Hethwill Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 1st rate Ship of the Line - Príncipe Real A 1st rate ship of the line rated 90. Built and set sail in 1771 and first sea worthy voyage on the 13th July of the same year. This was the Admiral Ship of the Royal Portuguese Navy at that time and throughout the wars until 1815. For the Mediterranean theatre it was outfitted with 110 pieces and served as 2nd division command ship, under Marques de Niza, in the Anglo-Portuguese fleet under John Jervis and Horatio Nelson. Was so extensively outfitted during its time of service that records were kept. I noted the main changes. 1771 - 90 pieces - 34/32pdr - 34/24pdr - 12/18pdr - 10/8pdr 1794 - 98 pieces - 34/32pdr - 34/24pdr - 20/12 pdr - 10/8pdr 1798-1800 - 110 pieces during the Mediterranean campaign 34 of 32pdr 34 of 24pdr 28 of 12pdr 14 of 8pdr It was used as royal transport when the court left the mainland to Brasil following the Napoleonic peninsular wars and as such was downgraded to 74 pieces to accomodate the transport duty. 6th rate Frigate - Princesa da Beira 6th rate ship constructed by the shipwright of the royal portuguese navy in the territory of Brasil, Pará. Featured a total of 28 pieces setup in one deck only. 20 of 12 pounds and 8 of 6 pounds. Was first set on water in 1798. Was used as coastal guard and convoy escort. Lasted in "service" until 1841. If enough interest from the developers is shown to have these or other specific Portuguese ships the "trouble" ( involves unknown costs ) to go through the maritime museum archives for full information will be my pleasure. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaGama Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 If enough interest from the developers is shown to have these or other specific Portuguese ships the "trouble" ( involves unknown costs ) to go through the maritime museum archives for full information will be my pleasure. I'm almost certain that the navy's museum in Lisbon (Belém) sells copies of the blueprints/plans...how much it costs? Well I bet it isn't cheap. I do have a handfull pics of Portuguese ships (including Naus/Ship-of.the-line and frigates) the problem is to find accurate info and plans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 The Navy museum library is open public domain but access to the records has a cost and the copies have a cost associated. They also require a denomination of the purpose that the material will be used for, but this is not really a strict requirement. I did similar request before on the National Military Museum in Lisbon with no issues other than the cost. All costs revert, obviously, to the preservation of the documents. I did choose these 2 specific ones because, one is the prime of the navy. The top of the line. The other is a very unorthodox frigate. It dispensed the aft and fore castles for a cleat deck. All gun deployment is straight with only the pursuit fire positions. Maybe it was a design that fitted its role in the southern hemisphere and more hydro and aero dynamic due to the design ? Was a interceptor mainly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirones Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 how much would the plans cost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 how much would the plans cost? Usual cost for national archives is around 60 - 70 for the entire service and receive a copy of it, usually digital format. You pay by document accessed that has to be setup for . Old stuff like this 18th century documents you need screen access, microfilm or remote imagery as you don't touch the papers without special permission. Will only know after I receive word from them. Sent an email from office this afternoon inquiring about the plans. IIRC the Luftwaffe documentation has cost the same a couple years ago when "working" with another team. Their digital archives are excellent ( very concise and easy to access the index to find what you want ) and service is really quick. Who knows, might get lucky and find someone that has them already, a model builder or a writer. Will have to keep contacting around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oneironz Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 I wasn't aware of these two ships, thanks for enriching my general knowledge. I would certainly enjoy to sail a Portuguese ship in game! Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weirdguy Posted February 6, 2015 Share Posted February 6, 2015 Nothing can be done until some engineering style line drawings can be provided. Without line drawings a 3D art guy is better off making a ship that does have line drawings, and there are plenty to be found on the internet for free if you know where to look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted February 6, 2015 Author Share Posted February 6, 2015 Nothing can be done until some engineering style line drawings can be provided. Without line drawings a 3D art guy is better off making a ship that does have line drawings, and there are plenty to be found on the internet for free if you know where to look. If you can provide these same resource links to the Royal Portuguese armada of the 18th / 19th century I would appreciate. Having browsed the catalogue listing of the digital documentation of the navy records nothing relevant prior to 1860's is to be found. But then they list all the digitized records only. Contacted both the national navy historical records and the navy museum library for help regarding these and should be have some news soon. In the meanwhile I already have a couple weekends scheduled to pay a visit to the record vaults. It is time consuming to say the least. Even if the ships don't make it into the game I have my share of fun. Might spend a bit of cash and who knows, might write a small essay about them. Again, all info you can provide is welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 The team of the historical archive ( they were top service, as usual ) spent the last week assembling the index for my request. The only thing left to do is the trip to the archives. For anyone interested the indexes are ( especially the portuguese that can pass by the old Cordoaria Nacional in Belém ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weirdguy Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 The drawings you want to look for the most are the ones that show the ribs, usually only for a left or right side of the hull, and a side view showing where those ribs go. Then a spar and mast drawing showing the rigging helps quite a lot. After than, any drawing that shows how the deck looked, and where hatches and stairs are located. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethwill Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 Yes. A whole collection of technical and artistic depictions of the ships will help modelling for sure. Also will take all the relevant documentation. Who knows, might write an booklet about them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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