Devs say every ship is unique. What characteristics can they have?

[Axralis]

So two Bellona class ships built to the same specs in the same shipyard won't sail pretty much the same? I understand that there might be small miniscule and unnoticable differences of course, but I must admit that I find it a bit hard to believe that two such ships wouldn't sail virtually the same - providing the materials used and worksmanship was the same.

 

That having been said some references would be nice 

 

Well you pointed out one scenario and that is that two Bellona s are build in a same shipyard and they would be very very similar but never identical .

Did you think about that one Bellona is built in England and a second Bellona is built somewhere in the pacific would you think those two ships will be identical ?  i dont think so not even by close.

[Axralis]

To my delight, the devs have stated that even within a class, each ship will have its own 'personality' and handling characteristics, determined by hidden stats.

I want to support this excellent idea by throwing out a few reality-inspired properties that each ship could have (or lack) to make it unique. Because ships of course, moreso than anything else created by human hands, have souls. Everyone should post their own ideas as well.

 

Inherent properties of ships:

 

Ardent or Slack. In layman's terms, upwind vs. downwind turning ability. Rig balance notwithstanding, some ships are 'ardent' and naturally require a lot of weather helm for mysterious reasons. This can make them difficult to sail, but if you need to tack really fast, it can only work in your favor. Conversely, a ship might be slack and always be wanting to fall off the wind, which is handy if you want an easy downwind turn.

 

Stiff or crank. A stiff ship heels and rolls less than a crank ship, which is a clear boon for gunners. Stiff ships can be very uncomfortable to live on, so maybe morale could take a slight hit as a penalty for this advantage.

 

Best point of sail. A square rigger isn't necessarily only good at going downwind. Our famous HMS Surprise was "happiest on a bowline," which means sailing closehauled. The replica brig Niagara has a top speed of 10 knots, but has made 9 knots or more sailing upwind. There can be a lot of difference here. A dull sailor might struggle along going a half its top speed when closehauled, while another vessel could be tearing along without a care. Some ships might prefer the wind abeam, some might suffer less when sailing dead downwind.

 

Best in light airs or half a gale. Some ships sail well in a 'hatfull' of wind, tripping along quite happily in light airs. The same ship may or may not struggle in high winds and heavy seas, wallowing and pitching excessively. And some ships are good seagoing craft that just go faster as windspeed increases.

 

Soundness of planking. Some craft are better built than others, which will become apparent as the hull starts taking damage from gunfire or waves. If your planking is good, it will be easier to plug holes and leaks. If not, then plugging one shot hole may open up other seams.

 

Best tack. Most wooden ships are asymmetrical to some degree, meaning that they when closehauled they will perform better on one tack or the other, with up to a knot difference in speed.

 

Griping and control issues. Some ships tend to lurch to windward violently at inconvenient times. Or the bow is always wandering about, the wheel trying to jolt itself free of the helmsman. In-game, certain ships could suffer small penalties to rudder response times under certain courses, speeds and conditions to simulate the helmsman struggling against the ship.

 

Helloo sir Maturin,

 

I think this is a really really good suggestion it will add so much to the actual game and in many ways spice it up and furthermore give a nice variety to the player s that have the same ships but they will be not exacly the same witch is great for Captains to experiment with all kind of builds.

Those who are saying that this is not historicly true they are not well informed there where differences between the same classes and that is fact.

For example we have two captains both in a Suprise and they are building the boats in the same shipyard and one Capt decided to have a higher heel then its normal for surprise becouse it suit him that way and he made some modification the other Capt did nothing and build his Surprise by the book.

Will those 2 ships behave and sail identically on all condition?

 

Here is a example in today modern world >

On this last Volvo Ocean Race regatta that is currently on the way at the start from the race from day 1 from Spanish town of Alicante all Skippers and crew got the exactly  the same boats and exactly the same set of sails and pretty much the same cargo on the boats.

So that would meen that all these boats are exactly the same in every way the crew are also all proffs so they are equal in that too.

 

And they started all going in the same direction on the same wind on the same sea state on the same course and we see some boats are faster and gaining over the other ships >??? so howis that possible if they are all the same in every way??

[balticsailor]

I like the idea of haveing a personaly for each ship. So when a ship is first build you get a ship following the class it is build after with some small variation which are unknow at first. While you sail your ship though different situations and weather you notice the small traits and they are updated in the ship log (maybe in form of a Sailing Quality Report).

If there is an option to specialy focus particular trait on a new ship they should come with a balacing trade-off and a higher cost (in time, money and/or resouces depending on the trait). Focusing trait makes of couse only sense if the effect is allways bigger then the random variation (like up to 3-4 % for the random effect and up to 8-10% for the focused effect) otherwise it could get totaly counterbalanced.

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

 

Here is a example in today modern world >

On this last Volvo Ocean Race regatta that is currently on the way at the start from the race from day 1 from Spanish town of Alicante all Skippers and crew got the exactly  the same boats and exactly the same set of sails and pretty much the same cargo on the boats.

So that would meen that all these boats are exactly the same in every way the crew are also all proffs so they are equal in that too.

 

And they started all going in the same direction on the same wind on the same sea state on the same course and we see some boats are faster and gaining over the other ships >??? so howis that possible if they are all the same in every way??

 

This is true for a number of reasons.  First of all, the crew are not all equal.  They may all be professionals, but they all do not have the same base of skill, the same experiences, the same levels of proficiency.  They also read the weather differently, in fact, they attempt to steer for areas they believe to have a better weather pattern, which can put them a hundred or more miles away from another ship that has read things differently.  They choose and trim their sails differently based on their expectations and experience.  Even should two boats be exactly the same, down to the last micron, the myriad of different rigging and sail adjustments that are available, accompanied by the actions of the crew themselves will create performance differences.

[Axralis]

This is true for a number of reasons.  First of all, the crew are not all equal.  They may all be professionals, but they all do not have the same base of skill, the same experiences, the same levels of proficiency.  They also read the weather differently, in fact, they attempt to steer for areas they believe to have a better weather pattern, which can put them a hundred or more miles away from another ship that has read things differently.  They choose and trim their sails differently based on their expectations and experience.  Even should two boats be exactly the same, down to the last micron, the myriad of different rigging and sail adjustments that are available, accompanied by the actions of the crew themselves will create performance differences.

Yes exactly my point you did a nice elaboration sir of all the aspects that are involved there.

To summaray in one row > Crew- Rigging - Triming the boat. if you do better those thing on the same boats you win (forgot to add weather reading)

That is true also for the age of sails ships (example> main reason why the Franco-Spanish fleet lost at Trafalgar is Crew factor on all the boats not Nelson.)

So we agree that in today modern world with exac same boats and equip. we still have faster boat.

In the time of age of sails all ships where made by hand all the parts .so even if they made 2 surprises at the same time they would not be exac the same not even by a long shoot.

 

I like chat with a fellow sailor who understand the sailing good in rl. its been a pleasure sir Henry.

[Axralis]

Great post, Crankey.

People around the forum do in fact need convincing that these aren't like their fiberglass daysailers.

I agree with you sir maturin and with sir Crankey also nice post Crankey.

Some people of the forums are just pulling parallel to the modern world sailing boats.I just wanted to pointed out that in today world we have modern machines and computers that can make ..10 exac sailing boats and they still wont go the same ( crew - rigging -triming +weather reading )

will make some boat go faster over the other.

And back in age of sails all and i mean all the things are made by hand down to last nail so in my opinion people who are saying that all the boats in the same class are the same in every way i say they 100% wrong .

 

And you are right about today fiberglass daysailers in a way , They cant be compared to the age of sails boats but for the sailing part it has not changed much from that time to today s time (general sailing ) And in my humble opinion they knew more back then how to sail then we know now .

We might have advanced tech compared to them but we sail only for fun and for the sport sake and nothing more. they sailed from necessity and it was the only way to travel or the only way to make huge distances so i think it would be stupid to say that today we know much more then them back there.