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"Naval Arms Race" mod overhaul. BETA v11.2 - for UAD v1.5.1.3


o Barão

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Can I ask you if it could be possible to increase the fire resistance of the ships? Imho the game feels still too much HE centric, especially considering how many shells just over penetrate, especially against their " proper" targhets ( 16" Superheavy against 15k CAs and 70k BBs)

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5 hours ago, flaviohc16 said:

Can I ask you if it could be possible to increase the fire resistance of the ships? Imho the game feels still too much HE centric

In N.A.R. there is already a base value nerf to fire chance for the HE shells in comparison to vanilla game.

he_fire_mod,4.5,fire chance multiplier for he rounds penetrations,3,,,,,, Stock

he_fire_mod,3.5,fire chance multiplier for he rounds penetrations,3,,,,,, Mod

 There are other modifiers related to HE performance in game, but I am very reluctant to nerf even more to a point where battles like Tsushima will not make any sense inside the mod.

5 hours ago, flaviohc16 said:

especially considering how many shells just over penetrate, especially against their " proper" targhets ( 16" Superheavy against 15k CAs and 70k BBs)

Not only the shell weight, but also what type of shell (capped ?) and the propellant type used will have an impact in the penetration performance. So if you breach the 2x value, from your shell penetration value in comparison to the armor value at that angle and distance, you will get overpen. Try using the same BB against CA, but now using SAP, and you will probably notice a major performance difference if you were using capped shells before. Bigger is not always better.

 

So before considering nerfing HE even more, I prefer to make sure that you are using the right AP shell for the job, taking into consideration the target and gun.

 

From game files, both stock and mod.

over_penetration_threshold,2,penetration threshold over armor to over-penetration (ratio),,,,,,,

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8 hours ago, StrikerDanger said:

@o Barão I found a small typo. It's nothing major, but I felt it should be pointed out.

Screenshot (4663).png

English not being my native language, do me a favor and write what would be the correct way. 

 

Thanks in advance.

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1 hour ago, o Barão said:

English not being my native language, do me a favor and write what would be the correct way. 

 

Thanks in advance.

Just USA instead of EUA, I also have seen some small stuff, but right now I don't remember where.

 

On another note, when I was talking about fire resistance, I meant something  like how many  sections of the ships need to be on fire at the same time for the ship to be sunken by fire. I feel like small ships with HE spam can overwhelm a capital ships too easily using the fire mechanic, I'm ok instead with disabling it with a lot of hits and killing the crew.

 

Also, about the crew: can we have it killing the ship at 50% of the crew lost instead of 55? And also, why there is so much difference  in crew requirements with the sliders? A ship with cramped crew compartments has half the crew of one with spacious crew compartments, but the min crew required also goes up, and this doesn't make sense, it should be that same, and only be additive.

 

I hope I explained myself, especially in the last point.

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1 hour ago, flaviohc16 said:

I feel like small ships with HE spam can overwhelm a capital ships too easily using the fire mechanic, I'm ok instead with disabling it with a lot of hits and killing the crew.

That would create a situation where multiple ships would surrender due to crew losses instead of being sunk, and the battle of Tsushima tells a different story, and as I said before, fire chance from HE in the mod is already lower in comparison to the AP shell. And why should you not be your ship disable trough fire? If your capital ship have the guns advantage, can, and it should be kept at distance from smaller caliber guns. This is also one of the reasons why the navies start considering all or nothing armor by the start of the century. Another reason to consider, is for a ship to have a great capability to start fires is because it is probably using some pricic acid variant, and there is a high risk vs high reward by using that. It is not only positive things. Anyway, below I posted all fire modifiers from the game. I suggest anyone interested to read, tweak the values and run experiments.

 

crew_fire_damage,0.4,crew damage from fire modifier,12.5,,,,,,

section_fire_chance_gun,8,basic chance of fire in section (from gun),10,,,,,,
section_fire_chance_gun_deck,12.5,"same, but special chance of fire if hit deck sections",10,,,,,,

section_fire_chance_torpedo,15,basic chance of fire in section (from torpedo),15,,,,,,

fire_damage,0.33,base fire damage percent per second (to structure),0.5,,,,,,

fire_damage_part,0.1,base fire damage percent per second (to part),,,,,,,

surv_fire_decrease,65,percent decrease of fire damage due to fire (from max survivability),65,,,,,,

fire_stop_chance,35,basic chance to stop fire (every 10 seconds),10,,,,,,

water_stop_fire,80,threshold of water level (due to flooding) to stop any fire in section,80,,,,,,

fire_min_dur,45,minimal duration of fire (in seconds),15,,,,,,

fire_spread_chance,20,"chance of fire to spread to one nearby section (percent chance, every 10 sec)",5,,,,,,

ap_fire_mod,0.8,fire chance multiplier for ap rounds penetrations,3,,,,,,
he_fire_mod,3.5,fire chance multiplier for he rounds penetrations,3,,,,,,
3.5 in the mod, 4.5 in vanilla

 

1 hour ago, flaviohc16 said:

 can we have it killing the ship at 50% of the crew lost instead of 55?

Crew quarters should be important when designing a ship if it is going to be in the frontline. Raising the limit will only help the player by only going with the minimum and save weight. Not an interesting thing to do.

 

1 hour ago, flaviohc16 said:

A ship with cramped crew compartments has half the crew of one with spacious crew compartments, but the min crew required also goes up, and this doesn't make sense, it should be that same, and only be additive.

I changed those values months ago, and I can't explain now exactly what was the idea behind it. If I remember, the idea was about local damage and the losses of personal in one specific location could have an impact in performance which can be mitigated to an extent by the high crew numbers. Something like that, but the values (from the mod) are listed below.  As you can see, the minimum crew to operate the stations without a penalty are more generous in ships with big crew quarters.

crew_quarters_min,0.7,modifier for crew numbers at minimum quarters,,,,,,,
crew_quarters_max,1.3,modifier for crew numbers at maximum quarters,,,,,,,
crew_quarters_min_threshold,1,min crew percent to operate stations without efficiency penalty (Min Quarters),,,,,,,
crew_quarters_max_threshold,0.8,min crew percent to operate stations without efficiency penalty (Max Quarters),,,,,,,

 

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On 1/21/2024 at 3:09 AM, o Barão said:

 

 There are other modifiers related to HE performance in game, but I am very reluctant to nerf even more to a point where battles like Tsushima will not make any sense inside the mod.

 

Just a reminder, my understanding of Tsushima  is that the Russian ships were effectively floating bombs, having stored coal on deck for much of their journey. This meant that on the day coal dust was filling every nook and cranny. So perhaps not the best battle to base the values on? ( this from a player often guilty of Grand Larceny; Warship :-} )

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On 1/19/2024 at 5:57 PM, Draco said:

Sounds like the AI is attempting to close the distance with you as fast as possible, maybe you made a design that is more vulnerable to small shell saturation like an AoN design with no extended deck and belt armour, than you do normally?

Although it doesn't always perfectly work as intended, the AI is programmed to respond to different threats with different strategies.

I find that if I build a balanced design, the AI will basically mimic the moves of my ships, since it doesn't think it has a decisive advantage over me at any given range of combat, (sadly) allowing me to dictate the fight.

Is it something similar you are experiencing?

In the same custom battle sets with the same designs, I noticed that the AI chosen and kept a new behaviour after 1.16 update, so I agreed that the Dev truly did something about battle AI in v1.4.1.0 optx2.

New behaviour at least not less aggressive, so not bad if I say.

Edited by Azerostar
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@o Barão the mod runs fine now, thank for your help! 

I’ve a suggestion about late italian destroyers: 127mm destroyers main gun mounts are using the “dome-like” turret as if it was a secondary battery, which looks pretty weird. However, if you try mounting a secondary 127mm battery on a modern battleship hull, the 127mm gun will have a standard “more boxy” turret. Will it possibile to change the 127mm destroyer turret with the battleship one? If it’s a change that can be easily made tweaking the game files, maybe I can try it myself.

Let me know if I’ve been clear enough or if I need to take some screenshot to better illustrate my point, thanks in advance!

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8 hours ago, Bics93 said:

@o Barão

Will it possibile to change the 127mm destroyer turret with the battleship one?

No, because I don't have the right 3D model to represent the late Italian destroyer's 120mm guns in game, however they are not "boxy" as the BB counterpart. Those are turrets with a diagonal shape design, as you can see below.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folgore-class_destroyer#/media/File:Rn_fulmine.JPG

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freccia-class_destroyer#/media/File:RCT_Freccia_cartolina.jpg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maestrale-class_destroyer#/media/File:RM-Scirocco_at_anchor.jpg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oriani-class_destroyer#/media/File:Oriani_and_her_crew.jpg

 

You can edit the "partModels" file to get what you want. Swapping the 127mm italian BBs gun from the destroyers.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by o Barão
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im going to have a go at editing gun sizes to suit my personal use i like to build my ships to historical size and weight and i know you edited gun size to a happy medium where they look balanced across all ships but for me they are still much to big what just wanted to know where to find the gun sizes 

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3 hours ago, rossi191 said:

im going to have a go at editing gun sizes to suit my personal use i like to build my ships to historical size and weight and i know you edited gun size to a happy medium where they look balanced across all ships but for me they are still much to big what just wanted to know where to find the gun sizes 

Sure, go to "partModels" file inside the resource.assets.

In the first line you will see this.

@name,enabled,#mm,subName,countries,shipTypes,model_1,scale_1,max_scale_1,weight_modifier_1,caliber_length_modifier_1,model_2,scale_2,max_scale_2,weight_modifier_2,caliber_length_modifier_2,model_3,scale_3,max_scale_3,weight_modifier_3,caliber_length_modifier_3,model_4,scale_4,max_scale_4,weight_modifier_4,caliber_length_modifier_4,model_5,scale_5,max_scale_5,weight_modifier_5,caliber_length_modifier_5,#,#,#,#,#,#,#,#,#,#
default,1,,,,,,-1,-1,1,1,,-1,-1,1,1,,-1,-1,1,1,,-1,-1,1,1,,-1,-1,1,1,,,,,,,,,,
###,,,###,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

So 5 tiers guns, 5 scale modifiers. The max_scale modifiers, is how much the gun model will increase when change the gun caliber.

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  • o Barão changed the title to "Naval Arms Race" mod overhaul. BETA v5.0.1 - for UAD v1.4.1.1

Well, for those complaining about HE, just had quite a kill with it. 1941, I had 6 of my American super cruisers each with 12 12in guns fire a volley at a 90000 ton Japanese battleship, of those 72 shots fired there, 12 were hits, and that's all it took to kill that battleship with extensive fire instantly. Nothing penetrated, no guns were hit, no magazines cooked off. I generally switch shells to AP and watch them pick capital ships apart, but they got that volley off before I could this time.

Some tweaks to the threshold for 'ship is dead due to fire' might not be a bad idea.

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On 1/6/2024 at 11:18 AM, o Barão said:

Ok, I found the issue.

This happens because the resource.assets is not in the correct place.

Download the resource.assets you want.

A ) If it comes in a zip file, unpack the content.

B ) If you get a folder, is the content inside the folder that you need to move to the right location. The resource.assets

 

This location.

C:\.....\Steam\steamapps\common\Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts\Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts_Data

 

I have the same issue, actually;

  • have deleted the 3 json files, replaced the asset file and english file as well.

Not sure if if it's because my steam data directory is on my D drive rather than C?  But I was able to locate the subsequent files and replace them?

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14 hours ago, mother_oni said:

I have the same issue, actually;

  • have deleted the 3 json files, replaced the asset file and english file as well.

Not sure if if it's because my steam data directory is on my D drive rather than C?  But I was able to locate the subsequent files and replace them?

Deleted json files, but why?

Check the game files integrity from steam.

You can also open the game folder from steam just to be sure where it is.

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On 1/24/2024 at 10:42 AM, Fangoriously said:

Some tweaks to the threshold for 'ship is dead due to fire' might not be a bad idea.

You are asking for the only thing, that I am unable to do anything.

 

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@vonPeretz

Could you help me with startingyear_income_mod and startingyear_growth_mod?

I just can't get [GDP Growth] and [Naval funds] what I need for each state. Each time the campaign starts there are different numbers. Is there any randomness?

 

Yes! You will find the random modifier in the "params" file.

 

cash_start_randomness,0.05,plus-minus randomness ratio of amount of starting money,all money gain,revenue = budget,"2,187,500",,,,
wealth_start_randomness,5,at new game plus-minus this amount of monthly wealth growth will be applied,all money loss,expenses = expenses_fixed +  budget * ( tech_budget + intel_budget + training_budget + shipyard_budget )/100 + maintenance + shipbuilding + ship_repairing,#REF!,,,,

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2 hours ago, o Barão said:

Deleted json files, but why?

Check the game files integrity from steam.

You can also open the game folder from steam just to be sure where it is.

I was just following the instructions at the end of the PDF?

And yeah, I just went through steam directory to find the resource location

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3 hours ago, mother_oni said:

I was just following the instructions at the end of the PDF?

And yeah, I just went through steam directory to find the resource location

Sure, you are right. For a moment, I thought you were deleting the JSON files inside the data folder. My mistake.

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9 hours ago, Fangoriously said:

Darn I was afraid of that. I'd never heard of a modifier for that specific thing ever mentioned, and it was ripe for tweaking.

I need to change my statement. I got the information that is in fact possible trough @brothermunro, so credits to him. :)

It is at 70% now, the sections on fire needed to trigger the ship lost due to fires. I will buff this to 80% in the next version to run tests.

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BETA v5.0.2 N.A.R. changelog:

  • Updated to UAD 1.4.1.1R
  • Ships sections on fire needed to make it sunk buffed from 70% to 80%, credits to "brothermunro" for the tip.

 

Important Info for the upcoming days.

I will be on holidays starting at day 8 for 2 weeks, so don't expect me to be around to fix any issues with any updates during that period.

I will try to get some time before, to update the mod description pdf with all the changes and move the mod files to "Nexus". This will solve my headaches with cloud services, well, I hope.

*The place to gather feedback from the players, will still be here, not Nexus.

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