safety Bot fighting safety guide

[Licinio Chiavari]

On 1/6/2019 at 12:01 PM, jodgi said:

This is natural and alright. Most people are ok with someone beating them with skill and experience. 

"Most". I'd say a share. Because I heard too often about cheating or P2W ship insults. Not understanding, not even thinking that they have simply not a clue.

On 1/6/2019 at 12:01 PM, jodgi said:

I dunno. I asked to join RAKERS when I was still in Privateer back in Sea Trials. My first duel with Doran was in Privateers. I died fast and bad but I learned a ton. If people are truly open to learning the skill gap is a forte and not a problem.

(Doran did put us all through manual sails and maneuvers training, not unlike tutorial, then it was duels, duels , duels often with debriefs after.)

Again: it's the mindset. Coming from Global Server that was pretty quiet I got shocked by continous farming of US Coast and by plenty demasting (I rarely found demasters in Global).
I got enormous losses helping Coast Defense... then I started never sailing a fast tagger (and any ship in general) with FR Rig+Wingeout as a minumum.

As said: it's a mindset. And it's a rarer mindset that you're considering. Even among our small community.

And very steep learning curve in NA doesnt help neither... even if the reason (for veterans) to keep them interested and that motivated them initially.

On 1/6/2019 at 12:01 PM, jodgi said:

I know, I just doubt it works as a game experience. I believe it's the combination of full loss loot and asymmetrical warfare that makes us struggle with keeping players. It's hardcore, cool, correct and logical but I believe too many players struggle with motivation to play when they have to grind cash and things (PvE) after losing stuff in a (frustrating) lopsided fight.

I believe almost all players want nice fights, if you make it exceedingly hard for that too happen you have created a problem.

A - Being (again) a war simulation... it's warfare. And it ends up following similar rules. Best Commander is the one winning a battle before even starting it (choosing the situation, the time, the gear, the position for his outmost advantage - usually plainly NOT a fair battle).

B - On one hand we could want to have close to nothing priced ships... so plenty and relaxed throw-away. On the other we are playing a (supposely) meaningful MMO. With RvR.
So losing flagships (like 1st rates) should be a pain and the effort they need to be built create their value.
That's still too low for many super-rich veterans and big clans.

Economically NA is a pain for new comers (that's bad) and a breeze for veterans (that's bad too). Another point widening the gap.

C - Nice fights are meant to be balanced and "close". That's first and foremost impossible in a MMO enviroment. As already stated.
Moreover meaning "close", this leads to KD ratios close (in theory) to 1:1.
So you're saying people want to spend bulkloads of hours and then cash/resources ingame to fit a good ship... having 50% chance to lose her every "nice" fights (also called duels).

I say: no.
In a meaningful RvR MMO with full loot/loss and working economy, 50% loss chance is unbearable. And economically unfeasible.
In NA moreover impossible. Take into account 4/5+ ships costs + high tiered gear for them... and you already know it would be a suicide playing this way.

 

Then you'll add: you do not need a 4/5+ ship with shiny mods to win. Yes. True.
IF the enemy has them and he's a noob and you're a veteran, it's true.
But if you're facing an inferior enemy still experienced and with clue and half (and there're a lot)... this long list of +2% he has more than you will matter. A lot. And you know.

Therefore next natural step is asking: why in the hell should I give my enemy a edge of X% on these stats?
That leads (again) to high geared ships... that are precious and rarely blindly risked.
I can be experienced and on a super ship... but if I got badly ganked, I'll have an high chance to lose in any case. Even versus inferior players in inferior ships (not total crap, obviously).
And when not losing to a gank of not so noob captains, we end up in the infinite repair stuff... that are those permitting to supergeared veterans to HUMILIATE bunch of casuals even with impossible odds.

So, not randomly, I'll move with a group of similarly experienced players on often similarly geared ships.
That will rarely found an enemy of same strenght. So they'll kill on sight (also granted low population) simply anything on sight.

Unluckly targets that will be the usual demi-noobs with simply ZERO hopes to survive. That will keep being smashed... and kicked away from the game.

So: how to put a stop to this vicious circle?

 

[jodgi]

9 hours ago, Licinio Chiavari said:

As said: it's a mindset. And it's a rarer mindset that you're considering. Even among our small community.

Yes, we caught up on that. Quite a few wanted to join RAKERS but most silently dissappeared when they were expected to submit to the rather harsh training.

9 hours ago, Licinio Chiavari said:

So you're saying people want to spend bulkloads of hours and then cash/resources ingame to fit a good ship... having 50% chance to lose her every "nice" fights (also called duels).

They don't, that is exactly why I attack eco and the gear grind.

9 hours ago, Licinio Chiavari said:

A lot. And you know.

Yes! And I've said so very publicly for years.

10 hours ago, Licinio Chiavari said:

Unluckly targets that will be the usual demi-noobs with simply ZERO hopes to survive. That will keep being smashed... and kicked away from the game.

So: how to put a stop to this vicious circle?

While keeping eco(loss)?... No idea.