>>>v1.5 Feedback<<<(Latest version: v1.5.1.6)

[PhoenixLP44]

2 minutes ago, TK3600 said:

I think it is pretty self explanatory. They don't talk about it because they dont want to fix the problem, either because they cannot, or because they dont see it as a problem. Would you talk about stuff you don't want to do? You either must lie, or embarrass yourself by straight up refusing. Then people would ask you why not? Then you gotta dig yourself deeper by trying to justify it. The best option is to stay silent.

You will see they are otherwise pretty talkative. When they stay silent on certain issue you know something is up.

Perhaps it is so incomprehensible for me because I do tend to explain myself in these situations.

But whatever aint my job to stirr the devs into talking more and I don't want to cause any more commotion.

[MDHansen]

So apparently by clicking a friendly minor port, you can change repair priority! 

[TK3600]

2 hours ago, MDHansen said:

So apparently by clicking a friendly minor port, you can change repair priority! 

Will this affect their refit of their ships? Like making them able to refuel ship after fight?

[MDHansen]

no idea. Good question though. Saying that, the ports are set to "high", wich is the industrial standard anyway

 

Edited May 14 by MDHansen

[Nick Thomadis]

Uploaded optimized version x2 including the following:
- Fixed rare issue caused by AI logic and ammo calcs during campaign causing ships to freeze and the game to need a restart for making it work again. Please notify us, after getting this update, if you still may get such a problem.
- Fixed old problem in accuracy logic causing precalculated hits to not execute although the accuracy has triggered them. This issue was related to hull size and parts size, something that usually players exploited by making ships with minimal secondaries or only main guns, in order to make their ships getting hit much less than they should. (Player also could have such a problem vs AI, so it is a radical fix)
- Adjusted accuracy, effects of gun barrel length and Battle AI to compensate for the fixes in calculations.
- Further battle fps optimization.
- Minor UI fixes.
Please restart Steam to get this update

[atv]

Think there might be a new bug in Campaigns? 

Ships as war prizes from other countries no longer show up in 'ship designs' and are not refittable. 

 

[Nick Thomadis]

Uploaded optimized version x3 including the following:
- Further fixes to the potential problem of ammo calcs causing freezing in ships in campaign.
- Ship maneuverability adjustments.
- Other fixes and improvements.
Please restart Steam to get this update

**Warning** 
Due to the latest optimizations the AI may have become too "human-like" and opportunistic, finding with annoying success the optimal shooting range which is not close range always. We need feedback  not only for its effectiveness but also if this style of tactic is annoying the players.

[Nick Thomadis]

3 hours ago, atv said:

Think there might be a new bug in Campaigns? 

Ships as war prizes from other countries no longer show up in 'ship designs' and are not refittable. 

 

We haven't made any change regarding this. Please report with the in-game button to take a look.

[MDHansen]

20 minutes ago, Nick Thomadis said:

We need feedback  not only for its effectiveness but also if this style of tactic is annoying the players.

give us hell! 😬

[atv]

31 minutes ago, Nick Thomadis said:

We haven't made any change regarding this. Please report with the in-game button to take a look.

My save was edited: that was probably the reason why it happened. There are accounts of this happening for potentially un-edited saves, see below. 

Fixed it through more save-editing by creating a copy of the design ship with a unique ID, country ownership and Status 1 followed by reassigning said unique ID. 

[Werwaz]

 

12 hours ago, Nick Thomadis said:

Uploaded optimized version x2 including the following:
- Fixed rare issue caused by AI logic and ammo calcs during campaign causing ships to freeze and the game to need a restart for making it work again. Please notify us, after getting this update, if you still may get such a problem.
- Fixed old problem in accuracy logic causing precalculated hits to not execute although the accuracy has triggered them. This issue was related to hull size and parts size, something that usually players exploited by making ships with minimal secondaries or only main guns, in order to make their ships getting hit much less than they should. (Player also could have such a problem vs AI, so it is a radical fix)
- Adjusted accuracy, effects of gun barrel length and Battle AI to compensate for the fixes in calculations.
- Further battle fps optimization.
- Minor UI fixes.
Please restart Steam to get this update

It seems like that accuracy is playable again. Thank you for fixing that problem.

5 minutes ago, Nick Thomadis said:

Uploaded optimized version x3 including the following:
- Further fixes to the potential problem of ammo calcs causing freezing in ships in campaign.
- Ship maneuverability adjustments.
- Other fixes and improvements.
Please restart Steam to get this update

**Warning** 
Due to the latest optimizations the AI may have become too "human-like" and opportunistic, finding with annoying success the optimal shooting range which is not close range always. We need feedback  not only for its effectiveness but also if this style of tactic is annoying the players.

I quite like the new battle AI compared to the old one, and it can be quite difficult to play against if it is supplied with a player designed ship. The one time I let the AI design its own ship it got a flash fire and it sunk shortly afterwards. that being said, it seems to still have some problems with large fleet engagements, though I don't think it was intended for 25v25 battles. 

[Grayknight]

Ok so i started war with france (legendary) and i was quite impressed with the fact that my older ships were outmatched i actually lost a battle! For the first time since old beta i lost battle that i was really trying to win... and then... after i thought that AI can really build ships if the have proper hull.... i have seen the monster...

[Aldaris]

A dreadnought hull with four single main guns? That's impressively bad. It does look kinda cool though!

 

Got kind of a Jules Verne vibe to it.

Edited May 14 by Aldaris

[TK3600]

7 hours ago, Nick Thomadis said:

Uploaded optimized version x3 including the following:
- Further fixes to the potential problem of ammo calcs causing freezing in ships in campaign.
- Ship maneuverability adjustments.
- Other fixes and improvements.
Please restart Steam to get this update

**Warning** 
Due to the latest optimizations the AI may have become too "human-like" and opportunistic, finding with annoying success the optimal shooting range which is not close range always. We need feedback  not only for its effectiveness but also if this style of tactic is annoying the players.

AI needs any kind of help it can get. Please rest assured the new patch combat AI is a step to right direction! Unless AI is outright cheating like having extra armor, anything goes. 

The only time of AI being 'too good' is that it retreats a lot, sometimes in even fights. For example, one of my DD is dueling enemy DD. My ship cost more, but mostly caused by pricy subsystems and torpedo. Enemy DD has bigger guns and twice of them. Seems like an even fight but AI just run away. If I auto resolve I might get randomly cripled. So I had to chase enemy for like 20min (not allowed to 10x speed cuz our speed is similar). It would be nice if the chase can be skipped in even fights.

[TK3600]

22 hours ago, Nick Thomadis said:

- Fixed old problem in accuracy logic causing precalculated hits to not execute although the accuracy has triggered them. This issue was related to hull size and parts size, something that usually players exploited by making ships with minimal secondaries or only main guns, in order to make their ships getting hit much less than they should. (Player also could have such a problem vs AI, so it is a radical fix)

Could this be the cause of bad AI accuracy? I always use minimal draft ships, and I see AI literally only hit me once every 100 times at 5km. I usually attributed it to AI not having fire control or bad ship balance, but maybe this was the reason?

[Grayknight]

11 hours ago, Aldaris said:

A dreadnought hull with four single main guns? That's impressively bad. It does look kinda cool though!

 

Got kind of a Jules Verne vibe to it.

Problem with this design is mainly the fact that it has barbet with single centerline gun that and then 2x2 (those are 2 barrels guns) wing turrets just after it not to mention barbet with small gun aft. It is bizzare with bad arcs of fire and alot of dead weight that could have been better used.

Over all we all can see progress but that is right there with clown ships thread. The thing when given proper ships or better yet counter to your ships AI can be impressive. It works really well with small and medium size fleet. It gets a bit lost in big fleets i highly suggest checking division to make them smaller and able to act independently especially with smaller ships CLs, dds and tbs  and making engagement range of those a 1/2 or 1/3 of torpedo range.

 

Over all progress is easly visable but i stand with my previous point that game would benefit alot from setting starting date far earlier and having ironclads and ships of the lines instead of battleships and cruisers.

[marine0351w]

This is a continuing issue, when using divisions of more than one ship with large guns (9 inch and larger)  the lead ship will continuously fire, but the following ships will fire one or two salvoes and then go silent.  When selecting the following ships it is found that the recoil accuracy reduction is not falling off appropriately unless the ship is selected, then the accuracy reduction falls off.  I have submitted multiple bug reports through the game, but I figured I would put this out on the forums as well.  Is anyone else getting this problem, or am I an outlier?

 

[TK3600]

There is an exploit of infinite money by abusing ship purchase. First you build an absurdly expensive ship design, then make 20 copy of said design. This way AI has a high chance of buying that ship from you. You become incredibly rich real fast. For instance, you could design a ship of 20 billion, and AI will pay you 40 billion per ship. You can expect sell about 5 of those a year, that is more than annual GDP of a major. You get like 10x of your usual naval budget doing this.

I propose limiting minors to purchase ships appropriate for their GDP. Lets say, if ship cost more than their annual naval budget, do not purchase. This of course is a simplification. Technically there is maintnence cost but we can start with something simple.

Edited May 15 by TK3600
Clarification.

[Nick Thomadis]

Uploaded optimized version x4 including the following:
- Various optimization in all levels of gameplay. The game should now be playing as good as possible in fps performance but also on aspects that you recently complained about, such as the accuracy and AI being too evasive.
- Fixed a bug in recoil dissipation causing it to not be consistent when not selecting ships.
- Visual and Sound effects improvements for shell impacts.
Please restart Steam to get this update

[TK3600]

16 hours ago, Nick Thomadis said:

Uploaded optimized version x4 including the following:
- Various optimization in all levels of gameplay. The game should now be playing as good as possible in fps performance but also on aspects that you recently complained about, such as the accuracy and AI being too evasive.
- Fixed a bug in recoil dissipation causing it to not be consistent when not selecting ships.
- Visual and Sound effects improvements for shell impacts.
Please restart Steam to get this update

Oh my god! Does this mean AI retreat less often in even fights? This is great!

Edited May 16 by TK3600

[TK3600]

I see AI is being improved recently. I suggest a simple change that greatly improve AI: making 14in+ guns start with higher mk.

Example: The year is 1911, AI sees 14in mk1 being unlocked. It picks it as the newest and greatest. However, that gun is woefully outclassed by 13in mk3 since 1906. AI don't know that, but human does.

This greatly handicaps AI. In addition, it don't make much sense. Why is new caliber being discovered in 1890 standard? It should instead be discovered using either latest standard, or 1 generation behind.

Following this logic, the 14in gun should be starting at mk3, because it is the highest mk at 1911. For balance, we can make it 3 times longer to research. In addition, it should be delayed to 1918, the time when 14in mk3 is currently unlocked. 14in mk1 and mk2 tech removed. Alternatively mk2 in 1911, mk3 1918.

Edited May 16 by TK3600

[brothermunro]

If we are chatting about the AI it would be nice to see some tweaks to its targeting choices (also helpful for the multiplayer mode). Currently ships seem to prioritise the ship they think they can sink the most easily, but do not factor in how likely they are to hit said ship, or the threat of any enemy ships. It can lead to weird situations and potential exploits by naughty players; for instance using a destroyer that gets the attention of the enemy then retreating it, causing the ai to waste shells on it and to ignore your battleship that can now cruise up to point blank range without drawing fire. It’s not very elegant but I’d suggest that whatever enemy ship is closest is probably a good default target for the AI fire control.

[Aldaris]

Ideally, the AI should weigh target priority based on range, threat, and firing solution. It also should distinguish more between main guns and secondaries. If an enemy battleship is sitting at 10 km flinging shells, and a destroyer is racing in at the same time, a capital ship should ideally task its main guns on the BB and the secondaries on the DD.

 

I realize that's a pretty complex decision tree, and brothermunros solution is a lot more simple, I fear that proposal would probably result in all fire being concentrated on light ships all the time, and the heavies remaining unmolested until everything closer is wiped out. Which would also easily exploitable by building cheap, ludicrously fast destroyers designed to just be unhittable fire magnets.

[TK3600]

20 hours ago, brothermunro said:

If we are chatting about the AI it would be nice to see some tweaks to its targeting choices (also helpful for the multiplayer mode). Currently ships seem to prioritise the ship they think they can sink the most easily, but do not factor in how likely they are to hit said ship, or the threat of any enemy ships. It can lead to weird situations and potential exploits by naughty players; for instance using a destroyer that gets the attention of the enemy then retreating it, causing the ai to waste shells on it and to ignore your battleship that can now cruise up to point blank range without drawing fire. It’s not very elegant but I’d suggest that whatever enemy ship is closest is probably a good default target for the AI fire control.

In other words, secondary target the closest enemy, main battery target the most threatening enemy. Let AI be aware of where threatening enemy is at the start so it prioritize moves toward that, if it was not spotted yet.

[brothermunro]

Makes sense to me. Main fire control should also have some concept of what it can hurt (which I think it already does) and if the greatest threat cannot be hurt then it goes to the next greatest threat etc. as you don’t want a CA trying to sink a BB when another CA would be a better choice. There can (and absolutely should) be more to it than ‘closest enemy’, my point was more that the closest enemy is often a reasonable choice even if it isn’t the best choice.