Guns suggestion

[DarkspaceII]

Hello!

I was thinking about suggesting to make the gun variation on some or all ships a bit bigger.

My suggestion is to make a total gun lb cap. For example Frigate can carry 26 18lb and 12 6lb cannons. That means it has 26*18 + 12*6  = 540 total broadside lbs. 

Now my idea is to make it so you can choose the size of your cannons without exceeding the total lbs.

Example:

26 18lb and 4 18lb cannons. The total is again 540, but this time you choose to mount 4 18lb on weather deck rather than 12 6lb.

 Of course you should be able to change the number and size of your guns only on your weather deck. It may be possible to do it on other decks but with some penalty.

 

Another suggestion based on that would be to make the ship speed dependant to the weight of the guns.

 For example if a frig, which can carry 540lb is fitted only with 400, she should gain a small percentage of speed and acceleration. 140lb loss could be 0,7% speed  and acceleration gain.(0.005 modifier)

 

 Also, to make it a bit more interesting, you can choose to dump your guns. To dump your broadsides, or only weather deck, or back guns.. etc for the speed gain.

This should be usefull in many situations:

A guy hugely outnumbered may dump his guns for the speed gain.

Some tacklers may choose to leave only their bow gun for the sake of catching and keeping in battle faster ships.

 This should also improve some aspects of the game.

Like when some surprise chasers decide to dump their broadsides to catch a Trincomalee for instance, but they wont be able to cut  its sails fast enough so that their heavier buddies can close in faster. 

This way the Trincomalee may decide to actually fight them off at some point or cut their sails and escape after.

 

I have some other suggestions involving guns or sails overload at the cost of some huge penalties but will make another post for it.

 

I hope this can be usefull suggestion! 

[Arvenski]

Hello!

I was thinking about suggesting to make the gun variation on some or all ships a bit bigger.

My suggestion is to make a total gun lb cap. For example Frigate can carry 26 18lb and 12 6lb cannons. That means it has 26*18 + 12*6  = 540 total broadside lbs. 

Now my idea is to make it so you can choose the size of your cannons without exceeding the total lbs.

Example:

26 18lb and 4 18lb cannons. The total is again 540, but this time you choose to mount 4 18lb on weather deck rather than 12 6lb.

 Of course you should be able to change the number and size of your guns only on your weather deck. It may be possible to do it on other decks but with some penalty.

 

Another suggestion based on that would be to make the ship speed dependant to the weight of the guns.

 For example if a frig, which can carry 540lb is fitted only with 400, she should gain a small percentage of speed and acceleration. 140lb loss could be 0,7% speed  and acceleration gain.(0.005 modifier)

 

It's an interesting idea, to be sure, but it also offers quite a bit of flexibility in regards to historical accuracy, as it allows for ships to carry higher caliber guns than they did in real life. I don't know if the devs, or many of the players, want that.  

Edited February 21, 2016 by Arvenski

[Hethwill]

Carriages sizes. It is almost never about the guns directly but about the carriages volume.

[DarkspaceII]

Carriages sizes. It is almost never about the guns directly but about the carriages volume.

Exactly. I was thinking about trader ships load too. It does not feel right a fully loaded ship with good to be equal at speed with one empty of the same type. I think ship's speed and to greater extend trader ships speed should depend on their carriage. A full cargo traders brig should sail and accelerate at least 2-5% slower than an empty one of the same type. Again, I think ships should be able to get rid of their cargo or parts of it as you choose, over time to get lighter and faster.

 

 As for the main post, I was thinking.. maybe to implement a new mod which increases the drop gun speed increase multiplier for even more speed.

[Aetrion]

During the age of sail guns were basically considered cargo, not fixed armaments. It wasn't unusual at all to remove some from a ship to make room for other stuff, and the main difference between a warship and a cargo ship was often whether it was loaded down with weapons or with goods.

 

I think it would do this game a lot of good if they switched the economy from replacing ships to replacing equipment, so that when you sink you lose stuff like your guns, and guns can be crafted. 

[Francis Tabernac]

I like the idea of being able to surprise someone with an unorthodox gun layout. As it is, the only question going into battle is "does he have cannon or carronade" but the ability to mix it up would add an interesting element.

[sailNE]

I don`t see a reason for bothering with guns combinations. Historical layout is ok. Dumping guns may be useful but still it`s neither urgent nor crucial issue at all.

[Aetrion]

Dumping guns would only be possible with the smallest guns anyways. There is no way to haul a 42 pound long gun out from the bottom deck and throw it overboard while in a pursuit with someone.

 

A large naval cannon would weigh between 2000-5000kg, depending on its model and whether it was cast from iron or bronze.

[Destraex]

Also about deck thickness and how much weight they could take, warship decks were specially re-enforced to take the weight of cannon making them both tougher and slower at the same time if done too much. Usually higher decks took less weight and also for the stability of the ship lighter guns higher were also preferable as I understand it. In napoleonic times ships were even lowering rated weapon calibres if weight stressed the wood too much for long voyages.

[DarkspaceII]

Dumping guns would only be possible with the smallest guns anyways. There is no way to haul a 42 pound long gun out from the bottom deck and throw it overboard while in a pursuit with someone.

 

A large naval cannon would weigh between 2000-5000kg, depending on its model and whether it was cast from iron or bronze.

Great point. Again, dumping or modifying guns should be possible only on weather and front decks. Although there should be an option in port to be able to strip the rest of the decks for speed.

As for putting bigger guns on weather deck i dont see a historical problem. Only that it was better at these times to use smaller and lighter ones there. So if you want guns on weather deck as big as the main deck, you get speed/maneuver penalty.

[Aetrion]

Arranging the cannons from heaviest to lightest bottom to top probably also had a lot to do with just keeping the ship stable. The rigging and armaments all sit above the ships longitudinal axis, while regular cargo would be placed below. No idea exactly, but I'm pretty sure they had to add ballast to account for any weight that was riding above the waterline.

Edited February 22, 2016 by Aetrion

[SunKiller]

the problem with the lbs limit is also that 3x 6lb cannon are weighting less then 1x 18lb. Because of the different sizes and pressures involved. also throwing weight overboard, doesn't make you necesarliy faster. You could cut in to your own skin because you are loosing counterweight to the windpressure on the sails. So in worst case scenario you became slower because you cann´t use your hole sail area.

[DarkspaceII]

In order to happen so, the ship must lose a huge percentage of its weight. Not only a few cannons..

[Shepherd]

While some more creativity would be interesting, there would still need to be limits on the largest long and regular guns that could be fitted due to the simple geometry. A cutter isn't wide enough to run in and reload a very large breech-loading cannon. A limit too to the number of guns based on the vessel's number of gun ports of course... I could only imagine how obnoxious, say, a Constitution with a broadside of 84x 6pdrs would be, especially with the current model of rippling broadsides.

[Francis Tabernac]

Obnoxious, or glorious?!

 

Well, probably both. Still, what a sight!