. Take the time to fix the balance issues and bugs. 

1. As a first instance minor nations seem good but please give us a way to interact diplomatically. It would be great to use them as a way to kick off wars and such. Ie by out right declaring war on the Ottomans who are protected by the Austrians should trigger a war with the Austrians and their allies. Also should be a way to sway influence over minors so that it doesn't feel so RNG. 

2. Armies need balancing before release. Right now that should be done with manpower pools and such. In the future consider adding technology scores to armies based upon naval research. Guns would give more Artillery scores, Small Guns would add in better field artillery, Turrets and casemates for defensive scores, armor and AUX could add tanks along with small gun techs. Basically the logic here is to give players input into the Army without controlling the army. Therefore a numerically inferior foe could easily defeat a technologically inferior foe. 

3. Rebellions happen far to often for some nations. Also if a rebellion happens in a minor nation their allies should be able to help. 

4. Selling Ships, right now minors seem to have a limitless supply of cash and they ask for way to many ships. Also Majors should be able to buy a design off another Major if they have a high enough diplomatic score. 

5. Drunk Driving ships aren't just a visual bug they effect the shot accuracy and let ships get away far too easily. 

6. Torpedo Cruiser Funnels are way to weak they need more capacity. 

7. Majors break up way to randomly and when they do far too much of their territory goes to unowned status. Every single port/province should have an owner even if those countries never existed. Ie Barcelona being Aragon. Replace fallen Majors by promoting a minor like the Ottomans to become a great power. 

8. Shipyard capacity, This is an excellent idea, but it should always be max tonnage+ a percentage of active ports that can further upgrade based upon GDP and, Natural Resource Growth. 

9. Give players missions to support armies that are already on the ground but are close to the shore.

I like the fact that we are playing as the Secretary of Navy (or equivalent) However, that doesn't mean we should be powerless. For instance allies in other government positions should allow us to say or influence choices that fall out of our direct control. If players don't have direct control of a game mechanic make sure you have a way for us to influence those choices. Player agency is super important

[RNV]

I'm going to put it here (I've made an in game report some versions ago, but I understand it is a very low priority thing).

The flag and emblem for the Regia Marina used in game are wrong. They are using the Marina Militare emblem, the one adopted after WWII. Over the course of the time period the Navy flag and emblem were the following:

Flag  Emblem 

 

[Tycondero]

I still feel that the army invasions and a loss of territory has not sufficient impact. I have seen a couple of games started in 1900 in which Germany controlled 2/3 main provinces of France and the war still continued. With so much occupation, the French should not be able to continue the fight or at the very least not willing. 

EDIT: I also observed that when the occupier collapses, the occupied provinces are not returned to the owner, but remain neutral.

Furthermore, the German AI has severe issues in maintaining economical stability during war. Countries that are close to this should try to sue for peace. Alternatively, I believe that some countries, like Germany, Russia and Austria-Hungary might be too vulnerable to blockades/economical warfare.

Also, I would recommend that all nations start out a bit less hostile to each other so that we do not get a war already within 3 years. Perhaps only the 1910 and 1940 campaign startdates should be an exception to this due to historical reasons. 

Edited January 3, 2023 by Tycondero

[The PC Collector]

I think it has already been reported, but I'm having to Alt-F4 like every 4-5 turns due to the "yes" button on dialogs bugging out and being non responsive. Bugs like this one are the reason why I say that the update is not even remotely close to be ready for RC stage.

Edit: Now the "move" button is also becoming irresponsive lots of times, forcing me to restart the game to move my fleets.

Edited January 3, 2023 by The PC Collector

[Kevin Alexander]

7 hours ago, Nick Thomadis said:

*Update 10*
- Fixed many bugs of the campaign that could make it unplayable for various reasons, especially when major nations dissolved and broke into smaller territories. It is advised to start a new campaign to test if a new one is completely free of such issues.
- Fixed Major Offensive bug that prevented losses caused by allies to be calculated.
- Major Offensives can now end promptly if losses are overwhelming for the attacker.
- Fixed bugs of aiming that made aiming to not grow correctly, especially for guns of the left side.
- Fixed various issues that could cause auto-design delays or errors.
- Improved further the shell dispersion mechanics.
- Improved the citadel weight distribution based on recent feedback. Your saved designs may need re-adjustments.
- Fixed probably the last of the crucial formation bugs, causing division speed stalling when a ship got damaged or delay to turns for following ships of the division.

The build should be now close to be a release candidate. Some small updates may come without notes. We hope now the most important bugs have been squashed and the build can be enjoyable for most of you.

PLEASE RESTART STEAM TO DOWNLOAD

Close to release? For the love of God, tell me you're kidding.

It's been 10 hotfixes since we've been complaining about the drunken steering of ships and it's still the same really. It's not realistic, it's annoying and I've lost ships that instead of crossing a T kept going and going and only started turning when surrounded by torpedo boats...

Just revert to like 1.08 steering, do our complaints about this issue really mean nothing?

Not to mention the other campaign-ending bugs, but with those ones I've been fairly lucky and haven't encountered them a whole lot.

Please. Fix. The. Steering.

 

[PainKiller]

10 minutes ago, The PC Collector said:

I think it has already been reported, but I'm having to Alt-F4 like every 4-5 turns due to the "yes" button on dialogs bugging out and being non responsive. Bugs like this one are the reason why I say that the update is not even remotely close to be ready for RC stage.

It feels like not everyting is being read. I only follow the recent version forum like this one so it's easy to read everything, but i saw that you guys post in new thread as well, also there are feedback on steam comments,discord, and the in game report. Probably hundreds of posts.

We may not have said this but when you tell us what bugs are know and worked on, we are very thankfull and happy. Equally worrying when a bug which had been reported by multiple people get's no mention 😕 Like the one above. Altough it can be in the [small improvement], i have not played the recent version yet, so sorry if this was actually fixed.😅

5 hours ago, admiralsnackbar said:

Has anyone else tried using alt+right click when moving ships?

Holy molly thank you for this, i have never used this command, such a huge improvement!!! Still don't understand why a normal right click does not work the same way....

[Norbert Sattler]

6 hours ago, Hull_001 said:

Has anyone else tried using alt+right click when moving ships? It seems to negate the wobbly effect of ships. I still prefer the "go this way" of the right click rather than the "go here" of alt+right click.

I have gone over to using a lot of manual rudder control, since that has no wobbling at all, but I'll give that a try too.

[The PC Collector]

Anyone else has had a curious problem on which the game doesn't let you move a ship to a specific port, no matter what you do?

[The PC Collector]

Damn, the bug of Mothballed ships not remaining mothballed if the "add crew" thing is marked is still present?

 

[PainKiller]

47 minutes ago, The PC Collector said:

Anyone else has had a curious problem on which the game doesn't let you move a ship to a specific port, no matter what you do?

Can you please describe in more detail what do you mean? I just tried sending ship to a different port, and the Move button was grey and couldn't press it, then just went back to map view to try another port, and it worked....went back to the first one, it worked as well. 

It feels like the same bug where we can't say yes. I also couldn't press the battle button, i had to alt+f4 and restart. 

Game sure close to release.

[RNV]

1 hour ago, The PC Collector said:

Anyone else has had a curious problem on which the game doesn't let you move a ship to a specific port, no matter what you do?

I'm not sure it is what you're referring to, but I have experienced this as France, Italy and, to a lesser extent, Spain. I think the map needs much more polishing; right clicking is especially imprecise, sometimes you can't get task forces to specific points without apparent reason, sometimes it seems the "clicking area" of a port or tile overlaps with another. I've seen this mostly in the tighter spaces of the Mediterranean where I had issue selecting Tunis over Bizerte (once I placed ships in either), Taranto over Bari, Livorno over La Spezia, Marseille over Toulon.

Edited January 3, 2023 by RNV

[Suribachi]

nevermind this post, moving to own thread

Edited January 3, 2023 by Suribachi

[Norbert Sattler]

Well... the "fixes" to crash and freeze issues did the exact opposite to me.

On my first campaign start, it hung up on octobre 1886.

On my second start it freezes up on "Building New Ships" in August 1891.

[Nick Thomadis]

1 minute ago, Norbert Sattler said:

Well... the "fixes" to crash and freeze issues did the exact opposite to me.

On my first campaign start, it hung up on octobre 1886.

On my second start it freezes up on "Building New Ships" in August 1891.

Do you have shared designs used? Can you disable the shared designs and create a new campaign.

By the 

2 hours ago, Kevin Alexander said:

Close to release? For the love of God, tell me you're kidding.

It's been 10 hotfixes since we've been complaining about the drunken steering of ships and it's still the same really. It's not realistic, it's annoying and I've lost ships that instead of crossing a T kept going and going and only started turning when surrounded by torpedo boats...

Just revert to like 1.08 steering, do our complaints about this issue really mean nothing?

Not to mention the other campaign-ending bugs, but with those ones I've been fairly lucky and haven't encountered them a whole lot.

Please. Fix. The. Steering.

 

Manual rudder is going to be removed. We noticed that a large number of players misuse this function or overuse it, creating multiple problems in the movement of ships. 

Drunken? What eventually is this new forum term? If someone can elaborate? There have been many improvements compared to the previous version of the game so such feedback cannot help us at all.

[KAIKAI]

3 new save file (1890) crash at around turn 16 . 

Reinstalled the game before the third try . ( I did verify the file ) 

During the turn it became so laggy it almost froze , i need to cut the computer power to shut it down . And yes , all three times end up need to cut the power to shut the game .

[Nick Thomadis]

6 hours ago, Alnitak said:

It was a fight between germany and Esthonia

The campaign will collapse after finifh a battle and stick on ‘battle’.If you chose auto it will also collapse and can't load in any more.Please fix it soon.

 Is this an image of a new campaign or you continued an old campaign? Old campaigns will continue to have problems that are irreparable. 

[Norbert Sattler]

22 minutes ago, Nick Thomadis said:

Do you have shared designs used? Can you disable the shared designs and create a new campaign.

In both cases I had shared designs disabled.
Would it help to drop an in-game bug report from the round before the freeze happens? I still have that.

[The PC Collector]

33 minutes ago, Nick Thomadis said:

Manual rudder is going to be removed. We noticed that a large number of players misuse this function or overuse it, creating multiple problems in the movement of ships.

Wow. What exactly are the problems that it causes? Players being able to control their ships? That is a problem? Right now, what is called the "drunken" movement, is that when you issue a direction, ships behave like a car driven by a drunken guy, sailing in an "S" pattern for several ingame minutes before it finally goes straight.

Nobody likes the new control behaviour. We don't care how reallistic do you think it is. It is annoying at the very least. And seems to be another step into artificially crippling the players to make AI more competitive instead of improving the combat AI.

Do you really think that spoon feeding a change that all the testers have requested to revert is going to be good for the game?

Edited January 3, 2023 by The PC Collector

[Suribachi]

38 minutes ago, Nick Thomadis said:

Drunken? What eventually is this new forum term? If someone can elaborate?

I will try to help with this.  When the player base says that a ship or helmsman is "drunk" what we are referring to is the ship going left to right and right to left after a turn along the line of bearing, like a drunk driver weaving on a road.

EDIT:  it looks like this. 

Edited January 3, 2023 by Suribachi