"Naval Arms Race" mod overhaul. BETA v11.2 - for UAD v1.5.1.3

[clavernever]

5 hours ago, o Barão said:

With all due respect, but I do mind, yes, at least for now.

• You didn't ask permission to use my whole work as a base for your version. Nothing stops you from doing that, but it is a courtesy between modders to ask first.
• You are posting a different version from my work in the same post I am using to share my work development.
• My mod is still in development, and I would appreciate until the moment my work ends in a few months from other modders to refrain posting in public different versions from my work.

After my work is done, all modders are free to use content from N.A.R. and to launch different versions to the public. I will only ask when that happens to give credits to the author and the hundreds of hours invested in the work.

Yeah I understand.. I got a bit too excited and went ahead of myself.

I removed it and won't be posting again until you finish it, so there's no version confusion.

In the meantime, you can count on me for help if you need something investigated or tested, as I said I'm a big fan of your work!

Edited May 27, 2023 by clavernever

[Fangoriously]

Reunite the 'branches' I say lol

[CrazyElf]

There seems to be a bug with the gas turbines in the "Shared Designs" ship builder.

 

The engine option for "Gas Turbines" says "required tech - Gas Turbines" - that should only be the case in the campaign, not in the Shared Designs.

[o Barão]

Created and added French Armored cruiser V. "Edgar Quinet" - 1905 W.I.P.

[o Barão]

On 5/28/2023 at 5:19 AM, CrazyElf said:

The engine option for "Gas Turbines" says "required tech - Gas Turbines" - that should only be the case in the campaign, not in the Shared Designs.

Shared designs are limited to 1940.

Gas turbine is a 1945 tech in N.A.R.

Not a bug.

Edited May 31, 2023 by o Barão

[JaM]

What about Turbines - Geared Turbines - Multi-expansion engines? In vanilla game, Multi-expansion engine disappears with Geared turbine, but gameplay wise,  Geared Turbine is an upgrade of ordinary Turbine, while Multi-expansion engine is more of an long range/low speed engine that is still useful at that time..  Wouldnt it make more sense for ordinary Turbine to disappear, and Multi-expansion engine stay at least till Geared II Turbine? (or probably would make more sense for ME engine disappear when semi-oil is introduced?)

[o Barão]

2 hours ago, JaM said:

What about Turbines - Geared Turbines - Multi-expansion engines? In vanilla game, Multi-expansion engine disappears with Geared turbine, but gameplay wise,  Geared Turbine is an upgrade of ordinary Turbine, while Multi-expansion engine is more of an long range/low speed engine that is still useful at that time..  Wouldnt it make more sense for ordinary Turbine to disappear, and Multi-expansion engine stay at least till Geared II Turbine? (or probably would make more sense for ME engine disappear when semi-oil is introduced?)

 

 Multi expansion engine was still useful for merchants. Not for warships in general in WWII. And this is a game about building warships, not liberty ships.

 Making multi expansion engine obsolete in game, is also helping the AI in the design process. 

[JaM]

40 minutes ago, o Barão said:

 

 Multi expansion engine was still useful for merchants. Not for warships in general in WWII. And this is a game about building warships, not liberty ships.

 Making multi expansion engine obsolete in game, is also helping the AI in the design process. 

I'm fine with them being obsolete, just not at the point they are right now.. because you end up with two types of Turbines available, where one is better than the other so first one is pointless.. Would be better to have two engines with different pros and cons available instead...

 

 

 I usually have Turbines in 1905 or so, with Geared one coming in 1910 latest.. so not having Multi Expansion available at that time is a bit strange..

[o Barão]

1 hour ago, JaM said:

I usually have Turbines in 1905 or so, with Geared one coming in 1910 latest.. so not having Multi Expansion available at that time is a bit strange..

That is a good point. However, I already look at the files and I simply can't do anything. There is no simple setting if you want the component obsolete or not. It seems is related to the oil fire boilers. Anyway no luck.

[o Barão]

0.9 N.A.R. preview

• Ships stability major change. Much easier now to have ships in stable hulls. So easy in fact that now also the AI ships will have good values, and so as indirect effect expect to fight harder battles against the AI. I did however increase slightly the roll penalty. So if placing heavier guns in the sides, expect to have a roll penalty, but only minimal to help the AI in the design process.
• Rework all 2" and 3" mk1; mk2 and mk3 guns to be all non turret guns for most nations.
• 5" mk1 and mk2 single barrel will be non turret models.
• Rework barrel length for all nations to be a smooth transition, between gun models and Mk variants. Also editing guns size; max scale and weight. This is a W.I.P. and will take weeks to be all fixed. PART 1
• Moga gun added to 8" and 9" CA japanese mk5
• Fuso gun added to 10" and 11" CA japanese mk5
• Honiara port capacity nerfed. Pearl Harbor and Truk port capacity buffed *
• Added standard funnel to Bradenburg BB hull.
• Created and added French "Armored cruiser V". "Edgar Quinet-class" - 1905
• Created and added "Mini enhanced funnel" added to french armored cruisers and french light cruiser III and light cruiser II.
• Lowered the random spread tech at the start to prevent 10" mk2 guns to be available for researched in 1890.
• War naval budget nerfed and GDP rebalanced for all nations. The differences are now smaller.
• "Withdraw" and "delay" power factor increased according to average speed of ships.
• Changed the auto resolve parameters to focus more in armor and firepower, less in speed, crew and ammo.*
• BB crew numbers increased to realistic values.
• Buffed target size accuracy modifier and nerfed range found modifiers. Aim boost at close range increased.
• Engine vibrations accuracy penalty modifier increased to 20%.
• Hit chance to conning tower and fire control lowered. Fire control damaged will give 40% accuracy penalty.
• Removed the 3" and 4" quads from France; Britain and USA
• Changed the AI logic to switch to HE in combat. *
• Increased slightly the zone denial for ships.
• Added decrease reputation & respect penalty for each turn the player is at war.*
• Slightly lowered the chance of a torpedo to have a premature explosion but increased the chance to deviate from the path.

* Mechanics being tested and subject to changes.

Possible to be added:

• To enable the "night" hidden stat in the dockyard.  I still need to run some tests to understand if this is working in game.

French "Armored cruiser V"

Edited May 31, 2023 by o Barão

[JaM]

In terms of gun accuracy, i think there needs to be bigger link between muzzle speed and short range accuracy - faster the projectile flies, easier it is to hit a moving target at short range, but as distance increases, other factors are much more important, like gun dispersion.. Of course, primitive projectiles had terrible aerodynamics and were losing speed a lot faster than later ones, so even same gun would have different velocity for different type of projectiles.. and of course, there is this whole thing about HE damage potential from high velocity/high pressure guns, which required much thicker shell walls to "survive" being fired from such gun, therefore these shells had less HE filler than shells suited for lower velocity guns..

 

Overall, i think lengthening the gun should improve short range accuracy (1000 to 2500m max), but slightly decrease HE damage. (but of course, muzzle velocity also needs to be capped, as 1000-1100m/s was practically maximum achievable with full bore projectiles, while APDS rounds had no real usage in ship to ship combat as far as i know). And of course it should slow down the rate of fire.

Shortening the gun should improve long range accuracy due to dispersion, but should not be too dramatic and should be more about gun technology than anything else. Shortening the barrel already provides Rate of Fire bonus and saves weights, which are both quite valid goals..

[CrazyElf]

13 hours ago, o Barão said:

Shared designs are limited to 1940.

Gas turbine is a 1945 tech in N.A.R.

Not a bug.

 

Is there any way you could enable 1950 in the mod for Shared Designs?

[clavernever]

@o Barão Question: (if it isn't too complicated to answer) how do you add new models to the game? I've been looking into adding things like you do but haven't found a solution, and afaik neither has Sapphire

Do you reuse/re-purpose existing assets, duplicate and modify them in UABE or straight-up add new ones?

[o Barão]

1 minute ago, clavernever said:

@o Barão Question: (if it isn't too complicated to answer) how do you add new models to the game? I've been looking into adding things like you do but haven't found a solution, and afaik neither has Sapphire

Do you reuse/re-purpose existing assets, duplicate and modify them in UABE or straight-up add new ones?

It is all done in "parts" file. I copy a component and changed the entity name. After that, I can change the component stats, size, what ships are going to use that component, etc.

If I am creating a new hull package, then is also necessary to add the new ship to the "technologies" file to make them work in game.

If you want to edit the guns, then is the "partModels" file.

[clavernever]

50 minutes ago, o Barão said:

It is all done in "parts" file. I copy a component and changed the entity name. After that, I can change the component stats, size, what ships are going to use that component, etc.

If I am creating a new hull package, then is also necessary to add the new ship to the "technologies" file to make them work in game.

If you want to edit the guns, then is the "partModels" file.

Alright so if I understand correctly you're adding a new part but not a new model/asset...

...say you add NewShip by copying ShipX and changing it's ID to NewShip.
You modify stuff in the parts file (say make it smaller and slimmer and change corresponding tags from English BB to Chinese CA)
However NewShip still uses the ship_x_model asset and thus shares both the 3D model itself and all of it's children (mount points, shaders etc).
Therefore, if ship_x_model were to be changed by a mod or a game update, the change would affect both ShipX and NewShip.

..right?

Edited June 1, 2023 by clavernever

[o Barão]

7 hours ago, clavernever said:

Alright so if I understand correctly you're adding a new part but not a new model/asset...

...say you add NewShip by copying ShipX and changing it's ID to NewShip.
You modify stuff in the parts file (say make it smaller and slimmer and change corresponding tags from English BB to Chinese CA)
However NewShip still uses the ship_x_model asset and thus shares both the 3D model itself and all of it's children (mount points, shaders etc).
Therefore, if ship_x_model were to be changed by a mod or a game update, the change would affect both ShipX and NewShip.

..right?

Exactly!

 

[o Barão]

0.9 N.A.R. changelog:

• Ships stability major change. Much easier now to have ships in stable hulls. So easy in fact that now also the AI ships will have good values, and so as indirect effect expect to fight harder battles against the AI. I did however increase slightly the roll penalty. So if placing heavier guns in the sides, expect to have a roll penalty, but only minimal to help the AI in the design process.
• Rework all 2" and 3" mk1; mk2 and mk3 guns to be all non turret guns for most nations.
• 5" mk1 and mk2 single barrel will be non turret models.
• Rework barrel length for all nations to be a smooth transition, between gun models and Mk variants. Also editing guns size; max scale and weight. This is a W.I.P. and will take weeks to be all fixed. PART 1
• Moga gun added to 8" and 9" CA japanese mk5
• Fuso gun added to 10" and 11" CA japanese mk5
• Honiara port capacity nerfed. Pearl Harbor and Truk port capacity buffed *
• Added standard funnel to Bradenburg BB hull.
• Created and added French "Armored cruiser V". "Edgar Quinet-class" - 1905
• Created and added "Mini enhanced funnel" added to french armored cruisers and french light cruiser III and light cruiser II.
• Lowered the random spread tech at the start to prevent 10" mk2 guns to be available for researched in 1890.
• War naval budget nerfed and GDP rebalanced for all nations. The differences are now smaller.
• "Withdraw" and "delay" power factor increased according to average speed of ships.
• Changed the auto resolve parameters to focus more in armor and firepower, less in speed, crew and ammo.*
• BB crew numbers increased to realistic values.
• Buffed target size accuracy modifier and nerfed range found modifiers. Aim boost at close range increased.
• Engine vibrations accuracy penalty modifier increased to 20%.
• Hit chance to conning tower and fire control lowered. Fire control damaged will give 40% accuracy penalty.
• Removed the 3" and 4" quads from France; Britain and USA
• Changed the AI logic to switch to HE in combat. *
• Added decrease reputation & respect penalty for each turn the player is at war.*
• Slightly lowered the chance of a torpedo to have a premature explosion but increased the chance to deviate from the path.

* Mechanics being tested and subject to changes.

 

Ship pack I french navy 1890-1891

Download the folder "Designs" and move to: C:\Users\USERNAME\AppData\LocalLow\Game Labs\Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

Force the AI to use them in campaign and custom battles.

Goal:

• To create the French navy from 1890 - 1900 for testing. W.I.P.
• For the players, test and report if the battles are now hard to win.
• To test if the AI is building them on the campaign.
• To test if the way the AI is using on the campaign is normal for the ships to be "low on fuel" in battle.
• To see if the AI when doing refit are ruining the designs.

[o Barão]

12 hours ago, CrazyElf said:

 

Is there any way you could enable 1950 in the mod for Shared Designs?

I think is not possible. But is a reasonable request to ask the devs to implement.

[Fangoriously]

I built an entire 1929 line up for every faction, a BB, BC, CA, CL and DD in the shared design, each play tested and adjusted to perfection in custom battles, for use in a 1930 campaign. Started as many campaigns as there were save slots, played for 5 years each, never saw a single one of my designs, ai shared design set to always every time of course. This was right befor the last beta, haven't seen any patch notes about improved functionality since.

[o Barão]

12 minutes ago, Fangoriously said:

I built an entire 1929 line up for every faction, a BB, BC, CA, CL and DD in the shared design, each play tested and adjusted to perfection in custom battles, for use in a 1930 campaign. Started as many campaigns as there were save slots, played for 5 years each, never saw a single one of my designs, ai shared design set to always every time of course. This was right befor the last beta, haven't seen any patch notes about improved functionality since.

I already found the solution.

You can read here:

 

Edited June 1, 2023 by o Barão

[Fangoriously]

1 hour ago, o Barão said:

I already found the solution.

You can read here:

 

Yikes, I need to, what, create designs 5 years old for them to show up in the campaign?

[CrazyElf]

13 hours ago, o Barão said:

I think is not possible. But is a reasonable request to ask the devs to implement.

Fair enough - I'll send feedback to the developer team.

[o Barão]

9 hours ago, Fangoriously said:

Yikes, I need to, what, create designs 5 years old for them to show up in the campaign?

Because it is 1930, my suggestion would be to design your ships for 1926 and then copy the designs and paste for the years: 1927; 1928 and 1929 to make sure it will work.

When I say, copy and paste is in this location. The designs are the same, you are only changing the year.

[o Barão]

0.9.1 N.A.R. changelog:

Updated to UAD 1.3.6

• American and French guns rework is finished. Weapons data from http://www.navweaps.com/ website was used as reference for the guns to be close as possible to what was historical made. Because of this, the player should note big differences in the gun barrel length for many guns.  The French as an example are using long barrels in 1890 (X/45) in comparison with the other nations. With this comes some advantages and some disadvantages in terms of: reload, penetration, accuracy and range. In other situations, there were improvements. The Americans in stock game have MK1 main guns with a barrel length around X/26. In reality, it was more around X/30 or X/35, so this was also fixed. These are only a few examples. Almost all guns from the French and American navies had the 3d model size, barrel length or weight values tweaked, to guarantee a smooth transition and as mentioned above to be as close as possible to what was made back then. Next in line, will be the English and the Italians.
• "Maine" Gun model added to french 3" and 4" mk1 and mk2 for double barrel turrets.
• Because of the French ship pack, I noticed that I was struggling to get the armor values used by the French in that time period. So I changed some armor weight modifiers to make it easier.
• Improvements were made to the conning tower armor limit.
• Lowered the optimal distance for the AI to fix the issue or at least improve the situation, where the player could see the fleets fighting at 6 km away from each other in 1890. Unrealistic for the time period and a waste of ammo.
• French ship pack expanded to 1893. Also copies from the 1890 designs were made for the years: 1886, 1887, 1888 and 1889. This was the solution I found to force the game to use the player ship designs in the 1890 campaign. However, with this solution, the 1890 ship list for the French will lag for a few seconds for the game to read the ship files. If interested, start a new 1890 campaign and provoke already from the start the French to fight you to see how hard the battles can be.

Because of all the changes to guns and also the improvements to armor weight, the custom and campaign save files must be deleted. The ship pack was already updated, so replace the previous ship files.

Edited June 3, 2023 by o Barão

[Astor]

Might check US Mark 3 4" single guns, they appear as twins.